Zone1 Were there human beings before Adam and Eve?

provide one ... provide the original christian bible written in the 4th century - there are none.

no original bible means not written any others from the heavens ...

You changed your statement from what you said in post #(726). There you said 'there is no collection of documents preserved used to write the Christian Bible'. Now you say, 'provide the original Christian Bible'.

There are many manuscripts and writings from which the Bible comes from. There are no original manuscripts or writings in existence.

The fact that there are no originals doesn't mean what we have in the Bible, is not a copy of the originals.

Quantrill
 
The fact that there are no originals doesn't mean what we have in the Bible, is not a copy of the originals.

without the original claimed by you to have special meaning the spiritual essence is lost forever had such actually ever existed.

not so the heavenly religion of antiquity - the triumph of good vs evil - the means to acquire judgement upon completion allowing for admission to the everlasting. remains eternal for all living beings the sustenance of their existence.
 
without the original claimed by you to have special meaning the spiritual essence is lost forever had such actually ever existed.

not so the heavenly religion of antiquity - the triumph of good vs evil - the means to acquire judgement upon completion allowing for admission to the everlasting. remains eternal for all living beings the sustenance of their existence.

Well, the Bible disagrees with you. Jesus Christ gave His seal of approval of the Old Testament Scripture in His day. (Matt. 5:18) "...Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law till all be fulfilled." And Jesus quoted many other Scriptures. All of which would have come from copies of the Scriptures.

Quantrill
 
We know these passages are dealing with Christ and with Adam. (1 Cor. 15:22) "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive."

And we know that God calls Adam and Christ, the first Adam and the Last Adam. (1 Cor. 15:45) "And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit."

Many times Christians make the honest mistake of calling Christ the Second Adam. But Scripture doesn't call Him the Second Adam. It calls Him the Last Adam. And for a reason.

Each Adam represented their race. They are the head of their race. Their actions are applied to their race. Because Adam sinned, all his race sinned with him. Because Christ was obedient, all His race is obedient and receives the gift of life and righteousness. (Rom. 5:17)

For all those in the 'first Adam', there is nothing they can do to obtain eternal life. They can't lead a good life and be moral and earn eternal life. They are sinners because Adam sinned. They can't remove it no matter how hard they try. The only hope is to turn, by faith, to Jesus Christ, the Last Adam, and be saved. This places them 'in Christ', the Last Adam.

Adam is called 'the first Adam' because he was the 'first Adam'. There had never been another. He was the first representative head of the human race. Jesus Christ is called 'the Last Adam' because there will never be another. Jesus Christ is the Last Representative Head of the human race'

But, what about Jesus as the Second Man. Why is He called the Second Man when numerically He was not the Second Man?
(1 Cor. 15:47)

Quantrill

It was always God's plan to populate the earth with man and have man implement God's will upon earth. And the mankind that God would create would be perfect and God fearing and obedient to His laws and will.

Which means, when God created Adam and Eve and told them to be fruitful and multiply, (Gen. 1:28), it was the children of a perfect Adam and Eve born unto them that God had in mind. Making the children perfect and Godly also.

Just as it was God's will to have man exercise the Kingdom of God on earth, so it was always His plan that the Son, that Second Person of the Godhead (Trinity), would be born into the family of man as a Man, and would rule over the earth and perform all of the Fathers will.

When the Fall occurred, another seed line was introduced into the human race that was not 'of God'. Which meant that the earth would be populated by both those of God and those not of God. And Cain, who was numerically the second man after Adam, was born. But Cain was not of God. He was of the devil. (1 John 3:12) "Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one"

And it's interesting that when Cain was born Eve said, "I have gotten a man from the LORD". As though she expected the child to be from God. But Cain was not from God. He was of that wicked one.

It is my opinion that Christ is called the Second Man, because God always intended for Him to be the Second Man numerically from Adam. For to accomplish what (1 Cor. 15:45-46) says in calling Christ a 'quickening spirit'. When Adam was created he had a spirit, but it was a human spirit. And it was always God's plan to impart His Spirit to man, which would be done through Christ the Last Adam and Second Man. And didn't Christ do just that even prior to the coming of the Holy Ghost at Pentecost? (John 20:22) "And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost."

Now, the fall changed the timing of Christ's being born into the family of man, but didn't change God's count. Because God's count was always based upon those of him. Have you noticed how when Cain's line is given in (Gen. 4:16-24) that nothing is said of how long they lived? Because it was not important to God. But with Seth's line, the Godly line, (Gen. 4:25-26) God gives the exact number of years each lived.

Had the fall not occurred Christ was the Last Adam and Second Man who would give the Holy Ghost to Adam's perfect descendants. A quickening or life giving spirit. But because the Fall did occur, Christ is still the Last Adam and Second Man and the Holy Ghost is given to those placing faith in Christ. And all the believing are counted from that Second Man, Christ.

Quantrill
 
Well, the Bible disagrees with you. Jesus Christ gave His seal of approval of the Old Testament Scripture in His day. (Matt. 5:18)

you mean the 4th century crucifiers who wrote the non corroborated 4th century christian bible ... you are correct.

the 1st century events from the beginning to end is the repudiation of judaism - false commandments, hereditary idolatry religion of apartheid et al ... than conveying the true religion of antiquity taught by jesus - liberation theology, self determination.
 
you mean the 4th century crucifiers who wrote the non corroborated 4th century christian bible ... you are correct.

the 1st century events from the beginning to end is the repudiation of judaism - false commandments, hereditary idolatry religion of apartheid et al ... than conveying the true religion of antiquity taught by jesus - liberation theology, self determination.

No, the Bible that was written by Individuals from the time of Moses.

Quantrill
 
Well, being true to God and Jesus Christ is first on the Christians agenda. When government becomes evil and goes against God, and persecutes the Christians for their faith, the Christian submits to that...not by obeying to the evil, but by submitting to the punishment for not obeying the evil.
Thats not what Paul said which purports that Caesar was in power by Divine decree, not by fascist violence cruelty and brutality, and to defy Caesar was to defy God which refutes your pathetic spin on what he wrote.

Paul is clearly exhorting Christians to not rebel against 'authorities', to obey and submit to evil. Nero at the time. If Jesus took Pauls despicable advice he would have never been crucified and you would have never heard of him. He would have submitted to the devil of the temptation and joined the accursed dead to become wealthy.

I heard that you read the Bible and believe. Am I telling you something you didn't already know you phony ****?

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

Romans 13:1-3
 
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No, the Bible that was written by Individuals from the time of Moses.

Quantrill

they wrote about the 1st century - and there is corroborating evidence for their claims of heavenly personifications during their times ... judaism, as their phony commandments.
 
Thats not what Paul said which purports that Caesar was in power by Divine decree, not by fascist violence cruelty and brutality, and to defy Caesar was to defy God which refutes your pathetic spin on what he wrote.

Paul is clearly exhorting Christians to not rebel against 'authorities', to obey and submit to evil. Nero at the time. If Jesus took Pauls despicable advice he would have never been crucified and you would have never heard of him. He would have submitted to the devil of the temptation and joined the accursed dead to become wealthy.

I heard that you read the Bible and believe. Am I telling you something you didn't already know you phony ****?

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

Romans 13:1-3

The Christian in submitting to the punishment is obeying the powers that be.

Jesus did submit to Rome's authority. Are you saying Jesus did not submit to Rome's authority? Yes, I know the Bible and believe. You instead use the Bible for your own gain, trying to present yourself as some religious one to follow. How is that going? Got any followers yet.? Some empty minded individuals who don't know shit from shineola.

(John 19:10-11) "Then saith Pilate unto him, Speakest thou not unto me? knowest thou not that I have power to crucify thee, and have power to release thee? Jesus answered, Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above: therefore he that delivered me unto thee hath the greater sin."

I heard you didn't know the Bible at at all but used the Bible for your own gain, and after our discussions I now believe it. As you can see, Jesus and Paul are in agreement. But they don't agree with you.

Go peddle your lies and phony god to someone else.

Quantrill
 
they wrote about the 1st century - and there is corroborating evidence for their claims of heavenly personifications during their times ... judaism, as their phony commandments.

No, the Bible was written by individuals from the time of Moses.

Quantrill
 
No, the Bible was written by individuals from the time of Moses.

Quantrill
they wrote about the 1st century - and there is corroborating evidence for their claims of heavenly personifications during their times ... judaism, as their phony commandments.

c-bible is written in the 4th century after a period spanning just short of 100 years - and did not retain an appendix of the documents used as partially non existed of relevance for what they wrote.
 
c-bible is written in the 4th century after a period spanning just short of 100 years - and did not retain an appendix of the documents used as partially non existed of relevance for what they wrote.

The Bible was written from about 1450 B.C. to about 100 A.D.

Quantrill
 
The Christian in submitting to the punishment is obeying the powers that be.
Thats absurd. Paul is clearly saying that rebelling against the "authorities' was rebellion against God, and if they did rebel against the authority which at that time was Rome under Nero (who claimed to be a god) they will suffer the consequences. IT WAS A THREAT.

But they did openly rebel, THEY DID NOT SUBMIT TO ROMAN "AUTHORITIES" and suffered the consequences.

The first persecution of Christians organized by the Roman government was under the emperor Nero in 64CE, just a few years after this letter of Paul telling Christians to not rebel against Rome, or else, was written.

Obviously early Christians said **** you to Paul and his warning about Roman authority in a very heroic way.


Jesus did submit to Rome's authority. Are you saying Jesus did not submit to Rome's authority?
Nonsense. Jesus submitted to the will of God and did not submit to Rome. He was executed for sedition.:nocknockHT: ITS TRADITION! Jesus was most likely inspired by the Prophets and the story of Eleazar the scribe and martyr.

Even when someone tried to trick him by asking if they should pay taxes and Jesus replied,"Render unto Caesar the things of Caesar and render unto God the things of God." he was not submitting to any Roman authority. His response was brilliant. To the average Roman or Jewish traitor standing around it seemed like Jesus was telling people to pay taxes, but to the Jewish faithful standing around he was saying the exact opposite, do not render unto Caesar anything because everything belongs to God and nothing belonged to Caesar especially in Judea.
 
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Thats absurd. Paul is clearly saying that rebelling against the "authorities' was rebellion against God, and if they did rebel against the authority which at that time was Rome under Nero (who claimed to be a god) they will suffer the consequences. IT WAS A THREAT.

But they did openly rebel, THEY DID NOT SUBMIT TO ROMAN "AUTHORITIES" and suffered the consequences.

The first persecution of Christians organized by the Roman government was under the emperor Nero in AD 64 just a few years after this letter of Paul telling Christians to not rebel against Rome, or else, was written.



Nonsense. Jesus submitted to the will of God and did not submit to Rome. He was executed for sedition.

Even when someone tried to trick him by asking if they should pay taxes and Jesus replied,"Render unto Caesar the things of Caesar and render unto God the things of God." he was not submitting to any Roman authority. His response was brilliant. To the average Roman or Jewish traitor standing around it seemed like Jesus was telling people to pay taxes, but to the Jewish faithful standing around he was saying the exact opposite, do not render unto Caesar anything because everything belongs to God and nothing belonged to Caesar especially in Judea.

No, not absurd. The Christian is to obey the powers that be. But, when the powers that be go against the commandment of God and order the Christian to obey the government, then the Christian obeys God instead, and suffers the punishment for it. That is submitting to the government.

I already showed you how Jesus submitted to Rome. (John 19:10-11) The disciples later would do the same when brought before the council of the Jews. (Acts 5:27-28) "...Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name?...Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men. (Acts 5:40) "...and when they had called the apostles, and beaten them, they commanded that they should not speak in the name of Jesus, and let them go." (Acts 5:40-41) "And they departed...rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for his name. And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ"

When the Christian obeys God rather than man and suffers the penalty for it, he is submitting to the authority.

Jesus was not executed for sedition by Rome. He was found innocent by Rome. (John 19:4) "Pilate therefore went forth again, and saith unto them, Behold, I bring him forth to you, that ye may know that I find no fault in him."

Quantrill
 
The Christian is to obey the powers that be.
Wow. You actually wrote that down for everyone to see? Copra sanctum! You should be ashamed of yourself.

You are just wrong. The Christian is supposed to obey God by complying with the Divine commands in the same exact WAY that Jesus taught and demonstrated, whatever the cost, the only right WAY to comply with the Laws demands that fulfills the promise of abundant blessings on earth and eternal life in the sanctuary of God, NOW, for all who listen to his teaching and act on it, eat his flesh and drink his blood. Life is in the blood, in the doing.

Listen father Vivian O'Blivion, however resplendent in your frock you are just a corpse without "the breath of life". You are only fooling yourself. You have confused faith with obstinate stupidity, idolatry, a sin under penalty of death, with the way to eternal life. YOUR HAVE YOUR REWARD ALREADY. Death. But don't take it too hard. There is still some hope. You still have a few milliseconds left as a hapless human lurking here on earth to repent for your idolatry and your lies and your murders and your sorcery to avoid complete and permanent destruction.

Thats "the good news". You're welcome.



ATTENTION! NOW HEAR THIS:

Rising from the dead is as easy or as difficult as it is for anyone to be honest with themselves and others.

You should give it a try.

THIS IS NOT A DRILL.
 
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Jesus was not executed for sedition by Rome. He was found innocent by Rome. (John 19:4) "Pilate therefore went forth again, and saith unto them, Behold, I bring him forth to you, that ye may know that I find no fault in him."

Sure, Rome thought Jesus was innocent but executed him for sedition anyway because Pilate was afraid of the crowd? :auiqs.jpg:But you are leaving out the part where Pilate asks Jesus if he was a king and Jesus responded "King is your word. My task (as messiah) is to bear witness to the truth." And went on to say, "My kingdom is not of this world." to which Pilate exclaimed "So you are a king!" and then had Jesus taken away to be executed.

Melekh Ha-Yehudim, crown of thorns,140 lashes with the flagellum, beatings, mock worship, crucifixion and all.
 
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The Bible was written from about 1450 B.C. to 100 A.D.

I am Christian.

Quantrill

if that is your written bible you are a jew ... not really any worse than being a christian - both are makebelieve.
 
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