Zelenski Says Trump Can't Make Him Negotiate With Russia....Practically Admitting He's Not Trying To End It

[Foxfyre]

No, you're just pretending to not know all the details/dynamics that I stated.

Pretending to not know is your attempt to not have to say that it's not true.

Have a nice day Donald. Some arguments are just too stupid to respond to. I stand by my post.

 

[Donald H]

Have a nice day Donald. Some arguments are just too stupid to respond to. I stand by my post.

If you're happy on where I set the bar then I'm happy to leave it at that too.

 

[mudwhistle]

 

[beagle9]

Surrogate to what though? I have sensed that he isn't all that strong or competent. Certainly the reforms he promised when he came to power have not happened. And he doesn't seem to want to end this war though I could be wrong about that..

But while they will not be willing to hand Putin an unqualified victory, I'm pretty sure Trump and the GOP controlled Congress will be putting conditions on Zelensky receiving any more funding from us. And as withdrawal of the U.S. would be extremely costly to the E.U., I imaging those leaders will help Trump encourage Zelensky into negotiations that can end the war on terms everybody can live with.

It's a stupid war between two corrupt countries that should be working together instead of hostilities that won't benefit anybody but has thousands of bodies piling up. A solution that produces at least some win-win for both is the best solution and increases the probability that peace will return to that region.

After all the resentment and hatred the Ukranians have for Putin and Russia, I can understand their wanting to resist any type of thoughts or thinking towards a peace agreement with Russia, especially after (for whatever reason Putin had for invading them, and whether it was legit or not), had now taken place against them.

This is exactly why neutral negotiators are needed to broker peace between two sides fighting each other, and especially if a side has laid waste to so much infrastructure and taken so many lives in the process of waring with the other side for whatever reason.

Bidens Idea of fueling the war with bullets, Intel, and equipment, and locking the opposition out of the room as if the opposition was some kind of easily defeated foe was a mistake......

Instead of brokering peace like we saw in the Bosnia/Croatian war or other war's between two factions in history, we decided to fuel the Ukraine/Russia war on one side.

Looking back at it all after the terrible destruction and death, it seems to have been a foolish thing Biden has done possibly.

What happen to our role as peace negotiators in the world ?

Example: The Dayton Accords, also known as the Dayton Peace Agreement, were a peace agreement that ended the Bosnian War in 1995:
Negotiations
The negotiations took place at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio from November 1–21, 1995. The negotiations were led by Richard Holbrooke, the chief U.S. peace negotiator, and Secretary of State Warren Christopher.
Signing
The agreement was formally signed in Paris, France on December 14, 1995.
Outcomes
The accords established a unifying governing structure for Bosnia and Herzegovina, including a Bosniak-Croat federation and the Bosnian Serb Republic. The agreement also committed to free and democratic elections with international supervision, and to respecting human rights.
Legacy
The Dayton Accords were a milestone for NATO and the Balkans, and led to the deployment of NATO's first peacekeeping force. The Dayton Constitution, which is Annex 4 of the Dayton Peace Agreement, is the current constitution of Bosnia and Herzegovina.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Explain why I would like any GD Russian?

You're an apologist for russia to.cover for the behavior of the orange rape god. Of course.

 

[Foxfyre]

After all the resentment and hatred the Ukranians have for Putin and Russia, I can understand their wanting to resist any type of thoughts or thinking towards a peace agreement with Russia, especially after (for whatever reason Putin had for invading them, and whether it was legit or not), had now taken place against them.

This is exactly why neutral negotiators are needed to broker peace between two sides fighting each other, and especially if a side has laid waste to so much infrastructure and taken so many lives in the process of waring with the other side for whatever reason.

Bidens Idea of fueling the war with bullets, Intel, and equipment, and locking the opposition out of the room as if the opposition was some kind of easily defeated foe was a mistake......

Instead of brokering peace like we saw in the Bosnia/Croatian war or other war's between two factions in history, we decided to fuel the Ukraine/Russia war on one side.

Looking back at it all after the terrible destruction and death, it seems to have been a foolish thing Biden has done possibly.

What happen to our role as peace negotiators in the world ?

Example: The Dayton Accords, also known as the Dayton Peace Agreement, were a peace agreement that ended the Bosnian War in 1995:
Negotiations
The negotiations took place at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio from November 1–21, 1995. The negotiations were led by Richard Holbrooke, the chief U.S. peace negotiator, and Secretary of State Warren Christopher.
Signing
The agreement was formally signed in Paris, France on December 14, 1995.
Outcomes
The accords established a unifying governing structure for Bosnia and Herzegovina, including a Bosniak-Croat federation and the Bosnian Serb Republic. The agreement also committed to free and democratic elections with international supervision, and to respecting human rights.
Legacy
The Dayton Accords were a milestone for NATO and the Balkans, and led to the deployment of NATO's first peacekeeping force. The Dayton Constitution, which is Annex 4 of the Dayton Peace Agreement, is the current constitution of Bosnia and Herzegovina.

Good rundown and of course Zelensky sees himself as the victim here. In his defense, there is no justification for Russia to make war on him as they did but whether or not they own it, the USA and E.U. were both rash by promoting the Ukraine joining NATO. Russian history results in them being suspicious of everybody.

But for there to be peace now, they need to stop killing each other and agree to leave each other alone. Hopefully a Trump led peace initiative will accomplish that.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Good rundown but neither the Ukraine nor Russia need restructuring. They just need to stop killing each other. Hopefully a Trump led peace initiative with accomplish that.

So Ukraine is supposed to accept a treaty and give up their land to a country that broke a treaty to invade them. Twice.

Tough sell.

 

[ThirdTerm]

According to a briefing paper leaked to the Times, Ukraine is about to go rogue by developing its own nukes as U.S. military assistance under President Trump is expected to dwindle.



The Times reported on Nov. 13 that Ukraine could develop a rudimentary nuclear bomb "within months" if U.S. military assistance under President-elect Donald Trump were to cease, according to a briefing paper prepared for the Ukrainian Defense Ministry seen by the outlet.

The report suggests that Ukraine could swiftly build a basic device using plutonium and technology similar to that of the atomic bomb the U.S. dropped on Nagasaki in 1945.

"Creating a simple atomic bomb, as the United States did during the Manhattan Project, would not be a difficult task 80 years later," the document reads.

Foreign Ministry responds to rumors of Kyiv's plans to build nuclear bomb

"Ukraine is committed to the NPT (the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons); we do not possess, develop, or intend to acquire nuclear weapons," Foreign Ministry spokesperson Heorhii Tykhyi said via X.

kyivindependent.com

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

According to a briefing paper leaked to the Times, Ukraine is about to go rogue by developing its own nukes as U.S. military assistance under President Trump is expected to dwindle.



The Times reported on Nov. 13 that Ukraine could develop a rudimentary nuclear bomb "within months" if U.S. military assistance under President-elect Donald Trump were to cease, according to a briefing paper prepared for the Ukrainian Defense Ministry seen by the outlet.

The report suggests that Ukraine could swiftly build a basic device using plutonium and technology similar to that of the atomic bomb the U.S. dropped on Nagasaki in 1945.

"Creating a simple atomic bomb, as the United States did during the Manhattan Project, would not be a difficult task 80 years later," the document reads.

Foreign Ministry responds to rumors of Kyiv's plans to build nuclear bomb

"Ukraine is committed to the NPT (the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons); we do not possess, develop, or intend to acquire nuclear weapons," Foreign Ministry spokesperson Heorhii Tykhyi said via X.

kyivindependent.com

 

[beagle9]

According to a briefing paper leaked to the Times, Ukraine is about to go rogue by developing its own nukes as U.S. military assistance under President Trump is expected to dwindle.



The Times reported on Nov. 13 that Ukraine could develop a rudimentary nuclear bomb "within months" if U.S. military assistance under President-elect Donald Trump were to cease, according to a briefing paper prepared for the Ukrainian Defense Ministry seen by the outlet.

The report suggests that Ukraine could swiftly build a basic device using plutonium and technology similar to that of the atomic bomb the U.S. dropped on Nagasaki in 1945.

"Creating a simple atomic bomb, as the United States did during the Manhattan Project, would not be a difficult task 80 years later," the document reads.

Foreign Ministry responds to rumors of Kyiv's plans to build nuclear bomb

"Ukraine is committed to the NPT (the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons); we do not possess, develop, or intend to acquire nuclear weapons," Foreign Ministry spokesperson Heorhii Tykhyi said via X.

kyivindependent.com

Dangerous escalation, even if it's just talk at this point.

Zelensky had best wait and see what Trump can do in hopes of ending the conflict for both sides, and this regardless of who might have started it or what.

Israel ain't playing when it comes to ending the Iran nuke threat, but that's not to say that the middle east conflict is the same as the Ukraine conflict, because it's not.

However, an escalation such as that type of rhetoric being true, could force the Russians hand to be played full bore against Ukraine upon receiving that type of Intel.

Not sure what the world would do in response to a nation or country like Russia, otherwise that would more likely than not attempt a crushing blow against the Ukranian capital, and it all being done due to the threat of Ukraine trying to go nuclear even if not true.

 

[Moonglow]

Explain why I would like any GD Russian?

I was trained to fight them.

I'm not some treasonous POS Marxist like Kamala and Obama.

You were trained to fight Soviets.

 

[mudwhistle]

You were trained to fight Soviets.

I was in the military during the Cold War. I was in Germany when the wall was still up.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Do you know what Putin thinks is a win?

Ukraine not in NATO

 

[mudwhistle]

Ukraine not in NATO

Ukraine wouldn't have to join NATO if Putin would stop trying to steal former Soviet lands back.

There would be no need for NATO.

NATO's primary purpose is to prevent Soviet aggression. Now they only exist to stop Russia from becoming the Soviet Union again.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Putin will blow Europe to bits rather than have NATO on its doorstep. Ukraine will become a neutral nation. Russia will give up all claims.

 

[Zavulon]

Ukraine wouldn't have to join NATO if Putin would stop trying to steal former Soviet lands back.

Russia wouldn't have to start those operations if NATO were not expanding and fought illegal and unprovoked wars in former Yugoslavia, Iraq, Syria and other places in the first place.

There would be no need for NATO.

Then why it wasn't dismissed back in 1991?

NATO's primary purpose is to prevent Soviet aggression. Now they only exist to stop Russia from becoming the Soviet Union again.

Soviet Union (as well as Russian Empire and the Great Duchy of Moscow) was created basically to defend Russian people from Western Barbarians. And this is what Russian Federation doing now - defending Russian people.

 

[beagle9]

Ukraine wouldn't have to join NATO if Putin would stop trying to steal former Soviet lands back.

There would be no need for NATO.

NATO's primary purpose is to prevent Soviet aggression. Now they only exist to stop Russia from becoming the Soviet Union again.

The North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), was created in 1949 by the United States, Canada, and several Western European nations in order to provide collective security against the Soviet Union.

NATO was the first peacetime military alliance the United States entered into outside of the Western Hemisphere.

Being it was created to stop Soviet Agression after World War Two had just ended, did it anticipate the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991 ?

The Fall .....
During the failed 1991 August coup, communist hardliners and military elites attempted to overthrow Gorbachev and stop the failing reforms. However, the turmoil led to the central government in Moscow losing influence, and ultimately that resulted in many republics proclaiming independence in the following days and months to come.

Is Putin one of those hardliners who wanted Gorbachev overthrown ? Was Gorbachev the leader who brought the Soviet Union down ? How many Russians are on Putin's side or feel like him in Russia currently ? Is the attempted taking of Ukraine by Russian hardliners, just a start of Putin's rekindling of the old Soviet block, and has he been given the green light per the west due to it's meddling in Ukraine ? How bad is this shite really ?

 

[beagle9]

Russia wouldn't have to start those operations if NATO were not expanding and fought illegal and unprovoked wars in former Yugoslavia, Iraq, Syria and other places in the first place.


Then why it wasn't dismissed back in 1991?


Soviet Union (as well as Russian Empire and the Great Duchy of Moscow) was created basically to defend Russian people from Western Barbarians. And this is what Russian Federation doing now - defending Russian people.

Your Russian speaking language that is shown in your writing tells us what your positions are in this forum.

 

[Mister Iggy]

Trump will end it.

 

[Zavulon]

Ukraine not in NATO

Not that simple.
There are three basic goals of Russia in Ukraine:
1. Denazification, which includes equal rights for ethnic Russians, Russian-speaking people, Orthodox Christians, recognition of their choice in referendums (in past and in future), free elections, ban of Neo-Nazi organisations and so on...
2. Demilitarization - which includes decrease of Ukrainian forces to 50K, and no foreign bases, mercenaries and advisors.
3. Neutral status.