Why is it in the progressive liberal's DNA to blame something?

[emilynghiem]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

^ spent 8 years blaming Obama for his own problems

TheOldSchool

Poor choice of example.
Obama pushing ACA mandates and declaring "right to health care as the law of the land"
CAUSED MANY PEOPLE problems on both left and right and people outside both parties.

He did happen to cause other people's problems.

What you can say that WOULD be more fair,
is for ding to say that progressives must have this blame projection in their DNA
is like blaming all of them as a projection in itself.

You could argue he's doing the same thing "they" do by saying the
problem is only coming from one side; "Theirs"

it is this separation in our minds of "them vs us" that fuels this very dynamic

If we remove that mental barrier and agree that ALL people go into grief mode,
and will start "denying and projecting" when angry at problems or injustice we didn't choose to suffer
from actions of others, then we can identify this as universal that all people experience when grieving and
trying to ad dress and overcome a collective problem that is much larger than we can change by ourselves.

 

[Care4all]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Except, more Americans voted for her and chose her, OVER Trump

 

[The Great Goose]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org/CHRguide.html
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Progressives are psychopaths. They harm a victim and then to justify that victim is in the wrong they convince themselves that the victim in some way forced them to harm the victim. Then they get angry at the victim for that and harm them again and again and again and again.

They are really dangerous and you can't judge them the same way you judge others. They don't know how to compromise. If you try to compromise with them you will lose.

 

[ding]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Except, more Americans voted for her and chose her, OVER Trump

Not in the states that mattered. In those states, the people rejected the policies of the last 8 years because they decided those policies were not in their best interest.

Are you blaming the electoral college for her loss? In terms of the margin that mattered, this was a landslide.

Can you hear us now?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Why is it in the progressive liberal's DNA to blame something?

Applies not just to "progressive liberal".
Conservative Republicans are also blaming "something".

Few could have predicted a Trump presidency.

And ask yourself why that is? Could it be the corrupt MSM that led us to believe that in the first place?

 

[emilynghiem]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org/CHRguide.html
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Emily, every single progressive believes without exception that the less fortunate are that way because they have been cheated; that they did not have the same opportunity for success; that they were held back because of their race or class.

Dear ding I think you are describing the equivalent of the scarcity mentality.

people with faith in the abundance mentality understand self-empowerment.

people who do not, can fall into the trap of victimhood and helplessness.

So let's break this down into steps to see how anyone can go through this:
when you or I feel "outnumbered" by this larger group of "progressives" blaming
"us" as enabling the bigots who are causing the oppression of minorities they seek to defend,
then you and I naturally defend ourselves, and we are going to point out how they are now bullying us,
in the same manner they accuse others. So they aren't so powerless or blameless if they do the same!

The difference between you and me is that I can talk to fellow progressives as one of their own colleagues.
If they don't see me that way but as a pawn of the other side, that's the victimhood talking again.
but the ones who CAN see that I'm on their side, can try to adapt better ideas from both of us working together.

I do the same with my prolife friends who feel victimized by the LGBT and liberal prochoice left.
We speak in Christian terms as a fellow Constitutionalist who is on the side of not allowing such abuses of govt either!

ding I have found this trend of blaming the other side
on BOTH sides, because BOTH are bullied and victimized/demonized by the other.

this isn't helping to undo the programming ding

By blaming the DNA of progressives, that only further divides and fuels ill will.

I would say the common "DNA" is fear and unforgiveness.
We overcome that, and both sides stop the namecalling and blame game.

Agreed?

If you are still grieving, I respect your natural expression of blaming progressives for their DNA.
To me it's the scarcity mentality based on fear and not forgiving past injustices
that are seen as oppression from class division.

First step is to forgive the past injustices and mutual oppression going on.
Then we can clear our hearts and minds emotionally, and do more of the
inclusive dialogue that you ask to be more OBJECTIVE.

You are right that we can be more objective, but like I said before about biases,
We are still going to drag those into any conversation or perception we hold.
Thanks for being honest about your bias that progressives are "born" that way.

The oppression and victim abuse mentality can be passed from generation to generation,
but it can still be overcome and healed by deep spiritual Forgiveness and healing.

then even the most deep rooted inbred "bad karma or ill will"
can be release and recovered from, through the same grief process
I described before, that all people go through, individually in our own ways and paths,
and collectively as cultures, nations, tribes, parties and all humanity as a whole.

We are all going through the stages of grief and recovery.
So all this is in our spiritual DNA to confront and overcome in order to grow up spiritually.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Liberals are very childish by nature. We can see that with the current events all this week. They are not protesting anything, they are venting their anger because they didn't get their way like an 8 year old.

Their adolescent behavior explains why they need a mommy and daddy; It Takes a Village. So they depend on big government to provide them with their needs and desires. It's why the biggest infraction in society today is to hurt somebody's feelings. The more attention you give them, the worse they act out, so the media is putting gasoline on the fire.

 

[ding]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Emily, every single progressive believes without exception that the less fortunate are that way because they have been cheated; that they did not have the same opportunity for success; that they were held back because of their race or class.

Dear ding I think you are describing the equivalent of the scarcity mentality.

people with faith in the abundance mentality understand self-empowerment.

people who do not, can fall into the trap of victimhood and helplessness.

So let's break this down into steps to see how anyone can go through this:
when you or I feel "outnumbered" by this larger group of "progressives" blaming
"us" as enabling the bigots who are causing the oppression of minorities they seek to defend,
then you and I naturally defend ourselves, and we are going to point out how they are now bullying us,
in the same manner they accuse others. So they aren't so powerless or blameless if they do the same!

The difference between you and me is that I can talk to fellow progressives as one of their own colleagues.
If they don't see me that way but as a pawn of the other side, that's the victimhood talking again.
but the ones who CAN see that I'm on their side, can try to adapt better ideas from both of us working together.

I do the same with my prolife friends who feel victimized by the LGBT and liberal prochoice left.
We speak in Christian terms as a fellow Constitutionalist who is on the side of not allowing such abuses of govt either!

ding I have found this trend of blaming the other side
on BOTH sides, because BOTH are bullied and victimized/demonized by the other.

this isn't helping to undo the programming ding

By blaming the DNA of progressives, that only further divides and fuels ill will.

I would say the common "DNA" is fear and unforgiveness.
We overcome that, and both sides stop the namecalling and blame game.

Agreed?

If you are still grieving, I respect your natural expression of blaming progressives for their DNA.
To me it's the scarcity mentality based on fear and not forgiving past injustices
that are seen as oppression from class division.

First step is to forgive the past injustices and mutual oppression going on.
Then we can clear our hearts and minds emotionally, and do more of the
inclusive dialogue that you ask to be more OBJECTIVE.

You are right that we can be more objective, but like I said before about biases,
We are still going to drag those into any conversation or perception we hold.
Thanks for being honest about your bias that progressives are "born" that way.

The oppression and victim abuse mentality can be passed from generation to generation,
but it can still be overcome and healed by deep spiritual Forgiveness and healing.

then even the most deep rooted inbred "bad karma or ill will"
can be release and recovered from, through the same grief process
I described before, that all people go through, individually in our own ways and paths,
and collectively as cultures, nations, tribes, parties and all humanity as a whole.

We are all going through the stages of grief and recovery.
So all this is in our spiritual DNA to confront and overcome in order to grow up spiritually.

Emily, actually it is called an external locus of control.

Locus of Control. ... Students with an “external locus of control” generally believe that their successes or failures result from external factors beyond their control, such as luck, fate, circumstance, injustice, bias, or teachers who are unfair, prejudiced, or unskilled.

 

[emilynghiem]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Emily, every single progressive believes without exception that the less fortunate are that way because they have been cheated; that they did not have the same opportunity for success; that they were held back because of their race or class.

Dear ding I think you are describing the equivalent of the scarcity mentality.

people with faith in the abundance mentality understand self-empowerment.

people who do not, can fall into the trap of victimhood and helplessness.

So let's break this down into steps to see how anyone can go through this:
when you or I feel "outnumbered" by this larger group of "progressives" blaming
"us" as enabling the bigots who are causing the oppression of minorities they seek to defend,
then you and I naturally defend ourselves, and we are going to point out how they are now bullying us,
in the same manner they accuse others. So they aren't so powerless or blameless if they do the same!

The difference between you and me is that I can talk to fellow progressives as one of their own colleagues.
If they don't see me that way but as a pawn of the other side, that's the victimhood talking again.
but the ones who CAN see that I'm on their side, can try to adapt better ideas from both of us working together.

I do the same with my prolife friends who feel victimized by the LGBT and liberal prochoice left.
We speak in Christian terms as a fellow Constitutionalist who is on the side of not allowing such abuses of govt either!

ding I have found this trend of blaming the other side
on BOTH sides, because BOTH are bullied and victimized/demonized by the other.

this isn't helping to undo the programming ding

By blaming the DNA of progressives, that only further divides and fuels ill will.

I would say the common "DNA" is fear and unforgiveness.
We overcome that, and both sides stop the namecalling and blame game.

Agreed?

If you are still grieving, I respect your natural expression of blaming progressives for their DNA.
To me it's the scarcity mentality based on fear and not forgiving past injustices
that are seen as oppression from class division.

First step is to forgive the past injustices and mutual oppression going on.
Then we can clear our hearts and minds emotionally, and do more of the
inclusive dialogue that you ask to be more OBJECTIVE.

You are right that we can be more objective, but like I said before about biases,
We are still going to drag those into any conversation or perception we hold.
Thanks for being honest about your bias that progressives are "born" that way.

The oppression and victim abuse mentality can be passed from generation to generation,
but it can still be overcome and healed by deep spiritual Forgiveness and healing.

then even the most deep rooted inbred "bad karma or ill will"
can be release and recovered from, through the same grief process
I described before, that all people go through, individually in our own ways and paths,
and collectively as cultures, nations, tribes, parties and all humanity as a whole.

We are all going through the stages of grief and recovery.
So all this is in our spiritual DNA to confront and overcome in order to grow up spiritually.

Emily, actually it is called an external locus of control.

Locus of Control. ... Students with an “external locus of control” generally believe that their successes or failures result from external factors beyond their control, such as luck, fate, circumstance, injustice, bias, or teachers who are unfair, prejudiced, or unskilled.

Dear ding so isn't blaming the projection on "DNA" outside your control or mine?
And I'm saying addressing the denial and division as a MUTUAL dynamic
does PUT it BACK on the level of equal access and ability to change for you and me as it does for "them" instead of a cause outside our control externally.

So this is recognizing the cause and the ability to change it
resides EQUALLY WITHIN our reach, inside you or me as it does inside with them.
So we CAN have an INTERNAL locus that affects how "progressives" respond and interact
to overcome this victim mentality by connecting with each other as equals. Not as external groups projecting blame on each other.

 

[The Great Goose]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Emily, every single progressive believes without exception that the less fortunate are that way because they have been cheated; that they did not have the same opportunity for success; that they were held back because of their race or class.

Dear ding I think you are describing the equivalent of the scarcity mentality.

people with faith in the abundance mentality understand self-empowerment.

people who do not, can fall into the trap of victimhood and helplessness.

So let's break this down into steps to see how anyone can go through this:
when you or I feel "outnumbered" by this larger group of "progressives" blaming
"us" as enabling the bigots who are causing the oppression of minorities they seek to defend,
then you and I naturally defend ourselves, and we are going to point out how they are now bullying us,
in the same manner they accuse others. So they aren't so powerless or blameless if they do the same!

The difference between you and me is that I can talk to fellow progressives as one of their own colleagues.
If they don't see me that way but as a pawn of the other side, that's the victimhood talking again.
but the ones who CAN see that I'm on their side, can try to adapt better ideas from both of us working together.

I do the same with my prolife friends who feel victimized by the LGBT and liberal prochoice left.
We speak in Christian terms as a fellow Constitutionalist who is on the side of not allowing such abuses of govt either!

ding I have found this trend of blaming the other side
on BOTH sides, because BOTH are bullied and victimized/demonized by the other.

this isn't helping to undo the programming ding

By blaming the DNA of progressives, that only further divides and fuels ill will.

I would say the common "DNA" is fear and unforgiveness.
We overcome that, and both sides stop the namecalling and blame game.

Agreed?

If you are still grieving, I respect your natural expression of blaming progressives for their DNA.
To me it's the scarcity mentality based on fear and not forgiving past injustices
that are seen as oppression from class division.

First step is to forgive the past injustices and mutual oppression going on.
Then we can clear our hearts and minds emotionally, and do more of the
inclusive dialogue that you ask to be more OBJECTIVE.

You are right that we can be more objective, but like I said before about biases,
We are still going to drag those into any conversation or perception we hold.
Thanks for being honest about your bias that progressives are "born" that way.

The oppression and victim abuse mentality can be passed from generation to generation,
but it can still be overcome and healed by deep spiritual Forgiveness and healing.

then even the most deep rooted inbred "bad karma or ill will"
can be release and recovered from, through the same grief process
I described before, that all people go through, individually in our own ways and paths,
and collectively as cultures, nations, tribes, parties and all humanity as a whole.

We are all going through the stages of grief and recovery.
So all this is in our spiritual DNA to confront and overcome in order to grow up spiritually.

Emily, actually it is called an external locus of control.

Locus of Control. ... Students with an “external locus of control” generally believe that their successes or failures result from external factors beyond their control, such as luck, fate, circumstance, injustice, bias, or teachers who are unfair, prejudiced, or unskilled.

I've got that, except with me, it's actually true.

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

Sounds like another intolerant human hemorrhoid.

Sounds like another cancerous commie moonbat.

 

[PK1]

Are you blaming the electoral college for her loss? In terms of the margin that mattered, this was a landslide.

The electoral college gets some blame, since Clinton won the pop vote.
However, the lack of Instant Runoff voting (when no candidate gets 50%) is the bigger culprit.

Polls showed that many young supporters of Sen. Bernie Sanders voted for Gary Johnson. If all the Stein voters and a quarter of Gary Johnson's supporters had voted for Clinton, she would have carried Pennsylvania, and the score would have been Clinton 278 and Trump 260, leading to President Clinton. If 27% of Johnson's supporters, rather than 25%, had voted for Clinton, that would have flipped Florida as well, leading to Clinton 307 and Trump 231.

We should be using instant runoff voting and also their backup choice if their first choice doesn't have a majority.[/QUOTE]

 

[ding]

First of all because they have elevated their beliefs to a religion. Secondly, they believe that all behaviors should lead to equal outcomes, so when they don't they must blame someone or something for the failure. Case in point, we all know why Hillary lost, she lost because she is a lousy candidate and more Americans rejected the social policies of the Democrats than Americans who accepted their progressive social policies. In short, they are behaving like religious fanatics whose religion is being attacked by a rival religion.

Dear ding
Just because the most vocal progressives are because they are projecting blame,
does NOT make them the majority. The militant and most visible Terrorists are a fraction of their populations terrorizing the majority who are peaceful.
but which do you think you are going to see and hear in the public and media:
the quite ones or the louder more vocal and visible ones?

Projection of blame is due to
* unforgiveness emotionally
* the grief process of working through anger about perceived injustice, oppression or imbalance.
* ill will, division and distrust between groups, which is a MUTUAL dynamic it takes both sides to change, not just one side blaming it all on the other.

So this is universal, that all humans go through this, and we are going to grieve,
express either anger or sadness, and we are going to struggle to understand
"how much is within our control, how much is outside, how to tell the difference, and what to do either way."

So you are looking at the human grief process in action.
Everyone goes through this, in our own ways and timing,
around different issues or lifechanging events.

The key is FORGIVENESS. That brings healing, and restores peace of mind,
so people can think more clearly.

But all people are human, and need to vent upset and grieve,
before working through bargaining and resolution, to get to peace.

the more Compassion we have for others going through grief,
the Sooner we can turn that anger into more constructive energy toward solutions.

Everyone grieves, goes through denial and rejection, anger and projection.
Not just progressives, not just the far right or the far left.
Anyone who has experienced frustration or oppression
because conflicts weren't resolved and the bigger bully silenced the opposition
knows this same struggle and the absolute "questioning of one's whole
perspective on life" that comes with it. The soul searching.

One sociologist explained that people have such an INNATE sense of justice
that when something goes wrong, we try to make sense of what caused it,
and that's why the projection of blame and victimhood issue comes up.
People want an explanation to fit their narrative on good trumping bad,
so they envision it must be the other person, even the victims of rape or wrong,
who had to do something wrong for this to happen, or else they 'can't explain' it,
and lose sense of security if this could happen to them as innocent people.

They have to have some wrong to blame it on to explain how to prevent or fix it.

So if they can't see their part in what went wrong, they blame the other side.
That makes it easier to explain the cause and how to fix it or prevent it.

If the fear they could be the next innocent rape or crime victim, and can't imagine
it being random or it could equally happen to them and that is too disturbing,
it is EASIER to find fault with the victim of rape, to ASSURE themselves
that's why it happened, and it would not happen to them because they wouldn't set themselves up.

So people justify right and wrong to maintain a sense of security,
that there is justice in the world and a cause to injustice they can find and change so they don't feel so powerless,
so they can focus and prepare themselves for prevention and correction,
and this goes on by trial and error until they really figure it all out.

If they wrongly explain away a problem, where it doesn't really solve it but was false justification,
then the same cycle repeats until we figure out the REAL root cause and fix it.

Again I find the root cause is unforgiveness that breeds ill will,
but other people call this FEAR that skews people's judgment.

ding if you FEAR this group you call the progressive left,
then that fear is fueling the same "unforgiveness" causing denial and projection
"outside onto external groups." instead of recognizing this same process going on within ourselves.

So by the time you confront your fear or ill perception toward "progressives" as an "it" a "them"
outside yourself, you will have gone through the same grief to overcome denial/projection
that these "progressives" are going through, too.

BTW I consider myself a progressive who sympathizes on the left.
I just had the grief crushed out of me so many times, I stopped fighting it
and just focus on solutions that all sides can agre e on, so there isn't this
constant sidetaking and projecting anger on blame back and forth all the time.

I still struggle to forgive the horrible legal and political bullying and abuses going on.
So I have my anger and my yelling "WTF can't we get past this already" going on.
But I try to forgive all sides equally, or align with those who CAN forgive things I can't.
I hope if you run into walls you can't forgive, you continue allying with people like
me who can get past those walls. And vice versa, cuz I need the same help when I can't get past something.

I hope some of this makes sense to you.
Since you are looking at the big picture of dialogue between conflicting sides,
I hope you can see how the dynamic is mutual on both sides.

The more both sides forgive, they can get past the projection and division.
Where both sides have ill will, hard feelings, and resentment that projects,
this can hinder the dialogue needed to fix the root causes of both sides' concerns and objections.

Thanks ding I'm glad in a way that you identify as outside the progressive movement,
so you can help check me when I'm projecting a bias that comes from that culture and language.

If you and I both identified as that, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
so if we are going to learn to bridge the gap in culture and mindset,
it makes sense you coming from outside that perspective looking in,
has to meet halfway with someone from that perspective reaching out.

http://www.houstonprogressive.org
Guidelines for Sharing - principles for intercultural dialogue

Emily, every single progressive believes without exception that the less fortunate are that way because they have been cheated; that they did not have the same opportunity for success; that they were held back because of their race or class.

Dear ding I think you are describing the equivalent of the scarcity mentality.

people with faith in the abundance mentality understand self-empowerment.

people who do not, can fall into the trap of victimhood and helplessness.

So let's break this down into steps to see how anyone can go through this:
when you or I feel "outnumbered" by this larger group of "progressives" blaming
"us" as enabling the bigots who are causing the oppression of minorities they seek to defend,
then you and I naturally defend ourselves, and we are going to point out how they are now bullying us,
in the same manner they accuse others. So they aren't so powerless or blameless if they do the same!

The difference between you and me is that I can talk to fellow progressives as one of their own colleagues.
If they don't see me that way but as a pawn of the other side, that's the victimhood talking again.
but the ones who CAN see that I'm on their side, can try to adapt better ideas from both of us working together.

I do the same with my prolife friends who feel victimized by the LGBT and liberal prochoice left.
We speak in Christian terms as a fellow Constitutionalist who is on the side of not allowing such abuses of govt either!

ding I have found this trend of blaming the other side
on BOTH sides, because BOTH are bullied and victimized/demonized by the other.

this isn't helping to undo the programming ding

By blaming the DNA of progressives, that only further divides and fuels ill will.

I would say the common "DNA" is fear and unforgiveness.
We overcome that, and both sides stop the namecalling and blame game.

Agreed?

If you are still grieving, I respect your natural expression of blaming progressives for their DNA.
To me it's the scarcity mentality based on fear and not forgiving past injustices
that are seen as oppression from class division.

First step is to forgive the past injustices and mutual oppression going on.
Then we can clear our hearts and minds emotionally, and do more of the
inclusive dialogue that you ask to be more OBJECTIVE.

You are right that we can be more objective, but like I said before about biases,
We are still going to drag those into any conversation or perception we hold.
Thanks for being honest about your bias that progressives are "born" that way.

The oppression and victim abuse mentality can be passed from generation to generation,
but it can still be overcome and healed by deep spiritual Forgiveness and healing.

then even the most deep rooted inbred "bad karma or ill will"
can be release and recovered from, through the same grief process
I described before, that all people go through, individually in our own ways and paths,
and collectively as cultures, nations, tribes, parties and all humanity as a whole.

We are all going through the stages of grief and recovery.
So all this is in our spiritual DNA to confront and overcome in order to grow up spiritually.

Emily, actually it is called an external locus of control.

Locus of Control. ... Students with an “external locus of control” generally believe that their successes or failures result from external factors beyond their control, such as luck, fate, circumstance, injustice, bias, or teachers who are unfair, prejudiced, or unskilled.

Dear ding so isn't blaming the projection on "DNA" outside your control or mine?
And I'm saying addressing the denial and division as a MUTUAL dynamic
does PUT it BACK on the level of equal access and ability to change for you and me as it does for "them" instead of a cause outside our control externally.

So this is recognizing the cause and the ability to change it
resides EQUALLY WITHIN our reach, inside you or me as it does inside with them.
So we CAN have an INTERNAL locus that affects how "progressives" respond and interact
to overcome this victim mentality by connecting with each other as equals. Not as external groups projecting blame on each other.

How am I blaming their DNA for their behavior of blaming? We all have free will to choose if we will be accountable. Just because someone has become conditioned to blame an external source for their failure doesn't mean they didn't have a choice in the matter.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. Showing someone how to be accountable will not make them become accountable. That will only happen when they are forced to suffer the consequences of their actions. They can either keep repeating the same mistakes (i.e. the mistake of not being accountable) or they can learn from them which can only happen if they accept responsibility and analyze where they went wrong.