The Gravest Threat to World Peace

[RoccoR]

Hossfly,

Lighten up.

to be a yellow-bellied coward

(COMMENT)

This is uncalled-fore.

We may not always agree --- but such emotional outburst and prejudices don't lend credibility to your position. The discussion group is suppose to promote the ability to think and express ideas in a mature way. We're not suppose to openly direct slander and fallacious insults against a fellow member; but rather, submit coherent challenges against his arguments (if we disagree).

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Hossfly]

Hossfly,

Lighten up.

to be a yellow-bellied coward

(COMMENT)

This is uncalled-fore.

We may not always agree --- but such emotional outburst and prejudices don't lend credibility to your position. The discussion group is suppose to promote the ability to think and express ideas in a mature way. We're not suppose to openly direct slander and fallacious insults against a fellow member; but rather, submit coherent challenges against his arguments (if we disagree).

Most Respectfully,
R

That was about as coherent as one can get.

 

[georgephillip]

Well it sure looks like you are reaping what you have sown. Look at you, living in a small subsidized one-room apartment helped by the taxpayers of Los Angeles instead of attempting to better yourself when you were younger and probably living a hand to mouth existence right now. There were trade-tech schools, occupational centers, and community colleges that you could have made the effort to go to, but you felt it much better not to do these things so that you could depend on others in later years and then sit back and whine about something or other.

There has been no shortage of mistakes in my life.
Killing and raping innocent human beings are not among them.
Your taxpayer-subsidized retirement required you to commit war crimes.
Mind didn't.
Go whine to Rush.

Yes, it must be nice to be a yellow-bellied coward who would not even defend an enemy attacking our shores. Why not get yourself a part-time job, Georgie, to earn a couple of bucks so that life will be more enjoyable for you. I think Georgie Boy resents the fact that people who have dedicated 20 years or more to the service of our country actually get a pension and then goes out after this service and gets a job to earn money for a decent retirement. So tell us, Gerogie Boy, why you feel entitled to have a subsidized apartment in Los Angeles mainly paid for by the taxpayers in your city who work hard to earn a living? Do you really think you deserve it?

When was the last time an enemy attacked or shores?
You made a choice to prove your "courage" by murdering human beings who posed no threat to your country.
If that's heroic, you are welcome to it.

 

[Hossfly]

There has been no shortage of mistakes in my life.
Killing and raping innocent human beings are not among them.
Your taxpayer-subsidized retirement required you to commit war crimes.
Mind didn't.
Go whine to Rush.

Yes, it must be nice to be a yellow-bellied coward who would not even defend an enemy attacking our shores. Why not get yourself a part-time job, Georgie, to earn a couple of bucks so that life will be more enjoyable for you. I think Georgie Boy resents the fact that people who have dedicated 20 years or more to the service of our country actually get a pension and then goes out after this service and gets a job to earn money for a decent retirement. So tell us, Gerogie Boy, why you feel entitled to have a subsidized apartment in Los Angeles mainly paid for by the taxpayers in your city who work hard to earn a living? Do you really think you deserve it?

When was the last time an enemy attacked or shores?
You made a choice to prove your "courage" by murdering human beings who posed no threat to your country.
If that's heroic, you are welcome to it.

Why, Georgie Boy, instead of whining while living in a subsidized apartment, you could have at least shown your courage by joining the Los Angeles Police Departmant or Sheriff's Department, or even the Los Angeles Fire Department. I imagine you didn't want to face any danger so those careers were never thought of by you. At least those who joined up for those careers and those who joined the military knew that they stood a good chance of facing danger in their careers. Sorry if you did not have the backbone. By the way, I don't think that Rocco, who is retired military and who came to this board recently, knows that you are the one who started calling servicemen "killers." I don't think Rocco would enjoy hearing you calling him a "killer."

 

[georgephillip]

What does my Section 8 apartment have to do with your decision to help murder, maim, displace, and incarcerate millions of Vietnamese civilians? How much "backbone" does it take to rape a 9 year-old?

 

[Hossfly]

What does my Section 8 apartment have to do with your decision to help murder, maim, displace, and incarcerate millions of Vietnamese civilians? How much "backbone" does it take to rape a 9 year-old?

I guess it was easier for you to figure out that you could have others support you when you retired (like getting a subsidized apartment) rather than put forth some effort to make a better future for yourself. I imagine even a job as a dispatcher for the Police Department would have been too much for Georgie Boy. So, Georgie Boy, are you actually trying to tell us that the American military has a habit of raping nine-year olds. We leave that to your Muslim friends who seem to have no problem with that, nor do they seem to have a problem with murdering millions in the past and will continue to murder innocent people as we are seeing today. Georgie Boy seems so stuck on the Viet Nam War like a silly robot with the same tape stuck in him which he sat out and probably ran to Canada rather than serve while he turns a blind eye to what his friends are doing in the world of today. I think most people can figure out that Georgie Boy was a loser in life and so he has to find something to blame on others. However, keep on spewing out about the Viet Nam War, Georgie Boy, if this is the way you get your jollies. Meanwhile, you apparently will never be able to say "laissez les bons temps rouler" while sitting out in your one-room apartment in the Pico-Union area of Los Angeles.

 

[P F Tinmore]

What does my Section 8 apartment have to do with your decision to help murder, maim, displace, and incarcerate millions of Vietnamese civilians? How much "backbone" does it take to rape a 9 year-old?

Uuuhh, deflection.

 

[georgephillip]

What does my Section 8 apartment have to do with your decision to help murder, maim, displace, and incarcerate millions of Vietnamese civilians? How much "backbone" does it take to rape a 9 year-old?

I guess it was easier for you to figure out that you could have others support you when you retired (like getting a subsidized apartment) rather than put forth some effort to make a better future for yourself. I imagine even a job as a dispatcher for the Police Department would have been too much for Georgie Boy. So, Georgie Boy, are you actually trying to tell us that the American military has a habit of raping nine-year olds. We leave that to your Muslim friends who seem to have no problem with that, nor do they seem to have a problem with murdering millions in the past and will continue to murder innocent people as we are seeing today. Georgie Boy seems so stuck on the Viet Nam War like a silly robot with the same tape stuck in him which he sat out and probably ran to Canada rather than serve while he turns a blind eye to what his friends are doing in the world of today. I think most people can figure out that Georgie Boy was a loser in life and so he has to find something to blame on others. However, keep on spewing out about the Viet Nam War, Georgie Boy, if this is the way you get your jollies. Meanwhile, you apparently will never be able to say "laissez les bons temps rouler" while sitting out in your one-room apartment in the Pico-Union area of Los Angeles.

You seem to be saying you've earned your taxpayer-subsidized retirement by participating in war crimes. If that's the case, you're no better than those Muslims you can never stop whining about. In fact if you had been born a Muslim in Sudan, you would probably be killing, selling, and raping Christians just as enthusiastically as some of your "brothers" did in Vietnam:

"On January 21, 1971, a Vietnam veteran named Charles McDuff wrote a letter to President Richard Nixon to voice his disgust with the American war in Southeast Asia. McDuff had witnessed multiple cases of Vietnamese civilians being abused and killed by American soldiers and their allies, and he had found the U.S. military justice system to be woefully ineffective in punishing wrongdoers.

“'Maybe your advisors have not clued you in,' he told the president, 'but the atrocities that were committed in Mylai are eclipsed by similar American actions throughout the country.'

"His three-page handwritten missive concluded with an impassioned plea to Nixon to end American participation in the war."

Not to put too fine a point on it, Hossie, you're a punk ass-***** who wouldn't know what to do in a fair fight beside whine for air support It's a damn shame you didn't come home in a bag before you could sire anymore ignorant slaves.

Remember Pat Tillman Sr's words for Rummy?

"**** you and yours."

Excerpt: Kill Anything That Moves | Book Club | BillMoyers.com

 

[Hossfly]

What does my Section 8 apartment have to do with your decision to help murder, maim, displace, and incarcerate millions of Vietnamese civilians? How much "backbone" does it take to rape a 9 year-old?

I guess it was easier for you to figure out that you could have others support you when you retired (like getting a subsidized apartment) rather than put forth some effort to make a better future for yourself. I imagine even a job as a dispatcher for the Police Department would have been too much for Georgie Boy. So, Georgie Boy, are you actually trying to tell us that the American military has a habit of raping nine-year olds. We leave that to your Muslim friends who seem to have no problem with that, nor do they seem to have a problem with murdering millions in the past and will continue to murder innocent people as we are seeing today. Georgie Boy seems so stuck on the Viet Nam War like a silly robot with the same tape stuck in him which he sat out and probably ran to Canada rather than serve while he turns a blind eye to what his friends are doing in the world of today. I think most people can figure out that Georgie Boy was a loser in life and so he has to find something to blame on others. However, keep on spewing out about the Viet Nam War, Georgie Boy, if this is the way you get your jollies. Meanwhile, you apparently will never be able to say "laissez les bons temps rouler" while sitting out in your one-room apartment in the Pico-Union area of Los Angeles.

You seem to be saying you've earned your taxpayer-subsidized retirement by participating in war crimes. If that's the case, you're no better than those Muslims you can never stop whining about. In fact if you had been born a Muslim in Sudan, you would probably be killing, selling, and raping Christians just as enthusiastically as some of your "brothers" did in Vietnam:

"On January 21, 1971, a Vietnam veteran named Charles McDuff wrote a letter to President Richard Nixon to voice his disgust with the American war in Southeast Asia. McDuff had witnessed multiple cases of Vietnamese civilians being abused and killed by American soldiers and their allies, and he had found the U.S. military justice system to be woefully ineffective in punishing wrongdoers.

“'Maybe your advisors have not clued you in,' he told the president, 'but the atrocities that were committed in Mylai are eclipsed by similar American actions throughout the country.'

"His three-page handwritten missive concluded with an impassioned plea to Nixon to end American participation in the war."

Not to put too fine a point on it, Hossie, you're a punk ass-***** who wouldn't know what to do in a fair fight beside whine for air support It's a damn shame you didn't come home in a bag before you could sire anymore ignorant slaves.

Remember Pat Tillman Sr's words for Rummy?

"**** you and yours."

Excerpt: Kill Anything That Moves | Book Club | BillMoyers.com

See, Rocco, Gerogie Boy is back to his "killers" bit again. Do you enjoy being called a "killer" because you were in the military? I guess you are not aware of this, but it was Georgie Boy who started all of this by constantly referring to me and other military as "killers."

 

[ima]

Yes, it must be nice to be a yellow-bellied coward who would not even defend an enemy attacking our shores. Why not get yourself a part-time job, Georgie, to earn a couple of bucks so that life will be more enjoyable for you. I think Georgie Boy resents the fact that people who have dedicated 20 years or more to the service of our country actually get a pension and then goes out after this service and gets a job to earn money for a decent retirement. So tell us, Gerogie Boy, why you feel entitled to have a subsidized apartment in Los Angeles mainly paid for by the taxpayers in your city who work hard to earn a living? Do you really think you deserve it?

When was the last time an enemy attacked or shores?
You made a choice to prove your "courage" by murdering human beings who posed no threat to your country.
If that's heroic, you are welcome to it.

Why, Georgie Boy, instead of whining while living in a subsidized apartment, you could have at least shown your courage by joining the Los Angeles Police Departmant or Sheriff's Department, or even the Los Angeles Fire Department. I imagine you didn't want to face any danger so those careers were never thought of by you. At least those who joined up for those careers and those who joined the military knew that they stood a good chance of facing danger in their careers. Sorry if you did not have the backbone. By the way, I don't think that Rocco, who is retired military and who came to this board recently, knows that you are the one who started calling servicemen "killers." I don't think Rocco would enjoy hearing you calling him a "killer."

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

 

[sealadaigh]

Stop being modest.
You volunteered twice to kill people who posed no threat to your country.
Hopefully you'll reap exactly what you've sown, Hero.

you really might want to check your fire there.

 

[sealadaigh]

Hossfly,

Lighten up.

to be a yellow-bellied coward

(COMMENT)

This is uncalled-fore.

We may not always agree --- but such emotional outburst and prejudices don't lend credibility to your position. The discussion group is suppose to promote the ability to think and express ideas in a mature way. We're not suppose to openly direct slander and fallacious insults against a fellow member; but rather, submit coherent challenges against his arguments (if we disagree).

Most Respectfully,
R

both of them should cut it out.

 

[sealadaigh]

When was the last time an enemy attacked or shores?
You made a choice to prove your "courage" by murdering human beings who posed no threat to your country.
If that's heroic, you are welcome to it.

Why, Georgie Boy, instead of whining while living in a subsidized apartment, you could have at least shown your courage by joining the Los Angeles Police Departmant or Sheriff's Department, or even the Los Angeles Fire Department. I imagine you didn't want to face any danger so those careers were never thought of by you. At least those who joined up for those careers and those who joined the military knew that they stood a good chance of facing danger in their careers. Sorry if you did not have the backbone. By the way, I don't think that Rocco, who is retired military and who came to this board recently, knows that you are the one who started calling servicemen "killers." I don't think Rocco would enjoy hearing you calling him a "killer."

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

my kid is the most gentle, most moral person i know. i mean, he amazes me...and i am not easily impressed. he is in the navy.

i was in the army. you have no idea what you are talking about.

man, you really are a bigot, aren't you. i made it ine in the real world.

 

[Hossfly]

When was the last time an enemy attacked or shores?
You made a choice to prove your "courage" by murdering human beings who posed no threat to your country.
If that's heroic, you are welcome to it.

Why, Georgie Boy, instead of whining while living in a subsidized apartment, you could have at least shown your courage by joining the Los Angeles Police Departmant or Sheriff's Department, or even the Los Angeles Fire Department. I imagine you didn't want to face any danger so those careers were never thought of by you. At least those who joined up for those careers and those who joined the military knew that they stood a good chance of facing danger in their careers. Sorry if you did not have the backbone. By the way, I don't think that Rocco, who is retired military and who came to this board recently, knows that you are the one who started calling servicemen "killers." I don't think Rocco would enjoy hearing you calling him a "killer."

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

Frau Ima, haven't you pulled up your bloomers yet. Of course Frau Ima would never think that people who join the service might want to do their patriotic duty for the country they love, ever since the beginning of this country. Maybe Frau Ima is disappointed that he/she can joined a Muslim country's army where he/she will have the time of his/her life killing those he/she hates. In fact, Frau Ima would have loved to be wearing those shiny jackboots, but he/she was just born too late to do so. Now he/she just wears them to the local Bund meeting. BTW I joined the Army in 1957, 55 years ago. That's hardly "these days."

 

[RoccoR]

ima, et al,

I, like a couple here, joined the military when it wasn't so popular. It is not a career path for everyone.

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

(COMMENT)

"they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone"​

I don't think the rules of engagement — directives issued by competent military authority that delineate the circumstances and limitations under which United States forces will initiate and/or continue combat engagement with other forces encountered — allow that — I don't think they ever allowed that.

Those of us who join the Armed Forces, either in times gone bye, or today, answer our nations call to duty. Congress and the Commander-inChief, say the word and we go where our nation needs us to be; to right wrongs, to liberate the oppressed, to protect those that need protected, shield that which is in the national interest, and to respond to aggression. We all follow the same basic principles everywhere we go. In addition to adhering to the principles of Military Necessity and Unnecessary Suffering (JP 1-04), we follow these two principles:

Distinction. This principle requires parties to a conflict to distinguish between combatants and noncombatants and to distinguish between military objectives and protected property and places. Parties to a conflict must direct their operations only against military objectives. Military objectives are combatants and those objects which by their nature, location, purpose, or use make an effective contribution to military action and whose total or partial destruction, capture or neutralization, in the circumstances ruling at the time, offer a definitive military advantage.

Proportionality. The principle of proportionality prohibits attacks that may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage expected to be gained. As such, this principle is only applicable when an attack may possibly affect civilians or civilian objects, and thereby, may cause collateral damage. Proportionality is a way in which a military commander must assess his or her obligations as to the principle of distinction, while avoiding actions that are indiscriminate.

Do we make mistakes? Yes, it happens. But we try to minimize those errors. Are there ever bad mistakes made? Yes, but we do our best, learning from our mistakes.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[ima]

ima, et al,

I, like a couple here, joined the military when it wasn't so popular. It is not a career path for everyone.

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

(COMMENT)

"they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone"​

I don't think the rules of engagement — directives issued by competent military authority that delineate the circumstances and limitations under which United States forces will initiate and/or continue combat engagement with other forces encountered — allow that — I don't think they ever allowed that.

Those of us who join the Armed Forces, either in times gone bye, or today, answer our nations call to duty. Congress and the Commander-inChief, say the word and we go where our nation needs us to be; to right wrongs, to liberate the oppressed, to protect those that need protected, shield that which is in the national interest, and to respond to aggression. We all follow the same basic principles everywhere we go. In addition to adhering to the principles of Military Necessity and Unnecessary Suffering (JP 1-04), we follow these two principles:

Distinction. This principle requires parties to a conflict to distinguish between combatants and noncombatants and to distinguish between military objectives and protected property and places. Parties to a conflict must direct their operations only against military objectives. Military objectives are combatants and those objects which by their nature, location, purpose, or use make an effective contribution to military action and whose total or partial destruction, capture or neutralization, in the circumstances ruling at the time, offer a definitive military advantage.

Proportionality. The principle of proportionality prohibits attacks that may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage expected to be gained. As such, this principle is only applicable when an attack may possibly affect civilians or civilian objects, and thereby, may cause collateral damage. Proportionality is a way in which a military commander must assess his or her obligations as to the principle of distinction, while avoiding actions that are indiscriminate.

Do we make mistakes? Yes, it happens. But we try to minimize those errors. Are there ever bad mistakes made? Yes, but we do our best, learning from our mistakes.

Most Respectfully,
R

The last time it was righteous to join to fight was WWII. Anyone who joined on purpose after that has no morals, you said it yourself "Congress and the Commander-inChief, say the word and we go where our nation needs us to be", so you blindly go where the man tells you to without worrying whether it's right or wrong. Like Iraq and Afghanistan, to name the 2 most recent. Sorry, but I've just lost all respect for your posts because you can't tell and/or don't know and/or don't care what's right and what's wrong. You're into random killing of people you don't know and who never did anything to you.

 

[georgephillip]

Stop being modest.
You volunteered twice to kill people who posed no threat to your country.
Hopefully you'll reap exactly what you've sown, Hero.

you really might want to check your fire there.

If you knew then what you know now, would you have served in Vietnam?

 

[georgephillip]

ima, et al,

I, like a couple here, joined the military when it wasn't so popular. It is not a career path for everyone.

People who join the army these days have no morals, they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone. And mostly, it's people who can't make it in the real world, so they join up for some random killing and to take orders so they don't have to think too hard.

(COMMENT)

"they don't care who they kill, as long as it's someone"​

I don't think the rules of engagement — directives issued by competent military authority that delineate the circumstances and limitations under which United States forces will initiate and/or continue combat engagement with other forces encountered — allow that — I don't think they ever allowed that.

Those of us who join the Armed Forces, either in times gone bye, or today, answer our nations call to duty. Congress and the Commander-inChief, say the word and we go where our nation needs us to be; to right wrongs, to liberate the oppressed, to protect those that need protected, shield that which is in the national interest, and to respond to aggression. We all follow the same basic principles everywhere we go. In addition to adhering to the principles of Military Necessity and Unnecessary Suffering (JP 1-04), we follow these two principles:

Distinction. This principle requires parties to a conflict to distinguish between combatants and noncombatants and to distinguish between military objectives and protected property and places. Parties to a conflict must direct their operations only against military objectives. Military objectives are combatants and those objects which by their nature, location, purpose, or use make an effective contribution to military action and whose total or partial destruction, capture or neutralization, in the circumstances ruling at the time, offer a definitive military advantage.

Proportionality. The principle of proportionality prohibits attacks that may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage expected to be gained. As such, this principle is only applicable when an attack may possibly affect civilians or civilian objects, and thereby, may cause collateral damage. Proportionality is a way in which a military commander must assess his or her obligations as to the principle of distinction, while avoiding actions that are indiscriminate.

Do we make mistakes? Yes, it happens. But we try to minimize those errors. Are there ever bad mistakes made? Yes, but we do our best, learning from our mistakes.

Most Respectfully,
R

Rocco...do you find any fault with the following definition of terrorism?

"The calculated use of unlawful violence or threat of unlawful violence to inculcate fear; intended to coerce or to intimidate governments or societies in the pursuit of goals that are generally political, religious, or ideological."

U.S. Department of Defense Definition of Terrorism

 

[RoccoR]

georgephillip, et al,

Yes, --- well, this is really a CJCS Joint Pub 1-02 operational definition for military purposes. The FBI has their operational definition as well as DHS.

Rocco...do you find any fault with the following definition of terrorism?

"The calculated use of unlawful violence or threat of unlawful violence to inculcate fear; intended to coerce or to intimidate governments or societies in the pursuit of goals that are generally political, religious, or ideological."

U.S. Department of Defense Definition of Terrorism

(COMMENT)

It is not a universal definition; or, a definition in depth. How and why you use the phrase makes a difference.

18 USC § 2331 - Definitions

Defines

• “international terrorism”
• “act of war”
• “domestic terrorism”
• and several other key definitions

22 USC § 2656f(d) - Definitions

Defines

• “international terrorism”
• “terrorism”
• “terrorist group”
• “territory”
• “territory of the country”
• “terrorist sanctuary”
• “sanctuary”
• and several other key definitions

50 USC § 1801 - Definitions

Defines

• “Foreign power”
• “Agent of a foreign power”
• “International terrorism”
• “Sabotage”
• “Foreign intelligence information”
• “Electronic surveillance”
• “Weapon of mass destruction”
• and several other key definitions.

Depending on the topic, intent and specificity, depends on the definition you use. When specifically dealing with "War & National Defense" - one generally used 50 USC § 1801. When dealing with Foreign Relations and International or Global generalities, one generally used 22 USC § 2656f(d). And, if you are looking a criminal prosecution one uses Title 18 (Federal Criminal Code).

So it depends. You use the definition to fit the context of the discussion.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[georgephillip]

Rocco...do you think the US invasion and occupation of South Vietnam qualified as terrorism?

"The My Lai Massacre (Vietnamese: thảm sát Mỹ Lai [tʰɐ̃ːm ʂɐ̌ːt mǐˀ lɐːj], [mǐˀlɐːj] ( listen); /ˌmiːˈlaɪ/, /ˌmiːˈleɪ/, or /ˌmaɪˈlaɪ/)[1] was the Vietnam War mass murder of between 347 and 504 unarmed civilians in South Vietnam on March 16, 1968, by United States Army soldiers of 'Charlie' Company of 1st Battalion, 20th Infantry Regiment, 11th Brigade of the Americal Division.

"Most of the victims were women, children, infants, and elderly people.

"Some of the women were gang-raped and their bodies were later found to be mutilated[2] and many women were allegedly raped prior to the killings.[3]

"While 26 U.S. soldiers were initially charged with criminal offenses for their actions at Mỹ Lai, only Second Lieutenant William Calley, a platoon leader in Charlie Company, was convicted. Found guilty of killing 22 villagers, he was originally given a life sentence, but only served three and a half years under house arrest."

"Specifically, were the above members of "Charlie" Company state-sponsored terrorists?
Do you suspect your opinion would be different if you had been born in Vietnam?

My Lai Massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia