Zone1 What is an angel? what is the difference?

[The Irish Ram]

Angels who have bodies of flesh and bone have either been resurrected from the dead or translated.

Angels don't die, they are eternal. They are spirit. They can take a physical form, but are not naturally flesh and bone:

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.​

We have both...

 

[onefour1]

Angels don't die, they are eternal. They are spirit. They can take a physical form, but are not naturally flesh and bone:

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.​

We have both...

All angels who administer to this earth either have belonged or will belong to this earth. Because Jesus was the first to resurrect, all angels who administered to this earth before Jesus' resurrection were spirits. Those who ministered to this earth after his resurrection could be either spirits or resurrected beings. Many of the angels who appeared to the prophet Joseph Smith were resurrected beings.

 

[Cougarbear]

Angels don't die, they are eternal. They are spirit. They can take a physical form, but are not naturally flesh and bone:

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.​

We have both...

A spirit then can be said to be made of much finer material that can mold to the body of the individual it is placed in. Most likely transparent in the real world unless the angel-spirit wants to be seen. Have you heard of "areogels?" They are transparent but solid material. God is great!

 

[The Irish Ram]

Many of the angels who appeared to the prophet Joseph Smith were resurrected beings.

Then that makes Christ a liar.

 

[onefour1]

Then that makes Christ a liar.

How does it make Christ a liar? In your scriptural quote he did not use the word, "angel" but the word "spirit". Spirits do not have bodies of flesh and bones. While Christ was alive and before his resurrection all angels were spirits because Christ was the first to resurrect. After the resurrection of Jesus Christ, those spirits who had already experienced mortality could resurrect and administer to others on earth. I see no problem in this doctrine that would make Christ a liar.

 

[Cougarbear]

Then that makes Christ a liar.

Angels and spirits are not interchangeable. Not the same. Angels can be just only spirit beings or resurrected beings. Christ was referring to non-resurrected spirits, not angels.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Some Bibles have ghost, some spirit, some angels. Does God have flesh and bone?

 

[onefour1]

Some Bibles have ghost, some spirit, some angels. Does God have flesh and bone?

While Christ was alive and before his birth all angels were spirits. However, after his resurrection, many resurrected and became angels with resurrected bodies. In the verse you mention, I believe the word "spirit" is the correct translation since Jesus states that a "spirit" hath not flesh and bones and ye see me have. However, at the time, all angels who administer to this earth would also not have had bodies yet. But after Jesus resurrected, the spirits that had already come to earth as mankind and were worthy of the kingdom of heaven may have been resurrected. As a resurrected being you can still fulfill the duty of a ministering angel. An angel is simply a messenger of God regardless of whether they are spirit or have a body. God the Father and Jesus Christ both have immortal bodies of flesh and bones but the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit.

 

[Cougarbear]

Some Bibles have ghost, some spirit, some angels. Does God have flesh and bone?

Jesus showed that he has flesh and bones. Are you unable to read? Jesus said “If he have seen me you have seen the Father.” Then both Father and Son have bodies of flesh and bones that cover their spirits. Resurrected, they are now inseparable. Unlike ours until we are resurrected.
It says spirits, not angels. The men thought they saw a ghost. Not an Angel.

 

[The Irish Ram]

God does not have flesh and bones. Jesus does now, but didn't until he came here in the flesh.
Spirit, ghost and angel are all interpretations of the same passage.
Angels are eternal. They don't die nor do they need to be resurrected. Find me the Bible verse that says otherwise. Find a Biblical incident where an angel dies.

psalms104:4 Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire.

The reason Christ never kills Satan and the fallen angels that He sends to the Lake of Fire is because they are eternal beings. They don't die.

 

[Cougarbear]

God does not have flesh and bones. Jesus does now, but didn't until he came here in the flesh.
Spirit, ghost and angel are all interpretations of the same passage.
Angels are eternal. They don't die nor do they need to be resurrected. Find me the Bible verse that says otherwise. Find a Biblical incident where an angel dies.

psalms104:4 Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire.

The reason Christ never kills Satan and the fallen angels that He sends to the Lake of Fire is because they are eternal beings. They don't die.

Is Jesus God? Then he has a body of flesh and bones. No blood. Since Jesus is the Father God’s sin, then Father had a body of flesh and bones before Jesus did. Why would Jesus have something the Father doesn’t and yet they are both Gods?

 

[The Irish Ram]

Is Jesus God? Then he has a body of flesh and bones. No blood. Since Jesus is the Father God’s sin, then Father had a body of flesh and bones before Jesus did. Why would Jesus have something the Father doesn’t and yet they are both Gods?

Jesus needed a body to become the second Adam. < In order to do that He had to be a man, just like Adam was. In order to undo the wrong caused by Adam, Christ had to be related to Adam. It is in keeping with the Jewish tradition of a kinsman.

Romans 5:15 the offense of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ

Romans 5:17-19 For if by one man's offense death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous

God didn't need a body, His Son did.
John 4:24 God is Spirit

 

[luiza]

Angels don't die, they are eternal. They are spirit. They can take a physical form, but are not naturally flesh and bone:

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.​

Zero to do with the price of parsnips either .
Let alone so called Angels .

But if twaddle keeps you happy , keep twaddling .

 

[onefour1]

There is on difference that I have failed to mention regarding mankind and that is the doctrine of translation. Translation is where God causes a change upon one's body to allow them to live beyond the normal years of life. Eventually a translated being will either die or be changed in the twinkling of an eye to their immortal resurrected state of being. Because Jesus was the first to be resurrected, there were some who were translated before the days of Jesus such as Enoch and those of his city Zion, Moses, and Elijah. Jesus also allowed John the Apostle to be translated to live up until the time of his second coming.

Translated Beings​

Persons who are changed so that they do not experience pain or death until their resurrection to immortality.

• Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him, Gen. 5:24 (Heb. 11:5; D&C 107:48–49).
• No man knoweth of Moses’ sepulchre unto this day, Deut. 34:5–6 (Alma 45:19).
• Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven, 2 Kgs. 2:11.
• If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee, John 21:22–23 (D&C 7:1–3).
• You shall never taste of death, 3 Ne. 28:7.
• That they might not taste of death there was a change wrought upon their bodies, 3 Ne. 28:38 (4 Ne. 1:14; Morm. 8:10–11).
• John the Beloved will live until the Lord comes, D&C 7.
• I have taken the Zion of Enoch into mine own bosom, D&C 38:4 (Moses 7:21, 31, 69).
• Enoch and his brethren are a city reserved until a day of righteousness, D&C 45:11–12.
• Elijah was taken to heaven without tasting death, D&C 110:13.
• The Holy Ghost fell on many, and they were caught up into Zion, Moses 7:27.

So, angels could also be men who are on the earth during their mortality and they could also be translated beings. I believe the angels who came to Lot and his family in Sodom were likely either mortal men or translated beings. I believe this because the people of Sodom saw them enter into Lot's house. I would think if they were spirits then could have simply appeared inside their home without being noticed.

 

[Cougarbear]

Jesus needed a body to become the second Adam. < In order to do that He had to be a man, just like Adam was. In order to undo the wrong caused by Adam, Christ had to be related to Adam. It is in keeping with the Jewish tradition of a kinsman.

Romans 5:15 the offense of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ

Romans 5:17-19 For if by one man's offense death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.
Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous

God didn't need a body, His Son did.
John 4:24 God is Spirit

As stated in the Bible, I’d have seen ME, you have seen the Father. So, is God’s spirit a body of a man? Yep! The fact that Jesus is God’s only begotten son in the flesh means Mary had implanted in her the human sperm of a man. Yes, God the Father has a physically-spiritually resurrected body as well. You have a brain, use it.

Also, I thought you “Christians “ believe that there is but one God the person that manifests himself as three different personages. Therefore, according to your own doctrine, the Father and Son are the same person. Because of this, and Jesus is the Father, the Father has a resurrected body.

Either way, your understanding doesn’t suffice to explain either way. It’s much simpler to accept the Godhead is 3 separate personages. Two of which have resurrected bodies and another of Spirit only. A Ghost. The Holy Ghost.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Zero to do with the price of parsnips either .
Let alone so called Angels .

But if twaddle keeps you happy , keep twaddling .

Wasn't directed at you, but feel free to creep on in...

 

[The Irish Ram]

As stated in the Bible, I’d have seen ME, you have seen the Father. So, is God’s spirit a body of a man? Yep! The fact that Jesus is God’s only begotten son in the flesh means Mary had implanted in her the human sperm of a man. Yes, God the Father has a physically-spiritually resurrected body as well. You have a brain, use it.

Also, I thought you “Christians “ believe that there is but one God the person that manifests himself as three different personages. Therefore, according to your own doctrine, the Father and Son are the same person. Because of this, and Jesus is the Father, the Father has a resurrected body.

Either way, your understanding doesn’t suffice to explain either way. It’s much simpler to accept the Godhead is 3 separate personages. Two of which have resurrected bodies and another of Spirit only. A Ghost. The Holy Ghost.

To resurrect is to bring someone back from the dead. God brought Christ back from the dead. If you are correct, then who resurrected God? How did God die, and how long was it before He died again?

If human sperm was necessary to produce Jesus, then Joseph could have done the job. That is not what happened. She was a virgin before she got pregnant and was still a virgin after Christ was placed in her womb. No one, human or otherwise, had sex with 14 year old Mary.

Tell me more about what we "Christians" believe.
If God is 3 in one, how is the Holy Ghost a ghost and not a human, like you insist the other two are? How did 2 humans and a ghost create the universe? How did human God and Jesus escape the dimensions of earth? Where are they now? Is there oxygen where they live now?
Can you defy gravity? If they can, and they are human, why can't you? Jump and tell me what happens. Did gravity bring you right back down?
Can you explain this verse:
God is spirit, (John 4:24).
If you are correct, then John is not. Were you there, or was John?

When Christ said, "If you have seen me, you have seen the Father", He wasn't referring to His hair color, the color of His eyes, or His height and weight. He was referring to His divinity.

 

[Cougarbear]

To resurrect is to bring someone back from the dead. God brought Christ back from the dead. If you are correct, then who resurrected God? How did God die, and how long was it before He died again?

If human sperm was necessary to produce Jesus, then Joseph could have done the job. That is not what happened. She was a virgin before she got pregnant and was still a virgin after Christ was placed in her womb. No one, human or otherwise, had sex with 14 year old Mary.

Tell me more about what we "Christians" believe.
If God is 3 in one, how is the Holy Ghost a ghost and not a human, like you insist the other two are? How did 2 humans and a ghost create the universe? How did human God and Jesus escape the dimensions of earth? Where are they now? Is there oxygen where they live now?
Can you defy gravity? If they can, and they are human, why can't you? Jump and tell me what happens. Did gravity bring you right back down?
Can you explain this verse:
God is spirit, (John 4:24).
If you are correct, then John is not. Were you there, or was John?

When Christ said, "If you have seen me, you have seen the Father", He wasn't referring to His hair color, the color of His eyes, or His height and weight. He was referring to His divinity.

1. To resurrect is to bring someone back from the dead. God brought Christ back from the dead. If you are correct, then who resurrected God? How did God die, and how long was it before He died again?

Answer: Based on your belief. First that there is but one God presenting himself as 3 personages, then Jesus is the Father and has been resurrected when Jesus was. Same person, right? But that would cause a problem with creating Jesus as Jesus was a man while on this earth. He had male DNA with a Y chromosome. Mary is a female. She only has XX chromosomes. Where did the Y chromosome come from? Father in Heaven. But, if Jesus is also the Father, one God belief, then who gave Mary the Y chromosome? It would have had to be Jesus since Jesus is the Son of God. But, that makes no cognitive reasoning sense. The only way to straighten this out is to realize the traditional dogma of almost all Christian sects is wrong about this 3 in one God approach. The Father and Son must be separate beings, period. And, the Father must be a physical being with Y chromosomes. And, to be eternal, Father would have to have a resurrected body with His spirit eternally connected forever.

So, you asked the second question about how did the Father die in order to be resurrected. I don't know how he died. But, he had to have died as a man and resurrected as an eternal glorified celestial God. The God of our universe he was awarded for his faithfulness. There is no other possibility when you mesh this with the first paragraph above. And, as God is now, man may become.

The third question about sperm requires me to ask why do so many people act as if they live 2000 years ago when it comes to the knowledge of biology, medical procedures of today and the ability of in vitro fertilization? In vitro fertilization does not require the act of sex. Sex requires a penis entering a vagina and enough sperm ejaculating to fertilize a woman's egg. So, my opinion is the Holy Ghost came over Mary and performed the in vitro fertilization operation. That simple.

 

[The Irish Ram]

The God of our universe he was awarded for his faithfulness

By whom? Who rewarded Him? Who is that that is above God?
When God created hosts and hosts of angels, who did He have sex with to produce all of them? And if God is human, then aren't the angels?
Who did God have sex with when He created Adam? How was Eve constructed without sperm?

If God is 3 in one, and you think that 2/3rds of God is human how is it that the Holy Ghost is not human? Is that not, then, as impossible as God being spirit, Holy Ghost being spirit, and Christ being different from the other 2/3? If God has to be human, because Christ is human, why doesn't the Holy Ghost have to be human as well?

 

[Cougarbear]

By whom? Who rewarded Him? Who is that that is above God?
When God created hosts and hosts of angels, who did He have sex with to produce all of them? And if God is human, then aren't the angels?
Who did God have sex with when He created Adam? How was Eve constructed without sperm?

If God is 3 in one, and you think that 2/3rds of God is human how is it that the Holy Ghost is not human? Is that not, then, as impossible as God being spirit, Holy Ghost being spirit, and Christ being different from the other 2/3? If God has to be human, because Christ is human, why doesn't the Holy Ghost have to be human as well?

By whom? Who rewarded Him? Who is that that is above God?

Answer: No one in our universe. But, that still doesn't answer the problems I laid out for you. God gave us a brain and with partaking of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, we need to use our God-given brains for more than rote memorization and following traditional dogma that doesn't include what is now known through using our brains. In vitro fertilization is just one of those things that answers how Mary was impregnated with Father in Heaven's sperm to have Jesus have a Y chromosome. Stop acting like you don't have cognitive reasoning abilities and think.

When God created hosts and hosts of angels, who did He have sex with to produce all of them? And if God is human, then aren't the angels?
Who did God have sex with when He created Adam? How was Eve constructed without sperm?

Answer: We have always existed. All hosts of heaven including us before we descended into our bodies from heaven. The Bible says no man can ascend to heaven except if we first descended from heaven. Even Jesus Christ had to. Then, he was Jehovah who descended after Mary was with child. Before we were spirit children of our Heavenly Parents, we were intelligent energy. Energy cannot be created nor destroyed because it is "Matter."

Did Adam and Eve have belly buttons? Yep. Was Father in Heaven their Father? Nope. Jesus is the only begotten of the Father.

If God is 3 in one, and you think that 2/3rds of God is human how is it that the Holy Ghost is not human? Is that not, then, as impossible as God being spirit, Holy Ghost being spirit, and Christ being different from the other 2/3? If God has to be human, because Christ is human, why doesn't the Holy Ghost have to be human as well?

Answer: Why would the Holy Ghost have to be human? He's still a spirit child of Heavenly Father. Jehovah wasn't human until he descended into Mary's child and became Jesus. Michael also was a spirit child until he descended into the body of Adam. What you are missing is the true plan of our Father in Heaven. It was patterned after the same plan in the universe he came from with his Father in Heaven. The Plan of Salvation was to give the same opportunity that he had to us, his spirit children. To evolve through the process of coming to this earth that was prepared for us so that we could inherit the same exaltation if we would use our brains and hearts to be faithful when we come across His true Gospel.

But, let me go back to my last post. That's where you have no answers for the logic and cognitive reasoning that I laid out. Study that and then meditate and pray to Father in heaven in the name of Jesus Christ with real intent to know and without a double mind. James chapter one.