Zone1 Would Jesus support Donald Trump if alive today?

Again.......Asked and answered. Whether you reject or accept Hilter is moot.......unless you lived directly under His authority. If you would have lived and rejected Hitler.....the exact thing recorded in Romans 13:1 would have been your fate.

When you openly reject that authority you are at the mercy of the Authority you rejected, and "HE DOES NOT BEAR THE SWORD IN VAIN. (Romans 13) You would have been subject to that authority even up to and including the death penalty.

You have free will to make your own decisions/judgments. You are free to reject or accept Hitler in the context of documented history. Did you actually reject Hitler or are you presenting a STRAW ARGUMENT, a logical fallacy pretending that you rejected Hitler while He was in power? Regardless of your personal projections, Hitler received Judgment from the same authority that allowed His SOCIAL FASCISM to consume a great deal of Europe, the Middle East, and Africia. He was removed from authority through the wrath projected by other nations which were appointed by the same God.

Final thought: There is no man (with the exception of Jesus Christ, who lived and died by the letter of the law, sin free) who does not make judgments/decisions that end in Sin. If you logically follow out your personal objections in judging God and His judgments in appointing whom He will for what purpose He might decide to reveal to mankind.......you would have the CHRIST crucified and hung for no reason in vain
Not a straw man, an example situation that was real, during that time....

Oh for goodness sake! I am NOT judging God.....where do you get that from?

And I know we are all sinners, and all fall short of the glory of God.

And yes we do have free will to choose our path.. And sometimes that might lead to death or captivity.

Are you implying that in order to save our own life, during Hitler's time, we were suppose to support him, because he was the leader God ordained to power?

THAT is where we differ,, if I understood your point and argument?
 
My former self. Whats with the human sacrifice blood lust? Someone dying, an innocent man, so you can live? Do you have absolutely no inkling, no clue, how reprehensible that is?

Believe me. My former self was guilty.

I would never let an innocent person die even an animal for something I did. Thats fucked up.

Even if I did that would not render karma null and void. It is beyond stupidity to believe it can.

FYI, the resurrection is not about the resumption of a former existence but entry into a new existence, the metamorphosis from mortal to immortal becoming a new creature on earth immune to the poison of serpents. Your sorcery and lies have absolutely no effect on me.

You should pray harder for the Antichrist, your powerful supernatural mangod to destroy me.

:eusa_pray:

Mazel tov!
And again, you simply deny Scripture when it contradicts what you want to believe.

Have you figured out yet whether it's 2,000 years or 7 1/2?
 
And that's just it, the only "commandment" I've seen him express any interest in is that malarky he says about eating the flesh of animals that don't ruminate. Nothing about loving the Lord with all your heart and your neighbor as yourself.
That's because he playing a sick game. He's a miltant atheist trying to subvert Christianity.
 
I would never let an innocent person die even an animal for something I did. Thats fucked up.
Would you sacrifice your life for the life of someone else?

Jesus willingly sacrificed his life for others as an act of love to pay for human sins. He did not consider his death a forced tragedy, but a premeditated, voluntary act over which he had authority to both lay down and take up again.

Key Aspects of Jesus' Voluntary Sacrifice:
  • Explicit Statements: Jesus stated in John 10:18 and John 10:15, "No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord".
  • Purpose: He came to serve and give his life as a ransom for many (Mark 10:45).
  • Love as Motivation: His sacrifice was rooted in love for humanity and obedience to the Father.
  • Authority: He was not at the mercy of Pilate, religious leaders, or Satan, but allowed himself to be taken to fulfill his mission.
Despite experiencing anguish, he voluntarily proceeded with the sacrifice.
 
...the resurrection is not about the resumption of a former existence but entry into a new existence, the metamorphosis from mortal to immortal becoming a new creature on earth immune to the poison of serpents.
The doctrine of the resurrection is central to Christianity – so much so that St. Paul states:

If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead… Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied (1Cor 15:13-15,18-19).

It is truly extraordinary that Paul made the claim that if there is no resurrection from the dead, that the faith of believers is useless and that all who have died in Christ have died in their sins. Paul knows that if he is lying, he and the other disciples have jeopardized the salvation of the whole Christian community, and furthermore he emerges as a false witness (a perjurer) before God, and is answerable to Him. The consequences of lying to (or even deceiving) believers about the resurrection cannot be overstated, because the resurrection is the foundation of Jesus’ claim to be the exclusive Son of God – and the unconditional love of God with us.

After Jesus' resurrection, the apostles, especially Peter, immediately began preaching the Gospel, notably starting with Peter's sermon on Pentecost (Acts 2), which led to thousands of conversions, with all the apostles dispersing to preach globally, including Paul (an apostle to the Gentiles) and Thomas (to India). They all became witnesses to the resurrection, traveling widely, establishing churches, and facing martyrdom to spread the message of Jesus' death, burial, and resurrection.

Key Apostles & Their Post-Resurrection Ministry:
  • Simon Peter: Preached the first sermon after Pentecost, leading thousands to Christ, and ministered to Jews and Gentiles, eventually martyred in Rome.
  • John: A key leader alongside Peter and James, he also wrote significant parts of the New Testament.
  • James, son of Zebedee: Part of Jesus' inner circle, he was martyred early.
  • Matthew: The evangelist, he preached in various Mediterranean communities before his martyrdom in Ethiopia.
  • Thomas (Doubting Thomas): Known for his missionary work in India, where he established churches and was martyred.
  • James, brother of Jesus: Became the first bishop of Jerusalem and a major leader in the early church.
  • Paul: Though not one of the original twelve, he became a prominent apostle, chosen to preach the gospel to the Gentiles, emphasizing the resurrection message.
The Apostolic Mission:
  • Witnessing the Resurrection: Their primary role became bearing witness to Jesus' resurrection, as seen in Peter's powerful sermon in Acts.
  • Dispersion: After Jesus' ascension, the apostles scattered to different parts of the world, fulfilling the command to preach the Gospel everywhere.
  • Martyrdom: Most apostles, including Peter, Paul, and Matthew, faced persecution and were martyred for their faith, solidifying their commitment to the resurrected Christ.
Your sorcery and lies have absolutely no effect on me.
The risen Christ appeared to a variety of individuals and groups, with accounts in the Bible describing appearances to at least eight different groups of people over a 40-day period. While the Bible details specific instances, it does not explicitly state that these were the only appearances.

In all Jesus appeared a dozen different times over forty days to more than 515 individuals. He appeared to women and to men, He appeared to individuals and to groups, He appeared indoors and outdoors, He appeared to people who were skeptics and people who were believers, He appeared to people who were hardhearted and people who were tenderhearted. And He talked with people, He ate with people, He even invited Thomas - the skeptic, the doubter - to put his finger in the nail holes in His hands, put his hand in the spear wound in His side - to see and touch the evidence himself. Then what was Thomas's reaction? To say, "My Lord and my God!" He became convinced by the evidence that Jesus had returned from the dead. And what does history tell us about Thomas? He spent the rest of his life declaring Jesus did return from the dead, He is the Son of God, even to the point of being put to death for his faith in southern India.

Here's a breakdown of some of the groups Jesus appeared to:


All four canonical Gospels make a concerted and central effort to portray that Jesus rose from the dead, presenting it as a physical, historical, and transformative event. While the narratives differ in specific details—which scholars often interpret as complementary, independent eyewitness accounts rather than contradictions—they consistently agree on the core truth that the tomb was empty and Jesus appeared to his followers.

Key Evidence of a Concerted Effort

The Gospels employ several strategies to assert the reality of the resurrection:
  • The Empty Tomb & Early Witnesses: All four Gospels record that women were the first witnesses to the empty tomb on Sunday morning, an detail that would have been unlikely to be fabricated in 1st-century Jewish culture where a woman's testimony was often not accepted.
  • Physicality of the Risen Jesus: To combat early notions that Jesus only rose spiritually, the Gospels emphasize a physical resurrection. Luke 24:39-43 describes Jesus eating fish and showing his "flesh and bones," while John 20:24-29 features Jesus inviting Thomas to touch his wounds.
  • Post-Resurrection Appearances: The Gospels record multiple appearances to individuals and groups, including Mary Magdalene, other women, the disciples in locked rooms, and on the road to Emmaus, designed to prove he was alive.
  • The Great Commission: The Gospel narratives culminate in Jesus appearing to his disciples to authorize their mission, cementing the resurrection as the foundation of the Christian faith.
Thematic Differences in the Narratives

While the message is consistent, the authors emphasize different aspects:
  • Matthew (28): Highlights the earthquake, the guarding of the tomb, and Jesus' appearance to the women.
  • Mark (16): Originally ends abruptly with the empty tomb and fearful women, though the longer ending (16:9-20) adds later,, traditional post-resurrection appearances.
  • Luke (24): Focuses on the road to Emmaus appearance and the physical, touchable nature of Jesus, emphasizing the fulfillment of Scripture.
  • John (20-21): Provides detailed accounts of Mary Magdalene at the tomb and the doubting Thomas scene, placing strong emphasis on the personal, intimate nature of the interactions.
The consistent, albeit varied, reporting of these events suggests a deliberate effort by the gospel writers to affirm that the resurrection was not a myth or legend, but a concrete event.
 
And again, you simply deny Scripture when it contradicts what you want to believe.
What I want to believe? Nah.

For you to "believe" that you can escape the hand of God in this life or the next and avoid paying the penalty for your own sins by celebrating the death of an innocent man, the Jewish Messiah, crucified as "a perfect human sacrifice" to a trinity on the Mithran cross is OBJECTIVELY reprehensible. You understand neither scripture nor the power of God.

You have been beguiled by a devil into doing the exact opposite of what God commands.
'
Thats not what I want to believe, thats what I know because my eyes can see, my ears can hear, and my mind can perceive what is OBVIOUS. A genuine miracle! Amazing isn't it? lol.
 
What I want to believe? Nah.

For you to "believe" that you can escape the hand of God in this life or the next and avoid paying the penalty for your own sins by celebrating the death of an innocent man, the Jewish Messiah, crucified as "a perfect human sacrifice" to a trinity on the Mithran cross is OBJECTIVELY reprehensible. You understand neither scripture nor the power of God.

You have been beguiled by a devil into doing the exact opposite of what God commands.
'
Thats not what I want to believe, thats what I know because my eyes can see, my ears can hear, and my mind can perceive what is OBVIOUS. A genuine miracle! Amazing isn't it? lol.
And you have to deny Scripture to maintain your warped beliefs. That's obvious.
 
And you have to deny Scripture to maintain your warped beliefs.
So you think believing an innocent man died for YOUR SINS is not reprehensible and I am warped for knowing it is as reprehensible or even worse than if you let an innocent man die for what you did because it is Jesus who someone is supposed to believe you love so much.

Fascinating!

Thanks for sharing.

:cuckoo:
 
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So you think believing an innocent man died for YOUR SINS is not reprehensible...
Jesus willingly sacrificed his life for others as an act of love to pay for human sins. He did not consider his death a forced tragedy, but a premeditated, voluntary act over which he had authority to both lay down and take up again.

Key Aspects of Jesus' Voluntary Sacrifice:
  • Explicit Statements: Jesus stated in John 10:18 and John 10:15, "No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord".
  • Purpose: He came to serve and give his life as a ransom for many (Mark 10:45).
  • Love as Motivation: His sacrifice was rooted in love for humanity and obedience to the Father.
  • Authority: He was not at the mercy of Pilate, religious leaders, or Satan, but allowed himself to be taken to fulfill his mission.
Despite experiencing anguish, he voluntarily proceeded with the sacrifice.
 
So you think believing an innocent man died for YOUR SINS is not reprehensible and I am warped for knowing it is as reprehensible as if you let an innocent man die for what you did? Fascinating! Thanks for sharing. :cuckoo:
I think this is a perfect example of you are at war and you are not at peace. Other people's beliefs should not make you this crazy.
 
Would Jesus condemn Trump? Why does the left have to bring Christ into their political arguments these days?

The answer is very very simple, instead of going to what some people said, including Jesus, look at what he DID.

So, who did He condemn? Not the Roman (political) leaders, who at that time would have deserved it much much more than Trump, but the RELIGIOUS leadership.

Does that answer your question?
 
Jesus willingly sacrificed his life for others as an act of love to pay for human sins. He did not consider his death a forced tragedy, but a premeditated, voluntary act over which he had authority to both lay down and take up again.

Key Aspects of Jesus' Voluntary Sacrifice:
  • Explicit Statements: Jesus stated in John 10:18 and John 10:15, "No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord".
  • Purpose: He came to serve and give his life as a ransom for many (Mark 10:45).
  • Love as Motivation: His sacrifice was rooted in love for humanity and obedience to the Father.
  • Authority: He was not at the mercy of Pilate, religious leaders, or Satan, but allowed himself to be taken to fulfill his mission.
Despite experiencing anguish, he voluntarily proceeded with the sacrifice.
1773421235918.webp
 
So, who did He condemn? Not the Roman (political) leaders, who at that time would have deserved it much much more than Trump, but the RELIGIOUS leadership.
Yes, the RELIGIOUS LEADERSHIP that was in cahoots with the political forces of the enemy.

Just like trump was supprted by religious nut jobs as he embraced every dictator, despot, and fascist tyrant all over the world while prancing around like the king of fools, the epitome of the talking serpent, Jesus would condemn the RELIGIOUS LEADERSHIP for nonfeasance.
 
So you think believing an innocent man died for YOUR SINS is not reprehensible and I am warped for knowing it is as reprehensible or even worse than if you let an innocent man die for what you did because it is Jesus who someone is supposed to believe you love so much.

Fascinating!

Thanks for sharing.

:cuckoo:
You have to deny Scripture to deny that, it simply doesn't matter what you think, it's what Scripture tells us.

So, 2,000 or 7 1/2?
 
You have to deny Scripture to deny that, it simply doesn't matter what you think, it's what Scripture tells us...
Thats may be what scripture tells "us" whatever "us" is but what it tells me is that y'all have no love for Jesus at all. Jesus warned his sleeping disciples to pray to be spared "the test".

YOU FAILED. You only love and practice deceit.

You are an actor and lying fraud who understands neither scripture nor the power of God.
 
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Thats may be what scripture tells "us" whatever "us" is but what it tells me is that y'all have no love for Jesus at all. Jesus warned his sleeping disciples to pray to be spared the test.

YOU failed.

You are an actor and lying fraud who understands neither scripture nor the power of God.
Your continued denial of Scripture does you no favors. You keep putting your personal feelings before it.
 
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Your continued denial of Scripture does you no favors. You keep putting your personal feelings before it.
It is not a "feeling" to know that it is OBJECTIVELY reprehensible to let an innocent man die for your crimes, your sins, instead of you who is guilty and even worse that you would throw Jesus, who you are supposed to love so much, under the bus, your beloved mangod. Pft

Now you know.

How is it that you don't know what scripture requires, the only right course to take right now?
 
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It is not a "feeling" to know that it is OBJECTIVELY reprehensible to let an innocent man die for your crimes, your sins, instead of you who is guilty and even worse that you would throw Jesus, who you are supposed to love so much, under the bus, your beloved mangod. PFT.

How is it that you don't know what scripture requires, the only right course to take now?
You claim to champion the Law, the Law that is replete with living sacrifice, but deny it.
 
You claim to champion the Law, the Law that is replete with living sacrifice, but deny it.
No, I already showed you how the Laws of ritual slaughter have nothing to do with shedding blood or slaughtering anything except figuratively. Do you want me to show you yet again?
 
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