Trump's Tariffs Seriously Reducing The National Debt

[berg80]

I repeat, typing lies is easy, proving them is hard.
If US consumers had to pay the tariffs they would just buy domestically produced products without tariffs.

Domestically produced products are affected by tariffs as well because many use imported raw materials to produce a finished product.

 

[justoffal]

Domestically produced products are affected by tariffs as well because many use imported raw materials to produce a finished product.

Even more..... Half of American sub vending corporates are foreign owned....so the fees trickle down regardless. The entire world is now multinational.

 

[task0778]

Not necessarily. If they pass all the tariff cost they lose market share. Its a complex problem, eat the tariffs or lose customers. The tariffs probably don't eat into their profit margin very much, so why lose customers?

The thing about tariffs is that the idea is to raise the price on an imported item via a tariff to make similar domestic items more competitive, right? That encourages manufacturers to reshore operations back home in the US. But you can't have it both ways, either prices go up or they don't, which is it? If they do then that is bad for businesses and consumers, rising prices without an increase in productivity is inflationary and bad for economic growth. And if prices don't go up then where's the incentive for manufacturing to come back?

 

[kyzr]

The thing about tariffs is that the idea is to raise the price on an imported item via a tariff to make similar domestic items more competitive, right? That encourages manufacturers to reshore operations back home in the US. But you can't have it both ways, either prices go up or they don't, which is it? If they do then that is bad for businesses and consumers, rising prices without an increase in productivity is inflationary and bad for economic growth. And if prices don't go up then where's the incentive for manufacturing to come back?

Very true. If prices don't go up, then the IRS gets $400b in new revenue at no cost to the economy or consumers.

If prices do go up, then that makes US products more competitive, what we call a win-win either way.

 

[task0778]

Very true. If prices don't go up, then the IRS gets $400b in new revenue at no cost to the economy or consumers.

If prices do go up, then that makes US products more competitive, what we call a win-win either way.

Here's the thing: somebody has to pay the $400 billion, that's gotta come out of somebody's pocket. The question is who?

1. US Importers? OK, let's say they somehow absorb the tariff cost and there is no increase in price, right? So that means domestic manufacturing is not helped at all, cuz the price imported stuff has stayed the same. Where's the incentive to reshore anything? This option is the most unrealistic, historically higher import costs have always been passed on to consumers.

2. Consumers? This is the most often used option, the importers pass the higher cost to consumers. This is the option that Trump thinks will result in encouraging businesses to come back home and build new plants here, right? How else will manufacturing be made more attractive here unless the prices for imported stuff is higher than or at least equal to domestic prices? But that requires the price of imported stuff to be higher than it is now, and that means the costs of Trump's tariffs will be passed down to consumers.

3. Foreign exporters? Let's say that future contracts to import stuff into the US demand the foreign exporter to accept less money than they were getting before for the same thing, in effect they're eating the tariff costs, right? Here again, the price to US consumers has not changed, right? US importers will be getting the same stuff at the same price, right? I think with this option the foreign exporters are going to say **** you. This why US businesses rushed to buy more foreign imports before the tariffs took effect.

 

[kyzr]

Here's the thing: somebody has to pay the $400 billion, that's gotta come out of somebody's pocket. The question is who?
1. US Importers? OK, let's say they somehow absorb the tariff cost and there is no increase in price, right? So that means domestic manufacturing is not helped at all, cuz the price imported stuff has stayed the same. Where's the incentive to reshore anything? This option is the most unrealistic, historically higher import costs have always been passed on to consumers.

Not every product will be helped or hurt by tariffs. I'll take the $400b in new revenue to help the debt or deficit.

2. Consumers? This is the most often used option, the importers pass the higher cost to consumers. This is the option that Trump thinks will result in encouraging businesses to come back home and build new plants here, right? How else will manufacturing be made more attractive here unless the prices for imported stuff is higher than or at least equal to domestic prices? But that requires the price of imported stuff to be higher than it is now, and that means the costs of Trump's tariffs will be passed down to consumers.

Okay, the number I saw published was a $2,400 tariff hit to US families a year. Biden's inflation cost US families $11,400 a year. The BBB has tax breaks for OT and tips to offset that $2,400 tariff hit. Most middle-class families should come out ahead or minimally impacted.

3. Foreign exporters? Let's say that future contracts to import stuff into the US demand the foreign exporter to accept less money than they were getting before for the same thing, in effect they're eating the tariff costs, right? Here again, the price to US consumers has not changed, right? US importers will be getting the same stuff at the same price, right? I think with this option the foreign exporters are going to say **** you. This why US businesses rushed to buy more foreign imports before the tariffs took effect.

Importers and foreign sellers would negotiate. Either they make a deal, or one of them does say FU.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No embarrassment ....
This is absolutely true
Trump's part is also True

See the difference is I don't give a shit about defending Trump. That's your imagination.

No, it's a red herring. Trump's awful policies are causing him to bail out the farmers, just like in his first.

And your red herring is your attempt to change the subject.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Not every product will be helped or hurt by tariffs. I'll take the $400b in new revenue to help the debt or deficit.

Okay, the number I saw published was a $2,400 tariff hit to US families a year. Biden's inflation cost US families $11,400 a year. The BBB has tax breaks for OT and tips to offset that $2,400 tariff hit. Most middle-class families should come out ahead or minimally impacted.

Importers and foreign sellers would negotiate. Either they make a deal, or one of them does say FU.

Dude, you just don't have any idea whatsoever what you are talking about.

 

[task0778]

Not every product will be helped or hurt by tariffs. I'll take the $400b in new revenue to help the debt or deficit.

Okay, the number I saw published was a $2,400 tariff hit to US families a year. Biden's inflation cost US families $11,400 a year. The BBB has tax breaks for OT and tips to offset that $2,400 tariff hit. Most middle-class families should come out ahead or minimally impacted.

Importers and foreign sellers would negotiate. Either they make a deal, or one of them does say FU.

IMHO, you have dodged the question.

Who is going to pay for the $400 billion in new revenue? There's only 3 possibilities, which I laid out in post #286.

 

[kyzr]

IMHO, you have dodged the question.
Who is going to pay for the $400 billion in new revenue? There's only 3 possibilities, which I laid out in post #286.

That answer is not an integer. Its a combination of 1, 2, or 3 in varying proportions depending upon the final negotiated deal.
Consumers, importers, exporters/manufacturers, with or without government subsidies pay the tariffs.
That is not a dodge, but the truth.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

That answer is not an integer. Its a combination of 1, 2, or 3 in varying proportions depending upon the final negotiated deal.
Consumers, importers, exporters/manufacturers, with or without government subsidies pay the tariffs.
That is not a dodge, but the truth.

OK.

So, next thought: what do you think determines in what proportion each one carries the burden?

That's kind of important, no?

 

[beagle9]

Domestically produced products are affected by tariffs as well because many use imported raw materials to produce a finished product.

The country can restart it's own raw materials mining again. We deal and/or rely on other countries way to much.

The dependency chains have absolutely got to be broken.

We are driven by greed, and this greed has reached a level that has made us all dependent at every level on cheap product's that are being created or produced by nation's who are otherwise hostile to western culture and/or western civilization. These revenue streams pad the bottom lines of the rich or they rather feed the beast that has been created throughout it all.... It all breaks the backs of the dependent hard worker who only wanted to get ahead by product's being worth the money spent, and after that the product will last a proper lifespan or far into the future, and after that the purchase of the product created jobs for Americans, and it built up the American economies where those economies were ripe for growth and prosperity.