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You People Who Think Separation of Church and State is Possible.......How Do You Reconcile Abortion??

Mashmont

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You people might remember my excellent thread calling for the US to become a Christian Nation It’s Time to Formally Declare America A Christian Nation. In it, I made the airtight case that separation of church and state is impossible, has never happened, and cannot ever happen, and should be amended out of the Constitution. Let's face it. The framers made a mistake, just like they did in calling blacks 3/5 human.

Separation of Church and state is possible with most laws: No littering, no running a red light, etc. But there are some laws, the most important ones, where separation is impossible without creating an atheist state. In order to have actual separation of church and state, you have to have laws which the Catholic Church and other Christians can't follow in good conscience. In other words, atheist laws. Therefore abortion and gay marriage cannot be reconciled with separation of church and state without creating an atheist state. Leftist atheists say the current reversal of Roe v Wade violates separation of church and state because it pushes religious values. I say allowing abortion makes the state tantamount to an atheist state.

I would also add the Supreme Court declared atheism a religion in 1961, so why are we favoring the religion of atheism over the Christian religions? Again, separation of church and state is impossible, so let's scrap it and done with it.

I challenge anyone in the forum who claim to want separation of church and state (probably most people) tp reconcile the issues of abortion and gay marriage with the First Amendment without promoting the religion of atheism. I guarantee no one will be able to do it.
 
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Seymour Flops

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Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support abortion rights. The Democrat in the Georgia Senate race soon to be put to a runoff is a Baptist preacher who supports abortion rights.

Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support same-sex marriage. Gay couples are married in such churches. My mother in law is leaving the Episcopal Church I believe due to its acceptance of same-sex married pastors.

If government sticks with its legitimate function, which is to preserve rights, no joining of church and state is ever needed.

If you want government to be part of the church and vice versa, my question is which church? Declining to select a church, i.e. establish a religion, does not equal an atheist state.
 

Canon Shooter

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What drivel.

Calling your own thread "excellent" is akin to the answer you'd get when asking a chef who cooks the best steak in town.

You're wet dream about us being a christian nation is comical. Not adhering to christian values doesn't make someone an Atheist. It makes them not a christian.

Practice your religion as you see fit. Enjoy it. Take joy and solace in what it brings into your life.

But try to force it on those who don't want it will result in a fight you won't win...
 

Votto

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You people might remember my excellent thread calling for the US to become a Christian Nation It’s Time to Formally Declare America A Christian Nation. In it, I made the airtight case that separation of church and state is impossible, has never happened, and cannot ever happen, and should be amended out of the Constitution. Let's face it. The framers made a mistake, just like they did in calling blacks 3/5 human.

Separation of Church and state is possible with most laws: No littering, no running a red light, etc. But there are some laws, the most important ones, where separation is impossible without creating an atheist state. In order to have actual separation of church and state, you have to have laws which the Catholic Church and other Christians can't follow in good conscience. In other words, atheist laws. Therefore abortion and gay marriage cannot be reconciled with separation of church and state without creating an atheist state. Leftist atheists say the current reversal of Roe v Wade violates separation of church and state because it pushes religious values. I say allowing abortion makes the state tantamount to an atheist state.

I challenge anyone in the forum who claim to want separation of church and state (probably most people) tp reconcile the issues of abortion and gay marriage with the First Amendment without promoting the religion of atheism. I guarantee no one will be able to do it.
The very concept of natural rights depends upon the notion that God gave men those rights that the state may try to take away, but rights that exist that men should be free to fight for.

Having said that, they also came from a country, England, whose government preached from the pulpit as the state took over those churches. It would be akin to someone like Reverend Warnock in Georgia preaching from the pulpits every morning, something the Left is Ok with as he tells you that the Bible is Ok with abortion and gay marriage. That is what the Founders DID NOT want again.

But to prohibit prayer in public or displays of religious affiliation like the 10 commandments displayed in courtrooms, in no way means that the state has taken over the pulpit, thus should be legal but are not because the Left has waged war with anything and everything they feel opposes them

As for gay marriage and abortion, you cannot outlaw them based upon Biblical law because that was not how the Constitution was set in place. If so, where does it say that? The last thing the Founders wanted was someone like Warnock reading the Bible and dictating to us what the Bible actually says. Having said that, you could say that the government by default adopted a secular outlook as a result. As such, why is the government even involved in marriage? What interest does the state giving special perks to people who decide to have certain sexual relationships? In other words, why should a gay couple or straight couple have more rights than Aunt Sue and Aunt Becky and Aunt Martha living together in a platonic relationship just because they are trying to make ends meet and survive? Marriage was a religious institution and should remain as such, but now we have Nancy Pelosi giving a thumbs down to polygamy, but a thumbs up to gay marriage. Why? There are not explanations, just money flowing in from gay lobbies and not from polygamist lobbies, that is why.

As for abortion, this is not just a religious issue. The question of when personhood begins needs to be addressed, much like the issue of personhood regarding slaves had to be addressed.
 

postman

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Separation of Church and state is possible with most laws: No littering, no running a red light, etc. But there are some laws, the most important ones, where separation is impossible without creating an atheist state. In order to have actual separation of church and state, you have to have laws which the Catholic Church and other Christians can't follow in good conscience. In other words, atheist laws. Therefore abortion and gay marriage cannot be reconciled with separation of church and state without creating an atheist state. Leftist atheists say the current reversal of Roe v Wade violates separation of church and state because it pushes religious values. I say allowing abortion makes the state tantamount to an atheist state.

Total bullshit.

Do you know how you separate church and state. If a Christian is against abortion or gay marriage, tell them they don't have to get an abortion, or marry someone of the same sex.

DONE !!!
 
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Mashmont

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Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support abortion rights. The Democrat in the Georgia Senate race soon to be put to a runoff is a Baptist preacher who supports abortion rights.

Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support same-sex marriage. Gay couples are married in such churches. My mother in law is leaving the Episcopal Church I believe due to its acceptance of same-sex married pastors.

If government sticks with its legitimate function, which is to preserve rights, no joining of church and state is ever needed.

If you want government to be part of the church and vice versa, my question is which church? Declining to select a church, i.e. establish a religion, does not equal an atheist state.
Violating the teachings of most Christians and all Catholics violates separation of church and state, because it favors atheism.
 
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Mashmont

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Total bullshit.

Do you know how you separate church and state. If a Christian is against abortion or gay marriage, tell them they don't have to get an abortion, or marry someone of the same sex.

DONE !!!
So...tell atheists they don't have to look at murals of the Ten Commandments in the town center. You agree?
 

Votto

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So...tell atheists they don't have to look at murals of the Ten Commandments in the town center. You agree?
Leftists will never agree with you.

Leftism has become the most successful religion in the world today, and it is here to snuff out any and all competing religions that don't bow their knee to the DNC like Warnock has done

Understand?
 

pknopp

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Separation of Church and State isn't in the Constitution.

You have to start with a factual position to have a discussion.
 

Votto

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Separation of Church and State isn't in the Constitution.

You have to start with a factual position to have a discussion.
Stop with the facts and play along

Kill joy.
 

dblack

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How to "reconcile" what? When religious people start trying to force their views on me, I usually just tell them to get fucked.
 
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Polishprince

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Be sure to observe the 11th commandment:

11. Thou shalt keep thy religion to thyself.


Sharing your religious faith with the Unsaved is part of the Christian faith. That's why Almighty God told His people to go out and preach to all people.

To wit:

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
 
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Mashmont

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Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support abortion rights. The Democrat in the Georgia Senate race soon to be put to a runoff is a Baptist preacher who supports abortion rights.

Plenty of Christians and Christian churches support same-sex marriage. Gay couples are married in such churches. My mother in law is leaving the Episcopal Church I believe due to its acceptance of same-sex married pastors.

If government sticks with its legitimate function, which is to preserve rights, no joining of church and state is ever needed.

If you want government to be part of the church and vice versa, my question is which church? Declining to select a church, i.e. establish a religion, does not equal an atheist state.
Warnock's brand of Christianity is a farce. No different than Fred Phelps' brand. God doesn't endorse massacre of little babies any more than He endorses hatred of gays.
 
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Mashmont

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What drivel.

Calling your own thread "excellent" is akin to the answer you'd get when asking a chef who cooks the best steak in town.

You're wet dream about us being a christian nation is comical. Not adhering to christian values doesn't make someone an Atheist. It makes them not a christian.

Practice your religion as you see fit. Enjoy it. Take joy and solace in what it brings into your life.

But try to force it on those who don't want it will result in a fight you won't win...
Great. Stop forcing your atheism on the rest of us.

As for my earlier thread, it was excellent because it got 2500 responses before it got derailed by trolls who wanted it closed.
 
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Mashmont

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The very concept of natural rights depends upon the notion that God gave men those rights that the state may try to take away, but rights that exist that men should be free to fight for.

Having said that, they also came from a country, England, whose government preached from the pulpit as the state took over those churches. It would be akin to someone like Reverend Warnock in Georgia preaching from the pulpits every morning, something the Left is Ok with as he tells you that the Bible is Ok with abortion and gay marriage. That is what the Founders DID NOT want again.

But to prohibit prayer in public or displays of religious affiliation like the 10 commandments displayed in courtrooms, in no way means that the state has taken over the pulpit, thus should be legal but are not because the Left has waged war with anything and everything they feel opposes them

As for gay marriage and abortion, you cannot outlaw them based upon Biblical law because that was not how the Constitution was set in place. If so, where does it say that? The last thing the Founders wanted was someone like Warnock reading the Bible and dictating to us what the Bible actually says. Having said that, you could say that the government by default adopted a secular outlook as a result. As such, why is the government even involved in marriage? What interest does the state giving special perks to people who decide to have certain sexual relationships? In other words, why should a gay couple or straight couple have more rights than Aunt Sue and Aunt Becky and Aunt Martha living together in a platonic relationship just because they are trying to make ends meet and survive? Marriage was a religious institution and should remain as such, but now we have Nancy Pelosi giving a thumbs down to polygamy, but a thumbs up to gay marriage. Why? There are not explanations, just money flowing in from gay lobbies and not from polygamist lobbies, that is why.

As for abortion, this is not just a religious issue. The question of when personhood begins needs to be addressed, much like the issue of personhood regarding slaves had to be addressed.
Abortion is a moral and religious issue. Allowing abortion is evil, pushes the atheist agenda and should not be permitted by government.
 

Canon Shooter

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Great. Stop forcing your atheism on the rest of us.

As for my earlier thread, it was excellent because it got 2500 responses before it got derailed by trolls who wanted it closed.

I'm not forcing anything on anyone, and I'm not an Atheist. I'm not telling you to not believe as you wish. That's what you're apparently too stupid to comprehend. You want everyone to believe as you do. Well, good luck instituting that because, as I said, that will result in you starting a fight you will most certainly come out on the shitty end of.

And the reason it got so many views is because people were fascinated by the extremist zealotry contained in it.

It was a garbage post...
 

Votto

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Abortion is a moral and religious issue. Allowing abortion is evil, pushes the atheist agenda and should not be permitted by government. Any government law that violates Christianity is wrong and shouldn't be permitted.
Agreed, but you are pushing it the wrong way

For example, you say the Founders wrote the Constitution and laws based upon the Bible. Ok, so why did they not allow polygamy that was allowed in the Bible?

Instead, you should approach this from a natural rights perspective. All men, and women, have natural rights given to us by God ( seek him and know him on your own if at all) protecting us from others snuffing out our lives under the law.. So when do those rights begin? At conception? Until viable in the womb? Only until passing out of the womb? Or maybe they should not be considered human if they hold Left wing perspectives.

See what I mean?
 
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