The Truth about Mormons

[Truthspeaker]

And failed to answer most of them with any evidence at all.



Actually, I think you're more interested in representing the party line than in the truth.

You know what they say, though. The truth will set you free. I hope you someday lay hands on it.

you failed to read my answers

 

[Truthspeaker]

Good luck and get a life.

 

[catzmeow]

you failed to read my answers

I did read your answers. Did you notice that I substantiated my own claims with direct quotes, including sources, from your doctrine-makers?

 

[Truthspeaker]

I did read your answers. Did you notice that I substantiated my own claims with direct quotes, including sources, from your doctrine-makers?

So what?

 

[catzmeow]

So what?

So, I win. Neener, neener.

 

[Truthspeaker]

So, I win. Neener, neener.

Neener, neener? whatever, your opinion doesn't matter anymore. The argument is over. You think you won, but I don't care. Smart people can tell you are just a deviant.

 

[Truthspeaker]

the truth speaks for itself, you can ignore it or deny it. You are denying it.

 

[catzmeow]

the truth speaks for itself, you can ignore it or deny it. You are denying it.

You are the one ignoring your own prophets. Are blacks entitled to the priesthood, or not? Were black people less valiant in the pre-existence, or not? Is your church racist, or not?

 

[Truthspeaker]

You are the one ignoring your own prophets. Are blacks entitled to the priesthood, or not? Were black people less valiant in the pre-existence, or not? Is your church racist, or not?

Every question you just asked me I posted somewhere between the 10th and 18th pages in detail on blacks and the priesthood, proof again, you haven't read my posts.

 

[catzmeow]

Every question you just asked me I posted somewhere between the 10th and 18th pages in detail on blacks and the priesthood, proof again, you haven't read my posts.

I've read your posts. I know the official church stance on this issue:

Deny, deny, deny.

 

[Truthspeaker]

You didn't read the post

 

[catzmeow]

You didn't read the post

I read the post. Durr. I didn't fall off the turnip truck last week, wet-behind-the-ears. You're parroting illogical church-speak that fails to recognize the fact that mormon doctrine was once as racist as the KKK. Please read the quotes I've provided and respond to them.

 

[Truthspeaker]

I read the post. Durr. I didn't fall off the turnip truck last week, wet-behind-the-ears. You're parroting illogical church-speak that fails to recognize the fact that mormon doctrine was once as racist as the KKK. Please read the quotes I've provided and respond to them.

you didn't read my responses. I am not going to repeat myself. Start over and read the whole thread if you have to.

 

[catzmeow]

You state that these things were not taught as Mormon Doctrine by your church hierarchy, BUT THEY WERE:

Here is General Authority Mark S. Peterson's commentary on race. It includes several quotes from Brigham Young.

Elder Mark S. Peterson
Race Problems -- As They Affect The Church
Convention of Teachers of Religion on the College Level,
Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah, August 27, 1954.

Quote:
God has commanded Israel not to intermarry. To go against this commandment of God would be in sin. Those who willfully sin with their eyes open to this wrong will not be surprised to find that they will be separated from the presence of God in the world to come. This is spiritual death....

The reason that one would lose his blessings by marrying a Negro is due to the restriction placed upon them. "No person having the least particle of Negro blood can hold the Priesthood" (Brigham Young). It does not matter if they are one-sixth Negro or one-hundred and sixth, the curse of no Priesthood is the same. If an individual who is entitled to the Priesthood marries a Negro, the Lord has decreed that only spirits who are not eligible for the Priesthood will come to that marriage as children. To intermarry with a Negro is to forfeit a "Nation of Priesthood holders"....

Quote:
I think I have read enough to give you an idea of what the Negro is after. He is not just seeking the opportunity of sitting down in a cafe where white people eat. He isn't just trying to ride on the same streetcar or the same Pullman car with white people. It isn't that he just desires to go to the same theater as the white people. From this, and other interviews I have read, it appears that the Negro seeks absorption with the white race. He will not be satisfied until he achieves it by intermarriage. That is his objective and we must face it. We must not allow our feelings to carry us away, nor must we feel so sorry for Negroes that we will open our arms and embrace them with everything we have. Remember the little statement that we used to say about sin, "First we pity, then endure, then embrace"....

Quote:
Who placed the Negroes originally in darkest Africa? Was it some man, or was it God? And when He placed them there, He segregated them....

The Lord segregated the people both as to blood and place of residence. At least in the cases of the Lamanites and the Negro we have the definite word of the Lord Himself that he placed a dark skin upon them as a curse -- as a punishment and as a sign to all others. He forbade intermarriage with them under threat of extension of the curse. And He certainly segregated the descendants of Cain when He cursed the Negro as to the Priesthood, and drew an absolute line. You may even say He dropped an Iron curtain there....

Quote:
Think of the Negro, cursed as to the priesthood.... This Negro, who, in the pre-existence lived the type of life which justified the Lord in sending him to the earth in their lineage of Cain with a black skin, and possibly being born in darkest Africa--if that Negro is willing when he hears the gospel to accept it, he may have many of the blessings of the gospel. In spite of all he did in the pre-existent life, the Lord is willing, if the Negro accepts the gospel with real, sincere faith, and is really converted, to give him the blessings of baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost. If that Negro is faithful all his days, he can and will enter the celestial kingdom. He will go there as a servant, but he will get celestial glory.

This is the church you belong to. Own it.

Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 1967 version
p. 114

Quote:
In a broad general sense, caste systems have their root and origin in the gospel itself, and when they operate according to the divine decree, the resultant restrictions and segregation are right and proper and have the approval of the Lord. To illustrate: Cain, Ham, and the whole Negro race have been cursed with a black skin, the mark of Cain, so they can be identified as a caste apart, a people with whom the other descendants of Adam should not intermarry. (Gen. 4; Moses 5.) The whole house of Israel was chosen as a peculiar people, one set apart from all other nations (Ex. 19:5-6; Deut. 7:6; 14:2); and they were forbidden to marry outside their own caste. (Ex. 34:10-17; Deut. 7:1-5.) In effect the Lamanites belonged to one caste and the Nephites to another, and a mark was put upon the Lamanites to keep the Nephites from intermixing with and marrying them. (Alma 3:6-11.) All this is not to say that any race, creed, or caste should be denied any inalienable rights. But it is to say that Deity in his infinite wisdom, to carry out his inscrutable purposes, has a caste system of his own, a system of segregation of races and peoples. The justice of such a system is evident when life is considered in its true eternal perspective. It is only by a knowledge of pre-existence that it can be known why some persons are born in one race or caste and some in another. "However, in a broad general sense, caste systems have their origin in the gospel itself, and when they operate according to the divine decree, the resultant restrictions and segregation are right and proper and have the approval of the lord.

pp. 102.

Quote:
Tough he was rebel and an associate of Lucifer in pre-existence, and though he was a liar from the beginning whose name was Perdition, Cain was cursed with a dark skin; he became the father of the Negroes, and those sprits who are not worthy to receive the priesthood are born though his lineage. He became the first mortal to be cursed as a son of perdition. As a result of his mortal birth he is assured of a tangible body of flesh and bones in eternity, a fact which will enable him to rule over Satan.

p. 343

Quote:
Negroes in this life are denied the priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty. The gospel message of salvation is not carried affirmatively to them... Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain spiritual blessings are concerned....

SPENCER W. KIMBALL
General Conference Report, October, 1960.
Improvement Era, December 1960, pp. 922-923.

Quote:
I saw a striking contrast in the progress of the Indian people today.... The day of the Lamanites is nigh. For years they have been growing delightsome, and they are now becoming white and delightsome, as they were promised. In this picture of the twenty Lamanite missionaries, fifteen of the twenty were as light as Anglos, five were darker but equally delightsome The children in the home placement program in Utah are often lighter than their brothers and sisters in the hogans on the reservation.

At one meeting a father and mother and their sixteen-year-old daughter were present, the little member girl--sixteen--sitting between the dark father and mother, and it was evident she was several shades lighter than her parents--on the same reservation, in the same hogan, subject to the same sun and wind and weather....These young members of the Church are changing to whiteness and to delightsomeness. One white elder jokingly said that he and his companion were donating blood regularly to the hospital in the hope that the process might be accelerated.

You belong to an organization that has a history of being EVERY BIT as racist as the KKK. The fact that you don't know your own church's history does not make me an "anti-Mormon." Don't come here spewing your nonsense until you are well-versed in all aspects of your faith, including the ugly ones.

 

[KittenKoder]

Catzmeow posted fact.

 

[Truthspeaker]

I read that. You didn't read my responses. This is a joke right. I am not going to repeat myself. go back and read my responses. Then we can talk. You didn't read my responses because you didn't answer them. You are crazy.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Catzmeow posted fact.

I responded between the 15th and 18th pages but he or you didn't read them to check up that. I also responded again somewhere between the 21st and 22nd pages but you didn't read that either otherwise you would have quoted it in the gray area.

 

[KittenKoder]

LDS are just as much hypocrites as all other christians, another christian cult like Baptist, Catholic, etc..

 

[Truthspeaker]

This is an absurd statement

 

[KittenKoder]

This is an absurd statement

Answer me this: Why do you think it is?