Zone1 Were there human beings before Adam and Eve?

[Quantrill]

….and that’s what makes the story of Adam and Eve a myth.

You do realize that “supernatural” and “mythological” go hand in hand for a reason?

What makes the story of Adam and Eve a myth based on my questions in post #(538)?

Why reply to the post when what you are saying has nothing to do with what I said.?

Why didn't you reply to post #(536) instead of ignoring it, which was addressed to you and pertains to what you just said?

Quantrill

 

[braalian]

What makes the story of Adam and Eve a myth based on my questions in post #(538)?

Why reply to the post when what you are saying has nothing to do with what I said.?

Why didn't you reply to post #(536) instead of ignoring it, which was addressed to you and pertains to what you just said?

Quantrill

I quoted the wrong post. I was referring to the one you made about supernatural bs science etc

 

[Quantrill]

….and that’s what makes the story of Adam and Eve a myth.

You do realize that “supernatural” and “mythological” go hand in hand for a reason?

No, I didn't realize that. Why is that?

Quantrill

 

[braalian]

No, I didn't realize that. Why is that?

Quantrill

Because most myths are supernatural in nature, and the supernatural is inherently “mythological” in the sense that they don’t exist in the real world

 

[Quantrill]

Because most myths are supernatural in nature, and the supernatural is inherently “mythological” in the sense that they don’t exist in the real world

Except science cannot know that they exist or not in the real world.

Is science still learning things it did not previously know?

Quantrill

 

[toobfreak]

Because most myths are supernatural in nature, and the supernatural is inherently “mythological” in the sense that they don’t exist in the real world

I separate the two by saying:

MYTHOLOGICAL: An account or story which cannot be tied to any particular known time, location and occurrence in the physical world.

SUPERNATURAL: An account or story which contains elements outside of known physical laws, ie, not containing magic.

 

[braalian]

Except science cannot know that they exist or not in the real world.

Is science still learning things it did not previously know?

Quantrill

That’s been proven again and again to be some seriously strained logic

By that logic any random theory (and I’m using that word colloquially here) about ghosts or mental powers or demons or anything can be said to “maybe be true” simply because it’s inherently almost impossible to “prove” something doesn’t exist.

Maybe there was a talking snake that told a woman to eat a magic apple.

Maybe some Greek girl ate some enchanted wheat kernels and was doomed to spend every winter as the wife of Hades

Maybe aliens helped the ancient Egyptians build the pyramids and somehow left zero verifiable artifacts or proof behind

Maybe we live in a multiverse and tomorrow the Avengers will cross into our universe chasing some super villain who has an inter-dimensional machine

Maybe. Science cannot definitively DISprove any of that

See my point?

 

[braalian]

I separate the two by saying:

MYTHOLOGICAL: An account or story which cannot be tied to any particular known time, location and occurrence in the physical world.

SUPERNATURAL: An account or story which contains elements outside of known physical laws, ie, not containing magic.

I’ll agree with that to some extent

But once the supernatural stuff veers off into discussions of ghosts or telekinesis or stuff like that, we might as well be talking about magic

 

[toobfreak]

Maybe there was a talking snake that told a woman to eat a magic apple.

I'm sure you know all the stories behind various constellations in the sky, like the 7 stars in the Pleiades (star cluster) are the 7 sisters of Orion. Thing is, these are just stories. I used to study archeoastronomy, the history of ancient theories on the stars. Long ago in the East, they envisioned that the world was a flat disc that sat on the backs of elephants. Other cultures believed the world was held up by giant turtles.

That is what the above story reminds me of--- talking snake comes down a tree with a magic apple--- I mean, who made the snake and tree and put them there in the first place?

It all comes down to discipline and free choice. After all, God told them do not eat of the tree in the middle of the garden!

Obvious, the account of Genesis was either written by someone's fanciful imagination trying to give the Bible a start and beginning, or it was written by someone trying to take a story really big and bring it down to a level simple enough, that primitive mankind from thousands of years ago could understand and believe it.

 

[braalian]

I'm sure you know all the stories behind various constellations in the sky, like the 7 stars in the Pleiades (star cluster) are the 7 sisters of Orion. Thing is, these are just stories. I used to study archeoastronomy, the history of ancient theories on the stars. Long ago in the East, they envisioned that the world was a flat disc that sat on the backs of elephants. Other cultures believed the world was held up by giant turtles.

That is what the above story reminds me of--- talking snake comes down a tree with a magic apple--- I mean, who made the snake and tree and put them there in the first place?

It all comes down to discipline and free choice. After all, God told them do not eat of the tree in the middle of the garden!

Obvious, the account of Genesis was either written by someone's fanciful imagination trying to give the Bible a start and beginning, or it was written by someone trying to take a story really big and bring it down to a level simple enough, that primitive mankind from thousands of years ago could understand and believe it.

Adam and Eve works great as a metaphor

It’s the folks who, in 2025, take it at literal face value who concern me

 

[toobfreak]

Adam and Eve works great as a metaphor
It’s the folks who, in 2025, take it at literal face value who concern me

Well, science gives us 10,000 reasons to know that the first human did not just appear 6,000 years ago.

But Adam and Eve don't even have to be a metaphor--- they just were not the first people and no one from 6,000 years ago or even 1600 years ago could have known who, where and when the first humans appeared. Europeans didn't even know the Americas existed until the 1490s, but human activity can be traced back at least 25-30,000 years ago with anatomically modern humans, and proto-humans going back as far as perhaps 3 million years.

 

[braalian]

Well, science gives us 10,000 reasons to know that the first human did not just appear 6,000 years ago.

But Adam and Eve don't even have to be a metaphor--- they just were not the first people and no one from 6,000 years ago or even 1600 years ago could have known who, where and when the first humans appeared. Europeans didn't even know the Americas existed until the 1490s, but human activity can be traced back at least 25-30,000 years ago with anatomically modern humans, and proto-humans going back as far as perhaps 3 million years.

True

I’d also argue that, even taking out the “first humans ever” angle, a story about talking snakes and magic fruit is still pretty difficult to believe

 

[toobfreak]

a story about talking snakes and magic fruit is still pretty difficult to believe

At least not without having a few snorts of Irish Whiskey first.

I just want to know what those Franciscan Friars were /really/ putting in their rum cake?

But seriously, while I'll concede the possibility that at some point, there really was an actual Adam and Eve who went on to have Cain and Abel and begin the whole biblical drama, the devil as a snake telling her not to eat of the forbidden fruit really hurts the credibility of the story in the context of a 21st century society.

I'll give us at least having THAT much sense!

 

[Quantrill]

That’s been proven again and again to be some seriously strained logic

By that logic any random theory (and I’m using that word colloquially here) about ghosts or mental powers or demons or anything can be said to “maybe be true” simply because it’s inherently almost impossible to “prove” something doesn’t exist.

Maybe there was a talking snake that told a woman to eat a magic apple.

Maybe some Greek girl ate some enchanted wheat kernels and was doomed to spend every winter as the wife of Hades

Maybe aliens helped the ancient Egyptians build the pyramids and somehow left zero verifiable artifacts or proof behind

Maybe we live in a multiverse and tomorrow the Avengers will cross into our universe chasing some super villain who has an inter-dimensional machine

Maybe. Science cannot definitively DISprove any of that

See my point?

The logic is that science cannot prove one way or another the supernatural. Nothing strained about that. Science deals only with the natural, not the supernatural. It's not that science doesn't have the obligation as you try to say. It is that science does not have the ability, the tools, to understand or prove, or disprove anything in the supernatural.

Science can only say, 'it does not know'. Calling something a 'myth' because it is supernatural is calling it false. And for science to call something a 'myth' it must have the ability to prove or disprove the supernatural. Which it doesn't.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

True

I’d also argue that, even taking out the “first humans ever” angle, a story about talking snakes and magic fruit is still pretty difficult to believe

And no one says you have to believe it. But we who are Christian and believers, do believe it.

Quantrill

 

[hobelim]

Oh gee...you can add. Can you multiply? 1 x 1 x 1= what?

When one is god the father, and one is god the son, a man, and the other is god a ghost rapist it = a false god.

 

[hobelim]

All who are 'in Christ'.

I guess that disqualifies you who openly admits to being a sinner and proves it every time you set aside the law of my God to seek spiritual life on your knees from a lifeless piece of bread made by human hands.

Yes, I am a sinner. But, I am 'in Christ'.

You must be sinner to be in Christ

You should find another hobby. You really suck at acting.


To commit sin is to break Gods Law: Sin, in fact, is lawlessness. Christ appeared, as you know, to do away with sins, and there is no sin in him. No man who dwells in him is a sinner; the sinner has not seen him and does not know him.

My children, do not be misled: it is the man who does what is right who is righteous, as God is righteous; the man who sins is a child of the devil, for the devil has been a sinner from the first; and the Son of God appeared for the very purpose of undoing the devils work.

A child of God does not commit sin, because the divine seed remains in him; he cannot be a sinner because he is God's child. That is the distinction between the children of God and the children of the devil: no one who does not do what is right is God's child, nor is anyone who does not love his brother." 1 John 3:4-10

 

[hobelim]

a story about talking snakes and magic fruit is still pretty difficult to believe

Not if you understand the metaphors. The talking snake is a deceiver and the forbidden fruit is the bullshit of a con man, a liar, cult leader, demagogue, or religious charlatan who preys on the gullible for power wealth and fame. When you swallow the bullshit of a deceiver it will defile and contaminate your mind and you will surely die.

Lose your soul your awareness your individuality the ability to be rational, what makes humans humane, life itself.

In Hebrew the word for serpent is Nachash which is both a noun and an adjective meaning snake, brazen, shiny one, and/or someone who practices divination, the magical arts, sorcery, what is now well known as hypnotism brainwashing or mind control, the feared and revered stars of the ancient world. There's a plague of talking serpents infecting millions with their deadly poison running amok worldwide right now. Many die when bitten.

Their unburied corpses piled high are defiling congress, rotting where they stand under the heat of the rising sun.

 

[hobelim]

Maybe aliens helped

The entire Bible is full of accounts of people interacting with "otherworldly beings" who looked humanoid but had the semblance of a hand. Making it clear that what they called "living creatures" were not human or of this world.

 

[Quantrill]

When one is god the father, and one is god the son, a man, and the other is god a ghost rapist it = a false god.

You didn't answer the question. I guess multiplication is above you. It is after all, 3rd grade level. Better stick with 1+1.

Quantrill