was it ok to destroy Dresden?

[ShahdagMountains]

my actions?

You plural. Meaning the Germans.

 

[Mushroom]

I actually said bombing the railyard was valid. But destroying that city doesn’t have any similar military value

Other than the railyards, that were built right in the city or right on the edge of the city. And the factories, that were built in the city or right on the edge.

You know, the longer and longer this goes on, the more it sounds like a bad Monty Python joke.

 

[BackAgain]

Other than the railyards, that were built right in the city or right on the edge of the city. And the factories, that were built in the city or right on the edge.

You know, the longer and longer this goes on, the more it sounds like a bad Monty Python joke.

So give it up and stop making a fool of yourself.

 

[westwall]

I have to keep reminding you of Coventry Cathedral.

Neither the Germans nor the British were capable of preci

There was no extensive AA fire. Only ONE Mosquito was badly damaged and diverted to Sweden.

Four aircraft were lost to flak, out of 20 attackers, and 28 Mustangs flying cover say otherwise.

The losses were Mosquito SZ999 the one you reference, then Mosquito RS609. Two Mustangs were also lost to flak, Mustang III HK460, and HK446.

 

[westwall]

that was rehearsed VERY low level raid and there was almost no flak. Only one Mosquito took serious damage and that was from a moored German light cruiser. With the fuzes on the bombs set to eleven second delay, that attack was at a hundred feet or so. I can't find any confirmation of the altitude they bombed at but here is a photo of a Mossie after the attack climbing out:
View attachment 1176216
Estimating the altitude from the wingspan, that Mossie is at about two hundred feet. It might be lower since the perspective of the photo is from low to high.

Yes, it was rehearsed, but it was a regular ground attack unit. Not a specialist attack squadron like 9B or 617.

And 4 aircraft were shot down, not one like you claim.

 

[westwall]

Other than the railyards, that were built right in the city or right on the edge of the city. And the factories, that were built in the city or right on the edge.

You know, the longer and longer this goes on, the more it sounds like a bad Monty Python joke.

So stop. Your point is stupid.

 

[ShahdagMountains]

A view from both sides:

The Bombing of Dresden: Was the Attack Fully Justified?

Was the 1945 bombing of Dresden a military necessity, or an Allied war crime? Here's what the men involved remember.

warfarehistorynetwork.com

 

[ShahdagMountains]

Arthur “Bomber” Harris believed that by creating a humanitarian crisis, it would lead to the collapse of the Nazi government.

And did it hasten the end of war in Europe? Does anyone know?

 

[westwall]

Arthur “Bomber” Harris believed that by creating a humanitarian crisis, it would lead to the collapse of the Nazi government.

And did it hasten the end of war in Europe? Does anyone know?

No, it didn't. Germany lost because they couldn't move stuff around the country thanks to the massive losses of rolling stock, especially locomotives which were strafed by every fighter heading home from bomber escort missions.

I would argue that that had a greater effect on the war than the bombing itself.

 

[ShahdagMountains]

No, it didn't. Germany lost because they couldn't move stuff around the country thanks to the massive losses of rolling stock, especially locomotives which were strafed by every fighter heading home from bomber escort missions.

I would argue that that had a greater effect on the war than the bombing itself.

There was also the loss of men.

Old men and young boys were being recruited into a severely depleted army.

 

[westwall]

There was also the loss of men.

Old men and young boys were being recruited into a severely depleted army.

Correct. And they had very little to equip them with by the end. Instead of anti tank cannons, they had panzerfausts.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

yes, there was no need.

Only Pushovers Preach That Revenge Is Unethical

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

the railways were not the main aim.
the aim was to kill as many civilians as possible

Only Those Who've Been in Combat Have Any Right to Judge

There are no civilians in a country at war. It is an ignorant, cowardly, and childish term, one of the many words that never should have been invented.

 

[Leo123]

The object of war is to blow up and break things as well as to kill the enemy's civilian population. Those who wage war, risk their own population.

 

[knuckles]

Thought I'd ask Brave AI for related info:

Germany was the most heavily bombed country during World War II in terms of total tonnage of explosives dropped, excluding the nuclear blasts. Over the course of the war, more than 1.3 million tons of bombs were dropped on Germany, primarily by the British Royal Air Force (RAF) and the United States Army Air Forces (USAAF). The bombing campaign began with precision attacks on military and industrial targets but shifted to widespread area bombing, particularly by the RAF after 1942, and later by the USAAF as well. This extensive bombing campaign caused massive destruction to German cities, infrastructure, and industry.

follow-up for 2nd and 3rd most bombed.

Based on the extent of aerial bombardment during World War II, excluding nuclear attacks:

• Japan was the second most bombed country. It suffered extensive firebombing campaigns by the United States, especially from late 1944 onward, targeting major cities like Tokyo, Osaka, and Nagoya. These raids caused massive destruction and civilian casualties, second only to Germany in scale.

• The United Kingdom was the third most bombed country, primarily during the German Blitz (1940–1941), which targeted cities such as London, Coventry, and Liverpool. While the tonnage dropped was less than on Germany or Japan, the sustained bombing campaign caused significant damage and loss of life.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Neither the Germans nor the British were capable of preci

Four aircraft were lost to flak, out of 20 attackers, and 28 Mustangs flying cover say otherwise.

The losses were Mosquito SZ999 the one you reference, then Mosquito RS609. Two Mustangs were also lost to flak, Mustang III HK460, and HK446.

So a ten percent loss rate for the bombers, one destroyed and one damaged and destroyed on the ground to prevent internment. That is NOT a high rate of loss for a low level attack.

 

[westwall]

So a ten percent loss rate for the bombers, one destroyed and one damaged and destroyed on the ground to prevent internment. That is NOT a high rate of loss for a low level attack.

Yeah, considering they are coming in from multiple directions, multiple altitudes, and being strafed by Mustangs, that's a shitload of flak to shoot down 4. That doesn't count the damaged aircraft.

Comparing normal flak loss rates we find that 8th and 9th Air Forces suffered a 20% loss rate to flak, this includes heavy bombers.

The 12th and 15th lost 8.5% to flak.

So that raid loss less than was normal for the 8th and 9th, but more than the 12th and 15th.

So yeah, they were engaged by significant flak.

You thought one aircraft was lost, I have no idea where you came up with that number.

Add in half of the Mustangs stayed at high altitude for fighter CAP, and the actual loss rate was actually 11.8%, so much higher than was experienced by the 12th and 15th Air Forces. And those are the men that were involved in the Ploesti attacks. Which I assume you agree were tough missions.