What is Meant When Someone Uses the Words "Un-American" or "Anti-American"

Coloradomtnman

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What is Meant When Someone Uses the Words "Un-American" or "Anti-American" about another American?

Do they mean that the person wants to destroy the U.S. outright, not just the government but its citizens and culture?

Because I can't think of what else it might mean.

The terms seem to be used a lot more than is safe. I do remember my history lessons, and no body thinks what McCarthy did was a just thing.

I hear conservatives accusing the President of being un-American or anti-American and I would like to ask, "What exactly do you mean by that?"

If you mean that he is trying to cause the end of the United States as a nation, I have to disagree and wonder what could cause someone to react so vehemently to his political perspective. If they mean that he is attempting to destroy the American ideal, then I would like an explanation of what the American ideal is?

From my point of view the American ideal is a government which is a democratic republic, which is a government by the people for the people. I don't see how Obama isn't representing his consituency. I'm an American and he's doing (if not exactly what I would like) just fine by me. I could want him do more, and do things which are more to my liking(like a single payer system for health care - but at least we made the first step...), but I don't see how reacting as though he is trying to destroy us is valid.

I don't see how socialism and freedom are not synonymous (especially when I look at almost all other Western democracies...) unless one believes freedom means acquiring wealth and property. That's just how I see it. If you don't see it that way I don't think you're un-American or anti-American, its just how you see it. You believe that government shouldn't do all the things that I think it should. You don't think government is a tool for the people the way I believe it is. Ok. No big deal.

Pale Rider and I could hang out in a bar, drinking whiskey and telling stories. Perhaps if we started talking politics we'd come to blows (though I would hope not) - but otherwise we'd get along just fine. I don't think he's trying to harm people or is evil or is a traitor or is a bad person. The way he sees things is the way he sees things, and the way he believes is just the way he believes and the only thing that's gonna change him is him - not me. So I can get angry, call him names, get physical, and end up nothing to show for it but a new enemy - one who is one of my countrymen, an American. Just like I am.

Or we can talk about things, and maybe see the world in a broader frame of mind, become friends instead of enemies, and maybe even find a solution that works for both of us. And if it doesn't work perfectly, at least the compromise is better than nothing but potential hatred and violence from both sides. Take the the current health care reform, which IMHO, kinda sucks, but I do like it better than it was: no more pre-existing conditions, more purchasing power for small businesses, etc. And I don't know for a fact, but I could guess that Pale Rider doesn't like the new system either, but there must be something about that even he thinks ais an improvement on the old system.

So he and I could hate eachother because we don't like what the other wants, or we could think that its not all bad and at least we don't hate each other.

Because that's what I think someone means when they say "un-American" or "anti-American" - that they hate who it is they're accusing of such ambiguous, nebulous, and vaguely bad intentions or behavior - its no longer just disagreement.

You could just let it go and live for today.
 

jswiftproposal

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yeah..... what he said.....

no but seriously THANK YOU for writing that... thank you.... so much... :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2: :clap2:
 
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What is Meant When Someone Uses the Words "Un-American" or "Anti-American" about another American? ...

It means that the other person stands against the principles on which America was founded...

Most often, this is directed towards those individuals who adhere to the principle-less notions of the Ideological Left. As the full measure of that ideology stands in diametric opposition to those Immutable American Principles...

Often Leftists are found lamenting their being unqualified for the title of American... usually found defining the definition of America DOWN to the lowest common denominator; rendering the value of the term to meaningless... typically one wherein America amounts to a term of geography.

So the SAME idiot that DEMANDS THAT "THEY'RE AMERICANS TOO!" need to define what being an American IS... down to being absolutely NOTHING!
 

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What is Meant When Someone Uses the Words "Un-American" or "Anti-American" about another American? ...

It means that the other person stands against the principles on which America was founded...

Most often, this is directed towards those individuals who adhere to the principle-less notions of the Ideological Left. As the full measure of that ideology stands in diametric opposition to those Immutable American Principles...

Often Leftists are found lamenting their being unqualified for the title of American... usually found defining the definition of America DOWN to the lowest common denominator; rendering the value of the term to meaningless... typically one wherein America amounts to a term of geography.

So the SAME idiot that DEMANDS THAT "THEY'RE AMERICANS TOO!" need to define what being an American IS... down to being absolutely NOTHING!
Seems pretty clear to me.

The Dictionary said:
Main Entry: 1Amer·i·can
Pronunciation: \ə-ˈmer-ə-kən, -ˈmər-, -ˈme-rə-\
Function: noun
Date: 1568

1 : an American Indian of North America or South America
2 : a native or inhabitant of North America or South America
3 : a citizen of the United States
4 : american english

American - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
 

Xenophon

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I don't see how socialism and freedom are not synonymous
Then you need to look more closely.

In the American ideal you can do what you like, if you want to share all your money or form groups to do that, you are free to do so and free not to do so.

In the socialist ideal you have no choice, your freedom is curtailed and you must submit or be punished.

Socialism can NEVER be synonymous with freedom no matter how badly you may want it to be so.
 

Truthmatters

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I wish elections mattered to people.

When we have a litgitimate election then theresults should be respected.

There are a few Americans today who dont think elections matter.
 

Foxfyre

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I honestly don't know what anybody else means when they define something as 'anti-American'.

What that term means when I use it, however, means opposition to the principles the Founders wrote into the Constitution, aversion to some or even many of the traditional values that have defined a uniquely American culture, and/or distrust of the people as competent and capable of governing themselves. It is generally targeted at those who see only the warts and flaws and don't appreciate America as the great and successful experiment that it was and is. It refers to those who despise America for perceived sins and refuse to recognize its basic goodness and compassion and generosity, or why setting many tens of millions of people free to chart their own destiny is a remarkable thing. And sometimes it includes some of our citizens who so admire Europe and think America the inferior entity who should emulate them.
 

Truthmatters

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Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I think this is clearly unAmerican



1980s
In 1981 and 1986 the Republican National Committee (RNC) sent out letters to predominately African-American neighborhoods. When tens of thousands of them were returned undeliverable, the party successfully challenged the voters and had them deleted from voting rolls. Due to the violation of the Voting Rights Act, the RNC was taken to court. Its officials entered a consent decree which prohibited the party from engaging in anti-fraud initiatives that targeted minorities or conducting mail campaigns to "compile voter challenge lists."[5]

[edit] 2004 US Election
BBC journalist Greg Palast obtained an RNC document entitled "State Implementation Template III.doc" that described Republican election operations for caging plans in numerous states. The paragraph in the document pertaining to caging was:
 

Luissa

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I think both terms are used way too much by the right, along with unpatriotic.

It also pisses me off when someone like Pubes, a complete douch bag who obviously hates most of his fellow man calls me or someone else un American.
 

rightwinger

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By "Un-American"

They mean that "our side lost" and anyone who does not follow our failed agenda is obviously un-american.
 

Truthmatters

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I think keeping legal voters from voting to win an election is patently UnAmerican.

The right has been doing this systematically for decades now.
 

goldcatt

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I've always seen it as a way to say someone is against American principles.

Problem is, there are a lot of different ways people think of "American principles". Whose way is right, or are any or all of them? It's a very, very broad brush that's wielded with a lot of imprecision - so much so it's practically meaningless except as a vague insult.

I don't use it, and I'm no fan of meaningless potshots.
 

Alpha1

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Caging (voter suppression) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I think this is clearly unAmerican



1980s
In 1981 and 1986 the Republican National Committee (RNC) sent out letters to predominately African-American neighborhoods. When tens of thousands of them were returned undeliverable, the party successfully challenged the voters and had them deleted from voting rolls. Due to the violation of the Voting Rights Act, the RNC was taken to court. Its officials entered a consent decree which prohibited the party from engaging in anti-fraud initiatives that targeted minorities or conducting mail campaigns to "compile voter challenge lists."[5]

[edit] 2004 US Election
BBC journalist Greg Palast obtained an RNC document entitled "State Implementation Template III.doc" that described Republican election operations for caging plans in numerous states. The paragraph in the document pertaining to caging was:
Wanting....yes, demanding that elections are fair is totally and unequivocally American in every way....to make an effort that voters are registered according to the laws now in place and vote in their designated districts is the DUTY of every American.....
Demanding that only lawful citizens vote is our DUTY.
 

Alpha1

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I think keeping legal voters from voting to win an election is patently UnAmerican.

Your absolutely right....keeping LEGAL voters from voting is unAmerican, as is allowing ILLEGAL persons to vote, unAmerican...that includes illegally registered voters that lie on the application to register and that don't actually live the district they try to register in....

The right has been doing this systematically for decades now.

The only ones that tryed to keep citizens from voting were those that imposed poll taxes (charged a fee to vote)
and we know who they were...don't we
 

Truthmatters

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Yeah they were the conservative of their day.

Now its the republicans for the last couple of decades that try to keep people from voting and succede
 

Alpha1

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Yeah they were the conservative of their day.

Now its the republicans for the last couple of decades that try to keep people from voting and succede
They were Democrats....
as they are today....

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU&feature=player_embedded]YouTube - "Security" patrols stationed at polling places in Philly[/ame]
 

JScott

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Calling someone un-American is just name calling, simple as that. If you were born here, bada bing, youre American.

No American citizen can take it from you, period. They can yammer all they want but it only amounts to name calling.

It would be a very cold America if these bozos called the shots in this country.
 

Foxfyre

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Calling someone un-American is just name calling, simple as that. If you were born here, bada bing, youre American.

No American citizen can take it from you, period. They can yammer all they want but it only amounts to name calling.

It would be a very cold America if these bozos called the shots in this country.
It is name calling if it is directed at another person.

It is not name calling when it is directed at an idea, concept, or principle.
 

Alpha1

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I wish elections mattered to people.

Due to the violation of the Voting Rights Act, the RNC was taken to court. Its officials entered a consent decree which prohibited the party from engaging in anti-fraud initiatives .

You wish elections matters but your applaud this prohibition against anti-fraud?

When we have a legitimate election then the results should be respected.


You want everyone to respect the legitimate results of an election but yet don't agree with the SC when it stopped Fla. from changing election rules after an election?

There are a few Americans today who dont think elections matter.
elections matter.... but you show no outrage when a party threatens to "deem" legislation passed without a vote, to just 'declare' a law is passed.....
 
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Alpha1

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Calling someone un-American is just name calling, simple as that. If you were born here, bada bing, youre American.

No American citizen can take it from you, period. They can yammer all they want but it only amounts to name calling.

It would be a very cold America if these bozos called the shots in this country.
It is name calling if it is directed at another person.

It is not name calling when it is directed at an idea, concept, or principle.
Its no more name calling than to say, "See that fat guy or see that tall guy...
Its a description....
Just because you're born in American doesn't mean you can't be unAmerican or hold unAmerican ideals.....
 

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