Twelve Years A Slave

[Asclepias]

Anyone can tell by reading your posts. Believe me, it shows.

Give me an example. Take a section of my post and explain to me how it is filled with hate and it shows. I would like to know if this is just your opinion.something I can read and reflect on and come to the same conclusion or just a biased assumption on your part.

Do you really need someone to do that for you? Can't you just read some of your own posts?

I did and I dont see anything. Thats why I asked you to point out exactly what led you to the conclusion I am full of hate. If its just a feeling or assumption you have it wont bother me at all.

 

[Pheonixops]

You would THINK that there would be a more genuine Classic Liberal distrust of govt power and reach given what Asclepias just stated..

The remedy for being "programmed for perpetual slavery" doesn't seem to logically lead to being a fan of low risk residence in a welfare state.. And a fan of special deals and priveleges..

There actually is a pretty healthy dose of that Classical Liberal ideal, you also may or may not realize, that for Black people as an historical "group" in this country; government has been a Tyrant (the very Institution of slavery or allowance thereof through 'states rights'.), a Savoir (It ended of Slavery), a Tyrant ( Black Codes, Jim Crow, segregation, and other inhumane laws and allowance of such treatment), and a Savoir when it ended the aforementioned and allowed Black people to have more representation in the Government. It's been quite a "roller coaster" ride.

I am willing to bet that if you questioned Black people regarding a myriad of Classical Liberal ideals, you may or mat not be surprised with the amount of Classical Liberals that exist in the so-called "Black Community".

I don't think that there's this "trust" of Government by Black people that you may be alluding to. If anyone has a fervent concern for their Civil Liberties, I would venture to say that's there's a whole hell of a LOT of Black folks who are concerned about keeping their Civil Liberties!

Got to tell ya -- I don't see how the trials and tribulations of my ancestors could be the PRIMARY determinant of my political interests today.. No matter how hard I try -- joining a 21st Century Bolshevik revolution because Uncle Samuel in Russia was target practice for the Czar's personal guard, so he tossed in with Lenin ---- is not in my tea leaves. Not gonna happen.

Governments are fickle and unreliable standards of morals and conviction.

And seeing all those "today" issues of low expectations in the schools for my kids, disproportionate incareration and sentencing, poor utilization of the military, and increasing wage gaps because of juvenile economic vision and leadership would be far more important to me.

I'd still appreciate the struggles of my lineage, but that was THEIR battle. And the sides they chose were their limited convienient choices.. I've got to go with the choices that make sense today..

A more real tie to my historical heritage would be to immerse myself in the luxuries that were denied to ancestors. To education, to business independence, to inclusive govt policy, to family unity and the like. Because THOSE goals are things we share..

Doesn't make sense to be a Democrat because of FDR when FDR is 70 yrs dead. Or a Republican because Reagan was a great communicator. Or a civil rights crusader plastered to the hip of the Dem Party because LBJ was a shrewd white southerner cutting deals to humble the opposition party.

I'm not sure what you are trying to allude to. Would you agree that political, social, and moral beliefs of people tend to get passed on to them by the older generations? Of course there may be a rebellious period for some people but I think they do tend to migrate back to what has been familiar to them.

I agree.

I agree; those issues are important to me as well as many other people. We are certainly not in the minority.


Agreed, that's why I am an Independent and vote for the CANDIDATE that I like and not because they have a "D", "R", or "L" after their names. I like different candidates or politicians from different parties for various reasons.

 

[Sunshine]

I would wager all civilizations enslaved. My contention is that the slavery instituted and supported by whites here in the US was the worst type to every happen in human history. You dont tell a person suffering from PSTD to just move past it. You have to work to ID it, how it affects your habits and behaviors, and work out solutions to mitigate it. Denying it existed or was not that bad certainly hampers the process for those struggling to figure out how it affects their behavior.

I wish your great great great great great grandfather was never captured and sold by his fellow Africans. I wish you were still in your homeland. Can you say the same? I didn't think so. You reap the rewards from slavery and now you expect sympathy for the pain other people felt? You've got some nerve. Those slaves would spit in your face if they were here today.

Show me a quote where Asclepias asked anyone for sympathy. I'm sure that he can have the same wish for you, depending on where they came from and when. People, regardless of color have reaped the "just rewards" from slavery in this Country. If they were no longer slaves and former slaves and were at liberty to do what they wanted, I think they would be spitting in your face and not Asclepias.

Your post above sounds like a manifestation of those poor white bigots that Frederick Douglass described in Baltimore. If you don't attitudes are generational and hard to break, I can see aspects of the aforementioned people in the posts that you and some others make about "the Blacks".

Why would he need sympathy? He gets money from our paychecks. He is not entitled to sympathy as well.

 

[Asclepias]

I wish your great great great great great grandfather was never captured and sold by his fellow Africans. I wish you were still in your homeland. Can you say the same? I didn't think so. You reap the rewards from slavery and now you expect sympathy for the pain other people felt? You've got some nerve. Those slaves would spit in your face if they were here today.

Show me a quote where Asclepias asked anyone for sympathy. I'm sure that he can have the same wish for you, depending on where they came from and when. People, regardless of color have reaped the "just rewards" from slavery in this Country. If they were no longer slaves and former slaves and were at liberty to do what they wanted, I think they would be spitting in your face and not Asclepias.

Your post above sounds like a manifestation of those poor white bigots that Frederick Douglass described in Baltimore. If you don't attitudes are generational and hard to break, I can see aspects of the aforementioned people in the posts that you and some others make about "the Blacks".

Why would he need sympathy? He gets money from our paychecks. He is not entitled to sympathy as well.

You are correct. I dont need your sympathy. You are wrong about the money from your pay checks unless you are unwittingly a customer of mine. That would be funny as hell if you were. I thank you in advance.

 

[Pheonixops]

I wish your great great great great great grandfather was never captured and sold by his fellow Africans. I wish you were still in your homeland. Can you say the same? I didn't think so. You reap the rewards from slavery and now you expect sympathy for the pain other people felt? You've got some nerve. Those slaves would spit in your face if they were here today.

Show me a quote where Asclepias asked anyone for sympathy. I'm sure that he can have the same wish for you, depending on where they came from and when. People, regardless of color have reaped the "just rewards" from slavery in this Country. If they were no longer slaves and former slaves and were at liberty to do what they wanted, I think they would be spitting in your face and not Asclepias.

Your post above sounds like a manifestation of those poor white bigots that Frederick Douglass described in Baltimore. If you don't attitudes are generational and hard to break, I can see aspects of the aforementioned people in the posts that you and some others make about "the Blacks".

Why would he need sympathy? He gets money from our paychecks. He is not entitled to sympathy as well.

I agree that he doesn't need anyone's sympathy, he seems to be doing quite well. He may be actually getting money from your paycheck directly or indirectly if your purchase some of the things he may have engineered. I'm sure he could clarify it better than I can, but I think that you are mistaken if you assume that he is on "the public dole". Here's an exchange on this thread that you may have missed:

What kind of engineering? My background is in engineering (VOIP). Some people actually want to hear answers or can provide me some knowledge so its pretty fun hanging out on here.

Mostly signal and image processing.. My wife and I have been developing products for folks as consultants for about 20 years. Lot of displays, specialty cameras, medical devices.

VOIP is (was) a different kind of gold eh??

Very lucrative as is yours.

 

[Pheonixops]

Show me a quote where Asclepias asked anyone for sympathy. I'm sure that he can have the same wish for you, depending on where they came from and when. People, regardless of color have reaped the "just rewards" from slavery in this Country. If they were no longer slaves and former slaves and were at liberty to do what they wanted, I think they would be spitting in your face and not Asclepias.

Your post above sounds like a manifestation of those poor white bigots that Frederick Douglass described in Baltimore. If you don't attitudes are generational and hard to break, I can see aspects of the aforementioned people in the posts that you and some others make about "the Blacks".

Why would he need sympathy? He gets money from our paychecks. He is not entitled to sympathy as well.

You are correct. I dont need your sympathy. You are wrong about the money from your pay checks unless you are unwittingly a customer of mine. That would be funny as hell if you were. I thank you in advance.

Now people are going to think that we are "sock puppets"!!!

 

[Asclepias]

Why would he need sympathy? He gets money from our paychecks. He is not entitled to sympathy as well.

You are correct. I dont need your sympathy. You are wrong about the money from your pay checks unless you are unwittingly a customer of mine. That would be funny as hell if you were. I thank you in advance.

Now people are going to think that we are "sock puppets"!!!

Hey sometimes you got to deal with innuendo!!

 

[Pheonixops]

You are correct. I dont need your sympathy. You are wrong about the money from your pay checks unless you are unwittingly a customer of mine. That would be funny as hell if you were. I thank you in advance.

Now people are going to think that we are "sock puppets"!!!

Hey sometimes you got to deal with innuendo!!

No doubt, it's too funny that my reply was very similar to yours and written at about the same time.

 

[Asclepias]

Now people are going to think that we are "sock puppets"!!!

Hey sometimes you got to deal with innuendo!!

No doubt, it's too funny that my reply was very similar to yours and written at about the same time.

sometimes I amuse myself way too much laughing at these clowns.

 

[flacaltenn]

There actually is a pretty healthy dose of that Classical Liberal ideal, you also may or may not realize, that for Black people as an historical "group" in this country; government has been a Tyrant (the very Institution of slavery or allowance thereof through 'states rights'.), a Savoir (It ended of Slavery), a Tyrant ( Black Codes, Jim Crow, segregation, and other inhumane laws and allowance of such treatment), and a Savoir when it ended the aforementioned and allowed Black people to have more representation in the Government. It's been quite a "roller coaster" ride.

I am willing to bet that if you questioned Black people regarding a myriad of Classical Liberal ideals, you may or mat not be surprised with the amount of Classical Liberals that exist in the so-called "Black Community".

I don't think that there's this "trust" of Government by Black people that you may be alluding to. If anyone has a fervent concern for their Civil Liberties, I would venture to say that's there's a whole hell of a LOT of Black folks who are concerned about keeping their Civil Liberties!

Got to tell ya -- I don't see how the trials and tribulations of my ancestors could be the PRIMARY determinant of my political interests today.. No matter how hard I try -- joining a 21st Century Bolshevik revolution because Uncle Samuel in Russia was target practice for the Czar's personal guard, so he tossed in with Lenin ---- is not in my tea leaves. Not gonna happen.

Governments are fickle and unreliable standards of morals and conviction.

And seeing all those "today" issues of low expectations in the schools for my kids, disproportionate incareration and sentencing, poor utilization of the military, and increasing wage gaps because of juvenile economic vision and leadership would be far more important to me.

I'd still appreciate the struggles of my lineage, but that was THEIR battle. And the sides they chose were their limited convienient choices.. I've got to go with the choices that make sense today..

A more real tie to my historical heritage would be to immerse myself in the luxuries that were denied to ancestors. To education, to business independence, to inclusive govt policy, to family unity and the like. Because THOSE goals are things we share..

Doesn't make sense to be a Democrat because of FDR when FDR is 70 yrs dead. Or a Republican because Reagan was a great communicator. Or a civil rights crusader plastered to the hip of the Dem Party because LBJ was a shrewd white southerner cutting deals to humble the opposition party.

I'm not sure what you are trying to allude to. Would you agree that political, social, and moral beliefs of people tend to get passed on to them by the older generations? Of course there may be a rebellious period for some people but I think they do tend to migrate back to what has been familiar to them.

I agree.

I agree; those issues are important to me as well as many other people. We are certainly not in the minority.


Agreed, that's why I am an Independent and vote for the CANDIDATE that I like and not because they have a "D", "R", or "L" after their names. I like different candidates or politicians from different parties for various reasons.

Actually, the point was my Uncle being a dedicated Trotskyite to escape the Czar is a nice story (if it were true).. But it's not really relevent to my political problems today.. I probably wouldn't make a good revolutionary anyway...

The ONLY way I see politics gets inherited or passed on is IF the conditions are similiar and the issues and solutions apply to my wallet, my freedoms, my CURRENT concerns.

Which BTW --- seems to be the script that Jackson and Sharpton pull out all too frequently. Those opening zingers about "goin back to the hoses and police dogs" if something gets their dinner delivered out of order. You HAVE to believe that the issues and conditions are the same to maintain the brand loyalty..

Kinda strange to me to be a Dem today because Granny loved LBJ who once signed a good bill.. You pass on morals, social skills and ethics.. Not politicians.... They aren't the same as they used to be..

 

[Pheonixops]

Hey sometimes you got to deal with innuendo!!

No doubt, it's too funny that my reply was very similar to yours and written at about the same time.

sometimes I amuse myself way too much laughing at these clowns.

I think that this link below is part of the genesis for certain people's negative attitudes towards "the Blacks". I think it's pretty absurd (fucked up) to judge 70% of a people based on the actions of 30% or less of the people...................

http://www.usmessageboard.com/race-relations-racism/317319-twelve-years-a-slave-4.html#post7969248

 

[Pheonixops]

Got to tell ya -- I don't see how the trials and tribulations of my ancestors could be the PRIMARY determinant of my political interests today.. No matter how hard I try -- joining a 21st Century Bolshevik revolution because Uncle Samuel in Russia was target practice for the Czar's personal guard, so he tossed in with Lenin ---- is not in my tea leaves. Not gonna happen.

Governments are fickle and unreliable standards of morals and conviction.

And seeing all those "today" issues of low expectations in the schools for my kids, disproportionate incareration and sentencing, poor utilization of the military, and increasing wage gaps because of juvenile economic vision and leadership would be far more important to me.

I'd still appreciate the struggles of my lineage, but that was THEIR battle. And the sides they chose were their limited convienient choices.. I've got to go with the choices that make sense today..

A more real tie to my historical heritage would be to immerse myself in the luxuries that were denied to ancestors. To education, to business independence, to inclusive govt policy, to family unity and the like. Because THOSE goals are things we share..

Doesn't make sense to be a Democrat because of FDR when FDR is 70 yrs dead. Or a Republican because Reagan was a great communicator. Or a civil rights crusader plastered to the hip of the Dem Party because LBJ was a shrewd white southerner cutting deals to humble the opposition party.

I'm not sure what you are trying to allude to. Would you agree that political, social, and moral beliefs of people tend to get passed on to them by the older generations? Of course there may be a rebellious period for some people but I think they do tend to migrate back to what has been familiar to them.

I agree.

I agree; those issues are important to me as well as many other people. We are certainly not in the minority.


Agreed, that's why I am an Independent and vote for the CANDIDATE that I like and not because they have a "D", "R", or "L" after their names. I like different candidates or politicians from different parties for various reasons.

Actually, the point was my Uncle being a dedicated Trotskyite to escape the Czar is a nice story (if it were true).. But it's not really relevent to my political problems today.. I probably wouldn't make a good revolutionary anyway...

The ONLY way I see politics gets inherited or passed on is IF the conditions are similiar and the issues and solutions apply to my wallet, my freedoms, my CURRENT concerns.

Which BTW --- seems to be the script that Jackson and Sharpton pull out all too frequently. Those opening zingers about "goin back to the hoses and police dogs" if something gets their dinner delivered out of order. You HAVE to believe that the issues and conditions are the same to maintain the brand loyalty..

Kinda strange to me to be a Dem today because Granny loved LBJ who once signed a good bill.. You pass on morals, social skills and ethics.. Not politicians.... They aren't the same as they used to be..

Have you ever heard of "Rush babies"? I hear that phrase often on limbaugh's show, you can see the same thing with the "Regan worship".

I know that your making an analogy, but I think that one would be interesting to see backed up with an example. The analogy you provided regarding "goin back to the hoses and police dogs", does go against your theory about some people's "trust of government" because those "hoses and police dogs" were agents of the government at that time and location.

I think that you are grossly over simplifying the reasons that the majority of Black people vote Democrat instead of republican. My local talk show (Tony Macrini WNIS 790am 6am to 10am) host likes to state that; "Democrats talk to Black people and Republicans talk about them or at them". I TRUTHFULLY have relatives who are Black and are professionals (neurosurgeon,lawyer, insurance exec, small business owner, etc.) , that don't vote republican because of their perception regarding the attitudes that not a few republicans and conservatives have towards "Black people in general".

Do you think that the people who are making hateful remarks and ignorant blanket generalizations, regarding "the Blacks" in this very forum and even thread, are huge Democrats and Obama supporters? Or do you think that they are self described conservative republicans for the most part? Do you think that Black people in general want to align themselves to a party who has not a few people who hold those sentiments about "the Blacks"? Of course they will also vote for a party where they also have more representation and influence, and that party today IS the democrat party. One issue I have are some of the Black people that conservatives and republicans embrace; they tend to be the hucksters who make the same or similar blanket generalizations and insults about Black people that some of their White bigoted counterparts make. You know, "The Blacks are brainwashed", "The Blacks are on the Democrat plantation", the video "Runaway slave", etc etc. etc. The aforementioned seem to be the ones dwelling on that "Peculair Institution", yet they are embraced by the same people who complain that "the Blacks dwell on slavery"! That's pretty funny and ironic.

Then when someone like a General Powell or Michael Steele take a different tack, they tend to be ostracized by the same people who embrace the hucksters who make ignorant blanket generalizations and insults about Black people. What message does that send to Black people?

 

[Pheonixops]

Here's an excerpt from Frederick Douglass' book about an Irishman of great honor:

" The repeal of the union between England and Ireland was not so fortunate. It is still, under one name or another, the cherished hope and inspiration of her sons. It stands little better or stronger than it did six and thirty years ago, when its greatest advocate, Daniel O'Connell, welcomed me to Ireland and to "Conciliation Hall," and where I first had a specimen of his truly wondrous eloquence. Until I heard this man I had thought that the story of his oratory and power were greatly exaggerated. I did not see how a man could speak to twenty or thirty thousand people at one time and be heard by any considerable portion of them, but the mystery was solved when I saw his ample person and heard his musical voice. His eloquence came down upon the vast assembly like a summer thunder-shower upon a dusty road. He could at will stir the multitude to a tempest of wrath or reduce it to the silence with which a mother leaves the cradle-side of her sleeping babe. Such tenderness, such pathos, such world-embracing love!--and, on the other hand, such indignation, such fiery and thunderous denunciation, such wit and humor, I never heard surpassed, if equaled, at home or abroad. He held Ireland within the grasp of his strong hand, and could lead it whithersoever he would, for Ireland believed in him and loved him as she has
Page 296

loved and believed in no leader since. In Dublin, when he had been absent from that city a few weeks, I saw him followed through Sackville street by a multitude of little boys and girls, shouting in loving accents, "There goes Dan! there goes Dan!" while he looked at the ragged and shoeless crowd with the kindly air of a loving parent returning to his gleeful children. He was called "The Liberator," and not without cause, for, though he failed to effect the repeal of the union between England and Ireland, he fought out the battle of Catholic emancipation, and was clearly the friend of liberty the world over. In introducing me to an immense audience in Conciliation Hall he playfully called me the "Black O'Connell of the United States." Nor did he let the occasion pass without his usual word of denunciation of our slave system. O. A. Brownson had then recently become a Catholic, and taking advantage of his new Catholic audience in "Brownson's Review," had charged O'Connell with attacking American institutions. In reply Mr. O'Connell said: "I am charged with attacking American institutions, as slavery is called; I am not ashamed of this attack. My sympathy is not confined to the narrow limits of my own green Ireland; my spirit walks abroad upon sea and land, and wherever there is oppression I hate the oppressor, and wherever the tyrant rears his head I will deal my bolts upon it, and wherever there is sorrow and suffering, there is my spirit to succor and relieve." No transatlantic statesman bore a testimony more marked and telling against the crime and curse of slavery than did Daniel O'Connell. He would shake the hand of no slaveholder, nor allow himself to be introduced to one if he knew him to be such. When the friends of repeal in the Southern States sent him money with which to carry on his work, he, with ineffable scorn, refused the bribe and sent back what he considered the blood-stained
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offering, saying he would "never purchase the freedom of Ireland with the price of slaves."

 

[flacaltenn]

I'm not sure what you are trying to allude to. Would you agree that political, social, and moral beliefs of people tend to get passed on to them by the older generations? Of course there may be a rebellious period for some people but I think they do tend to migrate back to what has been familiar to them.

I agree.

I agree; those issues are important to me as well as many other people. We are certainly not in the minority.


Agreed, that's why I am an Independent and vote for the CANDIDATE that I like and not because they have a "D", "R", or "L" after their names. I like different candidates or politicians from different parties for various reasons.

Actually, the point was my Uncle being a dedicated Trotskyite to escape the Czar is a nice story (if it were true).. But it's not really relevent to my political problems today.. I probably wouldn't make a good revolutionary anyway...

The ONLY way I see politics gets inherited or passed on is IF the conditions are similiar and the issues and solutions apply to my wallet, my freedoms, my CURRENT concerns.

Which BTW --- seems to be the script that Jackson and Sharpton pull out all too frequently. Those opening zingers about "goin back to the hoses and police dogs" if something gets their dinner delivered out of order. You HAVE to believe that the issues and conditions are the same to maintain the brand loyalty..

Kinda strange to me to be a Dem today because Granny loved LBJ who once signed a good bill.. You pass on morals, social skills and ethics.. Not politicians.... They aren't the same as they used to be..

Have you ever heard of "Rush babies"? I hear that phrase often on limbaugh's show, you can see the same thing with the "Regan worship".

I know that your making an analogy, but I think that one would be interesting to see backed up with an example. The analogy you provided regarding "goin back to the hoses and police dogs", does go against your theory about some people's "trust of government" because those "hoses and police dogs" were agents of the government at that time and location.

I think that you are grossly over simplifying the reasons that the majority of Black people vote Democrat instead of republican. My local talk show (Tony Macrini WNIS 790am 6am to 10am) host likes to state that; "Democrats talk to Black people and Republicans talk about them or at them". I TRUTHFULLY have relatives who are Black and are professionals (neurosurgeon,lawyer, insurance exec, small business owner, etc.) , that don't vote republican because of their perception regarding the attitudes that not a few republicans and conservatives have towards "Black people in general".

Do you think that the people who are making hateful remarks and ignorant blanket generalizations, regarding "the Blacks" in this very forum and even thread, are huge Democrats and Obama supporters? Or do you think that they are self described conservative republicans for the most part? Do you think that Black people in general want to align themselves to a party who has not a few people who hold those sentiments about "the Blacks"? Of course they will also vote for a party where they also have more representation and influence, and that party today IS the democrat party. One issue I have are some of the Black people that conservatives and republicans embrace; they tend to be the hucksters who make the same or similar blanket generalizations and insults about Black people that some of their White bigoted counterparts make. You know, "The Blacks are brainwashed", "The Blacks are on the Democrat plantation", the video "Runaway slave", etc etc. etc. The aforementioned seem to be the ones dwelling on that "Peculair Institution", yet they are embraced by the same people who complain that "the Blacks dwell on slavery"! That's pretty funny and ironic.

Then when someone like a General Powell or Michael Steele take a different tack, they tend to be ostracized by the same people who embrace the hucksters who make ignorant blanket generalizations and insults about Black people. What message does that send to Black people?

Inter-party squabbles have little to do with race. Those clowns are gonna fight anyways. Colin Powell didn't pass the Conservative purity test. Michael Steele just couldn't herd cats.

If you look at the short campaign of Herman Caine --- he was a rock star.. He had Conservatives SWOONING over him.. It's all political.. And my eyes glaze over when it has to do with Rep or Dem politics because I've dedicated my time to getting 3rd party ballot access and promoting the Lib Party.. So I can't tell ya why your relatives think Repubs dont respect them.. I know they ADORE Walter Williams (who can't) and Thomas Sowell (harder to love) and others that the DEMS just love to hate...

In my biased opinion --- its the same sucky choice for blacks or whites.
The Republican party is not the hotbed of racism that you should worry about. Being raised in the South and barely old enough to remember the segregation signs and unspoken curfews on the white peninsula beaches for blacks, I had never encountered more virulent racism than when I moved to the Leftist colonies of S.F. Bay.. We had an honest to God ghetto on the rich white section of the peninsula called EAST Palo Alto.. Not the Palo Alto you know from Stanford University and the birthplace of Silicon Valley, but a hell-hole of crime, no visible means of support, and ALMOST every black person for a 20 mile radius..

So --- it wasn't like your outward crass racism, it was elite refined racism couched in terms like the "lovely standard of living that we enjoy in Menlo Park". Meaning that all that you didn't ever see a black person and your kids didn't have to go to the same schools. 56 OTHER ethnic and racial groups living amongst them --- but hardly a black family to be ever seen.. And ALL those folks --- rabid lefties.. Phoney as hell anyway --- which is why FlaCal --- became FlaCalTenn where my nice upscale neighborhood is nicely integrated and I don't fear going to a TSU (largely black) football game if I feel like it. (Not enough good Chinese restaurants tho) Funny enough --- one of few black faces I did see at the Palo Alto Shopping Mall was Condoleeza Rice.. Knew who she was from my contacts with Stanford.

Anyway.. Forget the party politics.. What about the ISSUE dependencies?

Things like school choice and reform? Sentencing and Asset Forfeiture? Barriers to starting business due to regulation and licensing? Even things like the Death Tax should provoke HUGE discussion in the black politic.. How do you ever remedy the wealth gap if current gen SUCCESSFUL blacks cannot endow THEIR descendents with a boost up? Why should Bill Cosby or Venus/Serena Williams have to surrender their rewards up to govt instead of transferring wealth at their discretion? Is it really because blacks love collectivist sharing by force? Or an overagressive policy of bombing 4 or 6 countries a year? Where is the dissappointment with the failure to produce results?

BTW---- Tell your relatives that FlaCalTenn doesn't think that Republicans "talk about them".. IMO -- the diff is that Repubs dont pander to skin color or status. You are one of them --- or you're not. No special party hats and photo ops..

Sorry for the length. I'm hiding out here because I'm tired of politics..

It's the ISSUES that don't seem to match the political choices.

 

[Zona]

The wife and I played hooky from work today and we were one of her favorite daytime shows; The View. The show had Jesse Ventura and then they had these two actors from a movie that is about to be release called "Twelve Years A Slave", it's based on a published narrative from Solomon Northrup, who was a free Black man living in New York and was kidnapped and sold into slavery.
I looked it up because the story sounded interesting, I think that he gave a balanced narrative on that condition. Here's a wiki reference to it if anyone is interested in reading it:
12 Years a Slave (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here's the actual memoirs, the docsouth link is a goldmine to find out and read memoirs, books, letters, etc. from that time period:
Solomon Northup. Twelve Years a Slave: Narrative ofSolomon Northup, a Citizen of New-York, Kidnapped in Washington City in1841, and Rescued in 1853.


I found this excerpt quite interesting, it's between a white caprpenter named Bass and the slave's master named Epps:

"But this question of Slavery; what right have you to your ******* when you come down to the point?"

"What right!" said Epps, laughing; "why, I bought 'em, and paid for 'em."

Of course you did; the law says you have the right to hold a ******, but begging the law's pardon, it lies. Yes, Epps, when the law says that it's a liar, and the truth is not in it. Is every thing right because the law allows it? Suppose they'd pass a law taking away your liberty and making you a slave?"

"Oh, that ain't a supposable case," said Epps, still laughing; "hope you don't compare me to a ******, Bass."

"Well," Bass answered gravely, "no, not exactly. But I have seen ******* before now as good as I am, and I have no acquaintance with any white man in these parts that I consider a whit better than myself. Now, in the sight of God, what is the difference, Epps, between a white man and a black one?"

"All the difference in the world," replied Epps. "You might as well ask what the difference is between
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a white man and a baboon. Now, I've seen one of them critters in Orleans that knowed just as much as any ****** I've got. You'd call them feller citizens, I s'pose?"—and Epps indulged in a loud laugh at his own wit.

"Look here, Epps," continued his companion; "you can't laugh me down in that way. Some men are witty, and some ain't so witty as they think they are. Now let me ask you a question. Are all men created free and equal as the Declaration of Independence holds they are?"

"Yes," responded Epps, "but all men, *******, and monkeys ain't;" and hereupon he broke forth into a more boisterous laugh than before.

"There are monkeys among white people as well as black, when you come to that," coolly remarked Bass. "I know some white men that use arguments no sensible monkey would. But let that pass. These ******* are human beings. If they don't know as much as their masters, whose fault is it? They are not allowed to know anything. You have books and papers, and can go where you please, and gather intelligence in a thousand ways. But your slaves have no privileges. You'd whip one of them if caught reading a book. They are held in bondage, generation after generation, deprived of mental improvement, and who can expect them to possess much knowledge? If they are not brought down to a level with the brute creation, you slaveholders will never be blamed for it. If they are baboons, or stand no
Page 268

higher in the scale of intelligence than such animals, you and men like you will have to answer for it. There's a sin, a fearful sin, resting on this nation, that will not go unpunished forever. There will be a reckoning yet—yes, Epps, there's a day coming that will burn as an oven. It may be sooner or it may be later, but it's a coming as sure as the Lord is just."

"If you lived up among the Yankees in New-England," said Epps, "I expect you'd be one of them cursed fanatics that know more than the constitution, and go about peddling clocks and coaxing ******* to run away."

"If I was in New-England," returned Bass, "I would be just what I am here. I would say that Slavery was an iniquity, and ought to be abolished. I would say there was no reason nor justice in the law, or the constitution that allows one man to hold another man in bondage. It would be hard for you to lose your property, to be sure, but it wouldn't be half as hard as it would be to lose your liberty. You have no more right to your freedom, in exact justice, than Uncle Abram yonder. Talk about black skin, and black blood; why, how many slaves are there on this bayou as white as either of us? And what difference is there in the color of the soul? Pshaw! the whole system is as absurd as it is cruel. You may own ******* and behanged, but I wouldn't own one for the best plantation in Louisiana."

If she was playing hooky, how is the View her favorite show?

I SMELL BULLSHIT. Just sayin.

 

[S.J.]

Give me an example. Take a section of my post and explain to me how it is filled with hate and it shows. I would like to know if this is just your opinion.something I can read and reflect on and come to the same conclusion or just a biased assumption on your part.

Do you really need someone to do that for you? Can't you just read some of your own posts?

I did and I dont see anything. Thats why I asked you to point out exactly what led you to the conclusion I am full of hate. If its just a feeling or assumption you have it wont bother me at all.

I'm not worried about it bothering you, but I know you'll reject anything I put up there as an example. If you really wanted to look at yourself honestly you would do it yourself but I think you're more interested in making me jump through hoops, and that ain't gonna happen.

 

[Pheonixops]

The wife and I played hooky from work today and we were one of her favorite daytime shows; The View. The show had Jesse Ventura and then they had these two actors from a movie that is about to be release called "Twelve Years A Slave", it's based on a published narrative from Solomon Northrup, who was a free Black man living in New York and was kidnapped and sold into slavery.
I looked it up because the story sounded interesting, I think that he gave a balanced narrative on that condition. Here's a wiki reference to it if anyone is interested in reading it:
12 Years a Slave (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here's the actual memoirs, the docsouth link is a goldmine to find out and read memoirs, books, letters, etc. from that time period:
Solomon Northup. Twelve Years a Slave: Narrative ofSolomon Northup, a Citizen of New-York, Kidnapped in Washington City in1841, and Rescued in 1853.


I found this excerpt quite interesting, it's between a white caprpenter named Bass and the slave's master named Epps:

"But this question of Slavery; what right have you to your ******* when you come down to the point?"

"What right!" said Epps, laughing; "why, I bought 'em, and paid for 'em."

Of course you did; the law says you have the right to hold a ******, but begging the law's pardon, it lies. Yes, Epps, when the law says that it's a liar, and the truth is not in it. Is every thing right because the law allows it? Suppose they'd pass a law taking away your liberty and making you a slave?"

"Oh, that ain't a supposable case," said Epps, still laughing; "hope you don't compare me to a ******, Bass."

"Well," Bass answered gravely, "no, not exactly. But I have seen ******* before now as good as I am, and I have no acquaintance with any white man in these parts that I consider a whit better than myself. Now, in the sight of God, what is the difference, Epps, between a white man and a black one?"

"All the difference in the world," replied Epps. "You might as well ask what the difference is between
Page 267

a white man and a baboon. Now, I've seen one of them critters in Orleans that knowed just as much as any ****** I've got. You'd call them feller citizens, I s'pose?"—and Epps indulged in a loud laugh at his own wit.

"Look here, Epps," continued his companion; "you can't laugh me down in that way. Some men are witty, and some ain't so witty as they think they are. Now let me ask you a question. Are all men created free and equal as the Declaration of Independence holds they are?"

"Yes," responded Epps, "but all men, *******, and monkeys ain't;" and hereupon he broke forth into a more boisterous laugh than before.

"There are monkeys among white people as well as black, when you come to that," coolly remarked Bass. "I know some white men that use arguments no sensible monkey would. But let that pass. These ******* are human beings. If they don't know as much as their masters, whose fault is it? They are not allowed to know anything. You have books and papers, and can go where you please, and gather intelligence in a thousand ways. But your slaves have no privileges. You'd whip one of them if caught reading a book. They are held in bondage, generation after generation, deprived of mental improvement, and who can expect them to possess much knowledge? If they are not brought down to a level with the brute creation, you slaveholders will never be blamed for it. If they are baboons, or stand no
Page 268

higher in the scale of intelligence than such animals, you and men like you will have to answer for it. There's a sin, a fearful sin, resting on this nation, that will not go unpunished forever. There will be a reckoning yet—yes, Epps, there's a day coming that will burn as an oven. It may be sooner or it may be later, but it's a coming as sure as the Lord is just."

"If you lived up among the Yankees in New-England," said Epps, "I expect you'd be one of them cursed fanatics that know more than the constitution, and go about peddling clocks and coaxing ******* to run away."

"If I was in New-England," returned Bass, "I would be just what I am here. I would say that Slavery was an iniquity, and ought to be abolished. I would say there was no reason nor justice in the law, or the constitution that allows one man to hold another man in bondage. It would be hard for you to lose your property, to be sure, but it wouldn't be half as hard as it would be to lose your liberty. You have no more right to your freedom, in exact justice, than Uncle Abram yonder. Talk about black skin, and black blood; why, how many slaves are there on this bayou as white as either of us? And what difference is there in the color of the soul? Pshaw! the whole system is as absurd as it is cruel. You may own ******* and behanged, but I wouldn't own one for the best plantation in Louisiana."

If she was playing hooky, how is the View her favorite show?

I SMELL BULLSHIT. Just sayin.

She's a teacher and has the summer off from mid June to after Labor day, that and the other holidays enable her to watch her favorite show.

 

[katsteve2012]

The wife and I played hooky from work today and we were one of her favorite daytime shows; The View. The show had Jesse Ventura and then they had these two actors from a movie that is about to be release called "Twelve Years A Slave", it's based on a published narrative from Solomon Northrup, who was a free Black man living in New York and was kidnapped and sold into slavery.
I looked it up because the story sounded interesting, I think that he gave a balanced narrative on that condition. Here's a wiki reference to it if anyone is interested in reading it:
12 Years a Slave (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here's the actual memoirs, the docsouth link is a goldmine to find out and read memoirs, books, letters, etc. from that time period:
Solomon Northup. Twelve Years a Slave: Narrative ofSolomon Northup, a Citizen of New-York, Kidnapped in Washington City in1841, and Rescued in 1853.


I found this excerpt quite interesting, it's between a white caprpenter named Bass and the slave's master named Epps:

"But this question of Slavery; what right have you to your ******* when you come down to the point?"

"What right!" said Epps, laughing; "why, I bought 'em, and paid for 'em."

Of course you did; the law says you have the right to hold a ******, but begging the law's pardon, it lies. Yes, Epps, when the law says that it's a liar, and the truth is not in it. Is every thing right because the law allows it? Suppose they'd pass a law taking away your liberty and making you a slave?"

"Oh, that ain't a supposable case," said Epps, still laughing; "hope you don't compare me to a ******, Bass."

"Well," Bass answered gravely, "no, not exactly. But I have seen ******* before now as good as I am, and I have no acquaintance with any white man in these parts that I consider a whit better than myself. Now, in the sight of God, what is the difference, Epps, between a white man and a black one?"

"All the difference in the world," replied Epps. "You might as well ask what the difference is between
Page 267

a white man and a baboon. Now, I've seen one of them critters in Orleans that knowed just as much as any ****** I've got. You'd call them feller citizens, I s'pose?"—and Epps indulged in a loud laugh at his own wit.

"Look here, Epps," continued his companion; "you can't laugh me down in that way. Some men are witty, and some ain't so witty as they think they are. Now let me ask you a question. Are all men created free and equal as the Declaration of Independence holds they are?"

"Yes," responded Epps, "but all men, *******, and monkeys ain't;" and hereupon he broke forth into a more boisterous laugh than before.

"There are monkeys among white people as well as black, when you come to that," coolly remarked Bass. "I know some white men that use arguments no sensible monkey would. But let that pass. These ******* are human beings. If they don't know as much as their masters, whose fault is it? They are not allowed to know anything. You have books and papers, and can go where you please, and gather intelligence in a thousand ways. But your slaves have no privileges. You'd whip one of them if caught reading a book. They are held in bondage, generation after generation, deprived of mental improvement, and who can expect them to possess much knowledge? If they are not brought down to a level with the brute creation, you slaveholders will never be blamed for it. If they are baboons, or stand no
Page 268

higher in the scale of intelligence than such animals, you and men like you will have to answer for it. There's a sin, a fearful sin, resting on this nation, that will not go unpunished forever. There will be a reckoning yet—yes, Epps, there's a day coming that will burn as an oven. It may be sooner or it may be later, but it's a coming as sure as the Lord is just."

"If you lived up among the Yankees in New-England," said Epps, "I expect you'd be one of them cursed fanatics that know more than the constitution, and go about peddling clocks and coaxing ******* to run away."

"If I was in New-England," returned Bass, "I would be just what I am here. I would say that Slavery was an iniquity, and ought to be abolished. I would say there was no reason nor justice in the law, or the constitution that allows one man to hold another man in bondage. It would be hard for you to lose your property, to be sure, but it wouldn't be half as hard as it would be to lose your liberty. You have no more right to your freedom, in exact justice, than Uncle Abram yonder. Talk about black skin, and black blood; why, how many slaves are there on this bayou as white as either of us? And what difference is there in the color of the soul? Pshaw! the whole system is as absurd as it is cruel. You may own ******* and behanged, but I wouldn't own one for the best plantation in Louisiana."

If she was playing hooky, how is the View her favorite show?

I SMELL BULLSHIT. Just sayin.

Ever heard of an invention called the DVR?. Just sayin.

 

[Pheonixops]

The wife and I played hooky from work today and we were one of her favorite daytime shows; The View. The show had Jesse Ventura and then they had these two actors from a movie that is about to be release called "Twelve Years A Slave", it's based on a published narrative from Solomon Northrup, who was a free Black man living in New York and was kidnapped and sold into slavery.
I looked it up because the story sounded interesting, I think that he gave a balanced narrative on that condition. Here's a wiki reference to it if anyone is interested in reading it:
12 Years a Slave (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here's the actual memoirs, the docsouth link is a goldmine to find out and read memoirs, books, letters, etc. from that time period:
Solomon Northup. Twelve Years a Slave: Narrative ofSolomon Northup, a Citizen of New-York, Kidnapped in Washington City in1841, and Rescued in 1853.


I found this excerpt quite interesting, it's between a white caprpenter named Bass and the slave's master named Epps:

"But this question of Slavery; what right have you to your ******* when you come down to the point?"

"What right!" said Epps, laughing; "why, I bought 'em, and paid for 'em."

Of course you did; the law says you have the right to hold a ******, but begging the law's pardon, it lies. Yes, Epps, when the law says that it's a liar, and the truth is not in it. Is every thing right because the law allows it? Suppose they'd pass a law taking away your liberty and making you a slave?"

"Oh, that ain't a supposable case," said Epps, still laughing; "hope you don't compare me to a ******, Bass."

"Well," Bass answered gravely, "no, not exactly. But I have seen ******* before now as good as I am, and I have no acquaintance with any white man in these parts that I consider a whit better than myself. Now, in the sight of God, what is the difference, Epps, between a white man and a black one?"

"All the difference in the world," replied Epps. "You might as well ask what the difference is between
Page 267

a white man and a baboon. Now, I've seen one of them critters in Orleans that knowed just as much as any ****** I've got. You'd call them feller citizens, I s'pose?"—and Epps indulged in a loud laugh at his own wit.

"Look here, Epps," continued his companion; "you can't laugh me down in that way. Some men are witty, and some ain't so witty as they think they are. Now let me ask you a question. Are all men created free and equal as the Declaration of Independence holds they are?"

"Yes," responded Epps, "but all men, *******, and monkeys ain't;" and hereupon he broke forth into a more boisterous laugh than before.

"There are monkeys among white people as well as black, when you come to that," coolly remarked Bass. "I know some white men that use arguments no sensible monkey would. But let that pass. These ******* are human beings. If they don't know as much as their masters, whose fault is it? They are not allowed to know anything. You have books and papers, and can go where you please, and gather intelligence in a thousand ways. But your slaves have no privileges. You'd whip one of them if caught reading a book. They are held in bondage, generation after generation, deprived of mental improvement, and who can expect them to possess much knowledge? If they are not brought down to a level with the brute creation, you slaveholders will never be blamed for it. If they are baboons, or stand no
Page 268

higher in the scale of intelligence than such animals, you and men like you will have to answer for it. There's a sin, a fearful sin, resting on this nation, that will not go unpunished forever. There will be a reckoning yet—yes, Epps, there's a day coming that will burn as an oven. It may be sooner or it may be later, but it's a coming as sure as the Lord is just."

"If you lived up among the Yankees in New-England," said Epps, "I expect you'd be one of them cursed fanatics that know more than the constitution, and go about peddling clocks and coaxing ******* to run away."

"If I was in New-England," returned Bass, "I would be just what I am here. I would say that Slavery was an iniquity, and ought to be abolished. I would say there was no reason nor justice in the law, or the constitution that allows one man to hold another man in bondage. It would be hard for you to lose your property, to be sure, but it wouldn't be half as hard as it would be to lose your liberty. You have no more right to your freedom, in exact justice, than Uncle Abram yonder. Talk about black skin, and black blood; why, how many slaves are there on this bayou as white as either of us? And what difference is there in the color of the soul? Pshaw! the whole system is as absurd as it is cruel. You may own ******* and behanged, but I wouldn't own one for the best plantation in Louisiana."

If she was playing hooky, how is the View her favorite show?

I SMELL BULLSHIT. Just sayin.

Ever heard of an invention called the DVR?. Just sayin.

LOL, it's funny how some people want try to discredit the most insignificant part of my post and not venture into the main point of the posts. It's also funny to see who thanked that poster for trying to call me out on some insignificant bullshit. I think it demonstrates their true mindset.

 

[Asclepias]

Do you really need someone to do that for you? Can't you just read some of your own posts?

I did and I dont see anything. Thats why I asked you to point out exactly what led you to the conclusion I am full of hate. If its just a feeling or assumption you have it wont bother me at all.

I'm not worried about it bothering you, but I know you'll reject anything I put up there as an example. If you really wanted to look at yourself honestly you would do it yourself but I think you're more interested in making me jump through hoops, and that ain't gonna happen.

I think I know myself pretty well and I don't think I'm full of hate. Maybe you can answer this. What is it you think I hate?