What exactly is the "one state solution"?

[montelatici]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

The way the Jews treat the non-Jews they rule over shows so much respect.

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[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

He did call for mutual respect. What makes you think he didn't?

 

[Shusha]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

The way the Jews treat the non-Jews they rule over shows so much respect.

Embedded media from this media site is no longer available

Sure. So you show more video for the purpose of demonizing Israel. (Footage, btw, that looks very much like what you would see at any international border).

Still getting us nowhere.

 

[Shusha]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

He did call for mutual respect. What makes you think he didn't?

Oh, I don't know. Perhaps it was all the rhetoric about Jewish supremacy and massacres and "relentless attempts to destroy them" and "violent ethnic cleansing" and that Israel has "no future" and "extreme forms of oppression" and "escalating massacres on a regular basis".

It would be rather like me posting a video about Muzzie barbarians who only understand violence and martyrdom and who enjoy murdering their children at the behest of their god and somehow expecting you to see that as respectful.

Respect necessarily includes a certain understanding and empathy for the other side, even if you disagree with their narrative.

 

[Shusha]

He did call for mutual respect. What makes you think he didn't?

He was not, himself, respectful.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

The way the Jews treat the non-Jews they rule over shows so much respect.

Embedded media from this media site is no longer available

Sure. So you show more video for the purpose of demonizing Israel. (Footage, btw, that looks very much like what you would see at any international border).

Still getting us nowhere.

It isn't a border crossing. It is just a harassment point.

 

[montelatici]

Mutual respect

 

[montelatici]

Mutual respect:

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

He did call for mutual respect. What makes you think he didn't?

Oh, I don't know. Perhaps it was all the rhetoric about Jewish supremacy and massacres and "relentless attempts to destroy them" and "violent ethnic cleansing" and that Israel has "no future" and "extreme forms of oppression" and "escalating massacres on a regular basis".

It would be rather like me posting a video about Muzzie barbarians who only understand violence and martyrdom and who enjoy murdering their children at the behest of their god and somehow expecting you to see that as respectful.

Respect necessarily includes a certain understanding and empathy for the other side, even if you disagree with their narrative.

He was merely stating why there is not peace. True, of course.

 

[Shusha]

It isn't a border crossing. It is just a harassment point.

The video actually shows a number of different checkpoints, as far as I could tell.

Do you think there should be no checkpoints between Israel and Palestine? If so, how would you address the still very real issue of attacks against innocent Israeli citizens?

 

[P F Tinmore]

It isn't a border crossing. It is just a harassment point.

The video actually shows a number of different checkpoints, as far as I could tell.

Do you think there should be no checkpoints between Israel and Palestine? If so, how would you address the still very real issue of attacks against innocent Israeli citizens?

Those were not between Israel and Palestine.

 

[Shusha]

Mutual respect:

Monte, seriously? Its not like I can't post videos of Arab Palestinians stabbing people, strapped with suicide bombs, inciting hatred in their places of worship and a hundred other things.

Its not respect. You know it and I know it. If the two of us (who are not intimately involved in the conflict) can't manage a respectful conversation free from rhetoric and demonization -- how can we ever manage to believe in a solution?

 

[montelatici]

Mutual respect:

Monte, seriously? Its not like I can't post videos of Arab Palestinians stabbing people, strapped with suicide bombs, inciting hatred in their places of worship and a hundred other things.

Its not respect. You know it and I know it. If the two of us (who are not intimately involved in the conflict) can't manage a respectful conversation free from rhetoric and demonization -- how can we ever manage to believe in a solution?

This humiliation of the non-Jews takes place on a daily basis and it is perpetrated by public officials. The occasional Palestinian attacks on, mostly public officials (the police and IDF), the same groups that are doing the humiliation, are attacks on perpetrators of the occupation. There is a huge difference.

 

[Shusha]

He was merely stating why there is not peace. True, of course.

No, he's not. If he were -- he would have included both narratives and would have presented it in a balanced, fair and understanding way. He wouldn't be framing things in terms of "massacres" occurring in a vacuum. He would acknowledge Gaza's belligerence and Israel's right to respond to that belligerence. He would acknowledge that Jewish desire for self-determination is the same as Palestinian desire for self-determination and not call it Jewish supremacy.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You have

He was merely stating why there is not peace. True, of course.

No, he's not. If he were -- he would have included both narratives and would have presented it in a balanced, fair and understanding way. He wouldn't be framing things in terms of "massacres" occurring in a vacuum. He would acknowledge Gaza's belligerence and Israel's right to respond to that belligerence. He would acknowledge that Jewish desire for self-determination is the same as Palestinian desire for self-determination and not call it Jewish supremacy.

You have that backwards. Remember, it was Israel that occupied Palestine in 1948.

BTW, here is another narrative.

 

[Shusha]

You have that backwards. Remember, it was Israel that occupied Palestine in 1948.

No, I don't have it backwards. In a one state solution the belligerence has to end and the Jewish people have to be respected.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You have that backwards. Remember, it was Israel that occupied Palestine in 1948.

No, I don't have it backwards. In a one state solution the belligerence has to end and the Jewish people have to be respected.

I don't have it backward. The Palestinians were at home. They didn't go attack anybody.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

You have

He was merely stating why there is not peace. True, of course.

No, he's not. If he were -- he would have included both narratives and would have presented it in a balanced, fair and understanding way. He wouldn't be framing things in terms of "massacres" occurring in a vacuum. He would acknowledge Gaza's belligerence and Israel's right to respond to that belligerence. He would acknowledge that Jewish desire for self-determination is the same as Palestinian desire for self-determination and not call it Jewish supremacy.

You have that backwards. Remember, it was Israel that occupied Palestine in 1948.

BTW, here is another narrative.

You don't really have a right to show this video. When Yuli talks about the Occupation, she's talking about the West Bank, not all of Israel.

 

[Challenger]

P F Tinmore

See, the above videos are exactly the rhetoric which demonizes Israel and demonizes even the Jewish desire for self-determination. There is no path to a solution to be found there. It gets us absolutely no where.

A solution can only be found with mutual respect.

The way the Jews treat the non-Jews they rule over shows so much respect.

Embedded media from this media site is no longer available

Sure. So you show more video for the purpose of demonizing Israel. (Footage, btw, that looks very much like what you would see at any international border).

Still getting us nowhere.

Really? In my travels I've crossed at least fifteen international borders and never seen anything remotely resembling the behaviour of the IDF in that video. Those aren't international border controls in any event, they're "checkpoints" that spring up like mushrooms in occupied Palestine, just to cause "inconvenience" to the Palestinians going about their lawful business. No signs of "respect" there, just Zionist thuggery.

 

[Challenger]

It isn't a border crossing. It is just a harassment point.

The video actually shows a number of different checkpoints, as far as I could tell.

Do you think there should be no checkpoints between Israel and Palestine? If so, how would you address the still very real issue of attacks against innocent Israeli citizens?

Show me the Israeli civillians at those "checkpoints".