The answer is easy: Armed guards at schools

[Dirk the Daring]

Wow... okay, that's so stupid it doesn't merit a response.



The flaw here is thinking that nutballs and criminals only evolved in the past 30 years. We've always had them. It's just 30 years ago, it wasn't this easy for them to get guns.

Ha, I'll translate since I once spoke democrat; 'chit, that's good, I can't rebut that so I'll just brush it off.'

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Typical! Point all the objectionable occurances from the Dems, but ignore Repuklican a-#oles! How soon we forget Clinton actually had a surplus budget during his last yrs in office & was actually paying the Nat'l Debt "down!" "W" Bush said, "fk. that. We need to go more in the hole so I'm going to cut taxes for the rich & to placate the masses, I'll give them a worthless check of $300!" I'm disgusted w/ all concerned!

The Clinton 'budget surplus' was an accounting trick, nothing more. Here's a chart of the national debt by year, you tell me which year in the 90's do you see the national debt going down?

U.S. National Debt by Year

The U.S. national debt grew to a record $34 trillion by the end of 2023. It was just $16 billion in 1930.

www.thebalancemoney.com

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Who said I ever forgot that? It was the one decent thing he did. And he was the last president to do it. Too bad the guy was otherwise such a schmuck and a total louse.

See post #122

 

[JoeB131]

Who are the "wrong" people and who gets to decide that? The government can't even keep track of the most basic things or enforce the existing laws much less figure out which people out of 330 million might misuse a weapon sometime in the future..

Crazy people
People with criminal records
People with a history of domestic violence.

That was easy.

Tell it to the feds, idiot, because that is exactly what it is, a felony carrying a 15 year penalty! I mean, RIGHT NOW, idiot, the DA in NY is trying to indict Trump for EXACTLY THE SAME REASON! Simply because he failed to properly check off the right box on a form listing a payment to an extortionist.

Nobody goes to jail for that unless they are a weapons trafficker or some shit like that.

 

[toobfreak]

wow .. a simple search on Google provided over 640M results on the early signs of mental illness..

...and now for the BIG question-- -- -- now tell us how many school shooters showed enough of those early signs in order for authorities to ACT?

Mind you, you are asking them to act on someone to punish them for something they haven't even done, and may never do. Guess you didn't think that far ahead. Are you OK if I impose some big restriction on YOUR life because I THINK you MIGHT do something in the FUTURE?

There's a reason why they call them early signs, because in most cases, people exhibiting "early signs" never actually go out and shoot up a classroom. Most people with early signs of mental illness never do anything, that's why psychology is such an imprecise science.

 

[toobfreak]

Crazy people
People with criminal records
People with a history of domestic violence.

Idiot, if you have a red flag like those in your history, you already can't and won't be able to buy a firearm. Wow.

 

[jotathought]

...and now for the BIG question-- -- -- now tell us how many school shooters showed enough of those early signs in order for authorities to ACT?

Mind you, you are asking them to act on someone to punish them for something they haven't even done, and may never do. Guess you didn't think that far ahead. Are you OK if I impose some big restriction on YOUR life because I THINK you MIGHT do something in the FUTURE?

There's a reason why they call them early signs, because in most cases, people exhibiting "early signs" never actually go out and shoot up a classroom. Most people with early signs of mental illness never do anything, that's why psychology is such an imprecise science.

What a silly question to ask. If authorities can impose red flag laws to seize weapons based on family / friend / neighbor / doctor / other informants, why not leverage this precedent for early signs of mental illness?

Regardless .. reacting to the outcomes of these types of behaviors doesn't solve the problem and only penalizes millions of law abiding citizens.

 

[toobfreak]

What a silly question to ask. If authorities can impose red flag laws to seize weapons based on family / friend / neighbor / doctor / other informants, why not leverage this precedent for early signs of mental illness?

Because it just gives the government more power to walk through innocent people's lives taking unfounded actions for no good reason? Because psychology is far too imprecise a method to determine who might and who won't act a certain way? You think that silly?

Regardless .. reacting to the outcomes of these types of behaviors doesn't solve the problem and only penalizes millions of law abiding citizens.

AMAZING. You call my comment silly, then go on to agree with it.

 

[jotathought]

Because it just gives the government more power to walk through innocent people's lives taking unfounded actions for no good reason? Because psychology is far too imprecise a method to determine who might and who won't act a certain way? You think that silly?


AMAZING. You call my comment silly, then go on to agree with it.

Tackling mental health / illness takes a huge bite out of mass shooters .. sorry .. the facts disagree with you. There are proactive measures and reactive measures, and government chooses reactive (translated: not tackling the problem).

 

[Fiero425]

The Clinton 'budget surplus' was an accounting trick, nothing more. Here's a chart of the national debt by year, you tell me which year in the 90's do you see the national debt going down?

U.S. National Debt by Year

The U.S. national debt grew to a record $34 trillion by the end of 2023. It was just $16 billion in 1930.

www.thebalancemoney.com

Of course! It was just a mirage the Nat'l Debt doubled under "W!" Obama had to fix his mess, then Trump turned us into a Banana Republic overnight bearly hanging on to respectability! It's a wonder we didn't totally collapse as a country after "the right" trashed every institution we have! As a senior it's hard to care! We've become Neanderthals believing if we continue as we are, it'll all turn around on its on eventually! Both sides of the spectrum are responsible for this sad state of affairs!

 

[toobfreak]

Tackling mental health / illness takes a huge bite out of mass shooters

Keep jerking off. The government is never going to effectively tackle mental health because it would be a MASSIVE expenditure only sure to catch many of them as crazy and unfit for office.

 

[JoeB131]

Idiot, if you have a red flag like those in your history, you already can't and won't be able to buy a firearm. Wow.

Except too many people do, because background checks are weak by design.

This is why we should simply allow victims of gun violence to sue the gunmakers and sellers. Then they institute their OWN background checks that will be thorough, not the watered down government version because the ATF is routinely underfunded.

 

[toobfreak]

Except too many people do, because background checks are weak by design.

You mean because without resorting to invasive shakedowns impossible in a free society, there are more crazy leftwingers than we can keep up with so we let them shoot each other in big cities.

This is why we should simply allow victims of gun violence to sue the gunmakers and sellers.

Which would do NOTHING because sellers and makers have no control over what people might do in the future if they already don't have something bad enough in their history to legally refuse a gun sale. And most school shooters easily passed the required background check.

 

[Dirk the Daring]

Of course! It was just a mirage the Nat'l Debt doubled under "W!" Obama had to fix his mess, then Trump turned us into a Banana Republic overnight bearly hanging on to respectability! It's a wonder we didn't totally collapse as a country after "the right" trashed every institution we have! As a senior it's hard to care! We've become Neanderthals believing if we continue as we are, it'll all turn around on its on eventually! Both sides of the spectrum are responsible for this sad state of affairs!

Soooooo you can't name a single year during Clinton's administration that the national debt went down, after claiming on this board that Clinton paid down the national debt (see post #111). Thanks for confirming I was right... not that I needed it obviously.

Edit: I WILL happily concede the part of your comment that I bolded. As I have said several times on this board already, the debt crisis we are in today has many fathers (and mothers). Neither party is innocent in our current situation.

 

[jotathought]

Except too many people do, because background checks are weak by design.

This is why we should simply allow victims of gun violence to sue the gunmakers and sellers. Then they institute their OWN background checks that will be thorough, not the watered down government version because the ATF is routinely underfunded.

So you support a victim suing a manufacturer and the organization that sold the good? Would this apply to ALL manufactures and seller of products / services?

Using your logic, one could sue Jack Daniels and Bob's Liquor store because some drunk slammed their vehicle into little johnny and killed him. How about government funded methadone clinics that enable drug addicts, and those addicts commit crimes to fund their addiction?

 

[Godboy]

No, that's the solution of the intellectually lazy. It's as stupid as the people who want to ban ARs

I am unconvinced by your argument against it.

 

[JoeB131]

You mean because without resorting to invasive shakedowns impossible in a free society, there are more crazy leftwingers than we can keep up with so we let them shoot each other in big cities.

Uh, guy, murder rates in the rural areas shot up as much as the urban ones. That's what happens when you flood the country with guns.

Which would do NOTHING because sellers and makers have no control over what people might do in the future if they already don't have something bad enough in their history to legally refuse a gun sale. And most school shooters easily passed the required background check.

Then the background check is inadequate.

That argument would hold water if the gun industry wasn't specifically marketing to the most unstable gun owners.

 

[JoeB131]

So you support a victim suing a manufacturer and the organization that sold the good? Would this apply to ALL manufactures and seller of products / services?

Nope, just the ones specifically designed to kill people.

Using your logic, one could sue Jack Daniels and Bob's Liquor store because some drunk slammed their vehicle into little johnny and killed him. How about government funded methadone clinics that enable drug addicts, and those addicts commit crimes to fund their addiction?

The problem with methadone clinics is there aren't enough of them, which is why addicts go back to drugs.

But we are already there with alcohol. If you are a bartender, and you see your customer is slurring his words and falling off his barstool, you are liable if he crashes and kills someone. It's why most states have laws and training to ID when someone has been overserved.

 

[jotathought]

Nope, just the ones specifically designed to kill people.

Of course not .. lol .. silly argument. What about equitable outcomes?

The problem with methadone clinics is there aren't enough of them, which is why addicts go back to drugs.

But we are already there with alcohol. If you are a bartender, and you see your customer is slurring his words and falling off his barstool, you are liable if he crashes and kills someone. It's why most states have laws and training to ID when someone has been overserved.

Considering alcohol kills more people than firearms, can the victim sue Jack Daniels for that bartender's decision?

 

[JoeB131]

Of course not .. lol .. silly argument. What about equitable outcomes?

Not everything is equitable. It's why you can buy aspirin off the shelf, but you have to show ID to get Claritan D because it can be used to make Crystal meth.

Considering alcohol kills more people than firearms, can the victim sue Jack Daniels for that bartender's decision?

Well, it's a hard sell to say that it does, unless you count long term health consequences.

But as I said, we already have lots of restrictions on alcohol sales.