The Myth of only raising taxes on those making over $250,000

[NOBama]

The Myth of only raising taxes on those making over $250,000.

First, he raised taxes on those making over $250,000.

- But I didn’t make over $250,000 so I supported him.

Then, when he didn’t have enough tax money to spread the wealth around to all of those not working - he raised taxes on those making over $150, 000.

- But I didn’t make over $150,000 so I supported him.

Then, when he didn’t have enough money to spread the wealth around to all of those not working - he raised taxes on those making over $100,000.

- But I didn’t make over $100,000 so I supported him.

And when he came to tax me, there was no income to tax for I was unemployed and there was no one left to support me.

Learn it.

Know it.

Because, if Obama wins this election you will: Live it.

 

[jillian]

Link it....

 

[NOBama]

Linked

 

[busara]

boy nobama, you really scared me into voting for mccain!

 

[NOBama]

boy nobama, you really scared me into voting for mccain!

If it helps keep my money out of your pocket, my job is done

 

[busara]

If it helps keep my money out of your pocket, my job is done

i could be getting your money? sweet! i got student loans to pay! im back to obama!

 

[Turboswede]

I am going to keep posting this until it sinks in,

Bush has left us with no feasible option but to raise taxes

So, here is a little exercise for all of you out there that think we can balance the federal budget through spending cuts and can avoid tax increases. I pulled these figures from Wikipedia for the 2008 Federal Budget:

$608 billion - Social Security
$386 billion - Medicare
$209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)
$324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending
$261 billion - Interest on National Debt
$481.4 billion- United States Department of Defense
$145.2 billion- Global War on Terror
$69.3 billion - Health and Human Services
$56.0 billion - United States Department of Education
$39.4 billion - United States Department of Veterans Affairs
$35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development
$35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs
$34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security
$24.3 billion - Energy
$20.2 billion - Department of Justice
$20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture
$17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration
$12.1 billion - Department of Transportation
$12.1 billion - Department of Treasury
$10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior
$10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor

For FY 2008 our estimated deficit will be $455 billion and our current national debt is $10.2 Trillion.

Easy question, what do you cut from the above to get $455 billion?

 

[NOBama]

I am going to keep posting this until it sinks in,

Bush has left us with no feasible option but to raise taxes

So, here is a little exercise for all of you out there that think we can balance the federal budget through spending cuts and can avoid tax increases. I pulled these figures from Wikipedia for the 2008 Federal Budget:

$608 billion - Social Security
$386 billion - Medicare
$209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)
$324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending
$261 billion - Interest on National Debt
$481.4 billion- United States Department of Defense
$145.2 billion- Global War on Terror
$69.3 billion - Health and Human Services
$56.0 billion - United States Department of Education
$39.4 billion - United States Department of Veterans Affairs
$35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development
$35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs
$34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security
$24.3 billion - Energy
$20.2 billion - Department of Justice
$20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture
$17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration
$12.1 billion - Department of Transportation
$12.1 billion - Department of Treasury
$10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior
$10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor

For FY 2008 our estimated deficit will be $455 billion and our current national debt is $10.2 Trillion.

Easy question, what do you cut from the above to get $455 billion?

Which departments benefit the slothful protion of the population that’s too lazy to get off their butts and find work, let’s start there.

You do realize that the US has been involved in a war on Terror over the past seven years and the economy is in the toilet, right?

Let me ask you a question, how much are you willing to pay keep terrorists on foreign soil rather than having them parade around in the United States, killing American’s and blowing-up buildings? Exactly what’s your cap on that? I’d really like to know.

As I alluded to in your original post regarding this matter, your question is nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical. It cannot be addressed at the highest level with any reason whatsoever. So, why don’t you find the detailed, line item budget, and post that. Then, we can take a look at each and very tentacle of the individual offices of the departmentalized budget. Be sure it includes everything right down to the smallest of office supplies and the value added by each federal employee.

Then, you and I can sit down together and design a new budget for the entire US government. When we’re done, perhaps you and I can present it to the new President after his inauguration speech.

I anxiously await and look forward to working with you on this most patriotic endeavor that your proposal entails.

EDIT: One more thing: We’ll not only need the projected budget, we’ll need YOY actual expenses for at least the past 12 months.

 

[DavidS]

Aww how cute. Not only is someone pulling shit out of their ass with a splintered wooden rod, but they also used my name and new avatar in their signature.

Truly, I'm honored. *takes a bow*

 

[DavidS]

I am going to keep posting this until it sinks in,

Bush has left us with no feasible option but to raise taxes

So, here is a little exercise for all of you out there that think we can balance the federal budget through spending cuts and can avoid tax increases. I pulled these figures from Wikipedia for the 2008 Federal Budget:

$608 billion - Social Security
$386 billion - Medicare
$209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)
$324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending
$261 billion - Interest on National Debt
$481.4 billion- United States Department of Defense
$145.2 billion- Global War on Terror
$69.3 billion - Health and Human Services
$56.0 billion - United States Department of Education
$39.4 billion - United States Department of Veterans Affairs
$35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development
$35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs
$34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security
$24.3 billion - Energy
$20.2 billion - Department of Justice
$20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture
$17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration
$12.1 billion - Department of Transportation
$12.1 billion - Department of Treasury
$10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior
$10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor

For FY 2008 our estimated deficit will be $455 billion and our current national debt is $10.2 Trillion.

Easy question, what do you cut from the above to get $455 billion?

Btw - McCain said he'd increase spending to NASA to $20 billion a year. I guess he forgot he told them that he'd freeze spending.

Space Politics McCain: still committed to additional NASA funding

 

[NOBama]

Aww how cute. Not only is someone pulling shit out of their ass with a splintered wooden rod, but they also used my name and new avatar in their signature.

Truly, I'm honored. *takes a bow*

We American patroits are glad for you, unlike many of your unemployed peers, you have aspired to the exalted position of the democratic parties beloved mascot.

Awe... It looks like Obama terminated your live birth abortion.

BLNT

 

[LOki]

I am going to keep posting this until it sinks in,

Bush has left us with no feasible option but to raise taxes

So, here is a little exercise for all of you out there that think we can balance the federal budget through spending cuts and can avoid tax increases. I pulled these figures from Wikipedia for the 2008 Federal Budget:

$608 billion - Social Security
$386 billion - Medicare
$209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)
$324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending
$261 billion - Interest on National Debt
$481.4 billion- United States Department of Defense
$145.2 billion- Global War on Terror
$69.3 billion - Health and Human Services
$56.0 billion - United States Department of Education
$39.4 billion - United States Department of Veterans Affairs
$35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development
$35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs
$34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security
$24.3 billion - Energy
$20.2 billion - Department of Justice
$20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture
$17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration
$12.1 billion - Department of Transportation
$12.1 billion - Department of Treasury
$10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior
$10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor

For FY 2008 our estimated deficit will be $455 billion and our current national debt is $10.2 Trillion.

Easy question, what do you cut from the above to get $455 billion?

This is easy.

Cut from $608 billion - Social Security :Everyone cover their own retirement.
Cut from $386 billion - Medicare :Everyone cover their own medical bills
Cut from $209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) :Seriously, cover your own kids medical bills too.
Cut from $324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending :Not really mandatory. Besides, it's time for the stupid/lazy/incompetent to go extinct.
Cut from $145.2 billion- Global War on Terror :There's no such thing.
Cut from $69.3 billion - Health and Human Services :We already have a Justice Dept.
Cut from $56.0 billion - United States Department of Education :No more epic fail.
Cut from $35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development :We're clearly not interested.
Cut from $35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs :LOL. Whatever.
Cut from $34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security :WTF is the Army for anyway?
Cut from $24.3 billion - Energy :What was their profit margin again?
Cut from $20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture :As if farmers would stop growing plants.
Cut from $17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration :If this is really as wortwhile as they claim, it can be privately funded.
Cut from $12.1 billion - Department of Treasury :They can just print whatever money they want--just like they do now.
Cut from $10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior eople need to go outside more.
Cut from $10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor:We've got the DOJ.

Total savings: 1.9941 Trillion. Put all that savings toward the national debt, and it's gone in ~5 years. Still no need to raise taxes. If you can stand to wipe the debt in ~10 years, you can afford to lower taxes by ~1 trillion a year. How much do they rake in anyway?

 

[jillian]

Not even to get into the lack of merit in those cuts, just how many jobs are contained in those agencies?

You do realize that the government is our largest employer, right? All of those workers pay taxes.

Want to cut expenses? Get out of Iraq.

And social security is our money.

 

[Turboswede]

Which departments benefit the slothful protion of the population that’s too lazy to get off their butts and find work, let’s start there.

You do realize that the US has been involved in a war on Terror over the past seven years and the economy is in the toilet, right?

Let me ask you a question, how much are you willing to pay keep terrorists on foreign soil rather than having them parade around in the United States, killing American’s and blowing-up buildings? Exactly what’s your cap on that? I’d really like to know.

As I alluded to in your original post regarding this matter, your question is nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical. It cannot be addressed at the highest level with any reason whatsoever. So, why don’t you find the detailed, line item budget, and post that. Then, we can take a look at each and very tentacle of the individual offices of the departmentalized budget. Be sure it includes everything right down to the smallest of office supplies and the value added by each federal employee.

Then, you and I can sit down together and design a new budget for the entire US government. When we’re done, perhaps you and I can present it to the new President after his inauguration speech.

I anxiously await and look forward to working with you on this most patriotic endeavor that your proposal entails.

EDIT: One more thing: We’ll not only need the projected budget, we’ll need YOY actual expenses for at least the past 12 months.

My Retort

Which departments benefit the slothful portion of the population that’s too lazy to get off their butts and find work, let’s start there.

And which departments would that be? I am assuming you would oppose military cuts and Medicare and Social security folks are safe as they are either retired or disabled. So it looks like your 1st step would be to eliminate Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending but that will still leave a shortfall of about $130B.

You would probably be fine with cutting that out of Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) because children could get off their lazy butts if we just repealed all those pesky child labor laws.

You do realize that the US has been involved in a war on Terror over the past seven years and the economy is in the toilet, right?

Yes, that was kind of the point of my response.

Let me ask you a question, how much are you willing to pay keep terrorists on foreign soil rather than having them parade around in the United States, killing American’s and blowing-up buildings? Exactly what’s your cap on that? I’d really like to know.

No, I am asking the question…

Ok, I don’t think you really want to know, but whatever we are paying for the DOD right now (the $400 Billion range) sounds good to me. I don’t think terrorists would ever “parade around” in America considering how well armed we are. I don’t think a parade of terrorists would make it very far down Main Street.

Besides, terrorism is a police / intelligence issue not a military one, but it’s just too kewl to blow shit up isn’t it.

As I alluded to in your original post regarding this matter, your question is nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical.

Yes, but it shows that while it may be possible, it is a political fantasy to think we can reverse the trend just by cutting spending, $455B is a whole lot of money to find by only cutting the pork out of the budget.

I want it understood that the deficit is a LOT of money, and it needs to be addressed rather than ignored.

It cannot be addressed at the highest level with any reason whatsoever.

Why not?

So, why don’t you find the detailed, line item budget, and post that. Then, we can take a look at each and very tentacle of the individual offices of the departmentalized budget. Be sure it includes everything right down to the smallest of office supplies and the value added by each federal employee.

I don’t have the time and I think the Wiki post shows my point that the government actually spends money on things rather than burning it and cutting $455B means making a lot of tough decisions. But the knee jerk reaction I always see from the right is “cut all social spending” and the left say cut all “defense spending” neither is a realistic solution so what does America do, we just put it off for the next generation.

Then, you and I can sit down together and design a new budget for the entire US government. When we’re done, perhaps you and I can present it to the new President after his inauguration speech.

No, I would really rather not.

I anxiously await and look forward to working with you on this most patriotic endeavor that your proposal entails.

EDIT: One more thing: We’ll not only need the projected budget, we’ll need YOY actual expenses for at least the past 12 months.

I don’t need that level of detail to show me that we can’t cut $455B out of the budget.

 

[LOki]

Not even to get into the lack of merit in those cuts, just how many jobs are contained in those agencies?

I admit that some of those cut are just for lulz, but then again, fuck it--all the services can go, and perhaps we can keep some of the budgets for some of those agencies for the constutionally mandated items they are tasked with--the rest of it goes.

As for these government workers, there's plenty of work in the private sector.

You do realize that the government is our largest employer, right?

You don't see that as a problem?

All of those workers pay taxes.

All of those workers extort taxes.

Want to cut expenses? Get out of Iraq.

I thought I covered that with cutting funding to the WOT(TM).

And social security is our money.

Yeah, you should keep your money; they've already fucked off with the money you've sent them--you won't get that back.

 

[Turboswede]

This is easy.

Cut from $608 billion - Social Security :Everyone cover their own retirement.
Cut from $386 billion - Medicare :Everyone cover their own medical bills
Cut from $209 billion - Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) :Seriously, cover your own kids medical bills too.
Cut from $324 billion - Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending :Not really mandatory. Besides, it's time for the stupid/lazy/incompetent to go extinct.
Cut from $145.2 billion- Global War on Terror :There's no such thing.
Cut from $69.3 billion - Health and Human Services :We already have a Justice Dept.
Cut from $56.0 billion - United States Department of Education :No more epic fail.
Cut from $35.2 billion - US Department of Housing and Urban Development :We're clearly not interested.
Cut from $35.0 billion - State and Other International Programs :LOL. Whatever.
Cut from $34.3 billion - Department of Homeland Security :WTF is the Army for anyway?
Cut from $24.3 billion - Energy :What was their profit margin again?
Cut from $20.2 billion - Department of Agriculture :As if farmers would stop growing plants.
Cut from $17.3 billion - National Aeronautics and Space Administration :If this is really as wortwhile as they claim, it can be privately funded.
Cut from $12.1 billion - Department of Treasury :They can just print whatever money they want--just like they do now.
Cut from $10.6 billion - United States Department of the Interior eople need to go outside more.
Cut from $10.6 billion - United States Department of Labor:We've got the DOJ.

Total savings: 1.9941 Trillion. Put all that savings toward the national debt, and it's gone in ~5 years. Still no need to raise taxes. If you can stand to wipe the debt in ~10 years, you can afford to lower taxes by ~1 trillion a year. How much do they rake in anyway?

This is the best response I have seen, In addition to being very entertaining to read it cuts both social and defense spending. Yup it can be done, but whoever did it would be run out of office.

 

[elvis]

And when he came to tax me, there was no income to tax for I was unemployed and there was no one left to support me.

Learn it.

Know it.

Because, if Obama wins this election you will: Live it.

everyone's taxes are going up. so get ready.

 

[elvis]

We American patroits are glad for you, unlike many of your unemployed peers, you have aspired to the exalted position of the democratic parties beloved mascot.

Awe... It looks like Obama terminated your live birth abortion.

BLNT

yeah, he can replace the jackass on the democratic party's logo.

 

[NOBama]

My Retort

Which departments benefit the slothful portion of the population that’s too lazy to get off their butts and find work, let’s start there.

And which departments would that be? I am assuming you would oppose military cuts and Medicare and Social security folks are safe as they are either retired or disabled. So it looks like your 1st step would be to eliminate Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending but that will still leave a shortfall of about $130B.

You would probably be fine with cutting that out of Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) because children could get off their lazy butts if we just repealed all those pesky child labor laws.

You do realize that the US has been involved in a war on Terror over the past seven years and the economy is in the toilet, right?

Yes, that was kind of the point of my response.

Let me ask you a question, how much are you willing to pay keep terrorists on foreign soil rather than having them parade around in the United States, killing American’s and blowing-up buildings? Exactly what’s your cap on that? I’d really like to know.

No, I am asking the question…

Ok, I don’t think you really want to know, but whatever we are paying for the DOD right now (the $400 Billion range) sounds good to me. I don’t think terrorists would ever “parade around” in America considering how well armed we are. I don’t think a parade of terrorists would make it very far down Main Street.

Besides, terrorism is a police / intelligence issue not a military one, but it’s just too kewl to blow shit up isn’t it.

As I alluded to in your original post regarding this matter, your question is nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical.

Yes, but it shows that while it may be possible, it is a political fantasy to think we can reverse the trend just by cutting spending, $455B is a whole lot of money to find by only cutting the pork out of the budget.

I want it understood that the deficit is a LOT of money, and it needs to be addressed rather than ignored.

It cannot be addressed at the highest level with any reason whatsoever.

Why not?

So, why don’t you find the detailed, line item budget, and post that. Then, we can take a look at each and very tentacle of the individual offices of the departmentalized budget. Be sure it includes everything right down to the smallest of office supplies and the value added by each federal employee.

I don’t have the time and I think the Wiki post shows my point that the government actually spends money on things rather than burning it and cutting $455B means making a lot of tough decisions. But the knee jerk reaction I always see from the right is “cut all social spending” and the left say cut all “defense spending” neither is a realistic solution so what does America do, we just put it off for the next generation.

Then, you and I can sit down together and design a new budget for the entire US government. When we’re done, perhaps you and I can present it to the new President after his inauguration speech.

No, I would really rather not.

I anxiously await and look forward to working with you on this most patriotic endeavor that your proposal entails.

EDIT: One more thing: We’ll not only need the projected budget, we’ll need YOY actual expenses for at least the past 12 months.

I don’t need that level of detail to show me that we can’t cut $455B out of the budget.

Which departments benefit the slothful portion of the population that’s too lazy to get off their butts and find work, let’s start there.

And which departments would that be? I am assuming you would oppose military cuts and Medicare and Social security folks are safe as they are either retired or disabled. So it looks like your 1st step would be to eliminate Unemployment/Welfare/Other mandatory spending but that will still leave a shortfall of about $130B.

You would probably be fine with cutting that out of Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) because children could get off their lazy butts if we just repealed all those pesky child labor laws.

Fiscally sound decisions cannot be made from a consolidated line item. That’s a fact.

You do realize that the US has been involved in a war on Terror over the past seven years and the economy is in the toilet, right?

Yes, that was kind of the point of my response.

This thread is about my speculation of what could happen regarding Obama’s Robin Hood tax cut proposal. I don’t believe it mentioned the federal budget. Additionally, I previously commented on your question in the thread where you raised it.

Let me ask you a question, how much are you willing to pay keep terrorists on foreign soil rather than having them parade around in the United States, killing American’s and blowing-up buildings? Exactly what’s your cap on that? I’d really like to know.

No, I am asking the question…

Ok, I don’t think you really want to know, but whatever we are paying for the DOD right now (the $400 Billion range) sounds good to me. I don’t think terrorists would ever “parade around” in America considering how well armed we are. I don’t think a parade of terrorists would make it very far down Main Street.

Besides, terrorism is a police / intelligence issue not a military one, but it’s just too kewl to blow shit up isn’t it.

This is my thread and I’ll ask any question I please. If you don’t like it, get out of it.

Unlike you, I cannot speculate that 400B$ is to little or to much for DOD. I would require line item details. Additionally, the phrase “parade around” was used figuratively not literally, but I suspect you knew that.

Wrong. Terrorism is not only a LEO concern. Ask any soldier if terrorism is a military concern/issue.

As I alluded to in your original post regarding this matter, your question is nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical.

Yes, but it shows that while it may be possible, it is a political fantasy to think we can reverse the trend just by cutting spending, $455B is a whole lot of money to find by only cutting the pork out of the budget.

I want it understood that the deficit is a LOT of money, and it needs to be addressed rather than ignored.

Thank you for acknowledging that your question is nothing more than illusionary hypothetical that cannot be logically resolved without detailed information.

Moot point. I never suggested it wasn’t.

It cannot be addressed at the highest level with any reason whatsoever.

Why not?

Your question is nothing more than illusionary hypothetical that cannot be logically resolved without detailed information.

So, why don’t you find the detailed, line item budget, and post that. Then, we can take a look at each and very tentacle of the individual offices of the departmentalized budget. Be sure it includes everything right down to the smallest of office supplies and the value added by each federal employee.

I don’t have the time and I think the Wiki post shows my point that the government actually spends money on things rather than burning it and cutting $455B means making a lot of tough decisions. But the knee jerk reaction I always see from the right is “cut all social spending” and the left say cut all “defense spending” neither is a realistic solution so what does America do, we just put it off for the next generation.

If you don’t have the time to research the question, what the hell makes you think I’m going to do it for you? I may have previously mentioned that I believe it’s an illusionary hypothetical question that cannot be resolved without detailed information.

Then, you and I can sit down together and design a new budget for the entire US government. When we’re done, perhaps you and I can present it to the new President after his inauguration speech.

No, I would really rather not.

I didn’t think so, nor was I concerned about the eventuality of any such meeting.

I anxiously await and look forward to working with you on this most patriotic endeavor that your proposal entails.

EDIT: One more thing: We’ll not only need the projected budget, we’ll need YOY actual expenses for at least the past 12 months.

I don’t need that level of detail to show me that we can’t cut $455B out of the budget.[/QUOTE]

Without that level of detail you have nothing more than an illusionary hypothetical question that cannot be answered, only speculated upon.

 

[Turboswede]

This does relate back to your original post as you are claiming that Obama’s tax increase will impact individuals who make less the $250,000 per year. I do agree with you there, I am sure Obama’s tax increases will impact more than that.

But from what I can see, no matter who would be elected, they would need to increase taxes. I don’t mind an increase in taxes even though it’s going to pay down a deficit caused by something I didn’t support in the first place. Point is the deficit is here and the next guy in the white house needs to deal with it. That’s why I was a McCain supporter until recently, from his track record I thought that McCain would be our best shot as getting to where we were in 2000.

I think McCain would have cut s substantial chunk out of the budget, but I am sure he would have raised taxes as he has a history of fighting budget deficits. The thing is I am betting Obama’s tax increases will target the wealth more than McCain’s would.