Capitalism without competition is not capitalism

[Toddsterpatriot]

Up to a point. At some point, the Government will have to step in with regulations. Otherwise, enter Depression II. and we have a full blown Armed Revolution on our hands. In the end, the Government will do what ever is necessary to protect itself. If that means regulating then they are going to regulate.

Alan Greenspan said his job was to keep wages down but not so low that the masses revolt. And that’s where we are now. Trump will show you wages are up. And they are up. My wages have gone up since 2014. Every year.

But if your wages aren’t up or you don’t think republicans have changed anything for the middle class and poor, just the rich. And if you believe their policies are going to make the middle class poorer, then you have to vote democratic.

Trickle down doesn’t work.

Alan Greenspan said his job was to keep wages down but not so low that the masses revolt.

Link?

Trickle down doesn’t work.

Higher taxes don’t work.

Onerous regulations don’t work.

Why don’t higher taxes work? Sure they do. They pay off the debt. Meanwhile corporations are killing it.

Give unto Caesar which is Caesar’s

Why don’t higher taxes work?

They destroy incentive. They encourage shelters and discourage investment.

Sure they do. They pay off the debt.

Here in Illinois, in 2011, they hiked the income tax 66% and the corporate tax by 46%. To pay off the debt.
The debt didn't go down. The pension liabilities didn't shrink. The budget didn't balance.

Give unto Caesar which is Caesar’s

If Caeser keeps fucking up, fuck Caesar.

You fuck up by voting republican.

I just found out a flat tax doesn’t work. It would be too much on the middle class and poor.

Maybe if the rich paid us better but until then no.

You fuck up by voting republican.

I do what I can to keep idiot Dems out of office.

I just found out a flat tax doesn’t work. It would be too much on the middle class and poor.

Why do you feel that?

 

[boedicca]

And if you have government raise enough barriers, you never have to worry about new competitors.

Are you aware that the really big Corps write all the new laws? You honestly believe that you have a say in anything anymore? The Corp believes it needs something to make more money. They write a new law, they dump millions into Congress and Presidential Campaign Contributions or tell the Polititian that they are spending million is Dark Money on their behalf, offer jobs to the Congress Critters when they leave office, and then turn the 1000 page law over to the Congress Critters who introduce it to Congress without even reading the damned thing.

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

At some point two things are going to happen. Our taxes will need to go up to make up for the taxes corporations no longer pay. And they’ll have to cut into social security and Medicare.

Further widening the gap between the rich and poor.

And Americans voted for it. Amazing.

They’ll also somehow pin it on liberals. Here we can point to exactly how republican policies widen the gap between rich and poor and still they blame democrats for what’s going on. Americans are being controlled by a corporate media that appears liberal on social issues because republicans benefit from the wedge issues that divide us. God gays guns and racism drives poor people into the republicans arms.

Liberals are no longer Classical Liberals - they are Big Government Statist Progressives. Americans are being controlled by more than just Big Corporations. Our ruling "elite" cabal includes Big Banks, Big Media, Big Entertainment as well as the Big Permanent Bureaucracy+Bi-Fusion Status Quo Establishment in DC. They are all members of the Party which wants to enslave the rest of us so that the Party Hacks can live off of our "surplus" productivity (whatever is generated above and beyond the subsistence lifestyles they deem the rest of us should live in order to appease the Very Angry Global Climate Change Gawd.)

Stop thinking big banks and big media aren’t corporations too. They are

There will always be a government and bureaucracy.

It’s the corporations who call it big government. What they want is for it to be powerless to stop their business decisions even ones that are harmful like not covering people with pre existing conditions

The Big Corporations wouldn't have the power if the Permanent Bureaucracy Status Quo didn't collude with them.

Just sayin'.

 

[boedicca]

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Again, free market is a myth.

It's an ideal - and a much healthier one than the Collectivist Utopian one.

Decentralized, distributed power is far more beneficial than concentrated power.

The only way to have free market is for everyone to play fair. It just ain't going to happen. Reality means that there is going to be many that are going to find ways to screw everyone else. This is why Free Market is a myth. But Fair Market is where regulation comes into play to even out the playing field whether it's done by a local, state, federal or international tariff. And that is a form of Socialism. For without a bit of Socialism, capitalism will run itself completely into the ground sooner or later and end up in chaos.

B'loney. Laws that respect property rights and prohibit fraud are not Socialism. These are what are necessary for Capitalism to thrive, and are consistent with the proper role for government to support a free markets. Regulations rig the game to distort the market, usually so that competition is squashed. That is what Totalitarian Statists, including Socialists, do.

 

[boedicca]

BTW, you are exploiting a monkey with your Av.

Photographer in bizarre selfie court battle reveals that being sued by a monkey has left him broke

You are as ignorant of the term exploit as you are of the term capitalism.

Did you get the monkey's permission to use his selfie? I doubt it.

It's called fair use.

Not according to PETA.

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

 

[boedicca]

Are you aware that the really big Corps write all the new laws? You honestly believe that you have a say in anything anymore? The Corp believes it needs something to make more money. They write a new law, they dump millions into Congress and Presidential Campaign Contributions or tell the Polititian that they are spending million is Dark Money on their behalf, offer jobs to the Congress Critters when they leave office, and then turn the 1000 page law over to the Congress Critters who introduce it to Congress without even reading the damned thing.

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Again, free market is a myth.

This Little Piggie Went to Market

It means that whichever rampaging GreedHead dominates the market in his sector is free to do whatever he wants.

Bzzzzzzt!!!!!

Wrong, you lose. Capitalism means no such thing.

Regulatory capture of the Permanent Status Quo Bureaucracy does mean which ever rampaging Greedhead that buys off the right people can kill off the competition in the womb.

 

[boedicca]

And if you have government raise enough barriers, you never have to worry about new competitors.

Are you aware that the really big Corps write all the new laws? You honestly believe that you have a say in anything anymore? The Corp believes it needs something to make more money. They write a new law, they dump millions into Congress and Presidential Campaign Contributions or tell the Polititian that they are spending million is Dark Money on their behalf, offer jobs to the Congress Critters when they leave office, and then turn the 1000 page law over to the Congress Critters who introduce it to Congress without even reading the damned thing.

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Capitalism is private ownership of the means of production.
It is capitalism regardless of how the market operates. The market operates outside the system of production.

You have a very inadequate knowledge of economics and political systems, bub.

Ownership doesn't mean squat if one is not able to freely operate one's business as one sees fit in order to make a profit.

 

[Dekster]

I’ve heard when republicans lowered taxes on the rich it took away the way we regulated corporate greed. We taxed anyone’s income above a certain amount so much they didn’t bother. So they invested all that money back into the business. Gave employees raises and insurance.

So today CEOs pay themselves like baseball players. They and all their generals get all the money. The shareholders get some and they don’t complain because the coward of directors of your company is a bunch of CEOs of other companies. They are doing it too.

CEO pay is largely stock related. We saw companies during earnngs seasons recently see their stocks drop after they beat expectations simply because it was done on less revenue. Amazon shares aren't $1600+ a share because they pay dividends.

The way I understand it is that when taxes were lowered on top earners, it caused greed.

And CEOs stopped worrying about the long term. They only worry about the next 5 years so they can make a fortune. Employees don’t get a cut.

Union employees would have got profit sharing. Today the ceo gets it all.

In fact, when Henry Ford raised his workers pay to 5 bucks a day and allowed them to buy the Model T on payments, the other Leaders all called him a Traitor to his Class. .

Because of Birth-Class Supremacy, We've Had Decade After Decadent Decade and Generation After Degenerate Generation


Since we are all programmed to ignore the controlling effect of birth privileges, the truth must be that class is hereditary. Henry Ford was born to a farm family, so he couldn't have been a traitor to the stagnant and firmly fixed class he had reached on his own. His incompetent son, Edsel, and his bullying clown grandson, Henry II, were of that class. That's why Ford has been going downhill ever since the mechanically inclined farmboy stopped running it.

In another misdefinition protecting HeirHeads, Kareem Abdul Jabbar was identified as "part of basketball's aristocracy, which is why we should listen to him." Only his son and grandson could be considered aristocratic, and nobody should expect them to have anything significant to say about the NBA.

My father was poor. He got a good union job with good benefits and now his son, my brother, is a Vice President of a Fortune 500. I do alright too.

So my brother and I can tell you the benefits of unions even though neither of us have ever belonged to a union.

And my brother is a member of a union who gives back more than it gets every contract. More specifically they negotiate crappy deal for younger/low seniority workers to make sure older/high seniority workers can keep living the high life.

 

[Tehon]

You are as ignorant of the term exploit as you are of the term capitalism.

Did you get the monkey's permission to use his selfie? I doubt it.

It's called fair use.

Not according to PETA.

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

 

[boedicca]

Did you get the monkey's permission to use his selfie? I doubt it.

It's called fair use.

Not according to PETA.

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

You are using his image without his consent. That's rather exploitive.

 

[Tehon]

Are you aware that the really big Corps write all the new laws? You honestly believe that you have a say in anything anymore? The Corp believes it needs something to make more money. They write a new law, they dump millions into Congress and Presidential Campaign Contributions or tell the Polititian that they are spending million is Dark Money on their behalf, offer jobs to the Congress Critters when they leave office, and then turn the 1000 page law over to the Congress Critters who introduce it to Congress without even reading the damned thing.

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Capitalism is private ownership of the means of production.
It is capitalism regardless of how the market operates. The market operates outside the system of production.

You have a very inadequate knowledge of economics and political systems, bub.

Ownership doesn't mean squat if one is not able to freely operate one's business as one sees fit in order to make a profit.

Winners and losers. That is what capitalism is. The winners buy the political right to hamper the losers ability to compete.

If one decides to freely use capital to purchase political power in order to gain an advantage in the market, we call that capitalism. That is capital accumulation being used for the purpose of making a profit, freely.

Fascists rise up to protect capitalists from socialists. That is historically accurate.

 

[Tehon]

It's called fair use.

Not according to PETA.

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

You are using his image without his consent. That's rather exploitive.

I am not benefiting from it. You don't understand the terms you throw around.

 

[boedicca]

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Capitalism is private ownership of the means of production.
It is capitalism regardless of how the market operates. The market operates outside the system of production.

You have a very inadequate knowledge of economics and political systems, bub.

Ownership doesn't mean squat if one is not able to freely operate one's business as one sees fit in order to make a profit.

Winners and losers. That is what capitalism is. The winners buy the political right to hamper the losers ability to compete.

If one decides to freely use capital to purchase political power in order to gain an advantage in the market, we call that capitalism. That is capital accumulation being used for the purpose of making a profit, freely.

Fascists rise up to protect capitalists from socialists. That is historically accurate.

Balderdash and hogwash.

Capital used to buy off politicians to rig the system is not Capitalism.

Your logic:

Money is capital
Joe used his capital to buy a gun
Joe used the gun to rob his neighbor's business
Capitalism is thievery

Money made by buying off politicians is Rent Seeking, not the profits of Capitalism.

 

[boedicca]

Not according to PETA.

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

You are using his image without his consent. That's rather exploitive.

I am not benefiting from it. You don't understand the terms you throw around.

*sigh* It is so depressing dealing with the the morons who completely lack even the merest acquaintance with a sense of humor....or in this particular case, the actual source of his avatar.

 

[Tehon]

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Capitalism is private ownership of the means of production.
It is capitalism regardless of how the market operates. The market operates outside the system of production.

You have a very inadequate knowledge of economics and political systems, bub.

Ownership doesn't mean squat if one is not able to freely operate one's business as one sees fit in order to make a profit.

Winners and losers. That is what capitalism is. The winners buy the political right to hamper the losers ability to compete.

If one decides to freely use capital to purchase political power in order to gain an advantage in the market, we call that capitalism. That is capital accumulation being used for the purpose of making a profit, freely.

Fascists rise up to protect capitalists from socialists. That is historically accurate.

Balderdash and hogwash.

Capital used to buy off politicians to rig the system is not Capitalism.

Your logic:

Money is capital
Joe used his capital to buy a gun
Joe used the gun to rob his neighbor's business
Capitalism is thievery

Money made by buying off politicians is Rent Seeking, not the profits of Capitalism.

Not all money is capital. Your analogy fails.

Speaking of rent seeking. It is an integral part of the capitalist system of production.

[The term capital] made its first appearance in medieval Latin as an adjective capitalis (from caput, head) modifying the word pars, to designate the principal sum of a money loan. The principal part of a loan was contrasted with the "usury"--later called interest--the payment made to the lender in addition to the return of the sum lent. This usage, unknown to classical Latin, had become common by the thirteenth century and possibly had begun as early as 1100 A.D., in the first chartered towns of Europe. [Frank A. Fetter, "Reformulation of the Concepts of Capital and Income in Economics and Accounting," 1937, in "Capital, Interest, & Rent," 1977]
capital | Origin and meaning of capital by Online Etymology Dictionary

 

[Tehon]

According to the court.

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

You are using his image without his consent. That's rather exploitive.

I am not benefiting from it. You don't understand the terms you throw around.

*sigh* It is so depressing dealing with the the morons who completely lack even the merest acquaintance with a sense of humor....or in this particular case, the actual source of his avatar.

You don't know how to deliver a punch line.

 

[sealybobo]

CEO pay is largely stock related. We saw companies during earnngs seasons recently see their stocks drop after they beat expectations simply because it was done on less revenue. Amazon shares aren't $1600+ a share because they pay dividends.

The way I understand it is that when taxes were lowered on top earners, it caused greed.

And CEOs stopped worrying about the long term. They only worry about the next 5 years so they can make a fortune. Employees don’t get a cut.

Union employees would have got profit sharing. Today the ceo gets it all.

In fact, when Henry Ford raised his workers pay to 5 bucks a day and allowed them to buy the Model T on payments, the other Leaders all called him a Traitor to his Class. .

Because of Birth-Class Supremacy, We've Had Decade After Decadent Decade and Generation After Degenerate Generation


Since we are all programmed to ignore the controlling effect of birth privileges, the truth must be that class is hereditary. Henry Ford was born to a farm family, so he couldn't have been a traitor to the stagnant and firmly fixed class he had reached on his own. His incompetent son, Edsel, and his bullying clown grandson, Henry II, were of that class. That's why Ford has been going downhill ever since the mechanically inclined farmboy stopped running it.

In another misdefinition protecting HeirHeads, Kareem Abdul Jabbar was identified as "part of basketball's aristocracy, which is why we should listen to him." Only his son and grandson could be considered aristocratic, and nobody should expect them to have anything significant to say about the NBA.

My father was poor. He got a good union job with good benefits and now his son, my brother, is a Vice President of a Fortune 500. I do alright too.

So my brother and I can tell you the benefits of unions even though neither of us have ever belonged to a union.

And my brother is a member of a union who gives back more than it gets every contract. More specifically they negotiate crappy deal for younger/low seniority workers to make sure older/high seniority workers can keep living the high life.

Is he going to get a pension? Then whatever he pays is worth it.

Yes, unions are weak and pathetic now. So is the middle class.

 

[boedicca]

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Capitalism is private ownership of the means of production.
It is capitalism regardless of how the market operates. The market operates outside the system of production.

You have a very inadequate knowledge of economics and political systems, bub.

Ownership doesn't mean squat if one is not able to freely operate one's business as one sees fit in order to make a profit.

Winners and losers. That is what capitalism is. The winners buy the political right to hamper the losers ability to compete.

If one decides to freely use capital to purchase political power in order to gain an advantage in the market, we call that capitalism. That is capital accumulation being used for the purpose of making a profit, freely.

Fascists rise up to protect capitalists from socialists. That is historically accurate.

Balderdash and hogwash.

Capital used to buy off politicians to rig the system is not Capitalism.

Your logic:

Money is capital
Joe used his capital to buy a gun
Joe used the gun to rob his neighbor's business
Capitalism is thievery

Money made by buying off politicians is Rent Seeking, not the profits of Capitalism.

Not all money is capital. Your analogy fails.

Speaking of rent seeking. It is an integral part of the capitalist system of production.

[The term capital] made its first appearance in medieval Latin as an adjective capitalis (from caput, head) modifying the word pars, to designate the principal sum of a money loan. The principal part of a loan was contrasted with the "usury"--later called interest--the payment made to the lender in addition to the return of the sum lent. This usage, unknown to classical Latin, had become common by the thirteenth century and possibly had begun as early as 1100 A.D., in the first chartered towns of Europe. [Frank A. Fetter, "Reformulation of the Concepts of Capital and Income in Economics and Accounting," 1937, in "Capital, Interest, & Rent," 1977]
capital | Origin and meaning of capital by Online Etymology Dictionary

Very good! You've learned how to use a search engine. But you still don't grok Capitalism, Economics, and Political Systems. Keep searching!

 

[boedicca]

Don't you LW moonbats care more about the Animals than some literal legal ruling?

I'm not harming the animal in any way.

You are using his image without his consent. That's rather exploitive.

I am not benefiting from it. You don't understand the terms you throw around.

*sigh* It is so depressing dealing with the the morons who completely lack even the merest acquaintance with a sense of humor....or in this particular case, the actual source of his avatar.

You don't know how to deliver a punch line.

You have neither a sense of whimsy, nor any curiosity whatsoever.

What a sad way to be.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Big Corporations writing regulations is Not Capitalism. It's Corporate-Fascism.

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Again, free market is a myth.

This Little Piggie Went to Market

It means that whichever rampaging GreedHead dominates the market in his sector is free to do whatever he wants.

Up to a point. At some point, the Government will have to step in with regulations. Otherwise, enter Depression II. and we have a full blown Armed Revolution on our hands. In the end, the Government will do what ever is necessary to protect itself. If that means regulating then they are going to regulate.

Democracy Requires a 100% Inheritance Tax

The main cause of greed is incompetence; it's the only way Low IQ Bizz Skule graduates can make a profit. Hereditary privileges, which elevate the sons of every white-collar worker, put inferior people in superior positions. The Nobility With No Ability can only survive by cheating.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Fascism is a political ideology.
Capitalism is a socioeconomic ideology.

Fascism can't exist without capitalism.

Nonsense. Fascism is about political control. Capitalism is a free market concept. Anything politicians due to distort the operation of free markets is anti-capitalism.

Again, free market is a myth.

This Little Piggie Went to Market

It means that whichever rampaging GreedHead dominates the market in his sector is free to do whatever he wants.

Up to a point. At some point, the Government will have to step in with regulations. Otherwise, enter Depression II. and we have a full blown Armed Revolution on our hands. In the end, the Government will do what ever is necessary to protect itself. If that means regulating then they are going to regulate.

Democracy Requires a 100% Inheritance Tax

The main cause of greed is incompetence; it's the only way Low IQ Bizz Skule graduates can make a profit. Hereditary privileges, which elevate the sons of every white-collar worker, put inferior people in superior positions. The Nobility With No Ability can only survive by cheating.

Democracy Requires a 100% Inheritance Tax

No thanks.