What human cost is acceptable in controlling illegal immigration?

[Bob Blaylock]

Why Treason? Treason is an executable offense. She has neither aided nor abetted our enemy or given comfort to them. I will go so far as to say that illegal immigrants are not so much enemies as they are felons under the law.

When did having a different opinion amount to treason? Why make such an irresponsible statement?

Foreign invaders are enemies, whether you acknowledge it or not.

And taking their side exactly meets the Constitutional definition of treason.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

And the trauma caused to all those children...that will just go away?

It was a horrible thing to do. Inexcusable. Why is it necessary to compare the two other than to somehow devalue the harm done because at least they weren’t killed?

Will the little boy who’s father committed suicide see his father again?

Not our responsibility.

Those who willingly participated in an illegal invasion of our country—and traitorous filth such as yourself who treasonously defend them—are solely responsible for the consequences thereof.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why Treason? Treason is an executable offense. She has neither aided nor abetted our enemy or given comfort to them. I will go so far as to say that illegal immigrants are not so much enemies as they are felons under the law.

When did having a different opinion amount to treason? Why make such an irresponsible statement?

Foreign invaders are enemies, whether you acknowledge it or not.

And taking their side exactly meets the Constitutional definition of treason.

Well then, we might as well repeal the 1st Amendment. Because as long as there is no action to the "taking sides", taking sides in and of itself is an expression of speech, not an act of treason.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

So are 10 million illegals responsible for the criminal act of one?

Yanno, that's not what I said at all. So, I'll ask you this, are they all law abiding citizens? None of them are, given they broke the law to get here.

You'll be shocked to know that not all illegal immigrants are angels. Some, like the guy who killed Tibbetts, or the guy who killed Kate Steinle are violent felons. Do you want those types here in the country?

Apparently you do.

Jaywalkers aren’t law abiding citizens.

No one thinks they are all angels. They aren’t all devils either.

And yes violent felons should be deported. I think that is something most agree on.

Here is the problem Coyote we deport the violent criminal and they keep on returning.

I do understand not every illegal is a violent criminal but how do yoh stop the violent ones from entering this nation?

Do you need to seperate parents and children to stop them?

My answer to my question:



You punish all illegal immigrants equally because the select few that kill, rape or do heinous crimes.

As we deport the criminal element they return knowing being put into our prison system is better than being sent home where they will join a Gang that is employed by the Cartel that are funded by U.S., Chinese, Iranian or Russian Operatives.

So deporting them will not work if they are return to their home country.

The only other choice is deporting them to somewhere like Syria and hoping they are killed by a terrorist group.

( Criminals like rapists, murders and so on )

In the end backlash is always harsh and right now it seem Felons from other countries are encouraged to enter our country illegally, so there is no way to stop them unless you punish everyone.

Sad reality but it is reality...

 

[Coyote]

Actually...many parents agreed to be deported on the promise their children would sent with them. They weren’t. They remain in US custody with government saying it isn’t their responsibility to unite them

'Keep up the good work.' Once-critical judge praises Trump team's reunification efforts

Yes. AFTER the judge blasted them and held their feet to the fire.

Earlier articles
Will kids of deported parents ever see families again? Feds won't say

Trump administration says ACLU – not government – should find deported parents

Still, the fact remains the government righted their wrong. Even the judge acknowledged that. The only way the families at the center of my OP will ever get to see their children again is at their grave sites.

And the trauma caused to all those children...that will just go away?

It was a horrible thing to do. Inexcusable. Why is it necessary to compare the two other than to somehow devalue the harm done because at least they weren’t killed?

Will the little boy who’s father committed suicide see his father again?

I'm not devaluing the trauma. But what the parents did by sending them here ALONE is traumatic enough. Do you think that kind of trauma will go away?

Death is permanent. The loss is permanent. The pain will go away to some degree, but it too is permanent. These illegal parents have some hope of seeing their children again. As inept as our government can be it is capable of reuniting them with their children. But as far as I know, the government can't resurrect the dead.
Meaning Mollie and Kate will lie in rest six feet underground, and their parents will never see them alive again.

I know the pain of not having a father for most of my childhood. I can relate. I can also tell you that it is the parent who is responsible for the health and safety of their children. He dumped me off on my grandmother and simply abrogated his responsibilities as a parent. My mother did the same. I'll never see her again because I chose not to associate myself with her and her subpar lifestyle. I know what it's like. I normally don't speak of things I have no experience in, but living in a dysfunctional family for the majority of my life gives me a unique perspective on matters like these.

Just a side note... who is this little boy you speak of?

But the parents didn’t send them alone..not the ones I am referring to.

This is the one
A migrant father separated from his wife and child at the US-Mexico border had a breakdown at a Texas jail and took his own life

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Well then, we might as well repeal the 1st Amendment. Because as long as there is no action to the "taking sides", taking sides in and of itself is an expression of speech, not an act of treason.

It is no more “an extension of speech” than are such acts as fraud or extortion, which rely on “speech” to promote a criminal purpose.

No rational interpretation of the First Amendment protects this.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

This is the one
A migrant father separated from his wife and child at the US-Mexico border had a breakdown at a Texas jail and took his own life

Tough shit.

He should have stayed the f••• out of our country.

 

[skye]

Stop the scum

Stop illegals scum......who kill because they like the look of a woman jogging in the park


STOP THE SCUM

let them kill at home....and be killed

 

[TemplarKormac]

'Keep up the good work.' Once-critical judge praises Trump team's reunification efforts

Yes. AFTER the judge blasted them and held their feet to the fire.

Earlier articles
Will kids of deported parents ever see families again? Feds won't say

Trump administration says ACLU – not government – should find deported parents

Still, the fact remains the government righted their wrong. Even the judge acknowledged that. The only way the families at the center of my OP will ever get to see their children again is at their grave sites.

And the trauma caused to all those children...that will just go away?

It was a horrible thing to do. Inexcusable. Why is it necessary to compare the two other than to somehow devalue the harm done because at least they weren’t killed?

Will the little boy who’s father committed suicide see his father again?

I'm not devaluing the trauma. But what the parents did by sending them here ALONE is traumatic enough. Do you think that kind of trauma will go away?

Death is permanent. The loss is permanent. The pain will go away to some degree, but it too is permanent. These illegal parents have some hope of seeing their children again. As inept as our government can be it is capable of reuniting them with their children. But as far as I know, the government can't resurrect the dead.
Meaning Mollie and Kate will lie in rest six feet underground, and their parents will never see them alive again.

I know the pain of not having a father for most of my childhood. I can relate. I can also tell you that it is the parent who is responsible for the health and safety of their children. He dumped me off on my grandmother and simply abrogated his responsibilities as a parent. My mother did the same. I'll never see her again because I chose not to associate myself with her and her subpar lifestyle. I know what it's like. I normally don't speak of things I have no experience in, but living in a dysfunctional family for the majority of my life gives me a unique perspective on matters like these.

Just a side note... who is this little boy you speak of?

But the parents didn’t send them alone..not the ones I am referring to.

This is the one
A migrant father separated from his wife and child at the US-Mexico border had a breakdown at a Texas jail and took his own life

I don't mean to sound cold hearted, but... he brought that on himself. You want to make a better life for your children? Don't come here illegally. And don't make it worse by killing yourself when you get caught. We have a system tailor made for legal immigration. It is wrong that people coming here illegally are not informed of it, or are told to ignore it because of its complexity, though it is complex for a reason.

One other thing... I can see it from this perspective. Why did the father have to kill himself and take away any hope of his son seeing him again? If it were that traumatic, logic dictates that you don't subject yourself to such trauma. Now the kid has gotten a double dose of this trauma. Being separated from his father, and now losing his father to suicide.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Well then, we might as well repeal the 1st Amendment. Because as long as there is no action to the "taking sides", taking sides in and of itself is an expression of speech, not an act of treason.

It is no more “an extension of speech” than are such acts as fraud or extortion, which rely on “speech” to promote a criminal purpose.

No rational interpretation of the First Amendment protects this.

Fascinating. Show me where Coyote committed treason against the United States by disagreeing with you. She committed treason because she has a different opinion on illegal immigration than you do? Once again, fascinating.

Time for this gif again:

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Fascinating. Show me where Coyote committed treason against the United States by disagreeing with you. She committed treason because she has a different opinion on illegal immigration than you do? Once again, fascinating.

Her “opinion” consists of openly taking the side of invading foreign criminals, against that of her own country and against that of her own fellow Americans. It's not merely disagreeing with me that makes her a traitor. It is promoting the interests of the enemies of this nation, and of this nation's citizens that makes her a traitor.

 

[TemplarKormac]

I'm going to bed now.

 

[grainbely]

Coyote asked that question at the height of the child separation/illegal immigration issue:

What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

Now, after the death of Mollie Tibbetts at the hands of an illegal immigrant, I feel obliged to ask that question myself. What is the cost? How many American lives must perish at the hands of violent illegal immigrants before we realize how vital controlling our southern border is?

Do you really want to abolish ICE? Given this?

Mollie Tibbetts was killed by an illegal immigrant. So, why can't we enforce our borders? Because it's "inhumane" and "racist". We're wrong for taking the children from their parents at the border. This illegal immigrant just took a daughter away from her parents. Forever.

I've had just about enough. What will the human...no...the American cost be?

It's one girl and one illegal and one heinous crime. Dont let her looks and story make it more than that. There are bigger problems and you know it. All the dumb as shit arguments the right uses against pulling out all the stops to stop crime are applicable here.

Let due process run its course. Let's find out the story. Let's then go back and see if extreme action is necessary or policy needs to change.

 

[rightwinger]

So are 10 million illegals responsible for the criminal act of one?

Yanno, that's not what I said at all. So, I'll ask you this, are they all law abiding citizens? None of them are, given they broke the law to get here.

You'll be shocked to know that not all illegal immigrants are angels. Some, like the guy who killed Tibbetts, or the guy who killed Kate Steinle are violent felons. Do you want those types here in the country?

Apparently you do.

They are breaking a law that is the equivalent of trespassing

Ha. Don't assault me with your half assed arguments, RW. Violating the sovereignty of another nation by illegally crossing its borders is more akin to invasion than trespassing.

And please, don't try to downplay the severity of the offense. I hate to break it to you, but when the law works properly, the law deals in absolutes.

What it comes down to is trespassing
They are not guilty of a violent act, stealing, drug smuggling.......they are merely somewhere they are not supposed to be

 

[Coyote]

Yes. AFTER the judge blasted them and held their feet to the fire.

Earlier articles
Will kids of deported parents ever see families again? Feds won't say

Trump administration says ACLU – not government – should find deported parents

Still, the fact remains the government righted their wrong. Even the judge acknowledged that. The only way the families at the center of my OP will ever get to see their children again is at their grave sites.

And the trauma caused to all those children...that will just go away?

It was a horrible thing to do. Inexcusable. Why is it necessary to compare the two other than to somehow devalue the harm done because at least they weren’t killed?

Will the little boy who’s father committed suicide see his father again?

I'm not devaluing the trauma. But what the parents did by sending them here ALONE is traumatic enough. Do you think that kind of trauma will go away?

Death is permanent. The loss is permanent. The pain will go away to some degree, but it too is permanent. These illegal parents have some hope of seeing their children again. As inept as our government can be it is capable of reuniting them with their children. But as far as I know, the government can't resurrect the dead.
Meaning Mollie and Kate will lie in rest six feet underground, and their parents will never see them alive again.

I know the pain of not having a father for most of my childhood. I can relate. I can also tell you that it is the parent who is responsible for the health and safety of their children. He dumped me off on my grandmother and simply abrogated his responsibilities as a parent. My mother did the same. I'll never see her again because I chose not to associate myself with her and her subpar lifestyle. I know what it's like. I normally don't speak of things I have no experience in, but living in a dysfunctional family for the majority of my life gives me a unique perspective on matters like these.

Just a side note... who is this little boy you speak of?

But the parents didn’t send them alone..not the ones I am referring to.

This is the one
A migrant father separated from his wife and child at the US-Mexico border had a breakdown at a Texas jail and took his own life

I don't mean to sound cold hearted, but... he brought that on himself. You want to make a better life for your children? Don't come here illegally. And don't make it worse by killing yourself when you get caught. We have a system tailor made for legal immigration. It is wrong that people coming here illegally are not informed of it, or are told to ignore it because of its complexity, though it is complex for a reason.

One other thing... I can see it from this perspective. Why did the father have to kill himself and take away any hope of his son seeing him again? If it were that traumatic, logic dictates that you don't subject yourself to such trauma. Now the kid has gotten a double dose of this trauma. Being separated from his father, and now losing his father to suicide.

I am not going to say much about the first part because I said it all in the earlier thread and don’t want to just repeat it again and again. But I will say this.

They are from Guatemala which means most likely they a fleeing horrible conditions. Most migrants from there are from indiginous groups who also face ethnic discrimination in addition to extreme poverty, do not speak English nor Spanish. They seeking asylum, a legal right. When they were forceably separated what did he think was happening? It is impossible to know exactly what trauma they had already been through, and what perhaps was the last straw for some one to do this. I understand your viewpoint on the issue of fathers and respect it, and I think it gives you an insight into how this child might feel. No one commits suicide lightly, they have to be in a very dark and hopeless place to do so.

I will add that just because they were fleeing bad conditions doesn’t entitle them to stay, but it does give them the right to ask for asylum in our country, to have a hearing and to be treated with the respect. They were not rapists. They were not murders. They illegal entrants to our country.

 

[Coyote]

Fascinating. Show me where Coyote committed treason against the United States by disagreeing with you. She committed treason because she has a different opinion on illegal immigration than you do? Once again, fascinating.

Her “opinion” consists of openly taking the side of invading foreign criminals, against that of her own country and against that of her own fellow Americans. It's not merely disagreeing with me that makes her a traitor. It is promoting the interests of the enemies of this nation, and of this nation's citizens that makes her a traitor.

I don’t seem to recall who gave you the authority to decide who is traitor and what is in the best interests of our people. I support good border control, and the legal immigration process which includes the amnesty process and the refugee programs.

Now go stuff yourself, your treasonous yapping is repetitive.

 

[BluesLegend]

So are 10 million illegals responsible for the criminal act of one?

This.


And does the vile act of one person, destroying a family through murder justify the tearing apart of other families at the border? No,

Illegals commit MILLIONS of crimes against Americans. Illegals have killed and raped thousands of American citizens. Injured, maimed for life, assaulted us, robbed us, stole from us. Its not 1 in 10 million. I say deport all of them the hell out of OUR country, they can go home to rape and kill people.

 

[Coyote]

No. An invasion is when a state sends people.

Do you see Mexico doing what it can to stop these illegal immigrants from crossing our border? No. What of the rest of Central America? No.

Who's responsibility is it? Are we preventing people from leaving our country and crossing in to Canada or Mexico?

 

[TemplarKormac]

They are not guilty of a violent act, stealing, drug smuggling.......they are merely somewhere they are not supposed to be

If they are somewhere they are not supposed to be, why justify that behavior as a nonviolent act? The creature that murdered Tibbetts committed that very same non violent act and went on to commit murder.

That is the most garbage excuse for illegal immigration I've ever heard. While the act of entry itself is nonviolent, we cannot assume that the person who entered isn't. Sure. You go with that trash logic, RW.

 

[Coyote]

They are not guilty of a violent act, stealing, drug smuggling.......they are merely somewhere they are not supposed to be

If they are somewhere they are not supposed to be, why justify that behavior as a nonviolent act? The creature that murdered Tibbetts committed that very same non violent act and went on to commit murder.

That is the most garbage excuse for illegal immigration I've ever heard. While the act of entry itself is nonviolent, we cannot assume that the person who entered isn't. Sure. You go with that trash logic, RW.

Because it is non violent. Why conflate it with murder?

These are two seperate crimes. Trespassing is not murder.