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If you've read the links I've already posted I'm happy to talk but I'm not interested in debating your opinion. Add something of substance or we can simply agree that you have an opinion.
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theconversation.com
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Hydrogen cars won’t overtake electric vehicles because they’re hampered by the laws of science
Everyone loves the idea of H2 cars, but they come with a huge disadvantage.
www.moneycontrol.com
Lib environmentalists dont believe it but consumers are better qualified to decide what's best for them than governmentActually, the mandates will probably be for cities, where the pollutants are concentrated in a small area. However, by 2025, the EV's will cost less, and have greater range than most ICE's. Already there are EV's on the market that have 300 to 400 miles range.
<Sigh> I give upSo do you think consumption levels are going to go down anytime soon ? I don't, the demand should peak by sometime in 2032, the developed west will be largely electric vehicles by then, while the third world demand should level off by then. Total demand should be around 1.5 trillion gallons a year. Current usage is 1.134 trillion. We are most likely past peak production with 92.5 million barrels a year. The 100 million record most likely will never be broken. US oil production is on the downslide already, even with using the filthy tar sands. When trump declared energy independence. It was a lie. It was in the middle of the pandemic and usage went down so much, we didn't need to import ( but we did anyway ).
However, they are positing this for a decade from now. By then you may be seeing batteries that 750 wth per kilo. I really don't see hydrogen as a possibility for EV's. Other purposes, yes.The laws of science are duly noted but what drives production is economics and product advantages.
Your author stated the following in your link:
"All the same, I think hydrogen fuel cells are a flawed concept. I do think hydrogen will play a significant role in achieving net zero carbon emissions by replacing natural gas in industrial and domestic heating. But I struggle to see how hydrogen can compete with electric vehicles, and this view has been reinforced by two recent pronouncements"
On the economic side:
One interesting fact is that: "hydrogen has an energy density of 35,000 watts per kilogram, while lithium-ion batteries have a density of just 200 watts per kilogram". I linked this earlier.
If you look at the cost (projections regarding the below link), the possibility is that $1 per kilogram for hydrogen could be a near-term reality.
"Feng notes that the U.S. Department of Energy Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Technologies Office has established benchmarks of technologies that can produce clean hydrogen at $2 per kilogram by 2025 and $1 per kilogram by 2030 as part of the Hydrogen Energy Earthshot target of cutting the cost of clean hydrogen by 80%, from $5 to $1 per kilogram, in one decade."
Researchers develop advanced catalysts for clean hydrogen production
New research into the design of catalysts has shown that hydrogen can be cleanly produced with much greater efficiency and at a lower cost than is possible with current commercially available catalysts.www.sciencedaily.com
I have to run but here is an article that offers a pretty good overview of the advantages hydrogen versus battery:
Lithium Ion Batteries vs Hydrogen Fuel Cell: Which is the technology of the future?
Both technologies harness electricity and leave behind zero emissions, but the similarities end there.
Happy to continue the conversation later.
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Twisting arms to sell EV's? Are you kidding? Tesla has most of their production sold well into 2022, some models into 2023. In Europe, in spite of being an imported car, the Model 3 just became the most purchased single model in 2021. In China, everybody is selling out their inventory of EV's. In the meantime, ICE vehicles are backing up on the car lots all over the world.Lib environmentalists dont believe it but consumers are better qualified to decide what's best for them than government
as for high milage ev’s they are not cheap but if you can sell them to the public without twisting arms when I have no objection to them
Government is not satisfied with free choice when it comes to the automobileTwisting arms to sell EV's? Are you kidding? Tesla has most of their production sold well into 2022, some models into 2023. In Europe, in spite of being an imported car, the Model 3 just became the most purchased single model in 2021. In China, everybody is selling out their inventory of EV's. In the meantime, ICE vehicles are backing up on the car lots all over the world.
you are such a fucking liar, here in the USA the car lots are bare, there are no new cars available, nothing, you stupid lying assholeTwisting arms to sell EV's? Are you kidding? Tesla has most of their production sold well into 2022, some models into 2023. In Europe, in spite of being an imported car, the Model 3 just became the most purchased single model in 2021. In China, everybody is selling out their inventory of EV's. In the meantime, ICE vehicles are backing up on the car lots all over the world.
The only way anybody can sell an EV is by lying. Here we have Old Crock lying his ass off. Car shortages, chip shortages, empty car lots. Drive by a New Car Lot, and check to see how many 2022 models you see.ICE vehicles are backing up on the car lots all over the world.
Just repping your sig line.Realism is oft mistaken for pessimism.
Ask your friendly neighborhood dinosaur.
Oh....wait.........
However, they are positing this for a decade from now. By then you may be seeing batteries that 750 wth per kilo. I really don't see hydrogen as a possibility for EV's. Other purposes, yes.
www.caranddriver.com
In many markets, things sell out all the time. Try getting a PlayStation 5, rare as hens teeth. Does running out mean massive demand or simply not supplying enough? Often supply is restricted to keep prices high. In 2020, the #1 EV was the Tesla model 3, sold 5,798 cars. The Ford Fiesta car sold 49,174. The top 10 EV cars in the UK sold about 34,000 cars in 2020 versus 330,000 top 10 ICE cars. Play the percentage game, EV's shot up 100%, ICE only went up 20%. But 100% sounds and looks good, hence why the media runs with it, and gullibles believe it.Tesla's, at present, no longer qualify for a subsidy because of the number already sold. However, their production is already sold out well into 2022. Looks like consumers have already decided.
Hydrogen vehicles will be viable if they can provide a kit that modifies an existing ICE vehicle to run on Hydrogen. Or at worst, to change the cylinder head as well.3 years from now in 2025 hydrogen could be more than 60% cheaper than it is today and that would already be a big advantage for the hydrogen car market - "$2 per kilogram by 2025"
Batteries are expensive, have limited energy storage capacity, present mining and recycling challenges and have a limited useful life. These stories underlines part of the problem with batteries and the frustration that arises:
Our Tesla Model 3 Has Lost 7 Percent of Battery Capacity in 24K Miles
If our car's battery continues to erode at this rate, it will qualify for replacement under Tesla's warranty.
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Now Karen, don't blow a gasket. A 10% increase for the first 11 months of 2021 for the ICE autos.you are such a fucking liar, here in the USA the car lots are bare, there are no new cars available, nothing, you stupid lying asshole
www.autonews.com
insideevs.com
Not this year, anyway. LOLMany Transit Agencies, mine included, are going to Electric Buses. fortunately for me, they WON'T be at my station. My station will continue to use good reliable diesel engines. Reason being, we have the longest and snowiest routes in the entire system in Erie and Niagara Counties.
You are a moronNow Karen, don't blow a gasket. A 10% increase for the first 11 months of 2021 for the ICE autos.
A December to remember for auto sales – or not?
December is typically one of the best months for vehicle sales. But after another month of deliveries in November suppressed by dealer inventory shortages, consumers will have trouble finding something to buy.
According to the car registration data from Experian (via Automotive News), some 378,466 electric vehicles were registered from January to October 2021, which is 94% more than in 2020 at this point. That's about 2.9% of the total market, compared to 1.7% a year ago.Dec 12, 2021
US: BEV Sales Almost Doubled In January-October 2021
The all-electric car segment in the U.S. has almost doubled year-over-year during the first 10 months of 2021, reaching new all-time records.
And worldwide, EV sales are booming;
BNEF said 2021 is estimated to be "yet another record year for EV sales globally," with 5.6 million sold. That is 83% higher than 2020 and a 168% increase over 2019 sales, the firm said.Nov 12, 2021
Global EV sales rise 80% in 2021 as automakers including Ford, GM commit to zero emissions: BNEF
New analysis from BloombergNEF is bullish on zero emission vehicles, concluding they will "capture a higher share of passenger vehicle sales, sooner than previously expected."www.utilitydive.com
Yes, Tesla is raising their prices because of demand. When you are sold out well into this year, some models into 2023, you can do that. And Tesla will be building more giga-factories and battery plants. When the Chinese start exporting vehicles, then you will see Tesla bring down some prices.In many markets, things sell out all the time. Try getting a PlayStation 5, rare as hens teeth. Does running out mean massive demand or simply not supplying enough? Often supply is restricted to keep prices high. In 2020, the #1 EV was the Tesla model 3, sold 5,798 cars. The Ford Fiesta car sold 49,174. The top 10 EV cars in the UK sold about 34,000 cars in 2020 versus 330,000 top 10 ICE cars. Play the percentage game, EV's shot up 100%, ICE only went up 20%. But 100% sounds and looks good, hence why the media runs with it, and gullibles believe it.
It's fantastic just to casually say, "Prices will come down", but a quick internet search shows that Tesla keep sneaking prices up. The idea of EV's is so amazing, governments from the start had to pay buyers a subsidy to get one. Yes, you will get a number of people that will initially buy a Tesla, and it's all guess work if those numbers increase or drop off over time.
