The gun used yesterday...was California compliant, it was likely and SKS

[2aguy]

Lyudmila Pavlichenko was one of the Soviet Union's top WWII snipers with 309 confirmed kills against the German invaders. Her weapon of choice was the "California compliant" bolt-action Mosin-Nagant which held 5 rounds in an internal magazine. No doubt the anti-gun mob wants to ban this "weapon of war" and anything like it.

So by the logic of gun nuts, that we needs our guns in case the gummit is tyrannical, would be kind of debunked by Ms. Pavlichenko. She had a gun, she lived under one of the worst dictators in history.

She was part of the government...moron.

 

[bodecea]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

Did he buy it in CA? Did he use it in CA?

Unless it has a bayonet on it, an SKS would be legal in California. OTOH, if he's been convicted of domestic violence or adjudicated to have mental health issues, he wouldn't be legal to buy a gun.

Ok, but I'm curious as to the California connection in this case......what is it?

 

[bodecea]

Lyudmila Pavlichenko was one of the Soviet Union's top WWII snipers with 309 confirmed kills against the German invaders. Her weapon of choice was the "California compliant" bolt-action Mosin-Nagant which held 5 rounds in an internal magazine. No doubt the anti-gun mob wants to ban this "weapon of war" and anything like it.

So by the logic of gun nuts, that we needs our guns in case the gummit is tyrannical, would be kind of debunked by Ms. Pavlichenko. She had a gun, she lived under one of the worst dictators in history.

She was part of the government...moron.

She was in the military.....as Timothy McVeigh was at one time.

 

[2aguy]

Actually, since violence is down, the laws are working. Instead of passing more anti-gun laws, why don't we focus upon better mental health care?

No, they aren't.

Violence is down because we are getting older as a country. 40 year olds don't commit violence like 20 year olds do.

we still have a horrific number of gun deaths every year, and when it is investigated, we usually find it's a guy who had no business owning a gun to start with.

No, violence is down because over 15.7 million people are now carrying guns for self defense, and we have over 400 million guns in private hands....and our gun crime rate is down 75%...our gun murder rate is down 42%....and our violent crime rate is down 72%....

 

[2aguy]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

If gun laws are useless, why didn;t that shooter have a silencer on his guns? He could have killed many more if nobody heard his shots. Why aren't silencers used by all bad guys?

He didn't care about his hearing loss.......he planned on dying....

 

[2aguy]

Fuck you no civilian should own one, who are you to judge that? Now one with 3 domestic violence arrests..eh.

Were there any convictions?

Why should that matter? I mean, yeah, I guess if an investigation found he didn't do what he was accused of, you might have a point. But in these cases, it's because the women he beat didn't want to press charges and send him to prison.

It STILL should have been enough to block him from gun ownership.

Agreed about domestic violence and mental illness. Since those are already against the law, how did he get the guns?

As for banning private ownership of all semi-automatic rifles, I disagree.

Okay, laws that don't get enforced are kind of meaningless, and when the NRA isn't blocking gun laws, they are doing a pretty good job of watering down enforcement.

Again, you can't sell guns to people if they aren't scared.

Yes. We all know that most domestic abuse isn't reported because the law favors the abuser.

If she dares to press charges, he will beat her even more.

I speak from experience and when I escaped from AZ, it was without any help from law enforcement. In fact, they made it very clear that if I got beat up, it was because I caused it. He's still at it with wife #4 and still has no official history. IOW, he could legally buy a gun.

What's wrong with this picture?


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

Yeah...in the 1960s dumb ass......

 

[2aguy]

Two mass shootings, several deaths and sure nuff, the usual suspects are fantasizing about how to make sure there will be more shootings and more deaths.


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

No...that would be you....making more gun free zones...

 

[2aguy]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

If gun laws are useless, why didn;t that shooter have a silencer on his guns? He could have killed many more if nobody heard his shots. Why aren't silencers used by all bad guys?

This LW shooter was such an idiot, he's lucky not to have shot himself much less think far-enough ahead to have practiced shooting and/or putting a silencer on his rifle.

You're probably right, but that doesn't answer the question. Why don't thugs use silencers? You know they would hide where the shots come from.

They often do...they make them or they steal them.

 

[2aguy]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

Did he buy it in CA? Did he use it in CA?

Nope....just making the point that the rifle....if it is an SKS would even be legal in extreme gun controlled California with their assault weapon ban....

 

[Mudda]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....

so let me get this straight.

A mentally ill man with at least three arrests for domestic violence was still able to acquire a military grade weapon, which he used to shoot a Congressman who has spent his career doing the bidding of the National Rampage Association.

Yeah, i can see why you are worried. These scumbags won't come up with laws to protect schoolchildren from these nuts, but they damned well will protect themselves.

Yeah. It seems your laws barring people like him from owning guns are highly noneffective.

But more laws would change that...right?

Dumbass.

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

 

[2aguy]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....

so let me get this straight.

A mentally ill man with at least three arrests for domestic violence was still able to acquire a military grade weapon, which he used to shoot a Congressman who has spent his career doing the bidding of the National Rampage Association.

Yeah, i can see why you are worried. These scumbags won't come up with laws to protect schoolchildren from these nuts, but they damned well will protect themselves.

Yeah. It seems your laws barring people like him from owning guns are highly noneffective.

But more laws would change that...right?

Dumbass.

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

You can't.....law abiding people are not committing these crimes...criminals get their guns illegally since the law already says they can't buy, own or carry them.

Other countries can't do it....Britain has seen increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Australia, increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Japan....yakuza use guns when they want or need them, the other Japanese obey authorities and they have a police state.

Rifles like this are banned in France....criminals get them easily, as do terrorists on government watch lists who are also convicted criminals...

Besides....you are addressing a problem we don't have with our laws.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[Mudda]

so let me get this straight.

A mentally ill man with at least three arrests for domestic violence was still able to acquire a military grade weapon, which he used to shoot a Congressman who has spent his career doing the bidding of the National Rampage Association.

Yeah, i can see why you are worried. These scumbags won't come up with laws to protect schoolchildren from these nuts, but they damned well will protect themselves.

Yeah. It seems your laws barring people like him from owning guns are highly noneffective.

But more laws would change that...right?

Dumbass.

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

You can't.....law abiding people are not committing these crimes...criminals get their guns illegally since the law already says they can't buy, own or carry them.

Other countries can't do it....Britain has seen increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Australia, increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Japan....yakuza use guns when they want or need them, the other Japanese obey authorities and they have a police state.

Rifles like this are banned in France....criminals get them easily, as do terrorists on government watch lists who are also convicted criminals...

Besides....you are addressing a problem we don't have with our laws.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

So to you, a country totally armed is a safe place.

Just one question: where do you think the criminals are getting their illegal guns from?

 

[BULLDOG]

You're probably right, but that doesn't answer the question. Why don't thugs use silencers? You know they would hide where the shots come from.

My guess is twofold: Most thugs are idiots and silencers are expensive, even without paying for all the legal stuff.

The claim is that legal stuff doesn't matter to bad guys anyway. They aren't expensive or hard to make yourself either. If the fact that they are illegal doesn't matter, why aren't all bad guys using silencers?

They may not be mechanically inclined or smart, even.

Still bullshit. If they were available, they would have them. They aren't available because they are against the law.

Oh, but they're not.

You may have to jump through a hoop, but they're not illegal.

Then that should make it easier for bad guys to get silencers, since they don't care about laws anyway. I wonder why they don't.

 

[Divine Wind]

Yeah. It seems your laws barring people like him from owning guns are highly noneffective.

But more laws would change that...right?

Dumbass.

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

Actually, since violence is down, the laws are working. Instead of passing more anti-gun laws, why don't we focus upon better mental health care?

Better health care won't solve the gun problem, it's called deflecting.

What gun problem? Guns are no more a problem than shovels or automobiles. Well over half of the "33,000 gun deaths" the anti-gun left loves to screech about are suicides. Are you seriously going to stand by your statement that better mental health care won't help fix that problem?

The US isn't the only place where mental illness occurs. Why aren't the mentally in other countries killing others?


Sent from my iPad using USMessageBoard.com

They are. They're also committing suicide.

Suicide Rates By Country
Rank Country Suicides per 100,000 People (Source: WHO, 2015)
1 Sri Lanka 34.6
2 Guyana 30.6
3 Mongolia 28.1
4 Kazakhstan 27.5
5 Cote d'Ivoire 27.2
6 Suriname 26.9
7 Equatorial Guinea 26.6
8 Lithuania 26.1
9 Angola 25.9
10 South Korea 24.1
11 Sierra Leone 22.1
12 Bolivia 20.5
13 Central African Republic 19.6
14 Belarus 19.1
15 Poland 18.5
16 Zimbabwe 18.0
17 Russia 17.9
18 Swaziland 17.9
19 Cameroon 17.5
20 Latvia 17.4
21 Ukraine 16.6
22 Burkina Faso 16.5
23 Belgium 16.1
24 India 16.0
25 Hungary 15.7

 

[Divine Wind]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

If gun laws are useless, why didn;t that shooter have a silencer on his guns? He could have killed many more if nobody heard his shots. Why aren't silencers used by all bad guys?

This LW shooter was such an idiot, he's lucky not to have shot himself much less think far-enough ahead to have practiced shooting and/or putting a silencer on his rifle.

You're probably right, but that doesn't answer the question. Why don't thugs use silencers? You know they would hide where the shots come from.

My guess is twofold: Most thugs are idiots and silencers are expensive, even without paying for all the legal stuff.

The claim is that legal stuff doesn't matter to bad guys anyway. They aren't expensive or hard to make yourself either. If the fact that they are illegal doesn't matter, why aren't all bad guys using silencers?

"Most thugs are idiots".

 

[airplanemechanic]

There are reports that the shooter used an SKS...an old, Russian rifle that would be California compliant...still waiting for more information....


BREAKING: Congress Baseball Shooter Used SKS, 9mm Handgun - The Truth About Guns

Original reports coming out of the shooting of GOP congress members at a Virginia baseball field reported that the attacker used a firearm “similar to an M4” in the attack. Reports are now emerging (confirmed by multiple sources) that the firearm in use was actually an SKS and a 9mm handgun.

The SKS is a semi-automatic rifle which pre-dates the AK-47 by about four years as a potential battle rifle for the Soviet Red Army. Designed as a top loading stripper clip fed gas operated rifle, the gun has since often been modified to use detachable magazines as well. SKS firearms imported into the United States are predominantly Yugoslavian manufactured, and while Russian and Chinese models are available they remain rare and sought after by collectors. That makes CNN’s statement about the SKS (“a Chinese-made variant of the popular AK rifle”) almost entirely incorrect.

If gun laws are useless, why didn;t that shooter have a silencer on his guns? He could have killed many more if nobody heard his shots. Why aren't silencers used by all bad guys?

Silencers do negligible good on a rifle with a 3000fps bullet speed. While they may silence the "boom" to a small degree, they won't silence the "crack" of the bullet breaking the speed of sound, so they aren't much good without subsonic ammo. However, combine a gun like the MP5 with subsonic ammo and a silencer and you have a deadly weapon that makes no more than a "tick tick" sound when fired.

Have you guys googled "AK" wounds? they are massive. He was shot in the hip. I can promise this man has a massive wound and may never walk right again. These bullets don't make neat holes, they blow off chunks of meat.

 

[2aguy]

Yeah. It seems your laws barring people like him from owning guns are highly noneffective.

But more laws would change that...right?

Dumbass.

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

You can't.....law abiding people are not committing these crimes...criminals get their guns illegally since the law already says they can't buy, own or carry them.

Other countries can't do it....Britain has seen increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Australia, increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Japan....yakuza use guns when they want or need them, the other Japanese obey authorities and they have a police state.

Rifles like this are banned in France....criminals get them easily, as do terrorists on government watch lists who are also convicted criminals...

Besides....you are addressing a problem we don't have with our laws.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

So to you, a country totally armed is a safe place.

Just one question: where do you think the criminals are getting their illegal guns from?

Yes......just ask the people of Mexico......the government only allows the rich and connected to own guns...the Mexican military owns the only gun store in the country.....and the Mexican military and police, working for the Mexican drug cartels, murder 10s of thousands of Mexican Citizens every year...right along our border....where Americans own more guns...but have less to worry about when it comes to murder....

Germany......disarmed their people in the 1920s....and the records used to register guns...those that remained...were used by the national socialists to disarm Jews and their political enemies....

As more Americans own guns and carry them...our crime rate has gone down, not up....as my link to you showed.....

guns are not the problem.....how we sentence repeat gun offenders is the actual problem.....since the average sentence for a repeat gun offender here in Chicago is less than 3 years...and then they get out, get another illegal gun, and commit murder.

The criminals get their guns from family members who can pass all of the current and future gun laws......they also get them by breaking into homes and cars...cars, because so many places are gun free zones, law abiding people have to keep their concealed carry guns in their cars when they go into various places......

The way Japan stopped most of the Yakuza, not all, and not during their gang wars.....from using guns....long prison sentences to the point they would be old men before they got out...where before they could use a gun, do several years, get out, and get a bump up for being seasoned criminals...now, the bosses tell the press that the long sentences are essentially a life sentence ....

 

[Divine Wind]

And here I thought he had an AR.

Boy I sure wish I would have gotten those Chinese SKSs when they were going for $115 and my friend was trying to talk me into it. I was like "oh screw those Chinese things, I got my guns" Doh!

ARs are more accurate. though.

maybe. but you'll spend an evening cleaning one when done vs. an AK. i also can drag an AK around in the muck and count on it. not so much with an AR. both are great guns for their intended purpose and design, it's just preference after that.

i don't like all the parts you have to know how to use and clean in an AR so i got my AK and am done with it.

No maybe about it. I can't say about a Kalashnikov, but with an SKS after 5-6 shots the pattern opens up to double or more what is was with cold barrel.

in the end i'd never say the AK was a better rifle than the AR - i just prefer it for as little as i actually use either.

"Better" is a relative term. You already mentioned one area where the AK is "better" than the AR: reliability in the field. Yes, the AR is more accurate and has a slightly longer effective range, but at 200 yards, does it really matter if you shoot someone with tighter groups?

AR vs. AK: Can't We All Just Get Along? - The Truth About Guns

 

[Mudda]

Can we agree that the laws on the books right now aren't working and that something should be done?

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

You can't.....law abiding people are not committing these crimes...criminals get their guns illegally since the law already says they can't buy, own or carry them.

Other countries can't do it....Britain has seen increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Australia, increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Japan....yakuza use guns when they want or need them, the other Japanese obey authorities and they have a police state.

Rifles like this are banned in France....criminals get them easily, as do terrorists on government watch lists who are also convicted criminals...

Besides....you are addressing a problem we don't have with our laws.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

So to you, a country totally armed is a safe place.

Just one question: where do you think the criminals are getting their illegal guns from?

Yes......just ask the people of Mexico......the government only allows the rich and connected to own guns...the Mexican military owns the only gun store in the country.....and the Mexican military and police, working for the Mexican drug cartels, murder 10s of thousands of Mexican Citizens every year...right along our border....where Americans own more guns...but have less to worry about when it comes to murder....

Germany......disarmed their people in the 1920s....and the records used to register guns...those that remained...were used by the national socialists to disarm Jews and their political enemies....

As more Americans own guns and carry them...our crime rate has gone down, not up....as my link to you showed.....

guns are not the problem.....how we sentence repeat gun offenders is the actual problem.....since the average sentence for a repeat gun offender here in Chicago is less than 3 years...and then they get out, get another illegal gun, and commit murder.

The criminals get their guns from family members who can pass all of the current and future gun laws......they also get them by breaking into homes and cars...cars, because so many places are gun free zones, law abiding people have to keep their concealed carry guns in their cars when they go into various places......

The way Japan stopped most of the Yakuza, not all, and not during their gang wars.....from using guns....long prison sentences to the point they would be old men before they got out...where before they could use a gun, do several years, get out, and get a bump up for being seasoned criminals...now, the bosses tell the press that the long sentences are essentially a life sentence ....

So you don't know where criminals get their guns? I'll tell you, from legal gun manufacturers. The process by which they obtain them is what's the problem.

 

[2aguy]

No....the laws we have are fine....the judicial system is the weakness...they do not put gun criminals in jail for 30 years....

That still doesn't stop the violence, it's an after-the-fact thing you're talking about. I'm for finding ways to PREVENT stuff from happening. Other countries can do it, but we can't?

You can't.....law abiding people are not committing these crimes...criminals get their guns illegally since the law already says they can't buy, own or carry them.

Other countries can't do it....Britain has seen increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Australia, increasing gun crime, they banned guns.

Japan....yakuza use guns when they want or need them, the other Japanese obey authorities and they have a police state.

Rifles like this are banned in France....criminals get them easily, as do terrorists on government watch lists who are also convicted criminals...

Besides....you are addressing a problem we don't have with our laws.....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2017...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

So to you, a country totally armed is a safe place.

Just one question: where do you think the criminals are getting their illegal guns from?

Yes......just ask the people of Mexico......the government only allows the rich and connected to own guns...the Mexican military owns the only gun store in the country.....and the Mexican military and police, working for the Mexican drug cartels, murder 10s of thousands of Mexican Citizens every year...right along our border....where Americans own more guns...but have less to worry about when it comes to murder....

Germany......disarmed their people in the 1920s....and the records used to register guns...those that remained...were used by the national socialists to disarm Jews and their political enemies....

As more Americans own guns and carry them...our crime rate has gone down, not up....as my link to you showed.....

guns are not the problem.....how we sentence repeat gun offenders is the actual problem.....since the average sentence for a repeat gun offender here in Chicago is less than 3 years...and then they get out, get another illegal gun, and commit murder.

The criminals get their guns from family members who can pass all of the current and future gun laws......they also get them by breaking into homes and cars...cars, because so many places are gun free zones, law abiding people have to keep their concealed carry guns in their cars when they go into various places......

The way Japan stopped most of the Yakuza, not all, and not during their gang wars.....from using guns....long prison sentences to the point they would be old men before they got out...where before they could use a gun, do several years, get out, and get a bump up for being seasoned criminals...now, the bosses tell the press that the long sentences are essentially a life sentence ....

So you don't know where criminals get their guns? I'll tell you, from legal gun manufacturers. The process by which they obtain them is what's the problem.

I just told you where they get them from...in detail......

Since you don't read my posts...here it is again...

The criminals get their guns from family members who can pass all of the current and future gun laws......they also get them by breaking into homes and cars...cars, because so many places are gun free zones, law abiding people have to keep their concealed carry guns in their cars when they go into various places......