Believing In A God Is Evil

[HUGGY]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Prove that a god does not exist. That is every bit as impossible as proving that a god does exist.

A classic false equivalency. Unless the science can find every last grain of sand to fill in the "missing link" evolution is false or at best a "theory". Meanwhile you don't have to come up with a single spec of factual proof of god or the fantastic fantasies of religion because theories require no proof.

The elephant in the room is of course that there are mountains of factual evidence supporting evolution. If evolution is a fact then of course there can be no god as described by all of the major religions.

There is nary a single fact supporting the existence of a god.

No unbiased intelligent human being can look at the evidence for evolution and conclude it is less likely than the stories cooked up in the religions describing god.

So WHO is lying? It is obvious. I still maintain that lying is evil.

.
No, it's not. There is no more evidence for the existence of a God than there is for one not existing. Those who claim false equivalence simply are incapable of admitting that fact.

You are correct. I am completely unwilling to give a stack of fairy tales more credence than the scientific stud ies on evolution.

I don't have any dog in this fight save reason and a personal inclination towards telling the truth.

I don't "want" there to be no god. I don't care either way. I have just seen nothing but outrageous fantasy stories supporting a god.

I don't "want" to believe in evolution. I don't really care that much. Though from what I have seen it is OBVIOUS that there has been a steady growth of living species on this planet. The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Also I am a believer in DNA. DNA all by it's self has enough information to prove evolution is a fact.

 

[HUGGY]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Whoa nelly, pard! Check your sentential logic!

T never equals F (necessary tautology for logical parsing.)

If we assume
wrong=evil
lying is wrong
lying is evil

ok I can work with the semantics here for the sake of discussion. So far so good.


However,

Point 1:
Your semantic "untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts." has nothing to do with logic--or the nature of Truth. The Truth of the matter Is that an illogical argument with false premises can still end in a true conclusion. (It's just true for some other unknown reason having nothing to do with the unsound argument. e.g. "If the moon is made of cheese, then we're on Mars. If we're on Mars, then the sky is blue. The moon is made of pasta. Therefore: the sky is blue." Completely invalid argument with false assumptions. True conclusion. The fact science has no evidentiary chain of "god" (assuming we define "god" as something imaginable and therefore among the set of 'logical possibilities') has no logical bearing on its potential existence of being either True or False. Take another example: our evidence of alien life in the Andromeda galaxy is utterly unsupported. Does this make the assertion untrue? By your definition of "untrue" we would Automatically Define it so.

It is absurd to define Truth itself by the scope of human science. I prefer to define human science as the pursuit of truth of the unknown. I bet after you think about it, you do too.

Point 2:
You seem to be defining being mistaken in your belief and honestly promoting your belief is lying. "the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue."

Well of course that's silly. With your semantic, only the omniscient could be morally innocent. Back here at the ranch: Lying is the intentional espousing an untrue fact. I might concede positivistic people on either side of the argument could afford to be more humble and agnostic. But in this case ardant atheists have become just as 'evil' as deists.

Point 3:
"I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil."

Putting your erroneous and illogical working definition of "untruth" aside, you seem to rely on the assumption Science can resolve the philosophical problem of First Cause. (An argument I'd like to see!) I'm not among those that say assertion of a god answers that problem...we can just as easily ask "what created god?" That's what makes the Problem of First Cause a good Problem.

Yet if Einstein says it's perfectly reasonable to believe in 10 dimensions or more based on evidence at hand and some math, I think science is a good tool for sculpting our own awe and wonder of the cosmos--and humility of acknowledging we don't know enough to have the first clue what all is in it...much less the audacity to say we can prove a negative.

***

Now, however since you've asserted that 'untruth is the transmission of a belief unsupported by fact' and doing so is evil...I have to point out you have argued that your original post was an act of evil!

I however submit that you were self-honest at the time and therefore not guilty of fraud. Having read my share of Gandhi, I think he'd say God cuts you the same slack.

Lying can be intentional and it can be passive by repeating untrue information.

I'm sure there are many people within religion that want to believe it true. These same people if presented the same information but just changing the names(to protect the innocent ) would laugh in your face.

Take away the want and the faith and what you have left is a fantastic fantasy. Period.

 

[westwall]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Prove that a god does not exist. That is every bit as impossible as proving that a god does exist.

A classic false equivalency. Unless the science can find every last grain of sand to fill in the "missing link" evolution is false or at best a "theory". Meanwhile you don't have to come up with a single spec of factual proof of god or the fantastic fantasies of religion because theories require no proof.

The elephant in the room is of course that there are mountains of factual evidence supporting evolution. If evolution is a fact then of course there can be no god as described by all of the major religions.

There is nary a single fact supporting the existence of a god.

No unbiased intelligent human being can look at the evidence for evolution and conclude it is less likely than the stories cooked up in the religions describing god.

So WHO is lying? It is obvious. I still maintain that lying is evil.

.
No, it's not. There is no more evidence for the existence of a God than there is for one not existing. Those who claim false equivalence simply are incapable of admitting that fact.

You are correct. I am completely unwilling to give a stack of fairy tales more credence than the scientific stud ies on evolution.

I don't have any dog in this fight save reason and a personal inclination towards telling the truth.

I don't "want" there to be no god. I don't care either way. I have just seen nothing but outrageous fantasy stories supporting a god.

I don't "want" to believe in evolution. I don't really care that much. Though from what I have seen it is OBVIOUS that there has been a steady growth of living species on this planet. The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Also I am a believer in DNA. DNA all by it's self has enough information to prove evolution is a fact.

I think your problem is you think that people who believe in religion can't also believe in evolution. Trust me they do. I used to work with a lot of religious folks and we had some great discussions about life and morality, ethics etc.

My biggest problem with religion is their assumption that you can only have ethics and morals if you are religious, which I think is patently ridiculous.

 

[OZman]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Belief in God is evil? Belief in God is in no way evil, believing in man's conception of God is the problem.

 

[Tuatara]

I provided proof. Proof that you are unwilling to review or read.

If it was proof it wouldn't still be called a theory, stupid.

you need to provide evidence that it is propaganda and how can you do either if you haven't watched it.

I've seen that shit a thousand times already. You think you're the only person who's ever tried to sell this theory?

Science should be questioned, disputed, evaluated and peer tested over and over again... with science.

And after 100 years you still have no proof. If you had to prove evolution in a court of law you would lose the case.

I think this has been posted here on these forums over a thousand times. A scientic theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is aquired through the scientific method and repeatedly tested and confirmed through observation and experimentation. I guess you didn't realize that the word theory has more than one meaning or else this theory of gravity would send us hurdling into space. I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

 

[hortysir]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

According to the entomology of the word "evil" one would have to believe in a 'God' in order to use the word......

The word evil is translated from the Ancient Greek word ubel, which is equivalent to the word azazel in hebrew. In Olde English, the word was spelt yfel and later ivell and evyl.

In the earliest meaning of the word, azazel was believed to be a demi-God cast down by the gods for his actions against humanity and doomed to wander the Earth never to escape until the end of time. In Biblican stories, this equates to the story of the archangel Michael and the story now associated to the history of The Devil.

Therefore the word evil in its earliest sense, is evil incarnate- the physical manifestation of ill, badness. The original meaning of evil as the title of the supreme bad spirit....
One-Heaven: About - Evil

 

[S.J.]

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

 

[BreezeWood]

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

 

[S.J.]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

 

[BreezeWood]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

special metamorphosis would not be anymore dissimilar than the everyday occurrence that provides you a visual imagery for the proof you require.

.

 

[S.J.]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

special metamorphosis would not be anymore dissimilar than the everyday occurrence that provides you a visual imagery for the proof you require.

.

Imagination is not proof.

 

[HUGGY]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Prove that a god does not exist. That is every bit as impossible as proving that a god does exist.

A classic false equivalency. Unless the science can find every last grain of sand to fill in the "missing link" evolution is false or at best a "theory". Meanwhile you don't have to come up with a single spec of factual proof of god or the fantastic fantasies of religion because theories require no proof.

The elephant in the room is of course that there are mountains of factual evidence supporting evolution. If evolution is a fact then of course there can be no god as described by all of the major religions.

There is nary a single fact supporting the existence of a god.

No unbiased intelligent human being can look at the evidence for evolution and conclude it is less likely than the stories cooked up in the religions describing god.

So WHO is lying? It is obvious. I still maintain that lying is evil.

.
No, it's not. There is no more evidence for the existence of a God than there is for one not existing. Those who claim false equivalence simply are incapable of admitting that fact.

You are correct. I am completely unwilling to give a stack of fairy tales more credence than the scientific stud ies on evolution.

I don't have any dog in this fight save reason and a personal inclination towards telling the truth.

I don't "want" there to be no god. I don't care either way. I have just seen nothing but outrageous fantasy stories supporting a god.

I don't "want" to believe in evolution. I don't really care that much. Though from what I have seen it is OBVIOUS that there has been a steady growth of living species on this planet. The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Also I am a believer in DNA. DNA all by it's self has enough information to prove evolution is a fact.

I think your problem is you think that people who believe in religion can't also believe in evolution. Trust me they do. I used to work with a lot of religious folks and we had some great discussions about life and morality, ethics etc.

My biggest problem with religion is their assumption that you can only have ethics and morals if you are religious, which I think is patently ridiculous.

Why assume I have a problem with this discussion? I do find it curious to say the least that so many millions of people got taken in by this scheme, this fraud...this lie.

I do thank you for conceding that a person can have moral standards, a moral game plan if you will, to guide me through life.

Not that it matters in this discussion though,I will admit freely that I have failed to live up to my ideals occasionally. Again to point I felt no great need to make amends(tell daddy I was a bad boy) as much as I as any intelligent individual just learned from my failures and pressed on.

 

[HUGGY]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Belief in God is evil? Belief in God is in no way evil, believing in man's conception of God is the problem.

Belief in god is evil in that it requires one to accept an obvious lie and as most religions command repeat the lie. Therein lies the evil.

 

[HUGGY]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

According to the entomology of the word "evil" one would have to believe in a 'God' in order to use the word......

The word evil is translated from the Ancient Greek word ubel, which is equivalent to the word azazel in hebrew. In Olde English, the word was spelt yfel and later ivell and evyl.

In the earliest meaning of the word, azazel was believed to be a demi-God cast down by the gods for his actions against humanity and doomed to wander the Earth never to escape until the end of time. In Biblican stories, this equates to the story of the archangel Michael and the story now associated to the history of The Devil.

Therefore the word evil in its earliest sense, is evil incarnate- the physical manifestation of ill, badness. The original meaning of evil as the title of the supreme bad spirit....
One-Heaven: About - Evil

Nonsense.

That may be the weakest reason to believe in a god I have ever seen.

 

[HUGGY]

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

There are thousands of examples. One that you may be able to wrap your mind around is the mosquito. When we discovered that the mosquito could be traced to yellow fever we sprayed with DDT to attempt to eradicate the pest. Many were killed then the DDT stopped being effective because the bug developed an immunity to the pesticide. Then the mosquito became stronger and much more difficult to kill. That is how evolution works in a nutshell.

 

[HUGGY]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

No one that believes in a god is looking for proof.

 

[S.J.]

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

There are thousands of examples. One that you may be able to wrap your mind around is the mosquito. When we discovered that the mosquito could be traced to yellow fever we sprayed with DDT to attempt to eradicate the pest. Many were killed then the DDT stopped being effective because the bug developed an immunity to the pesticide. Then the mosquito became stronger and much more difficult to kill. That is how evolution works in a nutshell.

So, what other species did the mosquito transform into?

 

[S.J.]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

No one that believes in a god is looking for proof.

We're sure not getting any from you.

 

[OZman]

If we can agree that lying is wrong and spreading a lie is wrong and therefore evil. Then we must conclude that believing in god and preaching the belief in god is wrong and clearly evil.

There are only truths and untruths. Truths have factual evidence to make truth self evident. Untruths are any variety of statements, beliefs or information passed on from one person to any other not supported by facts.

Religious people want to believe what they say is true. That does not relieve them of the consequences of telling or believing a lie if what they believe turns out to be untrue.

These people want to believe that they are good. Wanting to believe what you think and do just isn't good enough. Those ISIS Muslims believe they are doing good when they cut off the heads of non believers. They believe just as strongly as any Christian believes what they choose to believe.

I submit that those that want so dearly to believe in a god get busy and prove this or any god's factual existence is true or admit they have been lying to themselves and promoting a lie to others and in doing so continuing to promote a giant fraud on society. Fraud is wrong therefore evil.

Belief in God is evil? Belief in God is in no way evil, believing in man's conception of God is the problem.

Belief in god is evil in that it requires one to accept an obvious lie and as most religions command repeat the lie. Therein lies the evil.

The perception of God does not have to relate to a religion. There is no lie if there is no doctrine.

 

[HUGGY]

I'd be more than willing to put evolution up to scrutiny in any kind of court.

The similarities of these species and the transformation from one to another is undeniable.

Bullshit. Name a species that anyone has proven to have transformed into or from another. And show your proof. You are so full of shit.

.

how about from one being into another ... quite fashionable among insects and undoubtedly possible from one species to another.


the same process in freeing ones Spirit, attaining the knowledge to join the Everlasting.


there is nothing in Evolution that is not derived from the unknown any more than the presence of an Almighty that rules the universe.

.

.

Proof. We're looking for proof.

No one that believes in a god is looking for proof.

We're sure not getting any from you.

What'd ol gramps say? HHHMMmmm.....???? Oh Ya... "You can leave the barn door open BUT you can't lead a horse to water"...Ya! That's it!