What drives anti-government extremists?

[Kosh]

The header is a lie. The left knows we aren't anti government. Leftists lie. That's all you need to know.

Only when someone with an (R) sits in the white house.

 

[Ibentoken]

Everyone is a far right extremist unless you tow the party agenda. Idiotic.

 

[Ibentoken]

The header is a lie. The left knows we aren't anti government. Leftists lie. That's all you need to know.

Only when someone with an (R) sits in the white house.

That false rhetoric goes both ways. Didn't the left call Bush an illegitimate president. You know the Tea Party isn't anti government.

 

[KNB]

Republicans are far right extremists because they tow the party line.

 

[Ibentoken]

The left has to create a false premise, strawmen, projection, and outright lies to push their agenda. There must be something wrong if you can't be honest about your intentions.

 

[Ibentoken]

Republic
ans are far right extremists because they tow the party line.

Tell us what the TP line is.

 

[emilynghiem]

The header is a lie. The left knows we aren't anti government. Leftists lie. That's all you need to know.

I agree there is a mutual conflict with language and mixed perceptions.

The conservatives and Constitutionals are against big bureaucratic and corrupt
unchecked govt, not against govt itself. but the liberals see them as lying and just saying that to get control of govt to abuse it for their corporate interests to go unchecked by deregulating govt.
and the Greens and Occupy and even Tea Party will argue both major parties are lying to the public and both seeking control of govt to abuse it for their own interests.

The liberals and progressives also want power for the people but they keep seeing themselves as representing the people, so when they do things through govt they
THINK that is the will of the people. they don't see it as outside govt or bigger govt imposing on people.
they think the people are taking back control of govt, so they don't see it as socialism or govt taking over society but the opposite -- when their policies are in power they see govt as representing "the people" which they think they represent

both groups think they are representing and defending the people against abuse of govt by politics by the other group.

that is the saddest thing
they keep fighting while billions of dollars go into the same corporate media and politics benefiting from this mutual fear and division,exploiting and playing both sides against the other

 

[KNB]

Common ground:

Every American in every state can help support America again.

 

[Lakhota]

The header is a lie. The left knows we aren't anti government. Leftists lie. That's all you need to know.

I agree there is a mutual conflict with language and mixed perceptions.

The conservatives and Constitutionals are against big bureaucratic and corrupt
unchecked govt, not against govt itself. but the liberals see them as lying and just saying that to get control of govt to abuse it for their corporate interests to go unchecked by deregulating govt.
and the Greens and Occupy and even Tea Party will argue both major parties are lying to the public and both seeking control of govt to abuse it for their own interests.

The liberals and progressives also want power for the people but they keep seeing themselves as representing the people, so when they do things through govt they
THINK that is the will of the people. they don't see it as outside govt or bigger govt imposing on people.
they think the people are taking back control of govt, so they don't see it as socialism or govt taking over society but the opposite -- when their policies are in power they see govt as representing "the people" which they think they represent

both groups think they are representing and defending the people against abuse of govt by politics by the other group.

that is the saddest thing
they keep fighting while billions of dollars go into the same corporate media and politics benefiting from this mutual fear and division,exploiting and playing both sides against the other

"Not against government itself"? Really?

 

[Ibentoken]

The header is a lie. The left knows we aren't anti government. Leftists lie. That's all you need to know.

Y
I agree there is a mutual conflict with language and mixed perceptions.

The conservatives and Constitutionals are against big bureaucratic and corrupt
unchecked govt, not against govt itself. but the liberals see them as lying and just saying that to get control of govt to abuse it for their corporate interests to go unchecked by deregulating govt.
and the Greens and Occupy and even Tea Party will argue both major parties are lying to the public and both seeking control of govt to abuse it for their own interests.

The liberals and progressives also want power for the people but they keep seeing themselves as representing the people, so when they do things through govt they
THINK that is the will of the people. they don't see it as outside govt or bigger govt imposing on people.
they think the people are taking back control of govt, so they don't see it as socialism or govt taking over society but the opposite -- when their policies are in power they see govt as representing "the people" which they think they represent

both groups think they are representing and defending the people against abuse of govt by politics by the other group.

that is the saddest thing
they keep fighting while billions of dollars go into the same corporate media and politics benefiting from this mutual fear and division,exploiting and playing both sides against the other

"Not against government itself"? Really?

Yes, really, and you know that. The TP is for limited constitutional government and lower taxes. Nothing extreme about that. Discuss the issues without the fear mongering.

 

[Harry Dresden]

So you can not address the fact that the far left bomb and killed people and want to blame others that did the same thing later?

Typical far left Obama drone post! Boring!

So you support the far left and their bombings like Bill Ayers, no surprise there.

everyone who disagrees with you is a far left Obama Drone.....even those who are not....when do you mention the Far Right Drones?.....they have been in the threads you are in.....but no mention of them?......

This person is a far left Obama drone so claim that they are not would be a falsehood on your part.

And no I disagree with many on this board, those that get that title show deserve it.

The far right? Who do you consider far right? I bet some that you would are actually share the far left mindset.

you......only a far righty would consider just about everyone who disagrees with him ...far left......thats the way their minds work.....far lefties do the same on their end...

 

[9thIDdoc]

What drives anti-government extremists?[/B

Easy. Government extremists.

 

[Dad2three]

Y
I agree there is a mutual conflict with language and mixed perceptions.

The conservatives and Constitutionals are against big bureaucratic and corrupt
unchecked govt, not against govt itself. but the liberals see them as lying and just saying that to get control of govt to abuse it for their corporate interests to go unchecked by deregulating govt.
and the Greens and Occupy and even Tea Party will argue both major parties are lying to the public and both seeking control of govt to abuse it for their own interests.

The liberals and progressives also want power for the people but they keep seeing themselves as representing the people, so when they do things through govt they
THINK that is the will of the people. they don't see it as outside govt or bigger govt imposing on people.
they think the people are taking back control of govt, so they don't see it as socialism or govt taking over society but the opposite -- when their policies are in power they see govt as representing "the people" which they think they represent

both groups think they are representing and defending the people against abuse of govt by politics by the other group.

that is the saddest thing
they keep fighting while billions of dollars go into the same corporate media and politics benefiting from this mutual fear and division,exploiting and playing both sides against the other

"Not against government itself"? Really?

Yes, really, and you know that. The TP is for limited constitutional government and lower taxes. Nothing extreme about that. Discuss the issues without the fear mongering.

Limited by what definition and by whom?


CBO: Fed tax rates hit historic low

The average tax rates for American households reached a historical low in 2009, according to a report issued by the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office.

Indeed, federal taxes for American households averaged 17.4 percent in 2009, a historical low over the 1979 to 2009 period.

WEIRD, WASN'T THAT WHEN THE TP (BIRCHERS) WERE FORMED?


CBO: Fed tax rates hit historic low - Tim Mak - POLITICO.com


Your taxes are really low, in one chart

The average filer saw her effective tax rate drop from 22 percent in 1979 to 18.1 percent in 2010

Your taxes are really low, in one chart - The Washington Post


Tax bills in 2009 at lowest level since 1950


Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009, the lowest rate since 1950

Tax bills in 2009 at lowest level since 1950 - USATODAY.com

 

[Dad2three]

What drives anti-government extremists?[/B

Easy. Government extremists.

Conservatives just ignore facts and reality. They have "faith" that their ideology is correct.

 

[Dad2three]

I have my own beliefs and opinions, but I'd really like to hear from others.

One word: Freedom

Those that base their ideology on a bumper-sticker can be led by the nose to just about anywhere, as the TPGOP shows US daily....

 

[Dad2three]

The trouble with the modern union and pop-culture educated left is that they have been indoctrinated to be tolerant of all sorts of antisocial behavior for so long that they can't recognize a crazy person from a 60's radical. As a matter of fact maybe there is no difference between the bald on top, long hair on the sides former SDS Weatherman punk and a crazy person.

Parrots repeat what they hear. The RW media doesn't profit from educating their listeners. They know the money is in saying outrageous things that fit their listeners ideology. The listeners want to be outraged. The RW media produces the outrageous material. Truth not required. It's a symbiotic relationship.


The most intelligent, educated, and informed people are almost never Republicans



"Only 6% of scientists are registered republicans. Or this: Only 7% of journalists are registered republicans. We can agree, can’t we, that becoming a scientist requires a remarkable dedication to scholarship, education, and to the truth? We can agree, can’t we, that nobody knows more about the working of our “democracy” than journalists? So, why have well over 90% of those who have followed a scientific or journalistic path rejected the Republican party? Could the answer be more obvious? The Republican war on science fought on behalf of the wealthiest and most powerful and the utter contempt which Congressional Republicans hold for the democratic process have completely alienated our brightest, most informed, and most curious."

HAL GINSBERG

 

[Dad2three]

I have my own beliefs and opinions, but I'd really like to hear from others.

During the Vietnam war the far left was setting off bombs around the country.

Timothy McVeigh - Oklahoma City

Terror From the Right: Plots, Conspiracies and Racist Rampages Since Oklahoma City



July 28, 1995
Antigovernment extremist Charles Ray Polk is arrested after trying to purchase a machine gun from an undercover police officer, and is later indicted by federal grand jury for plotting to blow up the Internal Revenue Service building in Austin, Texas


October 9, 1995
Saboteurs derail an Amtrak passenger train near Hyder, Ariz., killing one person and injuring about 70 others. Several antigovernment messages, signed by the "Sons of Gestapo," are left behind. The perpetrators remain at large.

November 9, 1995
Oklahoma Constitutional Militia leader Willie Ray Lampley, his wife Cecilia and another man, John Dare Baird, are arrested as they prepare explosives to bomb numerous targets, including the Southern Poverty Law Center, gay bars and abortion clinics.


MANY, MANY MORE FROM RIGHT WING EXTREMISTS


http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/publications/terror-from-the-right

 

[Dad2three]

It's a load of crap.

Anti-government extremist want government to leave them alone, they aren't making a statement about what they want government to be. They want government to not be in their business.

Liberal's identity is so tied up in government, you can't even comprehend the idea that someone's identity isn't.

The problem with your question is you didn't define what you view as an extremist. Are you talking about the violent ones like Timothy McVie? Or do you consider libertarians extremists like Jake does. We are completely different animals.

I didn't SAY government. I said America. To reiterate, I said the following:

It's a hatred for America because it's not a reflection of the way they want it to be and think it should be.​

It's their hatred for the way that America is that drives their anti-American sentiments and anti-American feelings. They may very well blame gov't for some of it, but certainly not all of it. They blame other groups of people who are not like them. Those other groups have agendas different than theirs, maybe even opposed to what they want. They believe that THEIR America is slipping away from them, and by their America I don't just mean the kind of nation they want. I also mean a nation that belongs to them which used to grant people like them preferential treatment. They don't care about E Pluribus Unum unless they can be first among so-called equals. This is where their problem with gov't begins because the gov't is no longer consistently or automatically siding with them just because of who they are. Often when they talk about a loss of their rights, that's what they really mean.

Disdain for tyrannical government is not hating America.

But, like kaz said, the progressive identity is so intertwined with government, that the two are believed to be one in the same.

"Patriot" Profile #3

Every Man a King: The Rise and Fall of the Montana Freemen


To understand the roots of the Montana Freemen, like so many other elements of today's so-called "patriot" movement, one has to go back to Posse Comitatus, the nebulous antigovernment movement founded in 1969 by retired dry cleaner Henry L. Beach. Beach, a former Silver Shirt (a 1930s-era pro-Nazi group), argued that the only legitimate government was local government. The highest legitimate elected official in the country was the county sheriff, who could form juries and call out the able-bodied men of the county to enforce the law. Naturally enough, Beach and other members of the movement were strongly opposed to the federal government, especially those parts of it which dealt with money, the Internal Revenue Service and the Federal Reserve System.


"Patriot" Profile #3: Every Man a King: The Rise and Fall of the Montana Freemen


WINGNUTS!

 

[Shanty]

I have my own beliefs and opinions, but I'd really like to hear from others.

Driven? Nah. More like led to Lemming Heaven.

 

[Dad2three]

Bundy's not a nut. He's just a guy who is tired of being screwed over.

So we have a rancher who owes the government a ton of money but refuses to pay his bills. The rancher doesn't believe that the federal government has authority over him or even exists. When the authorities try to collect payment from the rancher, the rancher calls out for help to militia members. Armed individuals descend on the ranch and intimidate the government employees from doing their duty. Plans are made to use women and children as human shields against the tyrannical government. Oh, the rancher is also a racist to boot.

Cliven Bundy? Yes, but I'm also talking about a Montana rancher by the name of Ralph Clark who was a member of the Freemen "patriot" movement.


I "Understand" Cliven Bundy All Too Well


In the "foxified" world, his disdain for Federal Government gets EXTREMISTS a pass...