A Year Since MH-17 Tragedy

[Tehon]

I completely agree with you, our fearless sister. But my acquaintances who read this forum from time to time claim that exactly this conclusion come to the mind when one is summarising all written by you, my friends, here.

They are even trying to prove their stance with some silly reasoning. It is what they claim:
Look, Russia gives Ukraine the discount on gas. Right? Right. Why is it doing so?

And I always give them such an answer: You are stupid bastards, because the Great Russian rulers are trying to help the Ukrainian people to weather such difficult time.

After that they go on with their silly reasoning: Okay, let’s consider that it is true. But how do people now live in Ukraine? Look what is your mate with a doggy avatar writes here about all those things which are going on in Ukraine: almost all Ukrainian population are being pushed into complete misery; the utility prices have been hiked several times; the corruption is flourishing and the junta is enriching itself tremendously. Your courage sister has written about all that multiple times and we don’t have any reason not to believe her because she is a very honest person. So, the people in Ukraine live in utter misery and things are getting only worse; the junta is living in the lap of luxury; the discounts are still in place. Who receives the benefits, then? Common people? You must be kidding. The junta? Exactly! But the discounts are still in place. So, what the conclusion does come to the mind? That the Russia is supporting the fascist junta.

And the only answer I am able to come up with is ‘You are stupid Ukro-patriots, you don’t understand anything, idiots’.

Who receives the benefits, then?
Are you really that stupid to believe the gas hikes go to the junta?
The gas hikes have been on the condition of the Western banks for loans to Ukraine. The money goes to pay off the Ukrainian debt. Putin is helping Ukraine, probably because Ukraine can't pay a steeper price and he doesn't want to lose the revenue, possibly as a good will gesture. You should find some smarter acquaintances.

 

[Tehon]

democracy in contemporary Ukraine.

 

[ESay]

Are you really that stupid to believe the gas hikes go to the junta?
The gas hikes have been on the condition of the Western banks for loans to Ukraine. The money goes to pay off the Ukrainian debt.

Thank you, my dear friend, for the explanation. Of course, this money goes directly to American imperialists and that is why they support the junta. But my stupid acquaintances say that the junta receives something too. Of course, it is only leavings from the masters’ table, but it is enough for them. Some time ago our sister Stratford wrote here that the bastard Poroshenko had increased his fortune sevenfold in the course of the last year. I hope you don’t think he has done this honestly. So, except of the junta, Putin is also supporting the American imperialists.

Putin is helping Ukraine, probably because Ukraine can't pay a steeper price and he doesn't want to lose the revenue, possibly as a good will gesture.

Do you know what told me my stupid acquaintances? That it is awkward that Putin thinks about the revenue and a good will gesture. The junta has been carrying out the ethnic cleansing of Russian-speakers in Eastern Ukraine, hundreds (no, I even think that thousands) have been put in jail only for disagreeing with the junta. And after that Putin is thinking about the revenue? Of course business is business, but Putin is a moral authority, so he wouldn’t do that.

Also, take a look (they go on telling me) at what your brothers have written here about the Ukrainians. They say that Russia in the course of centuries has feed Ukrainians, supported them, given only the best to them. And after that these greedy bastards have disowned Russia and are spreading lie about it everywhere they can. Putin is a very smart man and he understands that any good gesture is worth nothing for these miserable people.

 

[Tehon]

Thank you, my dear friend, for the explanation. Of course, this money goes directly to American imperialists and that is why they support the junta. But my stupid acquaintances say that the junta receives something too. Of course, it is only leavings from the masters’ table, but it is enough for them. Some time ago our sister Stratford wrote here that the bastard Poroshenko had increased his fortune sevenfold in the course of the last year. I hope you don’t think he has done this honestly. So, except of the junta, Putin is also supporting the American imperialists.

Western Banks want their money back and know how to do it as they have been doing this sort of thing for many decades, I doubt that there is much in the way of crumbs left for the junta. Doesn't Poroshenko still own the chocolate factory? Doesn't Poroshenko already have billions to invest in markets. There isn't a reason to believe that Poroshenko couldn't increase his wealth without stealing from Ukraine. And of course we know that Poroshenko and clan are being watched very closely by the puppets of the Western banks.

Do you know what told me my stupid acquaintances? That it is awkward that Putin thinks about the revenue and a good will gesture. The junta has been carrying out the ethnic cleansing of Russian-speakers in Eastern Ukraine, hundreds (no, I even think that thousands) have been put in jail only for disagreeing with the junta. And after that Putin is thinking about the revenue? Of course business is business, but Putin is a moral authority, so he wouldn’t do that.

Also, take a look (they go on telling me) at what your brothers have written here about the Ukrainians. They say that Russia in the course of centuries has feed Ukrainians, supported them, given only the best to them. And after that these greedy bastards have disowned Russia and are spreading lie about it everywhere they can. Putin is a very smart man and he understands that any good gesture is worth nothing for these miserable people.

And do you or your stupid acquaintances think Putin would put Ukrainian people before his very own, no matter how moral he is. Do you dummies not think Putin has his own debt obligations that he and his people must meet. Are you dummies incapable of understanding that Putin is limited in choices because of Western pressures.

 

[Stratford57]

Thank you, my dear friend, for the explanation. Of course, this money goes directly to American imperialists and that is why they support the junta. But my stupid acquaintances say that the junta receives something too. Of course, it is only leavings from the masters’ table, but it is enough for them. Some time ago our sister Stratford wrote here that the bastard Poroshenko had increased his fortune sevenfold in the course of the last year. I hope you don’t think he has done this honestly. So, except of the junta, Putin is also supporting the American imperialists.

Western Banks want their money back and know how to do it as they have been doing this sort of thing for many decades, I doubt that there is much in the way of crumbs left for the junta. Doesn't Poroshenko still own the chocolate factory? Doesn't Poroshenko already have billions to invest in markets. There isn't a reason to believe that Poroshenko couldn't increase his wealth without stealing from Ukraine.

Poroshenko's Roshen chocolate factory knows many ways how to make money. They steal money not only from Ukraine. (BTW, Poroshenko violates Ukrainian constitution, having his chocolate business, but Ukraine is so democratic, that Western world prefers not to to notice that little detail).

A British architect has filed legal papers in Ukraine accusing a chocolate company belonging to Petro Poroshenko, the country’s billionaire president, of stealing building designs.
Philip Hudson, of the firm D’Estate, also alleged that an executive of Roshen had told him that the company believed in “mafia management methods” and had intimidated D’Estate’s director, prompting her to resign, to prevent the case from going to court.

British architect sues president s chocolate empire The Times

 

[Sbiker]

They say that Russia in the course of centuries has feed Ukrainians, supported them, given only the best to them.

Relax, there is no Ukraine in history, till the XIX century

 

[Sonc]

I hope you don’t think he has done this honestly. So, except of the junta, Putin is also supporting the American imperialists

I understand that your attempts to talk seriously suffered a complete failure.
And now you're playing the clown. as though everything is fine.
But are you saying more and more stupid things.
You can not not know that Gazprom canceled the discounts for Naftogaz after Maidan.

Raises many serious questions.
Why 20 years Ukrainians choose (at elections) morons?

If the Ukrainian people knew about the scale of theft ... how would you like to join the EU?

In 2006, the discount was about ~ 70%
This is a very serious help. There was a real plan (may be we do not know) to compensate for the difference after the entry into the European Union?

And so war is the only solution to Poroshenko. Only in this way can be blamed on someone else. Because obviously Ukraine, as the country has ceased to exist.
The standard of living in Ukraine is falling and no one said a plan to solve the situation.

 

[Sonc]

Instead of solutions the Ukrainians offered ridiculous propaganda.
>>>RUS

Who defends in Debaltsevо
Here are collected the most combat ready compounds of our army.
....
One company of the brigade, 80 paratroopers, was in the Crimea in the exercises at the beginning of the occupation. This company - the only union, has withdrawn from the peninsula on its technique and weapons.
...
Formed from volunteers Maidana, who after three weeks of training headed to the front. From the first days of the war, the soldiers covered themselves with glory.

 

[Sbiker]

Instead of solutions the Ukrainians offered ridiculous propaganda.
>>>RUS

Who defends in Debaltsevо
Here are collected the most combat ready compounds of our army.
....
One company of the brigade, 80 paratroopers, was in the Crimea in the exercises at the beginning of the occupation. This company - the only union, has withdrawn from the peninsula on its technique and weapons.
...
Formed from volunteers Maidana, who after three weeks of training headed to the front. From the first days of the war, the soldiers covered themselves with glory.

And they don't look like regular army forces:

It seems, there are no regular armies on the both sides of conflict. Just a fight of eastern volunteers with western nazi with full inability of current Ukrainian administration and army to stop this chaos.

 

[PK1]

View attachment 47718

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That Twain quote is priceless!
I'm sure it's posted on the walls of RT news rooms, and in offices on Madison Av & Wall St, as well as in St. Petersburg's troll factory, aka FSB's Internet Research Agency (or Веб-бригады).

.

 

[ESay]

Doesn't Poroshenko still own the chocolate factory? Doesn't Poroshenko already have billions to invest in markets. There isn't a reason to believe that Poroshenko couldn't increase his wealth without stealing from Ukraine.

No, I don’t think that you are right in this case, bro. Poroshenko has been and always will be a theft. Look what our faithful sister wrote below. And you think that such a person will change himself and stop stealing? I have great doubts about it, bro.

And do you or your stupid acquaintances think Putin would put Ukrainian people before his very own, no matter how moral he is. Do you dummies not think Putin has his own debt obligations that he and his people must meet. Are you dummies incapable of understanding that Putin is limited in choices because of Western pressures.

Wait, wait. What are you trying to say? You are saying that the fascist junta is helping Putin and his people pay their debts?

Relax, there is no Ukraine in history, till the XIX century

So, 19th century, 20th century, the first twenty years of 21st century. Then I said it correctly – in the course of centuries.

You can not not know that Gazprom canceled the discounts for Naftogaz after Maidan.

Do I understand you correctly, bro, that in 2014 and 2015 there were no discounts?

In 2006, the discount was about ~ 70%

2006? Okay, in 2004 there were so-called Orange Revolution, Yushchenko was the president at that time. So, Russia has been supporting the American puppets since then?

This is a very serious help. There was a real plan (may be we do not know) to compensate for the difference after the entry into the European Union?

What are the problems? Russia can apply to an international court about the compensation.

 

[Sonc]

So, Russia has been supporting the American puppets since then?

Gazprom gives Ukraine a discount.
The question is "why these prices have not been used to develop the economy" ... has already to you like the Ukrainians.

What are the problems? Russia can apply to an international court about the compensation.

You are very funny.
I do not think that Russia will demand compensation.
Because from the beginning it offered a discount, but it is not issued as a credit (legally).

Such kindness is an occasion for irony and jokes =)
Well ... my dear ... Russia is a barbaric country populated by stupid Ivanov, who are not literate.
But you do have a loyal ally - Europe.
They are civilized and literate. They are formed in legal matters.
Your European friends give you help ... by N% a year =)

And your children will be slaves to the IMF.
What are the problems?

Why 25 years of independence, Ukraine is such a wonderful country ... are in such a huge ass ...
Who is guilty? Yeltsin? Putin? stars?

Or maybe... maybe... all the way as it should be? And Ukraine has finally found its true place in the world?

 

[Tehon]

No, I don’t think that you are right in this case, bro. Poroshenko has been and always will be a theft. Look what our faithful sister wrote below. And you think that such a person will change himself and stop stealing? I have great doubts about it, bro.

I'm curious to know if you voted for Poroshenko.

Point taken on Poroshenko being a thief but your point was that he was enriching himself off of Russian gas. You said Putin was supporting and enriching the junta. My point was and still is that you are full of shit. Poroshenko is not in control of the finances of Ukraine. Western banks lent money to Ukraine under very strict conditions. You are aware who the Ukrainian finance minister is no doubt. Is this not a significant point? Does it not hint at who is in control of Ukrainian finances?

Wait, wait. What are you trying to say? You are saying that the fascist junta is helping Putin and his people pay their debts?

I think Russian oil and gas accounts for roughly 50% of it's federal budget revenue. If the price of oil hadn't dropped then perhaps Putin would have been able to handle this situation differently but things are what they are.

 

[Stratford57]

Yes, Tehon, a former US State Department employee controls ALL the money within Ukraine, and we are writing pages after pages about Putin.
Natalie Jaresko - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Meanwhile I've found a few interesting links about so called investigation of MH-17 tragedy:

ORIENTAL REVIEW publishes an Open Letter to President Putin by Dutch Professor Cees J. Hamelink on the furious 3-weeks-long international media campaign blaming Russia in the tragedy of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine on July 17, 2014. Today when the perpetrators are clearly determined (a Ukrainian air wing supported by air-defence on the ground, as it was recently acknowledged by the mainstream ruling party-affiliated press in Malaysia), the governments of Netherlands, UK and Ukraine are trying to conceal the results of investigation. So now it is critically important not to let them silence the issue. We should demand a transparent investigation and bring the perpetrators (Western-backed criminal regime in Kiev) to justice.
Dutch Professor apologizing for MH17 tragedy media coverage in the Netherlands

MH17 report not released because it proves that Russia is clean

US Intelligence on Malaysian Flight MH17: Russia Didn’t Do It. "US Satellite Photos do not Support Obama’s Lies"

The U.S. government
"knows a lot more" than it's letting on about the Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 crash and is "likely hiding [the] truth,"according to former Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas).

Ron Paul Says U.S. 'Likely Hiding Truth' About MH17 Crash

According to Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov, the investigation has turned out to be neither "international," nor "independent."

Russia's Struggle for MH17 Crash Justice 'Stonewalled' – Lavrov / Sputnik International

 

[Sbiker]

Yes, Tehon, a former US State Department employee controls ALL the money within Ukraine, and we are writing pages after pages about Putin.
Natalie Jaresko - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Meanwhile I've found a few interesting links about so called investigation of MH-17 tragedy:

ORIENTAL REVIEW publishes an Open Letter to President Putin by Dutch Professor Cees J. Hamelink on the furious 3-weeks-long international media campaign blaming Russia in the tragedy of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine on July 17, 2014. Today when the perpetrators are clearly determined (a Ukrainian air wing supported by air-defence on the ground, as it was recently acknowledged by the mainstream ruling party-affiliated press in Malaysia), the governments of Netherlands, UK and Ukraine are trying to conceal the results of investigation. So now it is critically important not to let them silence the issue. We should demand a transparent investigation and bring the perpetrators (Western-backed criminal regime in Kiev) to justice.
Dutch Professor apologizing for MH17 tragedy media coverage in the Netherlands

MH17 report not released because it proves that Russia is clean

US Intelligence on Malaysian Flight MH17: Russia Didn’t Do It. "US Satellite Photos do not Support Obama’s Lies"

The U.S. government
"knows a lot more" than it's letting on about the Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 crash and is "likely hiding [the] truth,"according to former Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas).

Ron Paul Says U.S. 'Likely Hiding Truth' About MH17 Crash

According to Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov, the investigation has turned out to be neither "international," nor "independent."

Russia's Struggle for MH17 Crash Justice 'Stonewalled' – Lavrov / Sputnik International

What can they do else, except of producing choked and noisy "news"? MH17 was forced down above Ukraininan territory, from Ukrainian territory and - the main fact - it was dispatched to crash point by Ukrainian dispatchers... So, it's a reason, only Ukraine completely responsible for this accident. Other case means Ukraine is not responsible for territories of strike and crash - and all operation, called 'ATO', de facto, is continuous unlawful aggression against territories, where Ukraine don't rule.

 

[Tehon]

Who is the West’s Lead MH17 Investigator? | New Eastern Outlook

While Russia drew upon its intelligence community and military assets to acquire and analyze information regarding the MH17 tragedy, the United States and NATO, despite their immense resources have turned instead to literally the most unqualified individual within their borders to lead its own unofficial "investigation." Since the US and NATO have clearly decided to try Russia in the court of public opinion, it is only suitable that the investigation unfolds there as well.

Meet Detective Couch Potato
Leading American and NATO efforts to manage public perception regarding MH17 is professional couch-potato Eliot Higgins. Previously a laid-off government worker living in the United Kingdom, Higgins began blogging from home under the pen name "Brown Moses."

It was his association there and an apparent financial arrangement was struck alleviating his unemployment and causing Higgins to cash in his objectivity to use his somewhat unique brand of citizen journalism as a sort of trojan horse. The established media of the US, UK and much of Europe has consistently betrayed and subsequently lost the trust of the public. By cultivating "alternative journalists" to repeat mainstream lies disguised as alternative commentary, it is hoped that lost ground in manipulating the general public can be gained back.

Despite Higgins' complete lack of forensic, military, geopolitical and academic background he is endlessly deferred to and given column space throughout the largest Western papers, magazines and online journals.

 

[Stratford57]

democracy in contemporary Ukraine.

Let's see what German journalists think about democracy in Ukraine:

"Attacks on activists, not taken up investigations and civil servants, the luxury car ride: Despite pithy battle cries blooming corruption and nepotism in Ukraine continues - with fatal consequences.

Anti-corruption in Ukraine are fighting a losing battle: laws are passed, the government and media preach their implementation.For more than a year themes dominate as the fight against corruption and lustration - ie the removal of contaminated employees from public office - the public debate.But has changed so far: nothing.Journalists and activists always reveal new cases of corruption and being beaten and threatened it.

The NGO "Reanimation reform package" writes in its recent opinion: "The new Ukrainelooks in many ways the same as under President Yanukovych. "The report of civil rights is an indictment of the government of President Petro Poroshenko and Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk.Had they but taken up the cause to fight corruption and nepotism and to free items in administrative and judicial capacity of the old cadres.

While in Kiev regularly public appeal senior officials are arrested, their homes searched and tons of luxury goods such as diamonds, gold bullion, precious jewelry and lots of dollar bills found, but such actions are rather the publicity.

Also located in the west of Kiev region Zhytomyr civil rights were attacked, reported as media of corruption cases.Alexander Nikolaitschuk has made the illegal amber mining on.The raw material is mined without authorization and smuggled untaxed across the border.This leaves the destroyed nature, because the degradation occurs with deforestation and the use of chemicals.The authorities are aware of the problem, but do nothing."

Korruption in der Ukraine: Die ungebrochene Macht in den Hinterzimmern

 

[ESay]

No, I don’t think that you are right in this case, bro. Poroshenko has been and always will be a theft. Look what our faithful sister wrote below. And you think that such a person will change himself and stop stealing? I have great doubts about it, bro.

I'm curious to know if you voted for Poroshenko.

Point taken on Poroshenko being a thief but your point was that he was enriching himself off of Russian gas. You said Putin was supporting and enriching the junta. My point was and still is that you are full of shit. Poroshenko is not in control of the finances of Ukraine. Western banks lent money to Ukraine under very strict conditions. You are aware who the Ukrainian finance minister is no doubt. Is this not a significant point? Does it not hint at who is in control of Ukrainian finances?

Wait, wait. What are you trying to say? You are saying that the fascist junta is helping Putin and his people pay their debts?

I think Russian oil and gas accounts for roughly 50% of it's federal budget revenue. If the price of oil hadn't dropped then perhaps Putin would have been able to handle this situation differently but things are what they are.

Okay, okay, bro, don’t worry. You have convinced me that it is not Putin supports the junta, but it is the junta supports Putin. But you have said nothing about Putin’s support of American imperialists, then it means that you have agreed with me.

So, what we have in conclusion. Putin is selling the gas with a discount to a fascist junta in order to have some money because it is a tough time for Russia and he doesn’t have much choice. But the junta is sending this money directly to the American imperialists who put them in their pockets and send some amount of the money back to the junta in the form of credits.

Wow. It is a damn good combination for Russia. It clearly shows that our beloved Putin is a perfect strategist. Let all spiteful critics choke due to powerless rage! Viva Putin!

PS No, I didn’t.

 

[Sbiker]

No, I don’t think that you are right in this case, bro. Poroshenko has been and always will be a theft. Look what our faithful sister wrote below. And you think that such a person will change himself and stop stealing? I have great doubts about it, bro.

I'm curious to know if you voted for Poroshenko.

Point taken on Poroshenko being a thief but your point was that he was enriching himself off of Russian gas. You said Putin was supporting and enriching the junta. My point was and still is that you are full of shit. Poroshenko is not in control of the finances of Ukraine. Western banks lent money to Ukraine under very strict conditions. You are aware who the Ukrainian finance minister is no doubt. Is this not a significant point? Does it not hint at who is in control of Ukrainian finances?

Wait, wait. What are you trying to say? You are saying that the fascist junta is helping Putin and his people pay their debts?

I think Russian oil and gas accounts for roughly 50% of it's federal budget revenue. If the price of oil hadn't dropped then perhaps Putin would have been able to handle this situation differently but things are what they are.

Okay, okay, bro, don’t worry. You have convinced me that it is not Putin supports the junta, but it is the junta supports Putin. But you have said nothing about Putin’s support of American imperialists, then it means that you have agreed with me.

So, what we have in conclusion. Putin is selling the gas with a discount to a fascist junta in order to have some money because it is a tough time for Russia and he doesn’t have much choice. But the junta is sending this money directly to the American imperialists who put them in their pockets and send some amount of the money back to the junta in the form of credits.

Wow. It is a damn good combination for Russia. It clearly shows that our beloved Putin is a perfect strategist. Let all spiteful critics choke due to powerless rage! Viva Putin!

PS No, I didn’t.

What is personally YOUR benefit from this talks? Or you're just ordinal hater?

 

[PK1]

Yes, Tehon, a former US State Department employee controls ALL the money within Ukraine, and we are writing pages after pages about Putin.
Natalie Jaresko - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Meanwhile I've found a few interesting links about so called investigation of MH-17 tragedy:

ORIENTAL REVIEW publishes an Open Letter to President Putin by Dutch Professor Cees J. Hamelink on the furious 3-weeks-long international media campaign blaming Russia in the tragedy of Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine on July 17, 2014. Today when the perpetrators are clearly determined (a Ukrainian air wing supported by air-defence on the ground, as it was recently acknowledged by the mainstream ruling party-affiliated press in Malaysia), the governments of Netherlands, UK and Ukraine are trying to conceal the results of investigation. So now it is critically important not to let them silence the issue. We should demand a transparent investigation and bring the perpetrators (Western-backed criminal regime in Kiev) to justice.
Dutch Professor apologizing for MH17 tragedy media coverage in the Netherlands

MH17 report not released because it proves that Russia is clean

US Intelligence on Malaysian Flight MH17: Russia Didn’t Do It. "US Satellite Photos do not Support Obama’s Lies"

The U.S. government
"knows a lot more" than it's letting on about the Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 crash and is "likely hiding [the] truth,"according to former Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas).

Ron Paul Says U.S. 'Likely Hiding Truth' About MH17 Crash

According to Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov, the investigation has turned out to be neither "international," nor "independent."

Russia's Struggle for MH17 Crash Justice 'Stonewalled' – Lavrov / Sputnik International

---
Yes, indeed, your full-time staff of Kremlin's FSB trollers are very convincing!
All the mainstream Western press are stooges of US capitalism, and Ukraine is just a puppet like Poland. Right!

However, i'm wondering, if the MH17 disaster was Ukraine's fault, assisted by USA, then why did your master/employer Putin veto the UN resolution for a criminal tribunal?
Is papa Putin working for the USA and helping the crooks in Kiev?