The Humanitarian Gaza Flotillas Saga

[Daniyel]

This is why you can't be president, your observation is shallowed.
First let's agree to disagree that a loss of lamps in evacuated Gazan street is not important as 18-21 years old soldiers about to get ambushed by a hostile government lurking inside hospitals and medical clinics...So let's move on to the opening part in your post where you talk about the source of the electricity, maintenance, and infrastructure.. Hamas?

I can be President and you would vote for me because you know its good for the country.

As for the lamps, street improvements is not terrorism. Shooting the lamps out from people who have no legal right to be in the area, is terrorism.

First of all I'm against Socialism, next let me inform you it's all made by Israel including the electricity provided to Gaza, my pocket, does this count an international aid or perhaps Israel's property? (In case you dont get it - Hamas didn't bend a finger for that)

Now you just happened to say something very interesting, technically it's "out of" but I assume you meant "by" ---
"people who have no legal right to be in the area"
Why does Israelis have no right to be in this area?

 

[P F Tinmore]

It wasnt ALL off topic. Some good themes were there. I just cant get all irate about inspecting incoming cargo to a government run by Iranian proxy terrorists. If it was any other tiny sliver of humanity, there would be a full out embargo in place.

When that government put up street lights on a Gazan street and the IDF comes in later and shoots out all the lamps at the top, who's the terrorist then?

Having a responsible government that WANTS ports and sovereign unfettered commerce would solve the problem.. Electing Hamas and destroying the democratic process is a bad move IF you value ports and commerce. Its really that simple. Give Billo an hour to sober up --- or maybe not -- before the thread is at warp speed again..

Hamas is a responsible government. The only reason they're the bad guy, is because they won't kiss Israel's ass.

No dumbass, Hamas are the bad guys because they're an Islamic terrorist organization that targets innocent civilians while hiding behind their own. They fully fulfil the criteria required by our govt and many other Western govt. to qualify as a terrorist organization.


Foreign Terrorist Organization Designation

1. What are the different types of designations? There are two kinds of designations. Groups can be designated as Foreign Terrorist Organizations under the Immigration and Nationality Act. Under Executive Order 13224 a wider range of entities, including terrorist groups, individuals acting as part of a terrorist organization, and other entities such as financiers and front companies, can be designated as Specially Designated Global Terrorists (SDGTs).

2. Who can designate FTOs and SDGTs?
The Department of State is authorized to designate FTOs and SDGTs, while the Department of the Treasury designates only SDGTs. Both departments pursue these designations in cooperation with the Department of Justice. All of the Department of State’s designations can be found at: http://www.state.gov/j/ct/rls/other/des/index.htm. All State FTO and EO designations can also be found at the Treasury OFAC website.

3. What are the criteria for designation?
The Secretary of State designates Foreign Terrorist Organizations in accordance with section 219 of the Immigration and Nationality Act. The legal criteria for designating Foreign Terrorist Organizations are:

• The organization must be foreign based.
• The organization engages in terrorist activity or terrorism, or retains the capability and intent to engage in terrorist activity or terrorism.
• The terrorist activity or terrorism of the organization threatens the security of United States nationals or national security of the United States.

For Executive Order 13224, The Secretary of State, in consultation with the Secretary of the Treasury and the Attorney General, may designate foreign individuals or entities that he determines have committed, or pose a significant risk of committing, acts of terrorism that threaten the security of U.S. nationals or the national security, foreign policy, or economy of the U.S.; or, the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Attorney General, may designate individuals or entities that are determined:

• To be owned or controlled by, or act for or on behalf of an individual or entity listed in the Annex to the Order or by or for persons determined to be subject to the Order;
• To assist in, sponsor, or provide financial, material, or technological support for, or financial or other services to or in support of, acts of terrorism or individuals or entities designated in or under the Order; or
• To be otherwise associated with certain individuals or entities designated in or under the Order.

4. What makes you decide to designate or not designate a group or entity?Within the Department of State, the Bureau of Counterterrorism identifies and evaluates possible individuals or organizations for designation. Other Departments also recommend designation targets.

5. How long does the process take?
For Foreign Terrorist Organizations, once an organization is identified, we prepare a detailed "administrative record," which is a compilation of information, typically including both classified and open source information, demonstrating that the statutory criteria for designation have been satisfied.

• If the Secretary of State, in consultation with the Attorney General and the Secretary of the Treasury, decides to make the designation, Congress is notified of the Secretary’s intent to designate the organization seven days before the designation is published in the Federal Register, as section 219 of the Immigration and Nationality Act requires.
• Upon the expiration of the seven-day waiting period and in the absence of Congressional action to block the designation, notice of the designation is published in the Federal Register, at which point the designation takes effect.

For Specially Designated Global Terrorists, once the Secretary of State or the Secretary of the Treasury designates an individual or entity, the Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) of the Department of the Treasury takes appropriate action to block the assets of the individual or entity in the United States or in the possession or control of U.S. persons, including notification of the blocking order to U.S. financial institutions, directing them to block the assets of the designated individual or entity.

• Notice of the designation is also published in the Federal Register. OFAC also adds the individual or entity to its list of Specially Designated Nationals, by identifying such individuals or entities as Specially Designated Global Terrorists (SDGTs), and posts a notice of this addition on the OFAC website.
• Designations remain in effect until the designation is revoked or the Executive Order lapses or is terminated in accordance with U.S. law.

6. What are the consequences of a designation?

Executive Order:

• With limited exceptions set forth in the Order, or as authorized by OFAC, all property and interests in property of designated individuals or entities that are in the United States or that come within the United States, or that come within the possession or control of U.S. persons are blocked.
• With limited exceptions set forth in the Order, or as authorized by OFAC, any transaction or dealing by U.S. persons or within the United States in property or interests in property blocked pursuant to the Order is prohibited, including but not limited to the making or receiving of any contribution of funds, goods, or services to or for the benefit of individuals or entities designated under the Order.
• Any transaction by any U.S. person or within the United States that evades or avoids, or has the purpose of evading or avoiding, or attempts to violate, any of the prohibitions in the Order is prohibited. Any conspiracy formed to violate any of the prohibitions is also prohibited.
• Civil and criminal penalties may be assessed for violations.

Foreign Terrorist Organization:

• It is unlawful for a person in the United States or subject to the jurisdiction of the United States to knowingly provide "material support or resources" to a designated FTO.
• Representatives and members of a designated FTO, if they are aliens, are inadmissible to and, in certain circumstances, removable from the United States
• Any U.S. financial institution that becomes aware that it has possession of or control over funds in which a designated FTO or its agent has an interest must retain possession of or control over the funds and report the funds to the Office of Foreign Assets Control of the U.S. Department of the Treasury.
• Supports our efforts to curb terrorism financing and to encourage other nations to do the same.
• Stigmatizes and isolates designated terrorist organizations internationally.
• Deters donations or contributions to and economic transactions with named organizations.
• Heightens public awareness and knowledge of terrorist organizations.

Signals to other governments our concern about named organizations.

Angus Martyn in a briefing paper for the Australian Parliament has stated that "The international community has never succeeded in developing an accepted comprehensive definition of terrorism. During the 1970s and 1980s, the United Nations attempts to define the term foundered mainly due to differences of opinion between various members about the use of violence in the context of conflicts over national liberation and self-determination."[4] These divergences have made it impossible to conclude a Comprehensive Convention on International Terrorism that incorporates a single, all-encompassing, legally binding, criminal law definition of terrorism.[5]

As Bruce Hoffman has noted: "terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. (...) Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization 'terrorist' becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned.

Definitions of terrorism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

Terrorism is political name calling.

 

[Kondor3]

...Terrorism is political name calling.

Classic example of Moral Relativism and Faux Equivalency...

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

We keep bumping into this "elected democratically" phrase here. Perhaps they were. But did they run on a platform to normalize relations in a way that would KEEP the PA agreements made with Israel to reopen the airport and seaport? Need an answer there. WHAT was their position??? It was clear that Fatah and the PA SUPPORTED the negotiations for sovereign control of those things.

And I called it coupe before. Wasn't exactly.. But it wasn't an election either. Because the sequence of events went something like "election" -- purge and civil war --- no more "elections" ever... Was that sequence of event WORTH IT to the Palestinian people? Is that the kind of "national representation" that they want and need? I see the "election" more as a betting pool on the winner of the eventual civil war and purge..

Why don't you post a thread on all the good things that Hamas promised in their "election" ? And what the Palestinians have given up by making that choice..

 

[P F Tinmore]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

We keep bumping into this "elected democratically" phrase here. Perhaps they were. But did they run on a platform to normalize relations in a way that would KEEP the PA agreements made with Israel to reopen the airport and seaport? Need an answer there. WHAT was their position??? It was clear that Fatah and the PA SUPPORTED the negotiations for sovereign control of those things.

And I called it coupe before. Wasn't exactly.. But it wasn't an election either. Because the sequence of events went something like "election" -- purge and civil war --- no more "elections" ever... Was that sequence of event WORTH IT to the Palestinian people? Is that the kind of "national representation" that they want and need? I see the "election" more as a betting pool on the winner of the eventual civil war and purge..

Why don't you post a thread on all the good things that Hamas promised in their "election" ? And what the Palestinians have given up by making that choice..

Hamas - 2006 Electoral Campaign Platform - Israeli-Palestinian Conflict - ProCon.org

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

And Hamas are angels walking around with halos on their heads, that's why they are designated as a terrorist organization by the U.S. And the West.

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

There is no use for a "constitutionally protected party" if there can be no more working government or elections.
You can't argue that is a GOOD thing for the prospect of a Palestinian state. (i suppose you could -- but your sincerity about the plight of the Palestinians would come into question).. Hamas is the PRIMARY reason those ports are not functioning and working for the Palestinian people.

 

[flacaltenn]

It wasnt ALL off topic. Some good themes were there. I just cant get all irate about inspecting incoming cargo to a government run by Iranian proxy terrorists. If it was any other tiny sliver of humanity, there would be a full out embargo in place.

When that government put up street lights on a Gazan street and the IDF comes in later and shoots out all the lamps at the top, who's the terrorist then?

Having a responsible government that WANTS ports and sovereign unfettered commerce would solve the problem.. Electing Hamas and destroying the democratic process is a bad move IF you value ports and commerce. Its really that simple. Give Billo an hour to sober up --- or maybe not -- before the thread is at warp speed again..

Hamas is a responsible government. The only reason they're the bad guy, is because they won't kiss Israel's ass.

Streetlights? Well I guess that's the same value system that chose Hamas over commerce. IDF was THERE because of Hamas.. And shooting streetlights is a smart way to fight a dense urban conflict. As opposed to placing military command and forces in schools and hospitals..

So --- you believe the Palestinians are better off with no more elections, no sovereign controlled commerce or ports under Hamas? How far towards nationhood status do you believe Hamas will take them?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

And Hamas are angels walking around with halos on their heads, that's why they are designated as a terrorist organization by the U.S. And the West.

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

There is no use for a "constitutionally protected party" if there can be no more working government or elections.
You can't argue that is a GOOD thing for the prospect of a Palestinian state. (i suppose you could -- but your sincerity about the plight of the Palestinians would come into question).. Hamas is the PRIMARY reason those ports are not functioning and working for the Palestinian people.

Gaza's airport and seaport were bombed by Israel years before Hamas was elected.

Abbas needs to step down and allow elections. He is on the tenth year of a four year term.

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

We keep bumping into this "elected democratically" phrase here. Perhaps they were. But did they run on a platform to normalize relations in a way that would KEEP the PA agreements made with Israel to reopen the airport and seaport? Need an answer there. WHAT was their position??? It was clear that Fatah and the PA SUPPORTED the negotiations for sovereign control of those things.

And I called it coupe before. Wasn't exactly.. But it wasn't an election either. Because the sequence of events went something like "election" -- purge and civil war --- no more "elections" ever... Was that sequence of event WORTH IT to the Palestinian people? Is that the kind of "national representation" that they want and need? I see the "election" more as a betting pool on the winner of the eventual civil war and purge..

Why don't you post a thread on all the good things that Hamas promised in their "election" ? And what the Palestinians have given up by making that choice..

Hamas - 2006 Electoral Campaign Platform - Israeli-Palestinian Conflict - ProCon.org

I saw nothing in their priorities about SeaPorts or Airports or infrastructure or education. Just war..
A political party with an AK rifle in their insignia.. This is not ZIONISM of a more vicious type?

It's actually appalling PF.. Completely and utterly appalling.. Especially the enumerated priorities.

The Change and reform List adopts a number of approaches to fulfill fixed aims emanating from Islamic references - namely:

• 
  1. Islam is our Reference.
  
  2. Palestine is Arab and Muslim Land.
  
  3. Palestinians are one nation regardless of location.
  
  4. The Palestinian People are still in the process of National Liberation and have the right to use all means including armed struggle to achieve this goal.
  

• 
  5. The right of return to all Palestinians.
  
  6. Adherence to the inalienable rights of the people.
  
  7. Protect and cement National Unity as a priority.
  
  8. The issue of prisoners and detainees tops the agenda ; on the internal policy level the C&R aims at achieving a great number of objectives - among them: Maintaining Palestinian fixed National Aims; Palestinian presence in Jerusalem; political freedom; dialogue as a means to solving internal differences; freedom of expression; assembling movement.
  
  9. The platform of the C&R prohibits: Political detention; shedding Palestinian blood; protection of civil society; directing the security apparatus to safeguarding the security of the citizens.
  

Among other things the Platform calls for protecting the "Resistance" and enhancing its role

to resist Occupation and achieve Liberation.

What's particularly appalling is that #9.. Given the Hamas penchant for executing Palis in the street without due process. This does not sound like a "party" that gives a WHIT about what normal nations do. They do not value Seaports and Airports. They do not value diplomacy or democracy... Palestinian people are DOOMED with this kind of leadership and NOW --- they appear to be stuck with it.

Their only hope is that the larger Arab conflict will wipe Iranian proxy terrorists out of the Holy Land and give them another chance to have a real nation..

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas was elected democratically because the PLO was considered corrupt.

And Hamas are angels walking around with halos on their heads, that's why they are designated as a terrorist organization by the U.S. And the West.

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

There is no use for a "constitutionally protected party" if there can be no more working government or elections.
You can't argue that is a GOOD thing for the prospect of a Palestinian state. (i suppose you could -- but your sincerity about the plight of the Palestinians would come into question).. Hamas is the PRIMARY reason those ports are not functioning and working for the Palestinian people.

Gaza's airport and seaport were bombed by Israel years before Hamas was elected.

Abbas needs to step down and allow elections. He is on the tenth year of a four year term.

Already covered that PF.. The withdrawal from Gaza by Israel came with a detailed plan for REOPENING those ports -- the purge and civil war ended any chances of that happening. And as you NOW KNOW --- Hamas doesn't value ports and commerce the way a normal nation does. That's why these flotillas are NOT effective at changing public opinion. Not in Israel. Not in Egypt. Not in the US. And probably not among many Palestinians.

Any POLLS taken to show how satisfied the Palestinians are with the results of the Hamas take-over of their movement?

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Applying terrorism, as a descriptive term to the actions of crimes that are committed in order to intimidate, coerce and inflame a population or government is NOT "political name calling."

I can cherry pick Dr Hoffman's material as well.

"Terrorism is thus violence -- or, equally important, the threat of violence -- used and directed in pursuit of, or in service of, a political aim."
SOURCE: Inside Terrorism By BRUCE HOFFMAN Columbia University Press
​

A N D​

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

√ freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);

√ armies or other military organizational structures (e.g. the National Military Organization, the Popular Liberation Army, the Fifth Battalion of the Liberation Army, etc.);

√ actual self-defence movements (e.g. the Afrikaner Resistance Movement, the Shankhill Defence Association, the Organization for the Defence of the Free People, the Jewish Defense Organization, etc.);

√ righteous vengeance (the Organization for the Oppressed on Earth, the Justice Commandos of the Armenian Genocide, the Palestinian Revenge Organization, etc.);freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);​

You just can't apply little sound-bites and expect to convey something meaningful. It might be worth remembering that "enemy" and the contemporary use of "Nazi" are "pejorative terms" as well; expressing contempt or disapproval.

Angus Martyn in a briefing paper for the Australian Parliament has stated that "The international community has never succeeded in developing an accepted comprehensive definition of terrorism. During the 1970s and 1980s, the United Nations attempts to define the term foundered mainly due to differences of opinion between various members about the use of violence in the context of conflicts over national liberation and self-determination."[4] These divergences have made it impossible to conclude a Comprehensive Convention on International Terrorism that incorporates a single, all-encompassing, legally binding, criminal law definition of terrorism.[5]

As Bruce Hoffman has noted: "terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. (...) Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization 'terrorist' becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned.

Definitions of terrorism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

Terrorism is political name calling.

(COMMENT)

Dr Hoffman may say that terrorism is a term expressing contempt or disapproval; it is not the only thing he had to say as to what "terrorism is." He was the first Director of the Centre for the Study of Terrorism and Political Violence (CSTPV), and a member on the 9/11 Review Commission.

The Palestinian attack during the 1972 Summer Olympics in Munich, was and act of terrorism. You may not be able to define it to everyones satisfaction, BUT you will know it when you see it.

The lead-up to the 2014 Israeli-Gaza Conflict (AKA: Operation Protective Edge) was peppered will less dramatic events, but none the less inflict the same introduction of fear in order to further a political agenda.

HAMAS attempted to blackmail (hold the ceasefire hostage) Israel by demanding (a ransom) that Israel:

• End all attacks on Gaza;
• Release those re-arrested during the crackdown in the West Bank;
• Lift the blockade on Gaza;
• Return to the cease-fire conditions of 2012 as conditions for a ceasefire.

You may hold the Islamic Resistance Movement in high esteem, but the fact of the matter is that since their inception, they have established a long and bloody history of past criminal behaviors that have instilled fear in various cultures and countries.

• You cannot be a freedom fighter and still follow Jihad with terrorism as your principle tool.

The Palestinians have absolutely nothing to be proud of in their history --- nothing at all.

Most Respectfully,
R​

 

[Kondor3]

...Hamas ...will defend its people...

Some defense...

...It will not give away the store...

Don't look now, but there is no store left to give away...

...You can't say any of that about Fatah.

True.

What they can say is that Fatah did not bring about the ruin of Gaza... Hamas did.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Applying terrorism, as a descriptive term to the actions of crimes that are committed in order to intimidate, coerce and inflame a population or government is NOT "political name calling."

I can cherry pick Dr Hoffman's material as well.

"Terrorism is thus violence -- or, equally important, the threat of violence -- used and directed in pursuit of, or in service of, a political aim."
SOURCE: Inside Terrorism By BRUCE HOFFMAN Columbia University Press
​

A N D​

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

√ freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);

√ armies or other military organizational structures (e.g. the National Military Organization, the Popular Liberation Army, the Fifth Battalion of the Liberation Army, etc.);

√ actual self-defence movements (e.g. the Afrikaner Resistance Movement, the Shankhill Defence Association, the Organization for the Defence of the Free People, the Jewish Defense Organization, etc.);

√ righteous vengeance (the Organization for the Oppressed on Earth, the Justice Commandos of the Armenian Genocide, the Palestinian Revenge Organization, etc.);freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);​

You just can't apply little sound-bites and expect to convey something meaningful. It might be worth remembering that "enemy" and the contemporary use of "Nazi" are "pejorative terms" as well; expressing contempt or disapproval.

Angus Martyn in a briefing paper for the Australian Parliament has stated that "The international community has never succeeded in developing an accepted comprehensive definition of terrorism. During the 1970s and 1980s, the United Nations attempts to define the term foundered mainly due to differences of opinion between various members about the use of violence in the context of conflicts over national liberation and self-determination."[4] These divergences have made it impossible to conclude a Comprehensive Convention on International Terrorism that incorporates a single, all-encompassing, legally binding, criminal law definition of terrorism.[5]

As Bruce Hoffman has noted: "terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. (...) Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization 'terrorist' becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned.

Definitions of terrorism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

Terrorism is political name calling.

(COMMENT)

Dr Hoffman may say that terrorism is a term expressing contempt or disapproval; it is not the only thing he had to say as to what "terrorism is." He was the first Director of the Centre for the Study of Terrorism and Political Violence (CSTPV), and a member on the 9/11 Review Commission.

The Palestinian attack during the 1972 Summer Olympics in Munich, was and act of terrorism. You may not be able to define it to everyones satisfaction, BUT you will know it when you see it.

The lead-up to the 2014 Israeli-Gaza Conflict (AKA: Operation Protective Edge) was peppered will less dramatic events, but none the less inflict the same introduction of fear in order to further a political agenda.

HAMAS attempted to blackmail (hold the ceasefire hostage) Israel by demanding (a ransom) that Israel:

• End all attacks on Gaza;
• Release those re-arrested during the crackdown in the West Bank;
• Lift the blockade on Gaza;
• Return to the cease-fire conditions of 2012 as conditions for a ceasefire.

You may hold the Islamic Resistance Movement in high esteem, but the fact of the matter is that since their inception, they have established a long and bloody history of past criminal behaviors that have instilled fear in various cultures and countries.

• You cannot be a freedom fighter and still follow Jihad with terrorism as your principle tool.

The Palestinians have absolutely nothing to be proud of in their history --- nothing at all.

Most Respectfully,
R​

"Terrorism is thus violence -- or, equally important, the threat of violence -- used and directed in pursuit of, or in service of, a political aim."​

Indeed, and the Zionist political aim for over a hundred years is all of Palestine without the Palestinians. That can't be done without terrorism.

The Palestinian's actions are to resist this stated takeover.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Applying terrorism, as a descriptive term to the actions of crimes that are committed in order to intimidate, coerce and inflame a population or government is NOT "political name calling."

I can cherry pick Dr Hoffman's material as well.

"Terrorism is thus violence -- or, equally important, the threat of violence -- used and directed in pursuit of, or in service of, a political aim."
SOURCE: Inside Terrorism By BRUCE HOFFMAN Columbia University Press
​

A N D​

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

This trend towards ever more convoluted semantic obfuscations to side-step terrorism's pejorative overtones has, if anything, become more entrenched in recent decades. Terrorist organizations almost without exception now regularly select names for themselves that consciously eschew the word `terrorism' in any of its forms. Instead these groups actively seek to evoke images of:

√ freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);

√ armies or other military organizational structures (e.g. the National Military Organization, the Popular Liberation Army, the Fifth Battalion of the Liberation Army, etc.);

√ actual self-defence movements (e.g. the Afrikaner Resistance Movement, the Shankhill Defence Association, the Organization for the Defence of the Free People, the Jewish Defense Organization, etc.);

√ righteous vengeance (the Organization for the Oppressed on Earth, the Justice Commandos of the Armenian Genocide, the Palestinian Revenge Organization, etc.);freedom and liberation (e.g. the National Liberation Front, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Freedom for the Basque Homeland, etc.);​

You just can't apply little sound-bites and expect to convey something meaningful. It might be worth remembering that "enemy" and the contemporary use of "Nazi" are "pejorative terms" as well; expressing contempt or disapproval.

Angus Martyn in a briefing paper for the Australian Parliament has stated that "The international community has never succeeded in developing an accepted comprehensive definition of terrorism. During the 1970s and 1980s, the United Nations attempts to define the term foundered mainly due to differences of opinion between various members about the use of violence in the context of conflicts over national liberation and self-determination."[4] These divergences have made it impossible to conclude a Comprehensive Convention on International Terrorism that incorporates a single, all-encompassing, legally binding, criminal law definition of terrorism.[5]

As Bruce Hoffman has noted: "terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. (...) Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization 'terrorist' becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned.

Definitions of terrorism - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

Terrorism is political name calling.

(COMMENT)

Dr Hoffman may say that terrorism is a term expressing contempt or disapproval; it is not the only thing he had to say as to what "terrorism is." He was the first Director of the Centre for the Study of Terrorism and Political Violence (CSTPV), and a member on the 9/11 Review Commission.

The Palestinian attack during the 1972 Summer Olympics in Munich, was and act of terrorism. You may not be able to define it to everyones satisfaction, BUT you will know it when you see it.

The lead-up to the 2014 Israeli-Gaza Conflict (AKA: Operation Protective Edge) was peppered will less dramatic events, but none the less inflict the same introduction of fear in order to further a political agenda.

HAMAS attempted to blackmail (hold the ceasefire hostage) Israel by demanding (a ransom) that Israel:

• End all attacks on Gaza;
• Release those re-arrested during the crackdown in the West Bank;
• Lift the blockade on Gaza;
• Return to the cease-fire conditions of 2012 as conditions for a ceasefire.

You may hold the Islamic Resistance Movement in high esteem, but the fact of the matter is that since their inception, they have established a long and bloody history of past criminal behaviors that have instilled fear in various cultures and countries.

• You cannot be a freedom fighter and still follow Jihad with terrorism as your principle tool.

The Palestinians have absolutely nothing to be proud of in their history --- nothing at all.

Most Respectfully,
R​

HAMAS attempted to blackmail (hold the ceasefire hostage) Israel by demanding (a ransom) that Israel:

• End all attacks on Gaza;

Hamas wanted a ceasefire that would end attacks on Gaza?

You have to admit, Rocco, that is a ******* bizarre demand.

 

[Hossfly]

P F Tinmore, ForeverYoung436, et al,

Yes, the Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) is a both an Islamic Organization by Charter, and a Political Party (headed by: Khaled Meshal, Chairman, Politburo of the Islamic Resistance Movement) and the hub of a larger terrorist organization that uses violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; the removal of the State of Israel. HAMAS is political, but we cannot forget that it has its own paramilitary wing called the Izz al Din Qassam Brigades (AQB) that is directed, funded and equipped by HAMAS; which has been responsible for most of the violence directed towards Israel.

Hamas is "only" a political party? Do you see Republicans in the U.S. shooting rockets? Democrats building tunnels?

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

(KEY COMPONENTS)

First, the January 2006 Palestinian Parliamentary Elections, that brought HAMAS to the forefront, is now well over eight (8) years old. Whatever mandate the elections gave HAMAS eight years ago, has long since expired. The Palestinian Government has not been able to make a smooth Constitutional transition of government since the Constitution was written over a decade ago. Since the 1993 Oslo Accords, which created the Palestinian National Authority (PNA), the PNA acted as the interim administrative body established to administer the governmental institutions necessary for the West Bank. In 2012, the PNA essentially became the government for the State of Palestine when the UN decided to "accord to Palestine non-member observer State status in the United Nations, without prejudice to the acquired rights, privileges and role of the Palestine Liberation Organization in the United Nations as the representative of the Palestinian people," (A/RES/67/19 4 December 2012).

The trouble here is that HAMAS (a Palestinian Islamic organization) has rejected two key elements that have survived for three decades in Palestine:

• HAMAS rejects the PLO (secular) as the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinians,
  • Seventh Arab League Summit Conference Resolution on Palestine Rabat, Morocco 28 October 1974
  • Having heard the statement of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the representative of the Palestinian people, A/RES/3236 (XXIX) 22 November 1974
  • ANNEX II Political Communiqué and ANNEX III Palestinian Declaration of Independence
• HAMAS rejects the Oslo Accords.
  • Oslo I Declaration of Principles on Interim Self-Government Arrangements
  • Oslo II Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip

HAMAS has a mantra ---- besides that of Jihad ---- in both the Covenant and its official Political Position:

• No recognition of the legitimacy of the Israeli occupation
• No recognition of "Israel"
  • Israel-PLO Recognition: Exchange of Letters between PM Rabin and Chairman Arafat - In connection with the Oslo Accords
• No legitimacy of Israel's presence in any part of Palestine from the river to the sea, and from north to south
  • A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 UN Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations

HAMAS is becoming a regional threat. In addition to HAMAS insisting it is Entitled To Attack Israel's Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide – It also claims it has the right to attack The Interests Of Israel's Allies; as well as the US.

(COMMENT)

HAMAS is not just a political party. It is a regional danger; not just by itself --- but by the bad pennies it attracts. HAMAS and the Gaza Strip have developed an attraction for DAESH (Islamic State or Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) that is attempting to establish itself on the Egyptian/Sinai Border region of the Gaza Strip and Israel.

It is rumored that a video, produced DAESH in the last week of June, is now making the rounds in the region. It is directed at the Palestinians (HAMAS and Fatah). The DAESH Jihadist accuses HAMAS of being soft in enforcing religious law in the Palestinian enclave it controls.

“We will uproot the state of the Jews [Israel] and you [Hamas] and Fatah [in the West Bank], and all of the secularists are nothing and you will be overrun by our creeping multitudes,” a masked Islamic State member said in the recorded message addressed to the “tyrants of Hamas.”

“The rule of Sharia [Islamic law] will be implemented in Gaza, in spite of you. We swear that what is happening in the Levant today, and in particular the Yarmouk camp [in Syria], will happen in Gaza,” he said, in reference to the besieged Palestinian refugee camp near Damascus.
SOURCE: Islamic State militant was booted from Hamas
SOURCE: Daesh threatens to overthrow Hamas in Gaza
SOURCE: ISIS Threatens To Topple Hamas In Gaza
​

HAMAS and Fatah may have more to worry about then its feud with Israel. If DAESH gets a firm foothold in the Gaza Strip from the Sinai --- it will probably cause Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt to get involved; inadvertently expanding the conflict.

YES, HAMAS is much much more than just an irritant politically.

Most Respectfully,
R

Hamas is not corrupt. It will defend its people. It will not give away the store.

You can't say any of that about Fatah.

Hamas is not corrupt.. - Just a legitimate dictatorship.
What with all the "Will" - how do you know Hamas "will" defend its people, when so far they didn't? only thing they strive for - and you the one supporting it should know out of everyone else - is WAR AGAINST ISRAEL'S JEWS - not even protecting "ITS" people including Hamas members.

We have seen Tinmore stick up for Hamas constantly so should we be surprised that even though Tinmore supposedly lives in the U.S. he was allowed to vote for Hamas?

 

[theliq]

...Hamas ...will defend its people...

Some defense...

...It will not give away the store...

Don't look now, but there is no store left to give away...

...You can't say any of that about Fatah.

True.

What they can say is that Fatah did not bring about the ruin of Gaza... Hamas did.

What!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!So Israel had NO PART IN THIS DESTRUCTION,I ????? your morality Kondie,considering Israel fired over 66,000 bombs and shells into Gaza a year ago,creating 2000 deaths and continued trauma for Palestinian children inparticular..................your logic is somewhat skewed.

steve

 

[theliq]

P F Tinmore, ForeverYoung436, et al,

Yes, the Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) is a both an Islamic Organization by Charter, and a Political Party (headed by: Khaled Meshal, Chairman, Politburo of the Islamic Resistance Movement) and the hub of a larger terrorist organization that uses violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; the removal of the State of Israel. HAMAS is political, but we cannot forget that it has its own paramilitary wing called the Izz al Din Qassam Brigades (AQB) that is directed, funded and equipped by HAMAS; which has been responsible for most of the violence directed towards Israel.

Hamas is "only" a political party? Do you see Republicans in the U.S. shooting rockets? Democrats building tunnels?

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

(KEY COMPONENTS)

First, the January 2006 Palestinian Parliamentary Elections, that brought HAMAS to the forefront, is now well over eight (8) years old. Whatever mandate the elections gave HAMAS eight years ago, has long since expired. The Palestinian Government has not been able to make a smooth Constitutional transition of government since the Constitution was written over a decade ago. Since the 1993 Oslo Accords, which created the Palestinian National Authority (PNA), the PNA acted as the interim administrative body established to administer the governmental institutions necessary for the West Bank. In 2012, the PNA essentially became the government for the State of Palestine when the UN decided to "accord to Palestine non-member observer State status in the United Nations, without prejudice to the acquired rights, privileges and role of the Palestine Liberation Organization in the United Nations as the representative of the Palestinian people," (A/RES/67/19 4 December 2012).

The trouble here is that HAMAS (a Palestinian Islamic organization) has rejected two key elements that have survived for three decades in Palestine:

• HAMAS rejects the PLO (secular) as the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinians,
  • Seventh Arab League Summit Conference Resolution on Palestine Rabat, Morocco 28 October 1974
  • Having heard the statement of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the representative of the Palestinian people, A/RES/3236 (XXIX) 22 November 1974
  • ANNEX II Political Communiqué and ANNEX III Palestinian Declaration of Independence
• HAMAS rejects the Oslo Accords.
  • Oslo I Declaration of Principles on Interim Self-Government Arrangements
  • Oslo II Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip

HAMAS has a mantra ---- besides that of Jihad ---- in both the Covenant and its official Political Position:

• No recognition of the legitimacy of the Israeli occupation
• No recognition of "Israel"
  • Israel-PLO Recognition: Exchange of Letters between PM Rabin and Chairman Arafat - In connection with the Oslo Accords
• No legitimacy of Israel's presence in any part of Palestine from the river to the sea, and from north to south
  • A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 UN Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations

HAMAS is becoming a regional threat. In addition to HAMAS insisting it is Entitled To Attack Israel's Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide – It also claims it has the right to attack The Interests Of Israel's Allies; as well as the US.

(COMMENT)

HAMAS is not just a political party. It is a regional danger; not just by itself --- but by the bad pennies it attracts. HAMAS and the Gaza Strip have developed an attraction for DAESH (Islamic State or Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) that is attempting to establish itself on the Egyptian/Sinai Border region of the Gaza Strip and Israel.

It is rumored that a video, produced DAESH in the last week of June, is now making the rounds in the region. It is directed at the Palestinians (HAMAS and Fatah). The DAESH Jihadist accuses HAMAS of being soft in enforcing religious law in the Palestinian enclave it controls.

“We will uproot the state of the Jews [Israel] and you [Hamas] and Fatah [in the West Bank], and all of the secularists are nothing and you will be overrun by our creeping multitudes,” a masked Islamic State member said in the recorded message addressed to the “tyrants of Hamas.”

“The rule of Sharia [Islamic law] will be implemented in Gaza, in spite of you. We swear that what is happening in the Levant today, and in particular the Yarmouk camp [in Syria], will happen in Gaza,” he said, in reference to the besieged Palestinian refugee camp near Damascus.
SOURCE: Islamic State militant was booted from Hamas
SOURCE: Daesh threatens to overthrow Hamas in Gaza
SOURCE: ISIS Threatens To Topple Hamas In Gaza
​

HAMAS and Fatah may have more to worry about then its feud with Israel. If DAESH gets a firm foothold in the Gaza Strip from the Sinai --- it will probably cause Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt to get involved; inadvertently expanding the conflict.

YES, HAMAS is much much more than just an irritant politically.

Most Respectfully,
R

Hamas is not corrupt. It will defend its people. It will not give away the store.

You can't say any of that about Fatah.

Hamas is not corrupt.. - Just a legitimate dictatorship.
What with all the "Will" - how do you know Hamas "will" defend its people, when so far they didn't? only thing they strive for - and you the one supporting it should know out of everyone else - is WAR AGAINST ISRAEL'S JEWS - not even protecting "ITS" people including Hamas members.

We have seen Tinmore stick up for Hamas constantly so should we be surprised that even though Tinmore supposedly lives in the U.S. he was allowed to vote for Hamas?

Not so quick Hoss,considering it was the US and Israel that supported,armed and gave cash for the inception of Hamas in the first place...then demanded FREE AND FAIR,OPEN ELECTIONS of which Hamas was voted in,in Gaza.........your crocodile tears today seem somewhat Hypocritical don't you think ??? steve

 

[Hossfly]

P F Tinmore, ForeverYoung436, et al,

Yes, the Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) is a both an Islamic Organization by Charter, and a Political Party (headed by: Khaled Meshal, Chairman, Politburo of the Islamic Resistance Movement) and the hub of a larger terrorist organization that uses violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; the removal of the State of Israel. HAMAS is political, but we cannot forget that it has its own paramilitary wing called the Izz al Din Qassam Brigades (AQB) that is directed, funded and equipped by HAMAS; which has been responsible for most of the violence directed towards Israel.

Hamas is "only" a political party? Do you see Republicans in the U.S. shooting rockets? Democrats building tunnels?

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

(KEY COMPONENTS)

First, the January 2006 Palestinian Parliamentary Elections, that brought HAMAS to the forefront, is now well over eight (8) years old. Whatever mandate the elections gave HAMAS eight years ago, has long since expired. The Palestinian Government has not been able to make a smooth Constitutional transition of government since the Constitution was written over a decade ago. Since the 1993 Oslo Accords, which created the Palestinian National Authority (PNA), the PNA acted as the interim administrative body established to administer the governmental institutions necessary for the West Bank. In 2012, the PNA essentially became the government for the State of Palestine when the UN decided to "accord to Palestine non-member observer State status in the United Nations, without prejudice to the acquired rights, privileges and role of the Palestine Liberation Organization in the United Nations as the representative of the Palestinian people," (A/RES/67/19 4 December 2012).

The trouble here is that HAMAS (a Palestinian Islamic organization) has rejected two key elements that have survived for three decades in Palestine:

• HAMAS rejects the PLO (secular) as the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinians,
  • Seventh Arab League Summit Conference Resolution on Palestine Rabat, Morocco 28 October 1974
  • Having heard the statement of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the representative of the Palestinian people, A/RES/3236 (XXIX) 22 November 1974
  • ANNEX II Political Communiqué and ANNEX III Palestinian Declaration of Independence
• HAMAS rejects the Oslo Accords.
  • Oslo I Declaration of Principles on Interim Self-Government Arrangements
  • Oslo II Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip

HAMAS has a mantra ---- besides that of Jihad ---- in both the Covenant and its official Political Position:

• No recognition of the legitimacy of the Israeli occupation
• No recognition of "Israel"
  • Israel-PLO Recognition: Exchange of Letters between PM Rabin and Chairman Arafat - In connection with the Oslo Accords
• No legitimacy of Israel's presence in any part of Palestine from the river to the sea, and from north to south
  • A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 UN Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations

HAMAS is becoming a regional threat. In addition to HAMAS insisting it is Entitled To Attack Israel's Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide – It also claims it has the right to attack The Interests Of Israel's Allies; as well as the US.

(COMMENT)

HAMAS is not just a political party. It is a regional danger; not just by itself --- but by the bad pennies it attracts. HAMAS and the Gaza Strip have developed an attraction for DAESH (Islamic State or Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) that is attempting to establish itself on the Egyptian/Sinai Border region of the Gaza Strip and Israel.

It is rumored that a video, produced DAESH in the last week of June, is now making the rounds in the region. It is directed at the Palestinians (HAMAS and Fatah). The DAESH Jihadist accuses HAMAS of being soft in enforcing religious law in the Palestinian enclave it controls.

“We will uproot the state of the Jews [Israel] and you [Hamas] and Fatah [in the West Bank], and all of the secularists are nothing and you will be overrun by our creeping multitudes,” a masked Islamic State member said in the recorded message addressed to the “tyrants of Hamas.”

“The rule of Sharia [Islamic law] will be implemented in Gaza, in spite of you. We swear that what is happening in the Levant today, and in particular the Yarmouk camp [in Syria], will happen in Gaza,” he said, in reference to the besieged Palestinian refugee camp near Damascus.
SOURCE: Islamic State militant was booted from Hamas
SOURCE: Daesh threatens to overthrow Hamas in Gaza
SOURCE: ISIS Threatens To Topple Hamas In Gaza
​

HAMAS and Fatah may have more to worry about then its feud with Israel. If DAESH gets a firm foothold in the Gaza Strip from the Sinai --- it will probably cause Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt to get involved; inadvertently expanding the conflict.

YES, HAMAS is much much more than just an irritant politically.

Most Respectfully,
R

Hamas is not corrupt. It will defend its people. It will not give away the store.

You can't say any of that about Fatah.

Hamas is not corrupt.. - Just a legitimate dictatorship.
What with all the "Will" - how do you know Hamas "will" defend its people, when so far they didn't? only thing they strive for - and you the one supporting it should know out of everyone else - is WAR AGAINST ISRAEL'S JEWS - not even protecting "ITS" people including Hamas members.

We have seen Tinmore stick up for Hamas constantly so should we be surprised that even though Tinmore supposedly lives in the U.S. he was allowed to vote for Hamas?

Not so quick Hoss,considering it was the US and Israel that supported,armed and gave cash for the inception of Hamas in the first place...then demanded FREE AND FAIR,OPEN ELECTIONS of which Hamas was voted in,in Gaza.........your crocodile tears today seem somewhat Hypocritical don't you think ??? steve

B-b-b-but Hamas is now a terrorist organization. Haven't you heard?

 

[flacaltenn]

P F Tinmore, ForeverYoung436, et al,

Yes, the Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) is a both an Islamic Organization by Charter, and a Political Party (headed by: Khaled Meshal, Chairman, Politburo of the Islamic Resistance Movement) and the hub of a larger terrorist organization that uses violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims; the removal of the State of Israel. HAMAS is political, but we cannot forget that it has its own paramilitary wing called the Izz al Din Qassam Brigades (AQB) that is directed, funded and equipped by HAMAS; which has been responsible for most of the violence directed towards Israel.

Hamas is "only" a political party? Do you see Republicans in the U.S. shooting rockets? Democrats building tunnels?

In Palestine, where Hamas was elected, Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party.

They are only terrorists to Israel and their name calling lackeys in the west.

(KEY COMPONENTS)

First, the January 2006 Palestinian Parliamentary Elections, that brought HAMAS to the forefront, is now well over eight (8) years old. Whatever mandate the elections gave HAMAS eight years ago, has long since expired. The Palestinian Government has not been able to make a smooth Constitutional transition of government since the Constitution was written over a decade ago. Since the 1993 Oslo Accords, which created the Palestinian National Authority (PNA), the PNA acted as the interim administrative body established to administer the governmental institutions necessary for the West Bank. In 2012, the PNA essentially became the government for the State of Palestine when the UN decided to "accord to Palestine non-member observer State status in the United Nations, without prejudice to the acquired rights, privileges and role of the Palestine Liberation Organization in the United Nations as the representative of the Palestinian people," (A/RES/67/19 4 December 2012).

The trouble here is that HAMAS (a Palestinian Islamic organization) has rejected two key elements that have survived for three decades in Palestine:

• HAMAS rejects the PLO (secular) as the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinians,
  • Seventh Arab League Summit Conference Resolution on Palestine Rabat, Morocco 28 October 1974
  • Having heard the statement of the Palestine Liberation Organization, the representative of the Palestinian people, A/RES/3236 (XXIX) 22 November 1974
  • ANNEX II Political Communiqué and ANNEX III Palestinian Declaration of Independence
• HAMAS rejects the Oslo Accords.
  • Oslo I Declaration of Principles on Interim Self-Government Arrangements
  • Oslo II Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement on the West Bank and the Gaza Strip

HAMAS has a mantra ---- besides that of Jihad ---- in both the Covenant and its official Political Position:

• No recognition of the legitimacy of the Israeli occupation
• No recognition of "Israel"
  • Israel-PLO Recognition: Exchange of Letters between PM Rabin and Chairman Arafat - In connection with the Oslo Accords
• No legitimacy of Israel's presence in any part of Palestine from the river to the sea, and from north to south
  • A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 UN Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations

HAMAS is becoming a regional threat. In addition to HAMAS insisting it is Entitled To Attack Israel's Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide – It also claims it has the right to attack The Interests Of Israel's Allies; as well as the US.

(COMMENT)

HAMAS is not just a political party. It is a regional danger; not just by itself --- but by the bad pennies it attracts. HAMAS and the Gaza Strip have developed an attraction for DAESH (Islamic State or Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) that is attempting to establish itself on the Egyptian/Sinai Border region of the Gaza Strip and Israel.

It is rumored that a video, produced DAESH in the last week of June, is now making the rounds in the region. It is directed at the Palestinians (HAMAS and Fatah). The DAESH Jihadist accuses HAMAS of being soft in enforcing religious law in the Palestinian enclave it controls.

“We will uproot the state of the Jews [Israel] and you [Hamas] and Fatah [in the West Bank], and all of the secularists are nothing and you will be overrun by our creeping multitudes,” a masked Islamic State member said in the recorded message addressed to the “tyrants of Hamas.”

“The rule of Sharia [Islamic law] will be implemented in Gaza, in spite of you. We swear that what is happening in the Levant today, and in particular the Yarmouk camp [in Syria], will happen in Gaza,” he said, in reference to the besieged Palestinian refugee camp near Damascus.
SOURCE: Islamic State militant was booted from Hamas
SOURCE: Daesh threatens to overthrow Hamas in Gaza
SOURCE: ISIS Threatens To Topple Hamas In Gaza
​

HAMAS and Fatah may have more to worry about then its feud with Israel. If DAESH gets a firm foothold in the Gaza Strip from the Sinai --- it will probably cause Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt to get involved; inadvertently expanding the conflict.

YES, HAMAS is much much more than just an irritant politically.

Most Respectfully,
R

Hamas is not corrupt. It will defend its people. It will not give away the store.

You can't say any of that about Fatah.

Hamas is not corrupt.. - Just a legitimate dictatorship.
What with all the "Will" - how do you know Hamas "will" defend its people, when so far they didn't? only thing they strive for - and you the one supporting it should know out of everyone else - is WAR AGAINST ISRAEL'S JEWS - not even protecting "ITS" people including Hamas members.

We have seen Tinmore stick up for Hamas constantly so should we be surprised that even though Tinmore supposedly lives in the U.S. he was allowed to vote for Hamas?

Not so quick Hoss,considering it was the US and Israel that supported,armed and gave cash for the inception of Hamas in the first place...then demanded FREE AND FAIR,OPEN ELECTIONS of which Hamas was voted in,in Gaza.........your crocodile tears today seem somewhat Hypocritical don't you think ??? steve

When did the US "support, arm and give cash" to Hamas? Or Israel for that matter?
Hamas was voted into GAZA, split the functional govt of the Palestinians and left them (after a bloody political fight) with no more elections, no more chance to become a nation, and no chance at handling open international commerce on their own (which is what this thread is about).

Hamas is the principal reason why there are no open Seaports or Airports in Gaza. That's why there's no propaganda value in these "humanitarian flotillas".. Did you READ the Hamas "political platform" that PF posted? Think THAT represents the best chance for the Palestinians to become an independent nation or have a decent standard of living? Where are THOSE things in the values that Hamas represents.??

All this whining about being isolated barricaded, and confined are because there is NO political organization of the Palestinians after Hamas moved in..

 

[Kondor3]

...Hamas ...will defend its people...

Some defense...

...It will not give away the store...

Don't look now, but there is no store left to give away...

...You can't say any of that about Fatah.

True.

What they can say is that Fatah did not bring about the ruin of Gaza... Hamas did.

What!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!So Israel had NO PART IN THIS DESTRUCTION,I ????? your morality Kondie,considering Israel fired over 66,000 bombs and shells into Gaza a year ago,creating 2000 deaths and continued trauma for Palestinian children inparticular..................your logic is somewhat skewed.

steve

Don't make war on Israel, and Israel will not make war on you.

Don't dig commando-sortie tunnels underneath the Gaza-Israel border and the IDF won't bomb them into a collapse.

Don't fire rockets at Israeli civilian population centers and the IDF won't bomb those launchers.

Don't embed your war assets (launchers, command centers, barracks, sally-ports, munitions caches, etc.) within residential neighborhoods and in mosques and hospitals and schools, and don't hide behind the skirts of your women and children, and the IDF won't bomb those assets and cause substantive collateral casualties and damage.

These were all threats to Israeli security that Hamas intentionally served up.

Gazans have no one to blame but themselves for voting into power a cowardly terrorist organization sworn to (and taking actions to) attack and destroy Israel.

Don't want to see your friends and neighbors and family killed?

Don't vote for idiots (Hamas) who are going to create the conditions by which that becomes inevitable.