Zone1 What is the Conservative View of the United States Constitution

[White 6]

What requires you to do that?

To go along and abide by the rulings of the Supreme Court? Article III of the U.S. Constitution, which vests judicial power in one supreme court. As I said, I support the US Constitution.

 

[PeterPilot]

To go along and abide by the rulings of the Supreme Court? Article III of the U.S. Constitution, which vests judicial power in one supreme court. As I said, I support the US Constitution.

Yes, I understand all that, but a close reading of Article III will reveal to you that it does not command a single thing from a US citizen like yourself. There is nothing in the document saying "Citizens shall follow the findings of the court" or words to that effect.

You choose voluntarily to abide by the rulings, and that's fine by me. My only point is that there is no federal law commanding you or me to follow court decisions.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

The Constitution is what makes America work.

IMHO...the Framers wanted a constant battle regarding what constrains or unconstrains....

That is not the word you are looking for, since it is not a real word. I suggest something else.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

You shouldn't. If SCOTUS told you to jump over a bridge, would you?

For example, Marbury vs Madison gave SCOTUS complete authority on determining what is Constitutional and what is not. Jefferson was enraged by that ruling, and said that was wrong.

Right not, Justice Brown is an absolute laughing stock, as her own Left wing loons try to splain to her that she does not really understand the issues being brought before her, or that she is not following proper procedures.

And yes, justice Brown, we all know what a woman is, thanks for asking.



And no, if the Left puts in 8 more stooges like her, what the hell to I care what they say about the Constitution?

I don't.

Who is Justice Brown. Did you mean Justice Jackson?

 

[MarathonMike]

No, not really.

In terms of legal jargon, it is pretty straight forward, so much so, it pisses off the Left.

"High Crimes and Misdemeanors" for one example.

 

[White 6]

Yes, I understand all that, but a close reading of Article III will reveal to you that it does not command a single thing from a US citizen like yourself. There is nothing in the document saying "Citizens shall follow the findings of the court" or words to that effect.

You choose voluntarily to abide by the rulings, and that's fine by me. My only point is that there is no federal law commanding you or me to follow court decisions.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I took that oath freely, without reservation or purpose of evasion.

 

[PeterPilot]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I took that oath freely, without reservation or purpose of evasion.

The oath to protect and defend, I presume. Yes, so did I.

The larger point I'm trying to make is that the document does not make a single command to any citizen. If you know of one, I would appreciate your pointing it out.

The document simply creates the federal government, our liberty grants it specific and enumerated powers, defines the relationship with the states who created the federal government, and defines the rights retained by we the people in creating this government meant to serve us.

 

[Foxfyre]

The United States Constitution formed the Federal Government. The Constitution spelled out at functions for the Federal Government. The Bill of Rights also provided specifics around things like religion, free speech, arms, and other things.

But, we are in a constant battle regarding what constrains or unconstrains our Federal Government. The courts, constant challenges and outright disregard all have a hand in how things proceed.

Curious to know, from conservatives what their view of the constitution is and how that view affects what is determined by the U.S. Constitution.

Rules:

1. Disagreement is encouraged in a productive way. No absolute pronouncments.
2. No bashing of those on the other side or their opinions.
3. No predictions of the future.

As one the left might describe as 'conservative' (among other things), I can say my view of the Constitution is that of the Founders as revealed in the founding documents they left us re their thinking, debates, beliefs, arguments regarding what the Constitution should be, should protect, should be limited by.

 

[HikerGuy83]

As one the left might describe as 'conservative' (among other things), I can say my view of the Constitution is that of the Founders as revealed in the founding documents they left us re their thinking, debates, beliefs, arguments regarding what the Constitution should be, should protect, should be limited by.

And what are some of your key views on what the Constitution says.

As an example: The Bill of Rights says congress shall make no laws regarding the establishment of religion. To me that says we can do whatever we want in the public arena with regards to religion and it's none of Congress' business. We can have prayer in school. We can prayer in our businesses. We can have the ten commandments and the Quran or whatever else the people want in our court houses.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Everyone,

This is a Zone 1 and I have listed 3 rules of my own. I have reported several posts.

Please stay with the questions of the OP or debate responses.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Economic Authoritarians are Economic Conservatives "

* Civil Authoritarians Are Social Conservatives *

The United States Constitution formed the Federal Government. The Constitution spelled out at functions for the Federal Government. The Bill of Rights also provided specifics around things like religion, free speech, arms, and other things.

But, we are in a constant battle regarding what constrains or unconstrains our Federal Government. The courts, constant challenges and outright disregard all have a hand in how things proceed.

Curious to know, from conservatives what their view of the constitution is and how that view affects what is determined by the U.S. Constitution.

Rules:

1. Disagreement is encouraged in a productive way. No absolute pronouncments.
2. No bashing of those on the other side or their opinions.
3. No predictions of the future.

The liberal versus conservative paradigm is over generalized with contradictory nonsense .

When a political policy is founded in civil libertarianism , it is a public policy for social liberalism .

When a political policy is founded in economic libertarianism , it is a public policy for economic liberalism .

When a political policy is founded in civil authoritarianism , it is a public policy for social conservatism .

When a political policy is founded in civil libertarianism , it is a public policy for social liberalism .

 

[HikerGuy83]

I very much like the idea of a Constitution, but I am very displeased with the one we currently have.

Are you a conservative? Just asking.

What, in the current constitution, displeases you and why?

 

[Foxfyre]

And what are some of your key views on what the Constitution says.

As an example: The Bill of Rights says congress shall make no laws regarding the establishment of religion. To me that says we can do whatever we want in the public arena with regards to religion and it's none of Congress' business. We can have prayer in school. We can prayer in our businesses. We can have the ten commandments and the Quran or whatever else the people want in our court houses.

That was the Founders' view. For instance, they believed the Bible had a place in all the schools and the federal government could promote that but not mandate it. The Quran was not an issue at that time as there was little or no Islamic presence in the USA at that time.

Certainly student led prayer, singing traditional religious based Christmas carols, celebrating/recognizing/observing Christmas, Thanksgiving, Easter or any other religious holiday/festival/tradition received no interference from the government.

 

[HikerGuy83]

That was the Founders' view. For instance, they believed the Bible had a place in all the schools and the federal government could promote that but not mandate it. The Quran was not an issue at that time as there was little or no Islamic presence in the USA at that time.

Certainly student led prayer, singing traditional religious based Christmas carols, celebrating/recognizing/observing Christmas and Easter or any other religious holiday/festival/tradition received no interference from the government.

Yes, that is why I posted what I did.

I was using it as an example of what I'd like to hear from you and others regarding the constitution and what it means to you or what you think it means in general.

Examples of big points of contention:

General Welfare Clause
10th amendment
Selective Incorporation

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

And what are some of your key views on what the Constitution says.

As an example: The Bill of Rights says congress shall make no laws regarding the establishment of religion. To me that says we can do whatever we want in the public arena with regards to religion and it's none of Congress' business. We can have prayer in school. We can prayer in our businesses. We can have the ten commandments and the Quran or whatever else the people want in our court houses.

You can pray in school anytime you want, as long as you do not force others to participate.

Great sentence! How does one "prayer"? You have the right to pray anytime you want, but you can't force others to do it.

No, you can't have religious content in our court houses because those are places of government, not religion. That would be establishment.

I want my church out of my government and government out of my church. I happen to want both the federal government and church out of my schools.

 

[HikerGuy83]

You can pray in school anytime you want, as long as you do not force others to participate.

Great sentence! How does one "prayer"? You have the right to pray anytime you want, but you can't force others to do it.

No, you can't because those are places of government, not religion.

I want my church out of my government and government out of my church. I happen to want both the federal government and church out of my schools.

What you want is yours to own.

The USC says nothing about what the local school district can or cannot do. That is a state and local matter.

That is my view. It is not necessarily what I want.

But, in my view, if a local district wants to pray, they can, and no court has any standing to prevent that. There is nothing in the Constitution that says as much.

Now, if the state constitution prohibits it, that is up to the state to deal with.

 

[Foxfyre]

Yes, that is why I posted what I did.

I was using it as an example of what I'd like to hear from you and others regarding the constitution and what it means to you or what you think it means in general.

Examples of big points of contention:

General Welfare Clause
10th amendment
Selective Incorporation

There would be very few points of contention if all Americans were required to study, without partisan interpretation or prejudice, the founding documents and agreed on the basics of original intent of the Constitution as the Founders saw it.

And, we still would have those who believe the Constitution should be fluid and interpreted according to modern culture or whatever. But I think most would go with the original intent.

But the Founders too did not always agree on how much power the central government should have. The debates between the federalists and anti-federalists were interesting and profound and compromise was required in order to get all the existing colonies to ratify the final document and then the Bill of Rights.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Its whatever Orange Jesus says it is.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

What you want is yours to own.

The USC says nothing about what the local school district can or cannot do. That is a state and local matter.

That is my view. It is not necessarily what I want.

But, in my view, if a local district wants to pray, they can, and no court has any standing to prevent that. There is nothing in the Constitution that says as much.

Now, if the state constitution prohibits it, that is up to the state to deal with.

University of Southern California or South Carolina? That is not a well-known abbreviation of the Constitution.

The First Amendment says that there will be no establishment of religion and whether you like it or not our schools are an extension of government. Did you ever notice that private schools are not bound by this requirement? This is a long-settled issue, despite your personal beliefs. We cannot help it if you are wrong. The 1st Amendment gave us guidance.

 

[HikerGuy83]

The First Amendment says that there will be no establishment of religion and whether you like it or not our schools are an extension of government.

It says congress shall pass no laws regarding the establishment of religion.

State sponsored religions existed up until 1833 and were never challenged at the federal level.

If they are an extension of government, it is the state government and the USC has no say in that.