The sad fall of liberalism

[P@triot]

Liberals can't even handle educating children anymore. That's how radicalized they've become and how far they've fallen. They can't even teach basic math properly...

Common Core Does Not Prepare Students for College

 

[Norman]

Liberals can't even handle educating children anymore. That's how radicalized they've become and how far they've fallen. They can't even teach basic math properly...

Common Core Does Not Prepare Students for College

Trump will repeal this Marxist garbage and bring back actual education.

It will be a long way from the current indoctrination:

 

[bripat9643]

QUOTE]
There is little question that America keeps growing more liberal with the passing years. The real problem is that it is growing liberal too fast for many, and efforts are devoted to trying to slow liberalism down to a crawl.

Growing more liberal at all is the problem. However, the disease is self limiting. It will grow more liberal until the dictatorship is established. Then all their foolish notions about rights will be tossed on the scrap heap.

 

[bripat9643]

Liberals can't even handle educating children anymore. That's how radicalized they've become and how far they've fallen. They can't even teach basic math properly...

Common Core Does Not Prepare Students for College

Trump will repeal this Marxist garbage and bring back actual education.

It will be a long way from the current indoctrination:

You're an optimist about what Trump can accomplish. I doubt much will change on that front.

 

[Norman]

Liberals can't even handle educating children anymore. That's how radicalized they've become and how far they've fallen. They can't even teach basic math properly...

Common Core Does Not Prepare Students for College

Trump will repeal this Marxist garbage and bring back actual education.

It will be a long way from the current indoctrination:

You're an optimist about what Trump can accomplish. I doubt much will change on that front.

Well, at least he has stated that he will repeal it. That's a start.

On the other hand, Hillary, paid by the marxists and teacher's unions, will not want to educate the kids.

 

[kaz]

Damn, but this is priceless!

The title of the OP is "The sad fall of liberalism". Then the originator of the OP cites and article, "11 Questions You Should Ask Libertarians to See if They're Hypocrites".

Generally speaking, liberals and liberalism are political schools of thought left of center in the political spectrum. Whereas libertarianism and Libertarians are to the right of center in the political spectrum. So why is the Article cited and quoted about Libertarians, and the narrative of the OP about liberalism and interchanging the terms liberal and libertarian?

It must be obvious that the person starting this thread doesn't know the difference between a liberal and a libertarian. That would be like grouping Martian Luther King, John Kennedy and President Obama with Ayn Rand, Ludwig von Mises and Ann Coulter as partners in solidarity of political thought.

Bottom line is that the OP is an EPIC FAIL!

There is no "interchanging". The article name is irrelevant. The content and the fact that it was written by LIBERALS is what matters. Of course, we've already established your reading comprehension problem so none of us are surprised by the fact that your too lazy to read (and too stupid to understand) the article or my post.

After reading enough of it, I started to guess that was what you meant, but I have to say I don't think that was very clear.

But I read the article and I was like wow, this is butt stupid. There were inane questions, like do libertarians realize that unions are an instrument of a free market. Duh, if they are voluntary, yes, if they come with mandated government power, no.

My favorite stupid liberal question was do libertarians realize democracy is part of free markets. Democracy isn't free market when it trods on the rights of others. That's tyranny of the majority.

Liberals are stupid as shit. I see your point

 

[Moonglow]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

 

[kaz]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

You didn't know you can quit your job and find a better one if your employer sucks? Wow. I guess you would have had to have had a job to know that ...

It's amazing how you people think if unions don't do your manhood for you, government has taken away your rights. Wow, take responsibility for your own life, that's not going to happen! Grow a pair

 

[Moonglow]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

You didn't know you can quit your job and find a better one if your employer sucks? Wow. I guess you would have had to have had a job to know that ...

It's amazing how you people think if unions don't do your manhood for you, government has taken away your rights. Wow, take responsibility for your own life, that's not going to happen! Grow a pair

Kinda hard to do in many instances, but then again, you guys are buzy foreboding what a lousy economy we have, so there are no jobs to jump to..Yet you still do not get to negotiate your pay, even by job jumping, that is not negotiating with your employer..I don't have to negotiate since I am the employer...and I don't negotiate wages. your performance does..

 

[kaz]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

You didn't know you can quit your job and find a better one if your employer sucks? Wow. I guess you would have had to have had a job to know that ...

It's amazing how you people think if unions don't do your manhood for you, government has taken away your rights. Wow, take responsibility for your own life, that's not going to happen! Grow a pair

Kinda hard to do in many instances, but then again, you guys are buzy foreboding what a lousy economy we have, so there are no jobs to jump to..Yet you still do not get to negotiate your pay, even by job jumping, that is not negotiating with your employer..I don't have to negotiate since I am the employer...and I don't negotiate wages. your performance does..

It's kinda hard to find a better job? Well, you need to be realistic about your market worth, grow your skills and take initiative. OK, I'll concede in your case it's "kinda hard to do."

However, if you are in a job and you can't find a better one, let me give you the 411. You are earning ... what you are worth ...

Having government take guns to your employer and forcing them to fork over more is simply armed robbery. And that's why government forced unions are a terrible idea and it drives employers to automate, go overseas and close to get rid of leaches like you who drive them to do it, and policians do it for your undying worship at the ballot box. Which you happily provide

 

[Moonglow]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

You didn't know you can quit your job and find a better one if your employer sucks? Wow. I guess you would have had to have had a job to know that ...

It's amazing how you people think if unions don't do your manhood for you, government has taken away your rights. Wow, take responsibility for your own life, that's not going to happen! Grow a pair

Kinda hard to do in many instances, but then again, you guys are buzy foreboding what a lousy economy we have, so there are no jobs to jump to..Yet you still do not get to negotiate your pay, even by job jumping, that is not negotiating with your employer..I don't have to negotiate since I am the employer...and I don't negotiate wages. your performance does..

It's kinda hard to find a better job? Well, you need to be realistic about your market worth, grow your skills and take initiative. OK, I'll concede in your case it's "kinda hard to do."

However, if you are in a job and you can't find a better one, let me give you the 411. You are earning ... what you are worth ...

Having government take guns to your employer and forcing them to fork over more is simply armed robbery. And that's why government forced unions are a terrible idea and it drives employers to automate, go overseas and close to get rid of leaches like you who drive them to do it for your undying worship at the ballot box

I've not been employed by a corporation since 1992...They sucked, so I started my own company back up that I stopped in 1989.....Since wages are set to scale in industry and top out way to low compared to what I could earn for myself being self employed..Pretty sad when being a mason pays more than an industrial electronics technician..

 

[kaz]

How does one negotiate ones labor with a company in a state where there is no right to negotiate?

You didn't know you can quit your job and find a better one if your employer sucks? Wow. I guess you would have had to have had a job to know that ...

It's amazing how you people think if unions don't do your manhood for you, government has taken away your rights. Wow, take responsibility for your own life, that's not going to happen! Grow a pair

Kinda hard to do in many instances, but then again, you guys are buzy foreboding what a lousy economy we have, so there are no jobs to jump to..Yet you still do not get to negotiate your pay, even by job jumping, that is not negotiating with your employer..I don't have to negotiate since I am the employer...and I don't negotiate wages. your performance does..

It's kinda hard to find a better job? Well, you need to be realistic about your market worth, grow your skills and take initiative. OK, I'll concede in your case it's "kinda hard to do."

However, if you are in a job and you can't find a better one, let me give you the 411. You are earning ... what you are worth ...

Having government take guns to your employer and forcing them to fork over more is simply armed robbery. And that's why government forced unions are a terrible idea and it drives employers to automate, go overseas and close to get rid of leaches like you who drive them to do it for your undying worship at the ballot box

I've not been employed by a corporation since 1992...They sucked, so I started my own company back up that I stopped in 1989.....Since wages are set to scale in industry and top out way to low compared to what I could earn for myself being self employed..Pretty sad when being a mason pays more than an industrial electronics technician..

So you support unions that are the reason wages are set while you complain about set wages?

You're a bit confused there, hombre ...

 

[NYcarbineer]

Of course, there are millions of instances that could be provided to show just how far liberalism has fallen in terms of being an ideology of substance, having some integrity, honesty, etc. As it has been examined over the decades and its policies have failed so profoundly, those that subscribe to it have been forced to stoop to lower and lower measures instead of just abandoning a failed ideology. Most notably: nonsensical and disingenuous positions.

I think this is one of the many instances that are a good example. While doing some research I came across a specific section of this article hit me like a bolt of lighting for being a prime example of the nonsensical and disingenuous positions of the modern-day liberal. The article instructs its readers on questions to pose to libertarians to "defeat" them. Here was the second question in the article:

Which gets us to our next test question: Is a libertarian willing to admit that production is the result of many forces, each of which should be recognized and rewarded?

Retail stores like Walmart and fast-food corporations like McDonalds cannot produce wealth without employees. Don’t those employees have the right to “coordinate their actions with those of others in order to achieve their purposes”—for example, in unions? You would think that free-market philosophers would encourage workers, as part of a free-market economy, to discover the market value for their services through negotiation.

Is our libertarian willing to acknowledge that workers who bargain for their services, individually and collectively, are also employing market forces?

Now...what is the problem with this? Well, for starters, libertarians are very open about the fact that the ideology revolves around the individual (and for the record here - I am not, nor have I ever been - a libertarian). So how is it a "gotcha" question to ask them if they support the collective??? But more importantly - how are employees banning together in the "collective" mindset to coerce a company into giving them what they want, "free-market"? It's not. At all. It's about the furthest thing from "free-market" that exists. If you were so good at your job, why would you need other people to step up and strike for you? If you were so good at your job, you could simply walk into your managers office and tell them what you want and tell them that if you didn't get it, you would leave. That is "free-market". The individual performing their talents and make a case for what their talents are worth. The last sentence in particular (highlighted in blue above) is the most absurd. Your value in the free market is completely and totally linked to you as an individual. If you decide to leave Walmart or McDonalds for a new job, does the new business accept all of your co-workers as part of the deal? Do they all come with you? Of course not.

As usual, the left - which has been annihilated on the battlefield of ideas - results to nonsensical and disingenuous positions to make a case which could not be made with a logical and rational position. They attempt to make the case that a single individuals "value" is actually the value of the collective and thus why any libertarian should logically support unions. Well, unless the collective accepts and leaves jobs together until they retire, then we can unequivocally conclude that each individual has their own unique market value in the free-market and as such, asking the collective (especially more talented, more valuable employees) to use their leverage to coerce a company to increase your compensation package above your value for your benefit (of which you will of course not give a portion of that increase back to said collective for their work in getting you that increase - proving the disgusting hypocrisy of liberalisms "collective mindset" while hoarding the increase instead of splitting it with the collective) is nonsensical and disingenuous.

Lastly, because libertarians are very serious about their commitment to freedom and choice, they would be the last people on earth to tell you that unions should be "banned". They wouldn't care if you had union - they just wouldn't be a part of one. Literally every aspect of this question fails in a very major way. It is so disingenuous and it's the epitome of the entire ideology and the people who subscribe to it.

11 Questions You Should Ask Libertarians to See if They're Hypocrites

Nothing sad about the fall of a coercive ideology. It's like watching the movie "Downfall", you are cheering the entire way...

Liberalism hasn't fallen. It keeps advancing. Conservatives haven't won a major battle on an issue in years.

Seriously Carb - how do you stand with such despicable people. Watch that video I posted a few posts above and tell me how you stand with such evil...

You want me to join conservatives? How far then do we roll back the clock? To legal segregation, the conservative cause? To keeping women from voting, the conservative cause? To ending all aid to the poor, the conservative cause?

 

[NYcarbineer]

QUOTE]
There is little question that America keeps growing more liberal with the passing years. The real problem is that it is growing liberal too fast for many, and efforts are devoted to trying to slow liberalism down to a crawl.

Growing more liberal at all is the problem. However, the disease is self limiting. It will grow more liberal until the dictatorship is established. Then all their foolish notions about rights will be tossed on the scrap heap.

Liberals have been winning for centuries and didn't need dictatorship to do it.

 

[bripat9643]

QUOTE]
There is little question that America keeps growing more liberal with the passing years. The real problem is that it is growing liberal too fast for many, and efforts are devoted to trying to slow liberalism down to a crawl.

Growing more liberal at all is the problem. However, the disease is self limiting. It will grow more liberal until the dictatorship is established. Then all their foolish notions about rights will be tossed on the scrap heap.

Liberals have been winning for centuries and didn't need dictatorship to do it.

Wrong. Hitler and FDR were both liberals and both dictators.

 

[P@triot]

Of course, there are millions of instances that could be provided to show just how far liberalism has fallen in terms of being an ideology of substance, having some integrity, honesty, etc. As it has been examined over the decades and its policies have failed so profoundly, those that subscribe to it have been forced to stoop to lower and lower measures instead of just abandoning a failed ideology. Most notably: nonsensical and disingenuous positions.

I think this is one of the many instances that are a good example. While doing some research I came across a specific section of this article hit me like a bolt of lighting for being a prime example of the nonsensical and disingenuous positions of the modern-day liberal. The article instructs its readers on questions to pose to libertarians to "defeat" them. Here was the second question in the article:

Which gets us to our next test question: Is a libertarian willing to admit that production is the result of many forces, each of which should be recognized and rewarded?

Retail stores like Walmart and fast-food corporations like McDonalds cannot produce wealth without employees. Don’t those employees have the right to “coordinate their actions with those of others in order to achieve their purposes”—for example, in unions? You would think that free-market philosophers would encourage workers, as part of a free-market economy, to discover the market value for their services through negotiation.

Is our libertarian willing to acknowledge that workers who bargain for their services, individually and collectively, are also employing market forces?

Now...what is the problem with this? Well, for starters, libertarians are very open about the fact that the ideology revolves around the individual (and for the record here - I am not, nor have I ever been - a libertarian). So how is it a "gotcha" question to ask them if they support the collective??? But more importantly - how are employees banning together in the "collective" mindset to coerce a company into giving them what they want, "free-market"? It's not. At all. It's about the furthest thing from "free-market" that exists. If you were so good at your job, why would you need other people to step up and strike for you? If you were so good at your job, you could simply walk into your managers office and tell them what you want and tell them that if you didn't get it, you would leave. That is "free-market". The individual performing their talents and make a case for what their talents are worth. The last sentence in particular (highlighted in blue above) is the most absurd. Your value in the free market is completely and totally linked to you as an individual. If you decide to leave Walmart or McDonalds for a new job, does the new business accept all of your co-workers as part of the deal? Do they all come with you? Of course not.

As usual, the left - which has been annihilated on the battlefield of ideas - results to nonsensical and disingenuous positions to make a case which could not be made with a logical and rational position. They attempt to make the case that a single individuals "value" is actually the value of the collective and thus why any libertarian should logically support unions. Well, unless the collective accepts and leaves jobs together until they retire, then we can unequivocally conclude that each individual has their own unique market value in the free-market and as such, asking the collective (especially more talented, more valuable employees) to use their leverage to coerce a company to increase your compensation package above your value for your benefit (of which you will of course not give a portion of that increase back to said collective for their work in getting you that increase - proving the disgusting hypocrisy of liberalisms "collective mindset" while hoarding the increase instead of splitting it with the collective) is nonsensical and disingenuous.

Lastly, because libertarians are very serious about their commitment to freedom and choice, they would be the last people on earth to tell you that unions should be "banned". They wouldn't care if you had union - they just wouldn't be a part of one. Literally every aspect of this question fails in a very major way. It is so disingenuous and it's the epitome of the entire ideology and the people who subscribe to it.

11 Questions You Should Ask Libertarians to See if They're Hypocrites

Nothing sad about the fall of a coercive ideology. It's like watching the movie "Downfall", you are cheering the entire way...

Liberalism hasn't fallen. It keeps advancing. Conservatives haven't won a major battle on an issue in years.

Seriously Carb - how do you stand with such despicable people. Watch that video I posted a few posts above and tell me how you stand with such evil...

You want me to join conservatives? How far then do we roll back the clock? To legal segregation, the conservative cause? To keeping women from voting, the conservative cause? To ending all aid to the poor, the conservative cause?

Was that the same argument that Nazi's made? "I have to stand with Adolf Hitler and brutally murder Jews - the other side wants to end socialism". You don't have to become a conservative. But you can do what the Tea Party did. Leave and start a party of charcter and integrity. You should be ashamed to stand with those people. Disgusting.

 

[P@triot]

QUOTE]
There is little question that America keeps growing more liberal with the passing years. The real problem is that it is growing liberal too fast for many, and efforts are devoted to trying to slow liberalism down to a crawl.

Growing more liberal at all is the problem. However, the disease is self limiting. It will grow more liberal until the dictatorship is established. Then all their foolish notions about rights will be tossed on the scrap heap.

Liberals have been winning for centuries and didn't need dictatorship to do it.

Dude....the very nature of liberalism means it ends with a dictatorship. Everything you guys do is about forcing people into your vision of utopia.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Of course, there are millions of instances that could be provided to show just how far liberalism has fallen in terms of being an ideology of substance, having some integrity, honesty, etc. As it has been examined over the decades and its policies have failed so profoundly, those that subscribe to it have been forced to stoop to lower and lower measures instead of just abandoning a failed ideology. Most notably: nonsensical and disingenuous positions.

I think this is one of the many instances that are a good example. While doing some research I came across a specific section of this article hit me like a bolt of lighting for being a prime example of the nonsensical and disingenuous positions of the modern-day liberal. The article instructs its readers on questions to pose to libertarians to "defeat" them. Here was the second question in the article:

Which gets us to our next test question: Is a libertarian willing to admit that production is the result of many forces, each of which should be recognized and rewarded?

Retail stores like Walmart and fast-food corporations like McDonalds cannot produce wealth without employees. Don’t those employees have the right to “coordinate their actions with those of others in order to achieve their purposes”—for example, in unions? You would think that free-market philosophers would encourage workers, as part of a free-market economy, to discover the market value for their services through negotiation.

Is our libertarian willing to acknowledge that workers who bargain for their services, individually and collectively, are also employing market forces?

Now...what is the problem with this? Well, for starters, libertarians are very open about the fact that the ideology revolves around the individual (and for the record here - I am not, nor have I ever been - a libertarian). So how is it a "gotcha" question to ask them if they support the collective??? But more importantly - how are employees banning together in the "collective" mindset to coerce a company into giving them what they want, "free-market"? It's not. At all. It's about the furthest thing from "free-market" that exists. If you were so good at your job, why would you need other people to step up and strike for you? If you were so good at your job, you could simply walk into your managers office and tell them what you want and tell them that if you didn't get it, you would leave. That is "free-market". The individual performing their talents and make a case for what their talents are worth. The last sentence in particular (highlighted in blue above) is the most absurd. Your value in the free market is completely and totally linked to you as an individual. If you decide to leave Walmart or McDonalds for a new job, does the new business accept all of your co-workers as part of the deal? Do they all come with you? Of course not.

As usual, the left - which has been annihilated on the battlefield of ideas - results to nonsensical and disingenuous positions to make a case which could not be made with a logical and rational position. They attempt to make the case that a single individuals "value" is actually the value of the collective and thus why any libertarian should logically support unions. Well, unless the collective accepts and leaves jobs together until they retire, then we can unequivocally conclude that each individual has their own unique market value in the free-market and as such, asking the collective (especially more talented, more valuable employees) to use their leverage to coerce a company to increase your compensation package above your value for your benefit (of which you will of course not give a portion of that increase back to said collective for their work in getting you that increase - proving the disgusting hypocrisy of liberalisms "collective mindset" while hoarding the increase instead of splitting it with the collective) is nonsensical and disingenuous.

Lastly, because libertarians are very serious about their commitment to freedom and choice, they would be the last people on earth to tell you that unions should be "banned". They wouldn't care if you had union - they just wouldn't be a part of one. Literally every aspect of this question fails in a very major way. It is so disingenuous and it's the epitome of the entire ideology and the people who subscribe to it.

11 Questions You Should Ask Libertarians to See if They're Hypocrites

Nothing sad about the fall of a coercive ideology. It's like watching the movie "Downfall", you are cheering the entire way...

Liberalism hasn't fallen. It keeps advancing. Conservatives haven't won a major battle on an issue in years.

Seriously Carb - how do you stand with such despicable people. Watch that video I posted a few posts above and tell me how you stand with such evil...

You want me to join conservatives? How far then do we roll back the clock? To legal segregation, the conservative cause? To keeping women from voting, the conservative cause? To ending all aid to the poor, the conservative cause?

Was that the same argument that Nazi's made? "I have to stand with Adolf Hitler and brutally murder Jews - the other side wants to end socialism". You don't have to become a conservative. But you can do what the Tea Party did. Leave and start a party of charcter and integrity. You should be ashamed to stand with those people. Disgusting.

The liberals, the Democratic Party, want to brutally murder the Jews?

Are you sure about that?

lol

 

[Norman]

Nothing sad about the fall of a coercive ideology. It's like watching the movie "Downfall", you are cheering the entire way...

Liberalism hasn't fallen. It keeps advancing. Conservatives haven't won a major battle on an issue in years.

Seriously Carb - how do you stand with such despicable people. Watch that video I posted a few posts above and tell me how you stand with such evil...

You want me to join conservatives? How far then do we roll back the clock? To legal segregation, the conservative cause? To keeping women from voting, the conservative cause? To ending all aid to the poor, the conservative cause?

Was that the same argument that Nazi's made? "I have to stand with Adolf Hitler and brutally murder Jews - the other side wants to end socialism". You don't have to become a conservative. But you can do what the Tea Party did. Leave and start a party of charcter and integrity. You should be ashamed to stand with those people. Disgusting.

The liberals, the Democratic Party, want to brutally murder the Jews?

Are you sure about that?

lol

Didn't some bright regressive democrat suggest that the genocide of the people of Israel would resolve the muslim problem?

They are basically advocating for holocaust 2.0.

 

[P@triot]

Nothing sad about the fall of a coercive ideology. It's like watching the movie "Downfall", you are cheering the entire way...

Liberalism hasn't fallen. It keeps advancing. Conservatives haven't won a major battle on an issue in years.

Seriously Carb - how do you stand with such despicable people. Watch that video I posted a few posts above and tell me how you stand with such evil...

You want me to join conservatives? How far then do we roll back the clock? To legal segregation, the conservative cause? To keeping women from voting, the conservative cause? To ending all aid to the poor, the conservative cause?

Was that the same argument that Nazi's made? "I have to stand with Adolf Hitler and brutally murder Jews - the other side wants to end socialism". You don't have to become a conservative. But you can do what the Tea Party did. Leave and start a party of charcter and integrity. You should be ashamed to stand with those people. Disgusting.

The liberals, the Democratic Party, want to brutally murder the Jews?

Are you sure about that?

lol

I guess the truth is just too uncomfortable for you, uh? Better to change the subject?