Why do you support illegal immigration?

[KMAN]

FYI - Illegal Immigration is a crime. Lawyer, Lawyers, Attorney, Attorneys, Law, Legal Information - FindLaw


So why do you support illegal immigration?



United States Code
TITLE 8 - ALIENS AND NATIONALITY
CHAPTER 12 - IMMIGRATION AND NATIONALITY
SUBCHAPTER II - IMMIGRATION
PART VIII - GENERAL PENALTY PROVISIONS


U.S. Code as of: 01/03/05
Section 1325. Improper entry by alien

(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection;
misrepresentation and concealment of facts
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States
at any time or place other than as designated by immigration
officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration
officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United
States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the
willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first
commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or
imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent
commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or
imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(b) Improper time or place; civil penalties
Any alien who is apprehended while entering (or attempting to
enter) the United States at a time or place other than as
designated by immigration officers shall be subject to a civil
penalty of -
(1) at least $50 and not more than $250 for each such entry (or
attempted entry); or
(2) twice the amount specified in paragraph (1) in the case of
an alien who has been previously subject to a civil penalty under
this subsection.

Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not
in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be
imposed.
(c) Marriage fraud
Any individual who knowingly enters into a marriage for the
purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be
imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or fined not more than
$250,000, or both.
(d) Immigration-related entrepreneurship fraud
Any individual who knowingly establishes a commercial enterprise
for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws
shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, fined in accordance
with title 18, or both.

 

[Reality]

FYI - Illegal Immigration is a crime. Lawyer, Lawyers, Attorney, Attorneys, Law, Legal Information - FindLaw


So why do you support illegal immigration?

So is smoking pot. So was anal sex between consenting adults in some states until 4 seconds ago. So was spitting on the sidewalk. So was being black and drinking from the wrong water fountain not all that long ago in some places. All laws.

So I'm going to change your question from the misnomer you presented. Why does illegal immigration not concern me?

In my view the talking points about expenses to government is overblown. Largely,we are talking about education and healthcare services.

Everyone should be allowed access to institutions of education. In my view, not even building a wall (that no one wants to pay for) will stop the majority of illegal immigration. Its just too big of a land border. If thats the case, then we don't want to force these people into dependency and poverty and enable them to be self dependent. Education is the single greatest investment government can make, and it should be denied to no one. In my view, denying education to illegals only encourages the social problems that come with immigrants from what is basically a third world country.

On healthcare, I'm just never going to support turning people away from the emergency room, I don't care who they are.

So those two expenses are acceptable to me.

With that said, these people really do provide needed services in many industries. These people can't go collect welfare or other public assistance, so they are forced into these below wage jobs. Kicking illegals out of the country en masse sounds great to some, until their cost to have their offices cleaned increases x5.

And my overriding principle is simple. If I'm standing in a third world country looking over a fence at the richest country in the world with the most jobs in the world, I'm going, not standing around thinking about the morality of the issue. These people simply are trying to get theirs, just like we all wake up and do every day.

 

[KMAN]

So is smoking pot. So was anal sex between consenting adults in some states until 4 seconds ago. So was spitting on the sidewalk. So was being black and drinking from the wrong water fountain not all that long ago in some places. All laws.

So I'm going to change your question from the misnomer you presented. Why does illegal immigration not concern me?

In my view the talking points about expenses to government is overblown. Largely,we are talking about education and healthcare services.

Everyone should be allowed access to institutions of education. In my view, not even building a wall (that no one wants to pay for) will stop the majority of illegal immigration. Its just too big of a land border. If thats the case, then we don't want to force these people into dependency and poverty and enable them to be self dependent. Education is the single greatest investment government can make, and it should be denied to no one. In my view, denying education to illegals only encourages the social problems that come with immigrants from what is basically a third world country.

On healthcare, I'm just never going to support turning people away from the emergency room, I don't care who they are.

So those two expenses are acceptable to me.

With that said, these people really do provide needed services in many industries. These people can't go collect welfare or other public assistance, so they are forced into these below wage jobs. Kicking illegals out of the country en masse sounds great to some, until their cost to have their offices cleaned increases x5.

And my overriding principle is simple. If I'm standing in a third world country looking over a fence at the richest country in the world with the most jobs in the world, I'm going, not standing around thinking about the morality of the issue. These people simply are trying to get theirs, just like we all wake up and do every day.

So are you saying that if the whole country of Mexico wants to come to the US that American citizens should pay for it? Currently there are about 20 million illegals here (estimate obviously differ) but if they are made legal and let's say they bring just 2 of their family members to the US, that's 60 million new citizens just like that. We currently have roughly 300 million people in this country so we will be adding 20% to the population. With our economy the way it is right now do you think this country could survive?

I assume you would not have a problem if an illegal immigrant broke into your house because he was looking for a new place to live, no? Or would you rather they ask your permission?

 

[ReillyT]

Currently there are about 20 million illegals here (estimate obviously differ) but if they are made legal and let's say they bring just 2 of their family members to the US, that's 60 million new citizens just like that.

And if they all brought 10 family members, that would be 220 million. Is this really your argument? You fear that the entire population of Mexico is going to cross the border?

 

[KMAN]

And if they all brought 10 family members, that would be 220 million. Is this really your argument? You fear that the entire population of Mexico is going to cross the border?

No, I want to know why you are for illegal immigration. So why are you for it?

 

[ReillyT]

No, I want to know why you are for illegal immigration. So why are you for it?

I think Reality pretty much conveys my sentiments as well.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

And if they all brought 10 family members, that would be 220 million. Is this really your argument? You fear that the entire population of Mexico is going to cross the border?

Reasonable fear. 20 percent of Mexico is ALREADY here illegally. Why? Because the 80's our idiot Government had an amnesty and granted a slew of illegals the right to stay. Now they want to do the EXACT same thing for 20 million more.

In a couple years when we have another 20 MILLION illegal Mexicans in the country we can all give them an amnesty too. AT this rate Mexico will be part of the use soon enough.

 

[KMAN]

I think Reality pretty much conveys my sentiments as well.

Ok so I ask you the same questions....

So are you saying that if the whole country of Mexico wants to come to the US that American citizens should pay for it? Currently there are about 20 million illegals here (estimate obviously differ) but if they are made legal and let's say they bring just 2 of their family members to the US, that's 60 million new citizens just like that. We currently have roughly 300 million people in this country so we will be adding 20% to the population. With our economy the way it is right now do you think this country could survive?

I assume you would not have a problem if an illegal immigrant broke into your house because he was looking for a new place to live, no? Or would you rather they ask your permission?

 

[ReillyT]

Reasonable fear. 20 percent of Mexico is ALREADY here illegally. Why? Because the 80's our idiot Government had an amnesty and granted a slew of illegals the right to stay. Now they want to do the EXACT same thing for 20 million more.

In a couple years when we have another 20 MILLION illegal Mexicans in the country we can all give them an amnesty too. AT this rate Mexico will be part of the use soon enough.

Great. Manifest Destiny going south. We get Mexico and then Canada and there is no stopping us. Pretty soon we also have the sweet beaches of Costa Rica.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Illegal ALIENS should be deported, they should be hunted down, rounded up and evicted from this country. And the border should be made secure so they can not just walk back in.

Anyone that makes a habit of hiring them should be fined until they get the idea it does not pay to hire them. Anyone caught smuggling them in should be jailed for 10 years and if not an American citizen deported when the term is up.

That you dumb shits think it is nothing to pay for 20 MILLION illegals schooling and medical care is amazing. They do NOT pay taxes, no property tax and no income tax. They pay nothing into the school system they pay nothing into the medical system, they are a complete dead weight. And there are 20 MILLION of them. 20 percent of Mexico is in the US illegally. 1 in 5. There are about 300 million American citizens that means for 15 Americans there is an illegal Mexican in this country. With the potential to climb even higher.

And you dipsticks want amnesty. Amnesty did not work before, it made it WORSE. Ever hear the one about learning from history not to make the same mistakes over and over?

 

[ReillyT]

Ok so I ask you the same questions....

So are you saying that if the whole country of Mexico wants to come to the US that American citizens should pay for it? Currently there are about 20 million illegals here (estimate obviously differ) but if they are made legal and let's say they bring just 2 of their family members to the US, that's 60 million new citizens just like that. We currently have roughly 300 million people in this country so we will be adding 20% to the population. With our economy the way it is right now do you think this country could survive?

I assume you would not have a problem if an illegal immigrant broke into your house because he was looking for a new place to live, no? Or would you rather they ask your permission?

It is not clear that these levels of immigration don't actually benefit the economy. It is an open question.

As for crime, I don't know that illegal immigration actually increases levels of crime per capita (aside from the illegality of the immigration itself). Crime has fallen in the last 15 years in most major US cities, which also have the highest levels of illegal immigrants.

 

[editec]

We have too damned many illegals.

Securing the border DOEs make sense.

Why both parties are not completely behind controlling this problem (and they clearly are NOT) should be a tip off about BOTH parties, doncha' think?

Still here we are bashing each other like we are personally the problem.

 

[CharlestonChad]

That you dumb shits

And you dipsticks

KMAN, here's our first specimen. Not a lib though.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

We have too damned many illegals.

Securing the border DOEs make sense.

Why both parties are not completely behind controlling this problem (and they clearly are NOT) should be a tip off about BOTH parties, doncha' think?

Still here we are bashing each other like we are personally the problem.

The two main parties have entirely different reasons for thinking illegal ALIENS are good. However of the two parties the Republican one has a grass roots movement to stop it where as the Democrats all think amnesty is the cure.

The dems want more voters beholden to them, the Republicans think it is good for the economy. They are both wrong. But of the two, the party that has any chance of doing anything about it is Republican, why, cause the base does NOT support the leadership on this and has thrown them out once for not listening already.

 

[ReillyT]

Illegal ALIENS should be deported, they should be hunted down, rounded up and evicted from this country. And the border should be made secure so they can not just walk back in.

What if this is not practicable? What if the costs involved to the economy and in enforcement costs would be unreasonably high?

Anyone that makes a habit of hiring them should be fined until they get the idea it does not pay to hire them. Anyone caught smuggling them in should be jailed for 10 years and if not an American citizen deported when the term is up.

That you dumb shits think it is nothing to pay for 20 MILLION illegals schooling and medical care is amazing. They do NOT pay taxes, no property tax and no income tax. They pay nothing into the school system they pay nothing into the medical system, they are a complete dead weight. And there are 20 MILLION of them. 20 percent of Mexico is in the US illegally. 1 in 5. There are about 300 million American citizens that means for 15 Americans there is an illegal Mexican in this country. With the potential to climb even higher.

And you dipsticks want amnesty. Amnesty did not work before, it made it WORSE. Ever hear the one about learning from history not to make the same mistakes over and over?

Despite all of this, there are economic benefits to the presence of illegal immigrants that may outweigh the economic costs. If it were determined that the benefits outweigh the costs (all of them), would you still feel so strongly about illegal immigration, and if so, why? If it benefits the country, would you approve of legalizing these immigrants?

 

[Abelian Sea]

Why both parties are not completely behind controlling this problem (and they clearly are NOT) should be a tip off about BOTH parties, doncha' think?

I find that pretty glaring, myself.

There seems to be a glass ceiling for concern about this immigration trend. There seems to be plenty of it at the grassroots level, but by the time you get to the influencial crust of either party, those concerns have evaporated either into nothing or into an insubstantial talking-point smokescreen.

Clearly, this type and level of immigration is benefiting somebody. Somebody with real clout.

 

[Tech_Esq]

So is smoking pot. So was anal sex between consenting adults in some states until 4 seconds ago. So was spitting on the sidewalk. So was being black and drinking from the wrong water fountain not all that long ago in some places. All laws.

So I'm going to change your question from the misnomer you presented. Why does illegal immigration not concern me?

In my view the talking points about expenses to government is overblown. Largely,we are talking about education and healthcare services.

Everyone should be allowed access to institutions of education. In my view, not even building a wall (that no one wants to pay for) will stop the majority of illegal immigration. Its just too big of a land border. If thats the case, then we don't want to force these people into dependency and poverty and enable them to be self dependent. Education is the single greatest investment government can make, and it should be denied to no one. In my view, denying education to illegals only encourages the social problems that come with immigrants from what is basically a third world country.

On healthcare, I'm just never going to support turning people away from the emergency room, I don't care who they are.

So those two expenses are acceptable to me.

With that said, these people really do provide needed services in many industries. These people can't go collect welfare or other public assistance, so they are forced into these below wage jobs. Kicking illegals out of the country en masse sounds great to some, until their cost to have their offices cleaned increases x5.

And my overriding principle is simple. If I'm standing in a third world country looking over a fence at the richest country in the world with the most jobs in the world, I'm going, not standing around thinking about the morality of the issue. These people simply are trying to get theirs, just like we all wake up and do every day.

This U.S. News and World Report piece (h/t DRJ) asks:

[W]hat do low-skilled immigrants cost America? Everything has its costs, of course. According to a new analysis by Robert Rector of the conservative Heritage Foundation, the average low-skilled immigrant household received $30,160 in direct benefits, means-tested benefits, education, and other services from all levels of government in 2004.

By contrast, low-skill immigrant households paid only $10,573 in taxes that year, meaning the average low-skill household had a fiscal deficit of $19,588. And what about retirement costs? Rector estimates that if all the current adult illegal immigrants in the United States were granted amnesty, the net retirement costs to government (benefits minus taxes) could be over $2.5 trillion.

A 2003 analysis by the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas concluded that while high-skilled immigration had “good economic effects”–it added to economic growth and helped government finances–low-skilled immigration was more of a mixed picture. “The economic benefits are there as well but have to be balanced against the fiscal impact, which is likely negative,” explained economist Pia Orrenius.

 

[KMAN]

It is not clear that these levels of immigration don't actually benefit the economy. It is an open question.

As for crime, I don't know that illegal immigration actually increases levels of crime per capita (aside from the illegality of the immigration itself). Crime has fallen in the last 15 years in most major US cities, which also have the highest levels of illegal immigrants.

Are you serious about not knowing if an increase in people who take from the system and don't pay into the system hurts the economy????????? Evidentally you don't have kids... Let me enlighten you... The more children you have the more your cost goes up...

Now back to my question... Do you think it is ok for illegals to break into your house? Or would you like for them to ring the doorbell and ask to come in?

 

[KMAN]

KMAN, here's our first specimen. Not a lib though.

I see it....

 

[Tech_Esq]

So is smoking pot. So was anal sex between consenting adults in some states until 4 seconds ago. So was spitting on the sidewalk. So was being black and drinking from the wrong water fountain not all that long ago in some places. All laws.

So I'm going to change your question from the misnomer you presented. Why does illegal immigration not concern me?

In my view the talking points about expenses to government is overblown. Largely,we are talking about education and healthcare services.

Everyone should be allowed access to institutions of education. In my view, not even building a wall (that no one wants to pay for) will stop the majority of illegal immigration. Its just too big of a land border. If thats the case, then we don't want to force these people into dependency and poverty and enable them to be self dependent. Education is the single greatest investment government can make, and it should be denied to no one. In my view, denying education to illegals only encourages the social problems that come with immigrants from what is basically a third world country.

On healthcare, I'm just never going to support turning people away from the emergency room, I don't care who they are.

So those two expenses are acceptable to me.

With that said, these people really do provide needed services in many industries. These people can't go collect welfare or other public assistance, so they are forced into these below wage jobs. Kicking illegals out of the country en masse sounds great to some, until their cost to have their offices cleaned increases x5.

And my overriding principle is simple. If I'm standing in a third world country looking over a fence at the richest country in the world with the most jobs in the world, I'm going, not standing around thinking about the morality of the issue. These people simply are trying to get theirs, just like we all wake up and do every day.

The problem in criminal justice is much worse than we were led to believe. Our county has been on the cutting edge of local government enforcement of illegal immigration. The program is that every time a stop is made by a police officer the immigration status of the person stopped is checked. The expectation was that about 40 illegals per month would be detained and held for ICE to deport. In the first 3 month over 700 were detained. We fill our jail and several surrounding counties jails. ICE was slow off the mark as usual. There was a crisis in this declining tax revenue year, we needed more money or the county would have to suspend the plan. You know what? We got them some more money. How effective is it? The Mexican government is investigating Prince William county because of it. Illegals are leaving in droves before they get caught. MS-13 related crime is down dramatically.

Immigrants are great. Just come here legally and we'll all be cool. Come here illegally and we will bust your ass! http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/17/us/17prison-cnd.html?ref=us