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Seems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
I tried to explain that, but he says it would work because of diesel electric locomotivesSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
I tried to explain that, but he says it would work because of diesel electric locomotivesSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
I have no clue as to why you are referencing fuel when the issue is transmission bearings. The whole fleet of littoral ships is screwed and they are not even sure how to fix the problem. So the last thing these krappy ships need is fuel.The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
Littoral ships are not little gun boats. They have the capability of carrying 2 Seahawk helicopters.
Getting in and out without being seen is not hampered by the ship going out to be refueled. If their mission is to remain in a given area, they will need to be refueled to maintain their readiness.
And it is far easier to remain unseen and safer going out to sea to meet an armed supply ship than it is to venture into a port and tie up at the refueling pier.
I have no clue as to why you are referencing fuel when the issue is transmission bearings. The whole fleet of littoral ships is screwed and they are not even sure how to fix the problem. So the last thing these krappy ships need is fuel.The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
Littoral ships are not little gun boats. They have the capability of carrying 2 Seahawk helicopters.
Getting in and out without being seen is not hampered by the ship going out to be refueled. If their mission is to remain in a given area, they will need to be refueled to maintain their readiness.
And it is far easier to remain unseen and safer going out to sea to meet an armed supply ship than it is to venture into a port and tie up at the refueling pier.
You are not right because the amount of fuel needed to run the generators to propel one of these ships to 50mph would just not fit on the ship, which is irrelevant because the electric motors to take the electricity to produce this level of speed do not exist.I have no clue as to why you are referencing fuel when the issue is transmission bearings. The whole fleet of littoral ships is screwed and they are not even sure how to fix the problem. So the last thing these krappy ships need is fuel.The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
Littoral ships are not little gun boats. They have the capability of carrying 2 Seahawk helicopters.
Getting in and out without being seen is not hampered by the ship going out to be refueled. If their mission is to remain in a given area, they will need to be refueled to maintain their readiness.
And it is far easier to remain unseen and safer going out to sea to meet an armed supply ship than it is to venture into a port and tie up at the refueling pier.
I made the initial comment on refueling as a reply to something you posted.
Just admit I am right and let it go.
You are not right because the amount of fuel needed to run the generators to propel one of these ships to 50mph would just not fit on the ship, which is irrelevant because the electric motors to take the electricity to produce this level of speed do not exist.I have no clue as to why you are referencing fuel when the issue is transmission bearings. The whole fleet of littoral ships is screwed and they are not even sure how to fix the problem. So the last thing these krappy ships need is fuel.The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
Littoral ships are not little gun boats. They have the capability of carrying 2 Seahawk helicopters.
Getting in and out without being seen is not hampered by the ship going out to be refueled. If their mission is to remain in a given area, they will need to be refueled to maintain their readiness.
And it is far easier to remain unseen and safer going out to sea to meet an armed supply ship than it is to venture into a port and tie up at the refueling pier.
I made the initial comment on refueling as a reply to something you posted.
Just admit I am right and let it go.
But in your mind this does not matter because the Navy has a tanker following literally every littoral ship everywhere.
Not practical pop
Nuclear submarines don't ever run off batteries. the piles use radioactive hot water to heat non-radioactive cold water turning it into steam to turn a turbine that turn the prop and the exhaust steam from the turbine turns a generator to provide electrical power to the boat. That's the reason diesel electric boats are quieter than nuke boats when running on batteries. Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? Ten seconds of Google would stop you from looking like a fool.Again the littoral ships have a high speed clutch bearing design flaw that encompasses the entire fleet of these ships. These ships can hit 50mph as designed. So the issue has nothing to do with either the diesel power or gas turbines, and if Daveman believes that his pieced together from the internet design is better than the current design and he is correct he will be a billionaire shortly. However all he is doing is quoting railroad technology that was invented 50 to 100 or even more years ago which has nothing to do with propelling a modern ship to 50mph today.In WWII several classes of Destroyer Escorts used either diesel-electric, or turbo-electric drives without batteries or oil tankers to carry fuel. They displaced roughly a third of a LCS. It’s not new technology and generators coupled to electric motors are simpler and more fuel efficient than conventional geared drivetrains. That’s because the generators can always run at the optimum speed to power the motors.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
You are correct that electric ship power is not new, and for that reason precisely it has been tested and vetted as inefficient for various reasons, though it does work better in ships that have no need to be refueled as is the case with reactor equipped vessels, in submarines the electric motors can run off battery and be very quiet as there are no generators running to provide the power. So what works well in one situation does not necessarily work as well in another
The new littoral ships were not meant to be either destroyers or troop carriers, they are glorified fast attack boats that have high speed malfunctioning clutch bearings to their gears. As such they are armored for the job that they are intended to do, as for their weapons, they are massive but reside in part on the subs under them that will certainly be there on an attack missionYou are not right because the amount of fuel needed to run the generators to propel one of these ships to 50mph would just not fit on the ship, which is irrelevant because the electric motors to take the electricity to produce this level of speed do not exist.I have no clue as to why you are referencing fuel when the issue is transmission bearings. The whole fleet of littoral ships is screwed and they are not even sure how to fix the problem. So the last thing these krappy ships need is fuel.The idea of a littoral ship is to be in and out before being seen, not to drag in a tanker half as big as Rhode Island to refuelNope, if the transmission does not run the ship needs no refuelingActually there is no need to refuel ships that need a tugboat to tow them into port which is what this thread is about.
But you make sure that the ships that do not run have fuel anyway.
LOL
You give up on the littoral ships being used for launching landing craft?
Littoral ships need support, like any other vessel. Being able to refuel without being forced to go to a specific port, or in places where there are no ports, increases their mission capability.
That is a given. I was simply addressing another of your comments.
Littoral ships are not little gun boats. They have the capability of carrying 2 Seahawk helicopters.
Getting in and out without being seen is not hampered by the ship going out to be refueled. If their mission is to remain in a given area, they will need to be refueled to maintain their readiness.
And it is far easier to remain unseen and safer going out to sea to meet an armed supply ship than it is to venture into a port and tie up at the refueling pier.
I made the initial comment on refueling as a reply to something you posted.
Just admit I am right and let it go.
But in your mind this does not matter because the Navy has a tanker following literally every littoral ship everywhere.
Not practical pop
Sorry to bring you back to the reality of what I said, but there would not be a tanker following them around. The tankers used by the US Navy are mobile and well armed.
And the Littoral ships include two classes and we have 21 of them in service right now. The oldest was commissioned in 2008.
The biggest operation issue, aside from the transmission, is that they lack the manpower and armaments to fight anything but small, fast boats not armed with missile systems.
Nuclear submarines don't ever run off batteries. the piles use radioactive hot water to heat non-radioactive cold water turning it into steam to turn a turbine that turn the prop and the exhaust steam from the turbine turns a generator to provide electrical power to the boat. That's the reason diesel electric boats are quieter than nuke boats when running on batteries. Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? Ten seconds of Google would stop you from looking like a fool.Again the littoral ships have a high speed clutch bearing design flaw that encompasses the entire fleet of these ships. These ships can hit 50mph as designed. So the issue has nothing to do with either the diesel power or gas turbines, and if Daveman believes that his pieced together from the internet design is better than the current design and he is correct he will be a billionaire shortly. However all he is doing is quoting railroad technology that was invented 50 to 100 or even more years ago which has nothing to do with propelling a modern ship to 50mph today.In WWII several classes of Destroyer Escorts used either diesel-electric, or turbo-electric drives without batteries or oil tankers to carry fuel. They displaced roughly a third of a LCS. It’s not new technology and generators coupled to electric motors are simpler and more fuel efficient than conventional geared drivetrains. That’s because the generators can always run at the optimum speed to power the motors.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
You are correct that electric ship power is not new, and for that reason precisely it has been tested and vetted as inefficient for various reasons, though it does work better in ships that have no need to be refueled as is the case with reactor equipped vessels, in submarines the electric motors can run off battery and be very quiet as there are no generators running to provide the power. So what works well in one situation does not necessarily work as well in another
Qualified for what? Cook, laundry attendant, missile counter?Nuclear submarines don't ever run off batteries. the piles use radioactive hot water to heat non-radioactive cold water turning it into steam to turn a turbine that turn the prop and the exhaust steam from the turbine turns a generator to provide electrical power to the boat. That's the reason diesel electric boats are quieter than nuke boats when running on batteries. Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? Ten seconds of Google would stop you from looking like a fool.Again the littoral ships have a high speed clutch bearing design flaw that encompasses the entire fleet of these ships. These ships can hit 50mph as designed. So the issue has nothing to do with either the diesel power or gas turbines, and if Daveman believes that his pieced together from the internet design is better than the current design and he is correct he will be a billionaire shortly. However all he is doing is quoting railroad technology that was invented 50 to 100 or even more years ago which has nothing to do with propelling a modern ship to 50mph today.In WWII several classes of Destroyer Escorts used either diesel-electric, or turbo-electric drives without batteries or oil tankers to carry fuel. They displaced roughly a third of a LCS. It’s not new technology and generators coupled to electric motors are simpler and more fuel efficient than conventional geared drivetrains. That’s because the generators can always run at the optimum speed to power the motors.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
You are correct that electric ship power is not new, and for that reason precisely it has been tested and vetted as inefficient for various reasons, though it does work better in ships that have no need to be refueled as is the case with reactor equipped vessels, in submarines the electric motors can run off battery and be very quiet as there are no generators running to provide the power. So what works well in one situation does not necessarily work as well in another
He should take a little time to research before he posts. Most of the information is out there.
In fact, I would be happy to answer any submarine questions. I qualified in 1981 onboard an FBM submarine.
It's funny -- you keep changing your story based on what I tell you.Ah yea kid, they stop along the way for more fuel. Like a car on a highway, this is all part of the grid, when you get off grid there is nothing as in a ship at sea. The comical thing about you is that you seem to think you are brighter than the best ship engineers because you can copy and paste 100 year old information about frikin trains from the net. Do you really think that the Lockheed Martin engineers do not know this?Oh, my good Gaea. How damn stupid can you be? I'm getting tired of educating you; there's simply no ROI.LOL a locomotive is connected to the grid simpleton, have GE run wires thru the ocean to make your wet dream a realityYou, of all people, shouldn't be throwing around the s-word.Well I guess it's too bad that the engineers at Lockheed Martin, Huntington Ingalls and General Dynamics aren't as bright as you.Still haven't called the cruise lines and railroads? Slacker.Actually diesel electric subs do require batteries and are equipped with batteries even when the power source is nuclear because battery power requires no moving parts to provide the electricity and in certain situations is quieter and far more stealthy. Diesel actually announces ones presence. However we are actually discussing a littoral ship that you want to re-engineer to be diesel electric. Why with your amazing brain aren't you designing power plants other than your fart machine.Still throwing your tantrum, huh? Not at all surprising.Dude the first electric boat was made in 1839, there were diesel electric subs in WW2 used because there was no way to store enough air or Oxygen while submerged to power the diesels. You claim that I am wrong because I do not believe in your mythical power plant for littoral ships yet all the designers that have not built your wet dream agree with me that while it might be possible the range is too small. See kiddy electric power plants work just fine on nuclear ships and boats because millions of gallons of diesel are not needed which along with the generators and batteries severely increase weight decrease mobility and as said range.Still nothing from you but petulance. You sure do hate it when people don't automatically accept everything you say simply because you say it.Actually you are the clown that insist he is capable of designing Navy ships not me.It's obvious you know nothing about any of this. Stop insisting you do.LOL, what is the range of your fictional all electric littoral ship?You had your chance to not look like a moron.Again simpleton there is no way that these small ships can carry the fuel to run the generators. Carriers and subs run for 20 years on one Uranium sealed reactor load. Your diagram also lacks batteries for instant power and does not take into account the weight of the batteries or fuel. Also the diagram does not tell the range of the ship before needing refueling.Since you know absolutely nothing about this subject, you should remain silent.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
On edit:
But since you won't, let me illustrate your ignorance.
The top part is what the LCS ships have now, only they're far more complicated.
The bottom part is how diesel electric ship propulsion works. Generators convert mechanical power to electrical power, which then drives electric motors to spin propellers. In the case of these LCS ships, the main generator drive engines would be a combination of diesel and turbine engines. The power they produce is put on to an electrical bus. Far simpler than the mechanical gearbox they're currently using.
Here's a diagram showing diesel- and gas turbine-driven generators powering a ship:
There are no "electric" ships like your misunderstanding insists.
However if you could design ship power plants instead of copying nonsense from the net you would not be here but working on the failed design
You chose not to take advantage of it.
Renewed Interest in Diesel-Electric Marine Propulsion
Diesel Electric Drive
A well-proven commercial technology trickles down to private yachts.
Electrical Propulsion System in Ships
Your petulant foot-stamping does not alter reality. Stop posting in this thread, unless, of course, you want to look even stupider. I don't mind.
You are posting random facts from the internet about a ship that only exist in your head.
Do you take meds for this?
What's your solution? Build a propulsion system that gets used once then thrown away?
So unless you are an engineer working for Huntington Ingalls or General Dynamics you are pulling your own pud.
Please continue.
PS Give the Navy a call and give them your plan, I hear that Admirals enjoy laughing
Meanwhile, in reality, you're wrong about diesel-electric ship propulsion, and your fragile ego simply can't accept that.
Sucks to be you.
Not that you can ever comprehend any of this.
You seem to be stuck on batteries. Diesel-electric propulsion doesn't require them. (Hint: Every modern train is that burns fuel is diesel-electric. They don't have batteries to power the drive motors.)
You'd best be gettin' on the horn to the cruise line companies. Their diesel-electric cruise ships are more efficient than diesel-driven ships. Make sure you tell them how wrong they are. While you've got your phone handy, call all the railroads and tell them diesel-electric is dumb.
Meanwhile, you want to put a nuclear reactor on a surface combat vessel as small as an LCS?
Way dumb.
Diesel-electric subs do require batteries. Duh. Surface ships, having a ready supply of oxygen, do not.
And obviously, LCS don't require sonar stealth, or they would have been built diesel-electric with batteries. Again, duh.
What you could do is patent your plan and sell it to the contractor for a billion or two
You seem almost stupid enough to work for the bureau
Called GE yet and told them they're building locomotives wrong?
So you do work for the bureau, I knew it
Diesel-electric locomotives have...can you guess what's coming?...a diesel engine driving an electrical generator. They don't require a connection to the grid. He's an image from How Stuff Works For Internet Retards:
This is the part where, if you had any self-awareness at all, you'd slink away in embarrassment.
But of course, you'll be back, claiming your astounding ignorance is MY fault.
I'm done with you.
Now for the Littoral ship problems, they do not need new fuel or new power plants, they have malfunctioning clutch bearings in their transmissions. These are mechanical parts used for high speed gear changes to the propulsion shafts
Yawn
But then you are a super agent
You just can't help being wrong. The design spec for the LCS is an unrefueled range of 3,500 miles.Actually a small fast littoral ship is not going to be very stealthy if it is refueled by a TANKER in shallow enemy waters where it is designed to operate.Ah yea kid, they stop along the way for more fuel. Like a car on a highway, this is all part of the grid, when you get off grid there is nothing as in a ship at sea. The comical thing about you is that you seem to think you are brighter than the best ship engineers because you can copy and paste 100 year old information about frikin trains from the net. Do you really think that the Lockheed Martin engineers do not know this?Oh, my good Gaea. How damn stupid can you be? I'm getting tired of educating you; there's simply no ROI.LOL a locomotive is connected to the grid simpleton, have GE run wires thru the ocean to make your wet dream a realityYou, of all people, shouldn't be throwing around the s-word.Well I guess it's too bad that the engineers at Lockheed Martin, Huntington Ingalls and General Dynamics aren't as bright as you.Still haven't called the cruise lines and railroads? Slacker.Actually diesel electric subs do require batteries and are equipped with batteries even when the power source is nuclear because battery power requires no moving parts to provide the electricity and in certain situations is quieter and far more stealthy. Diesel actually announces ones presence. However we are actually discussing a littoral ship that you want to re-engineer to be diesel electric. Why with your amazing brain aren't you designing power plants other than your fart machine.Still throwing your tantrum, huh? Not at all surprising.Dude the first electric boat was made in 1839, there were diesel electric subs in WW2 used because there was no way to store enough air or Oxygen while submerged to power the diesels. You claim that I am wrong because I do not believe in your mythical power plant for littoral ships yet all the designers that have not built your wet dream agree with me that while it might be possible the range is too small. See kiddy electric power plants work just fine on nuclear ships and boats because millions of gallons of diesel are not needed which along with the generators and batteries severely increase weight decrease mobility and as said range.Still nothing from you but petulance. You sure do hate it when people don't automatically accept everything you say simply because you say it.Actually you are the clown that insist he is capable of designing Navy ships not me.It's obvious you know nothing about any of this. Stop insisting you do.LOL, what is the range of your fictional all electric littoral ship?You had your chance to not look like a moron.Again simpleton there is no way that these small ships can carry the fuel to run the generators. Carriers and subs run for 20 years on one Uranium sealed reactor load. Your diagram also lacks batteries for instant power and does not take into account the weight of the batteries or fuel. Also the diagram does not tell the range of the ship before needing refueling.Since you know absolutely nothing about this subject, you should remain silent.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
On edit:
But since you won't, let me illustrate your ignorance.
The top part is what the LCS ships have now, only they're far more complicated.
The bottom part is how diesel electric ship propulsion works. Generators convert mechanical power to electrical power, which then drives electric motors to spin propellers. In the case of these LCS ships, the main generator drive engines would be a combination of diesel and turbine engines. The power they produce is put on to an electrical bus. Far simpler than the mechanical gearbox they're currently using.
Here's a diagram showing diesel- and gas turbine-driven generators powering a ship:
There are no "electric" ships like your misunderstanding insists.
However if you could design ship power plants instead of copying nonsense from the net you would not be here but working on the failed design
You chose not to take advantage of it.
Renewed Interest in Diesel-Electric Marine Propulsion
Diesel Electric Drive
A well-proven commercial technology trickles down to private yachts.
Electrical Propulsion System in Ships
Your petulant foot-stamping does not alter reality. Stop posting in this thread, unless, of course, you want to look even stupider. I don't mind.
You are posting random facts from the internet about a ship that only exist in your head.
Do you take meds for this?
What's your solution? Build a propulsion system that gets used once then thrown away?
So unless you are an engineer working for Huntington Ingalls or General Dynamics you are pulling your own pud.
Please continue.
PS Give the Navy a call and give them your plan, I hear that Admirals enjoy laughing
Meanwhile, in reality, you're wrong about diesel-electric ship propulsion, and your fragile ego simply can't accept that.
Sucks to be you.
Not that you can ever comprehend any of this.
You seem to be stuck on batteries. Diesel-electric propulsion doesn't require them. (Hint: Every modern train is that burns fuel is diesel-electric. They don't have batteries to power the drive motors.)
You'd best be gettin' on the horn to the cruise line companies. Their diesel-electric cruise ships are more efficient than diesel-driven ships. Make sure you tell them how wrong they are. While you've got your phone handy, call all the railroads and tell them diesel-electric is dumb.
Meanwhile, you want to put a nuclear reactor on a surface combat vessel as small as an LCS?
Way dumb.
Diesel-electric subs do require batteries. Duh. Surface ships, having a ready supply of oxygen, do not.
And obviously, LCS don't require sonar stealth, or they would have been built diesel-electric with batteries. Again, duh.
What you could do is patent your plan and sell it to the contractor for a billion or two
You seem almost stupid enough to work for the bureau
Called GE yet and told them they're building locomotives wrong?
So you do work for the bureau, I knew it
Diesel-electric locomotives have...can you guess what's coming?...a diesel engine driving an electrical generator. They don't require a connection to the grid. He's an image from How Stuff Works For Internet Retards:
This is the part where, if you had any self-awareness at all, you'd slink away in embarrassment.
But of course, you'll be back, claiming your astounding ignorance is MY fault.
I'm done with you.
Now for the Littoral ship problems, they do not need new fuel or new power plants, they have malfunctioning clutch bearings in their transmissions. These are mechanical parts used for high speed gear changes to the propulsion shafts
Yawn
But then you are a super agent
Ships are refueled at sea on a regular basis. So the idea that they are "off grid" where fuel is concerned is wrong.
Yawn
Qualified for what? Cook, laundry attendant, missile counter?Nuclear submarines don't ever run off batteries. the piles use radioactive hot water to heat non-radioactive cold water turning it into steam to turn a turbine that turn the prop and the exhaust steam from the turbine turns a generator to provide electrical power to the boat. That's the reason diesel electric boats are quieter than nuke boats when running on batteries. Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? Ten seconds of Google would stop you from looking like a fool.Again the littoral ships have a high speed clutch bearing design flaw that encompasses the entire fleet of these ships. These ships can hit 50mph as designed. So the issue has nothing to do with either the diesel power or gas turbines, and if Daveman believes that his pieced together from the internet design is better than the current design and he is correct he will be a billionaire shortly. However all he is doing is quoting railroad technology that was invented 50 to 100 or even more years ago which has nothing to do with propelling a modern ship to 50mph today.In WWII several classes of Destroyer Escorts used either diesel-electric, or turbo-electric drives without batteries or oil tankers to carry fuel. They displaced roughly a third of a LCS. It’s not new technology and generators coupled to electric motors are simpler and more fuel efficient than conventional geared drivetrains. That’s because the generators can always run at the optimum speed to power the motors.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
You are correct that electric ship power is not new, and for that reason precisely it has been tested and vetted as inefficient for various reasons, though it does work better in ships that have no need to be refueled as is the case with reactor equipped vessels, in submarines the electric motors can run off battery and be very quiet as there are no generators running to provide the power. So what works well in one situation does not necessarily work as well in another
He should take a little time to research before he posts. Most of the information is out there.
In fact, I would be happy to answer any submarine questions. I qualified in 1981 onboard an FBM submarine.
I read the article. And the mechanical drivetrain as it is now certainly can't meet the speed requirement.Seems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
No, you screeched NUH UH like a little brat. Just like you're still doing.I tried to explain that, but he says it would work because of diesel electric locomotivesSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
Stick to airplanes.I tried to explain that, but he says it would work because of diesel electric locomotivesSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
Yea he's a moron.
Stick to airplanes.I tried to explain that, but he says it would work because of diesel electric locomotivesSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Seems you didn't read the article. The combination of powerplants was required to meet the 40knot speed requirement. There are no electric motors available today that can push a ship that size 40knots.
Yea he's a moron.
Thank you for your service! USAF, 1991-2011, Electrical Power Production. So...I know a little about diesel engines attached to generators.Nuclear submarines don't ever run off batteries. the piles use radioactive hot water to heat non-radioactive cold water turning it into steam to turn a turbine that turn the prop and the exhaust steam from the turbine turns a generator to provide electrical power to the boat. That's the reason diesel electric boats are quieter than nuke boats when running on batteries. Don't you ever get tired of being wrong? Ten seconds of Google would stop you from looking like a fool.Again the littoral ships have a high speed clutch bearing design flaw that encompasses the entire fleet of these ships. These ships can hit 50mph as designed. So the issue has nothing to do with either the diesel power or gas turbines, and if Daveman believes that his pieced together from the internet design is better than the current design and he is correct he will be a billionaire shortly. However all he is doing is quoting railroad technology that was invented 50 to 100 or even more years ago which has nothing to do with propelling a modern ship to 50mph today.In WWII several classes of Destroyer Escorts used either diesel-electric, or turbo-electric drives without batteries or oil tankers to carry fuel. They displaced roughly a third of a LCS. It’s not new technology and generators coupled to electric motors are simpler and more fuel efficient than conventional geared drivetrains. That’s because the generators can always run at the optimum speed to power the motors.Dude there is no such thing as what you said which was. "combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically." How does that happen?No shit, genius. Did you read the article? Did you comprehend it? They're trying to mechanically combine the output power from two diesel engines and two gas turbine engines through one complicated gearbox system. The gearbox is failing, and they don't understand why yet.That makes zero sense, as all electric propulsion systems have mechanical partsSeems like an electric propulsion system would have been far simpler, combining the power from turbines and diesels electrically instead of mechanically.
Imagine an electrical power plant with steam turbines and a large diesel generator. Are all the output shafts ganged together mechanically, or are the alternators from each unit ganged together electrically?
Hint: They're tied together electrically. Matter of fact, every generator online at any given moment feeding power to the national electrical grid are all tied together electrically...NOT mechanically.
My statement makes perfect sense. An electric drive system would be far simpler.
So you have no idea what you are babbling about. But hey it sounded good right?
An electric ship can not charge at the charging station, they would need generators, batteries, and the fuel of an oil tanker to run these so it's impossible. So try again, this works in other situations because one oil drum of Uranium powers the ship for 20 years.
You are correct that electric ship power is not new, and for that reason precisely it has been tested and vetted as inefficient for various reasons, though it does work better in ships that have no need to be refueled as is the case with reactor equipped vessels, in submarines the electric motors can run off battery and be very quiet as there are no generators running to provide the power. So what works well in one situation does not necessarily work as well in another
He should take a little time to research before he posts. Most of the information is out there.
In fact, I would be happy to answer any submarine questions. I qualified in 1981 onboard an FBM submarine.
