The 50 most developed countries in the world and Universal Healthcare.

[EL Rich]

The rest of the developed world piggybacks off of that the pharmaceutical companies do here....And most of them either knock off (i.e. steal) or heavily subsidize medications and devices....So of course they're going to be less costly for the end user.

No only are you not comparing apples to apples, but you're also ignoring basic economic sense.

I think that is what I just said. What exactly have I said that you disagree with?

You original comment was that medical care can't be left to market forces, yet you've been confronted with numerous ways that market forces have been interfered with and usurped....These things are what's driving up the costs, not a truly free marketplace.

El Rich believes insurance can still be cheap after government forces insurance companies to cover people with preexisting conditions.

Hey straw man, come on??! All I have said is that healthcare should be of high quality and affordable. I’m not claiming that any path forward is right or wrong. I do suspect if we are to assure that basic healthcare is affordable to all and that high quality healthcare is available to those who can afford it, we need rethink our current approach.

You also claim that people who have no money should receive free healthcare.

The free market is the way to make healthcare the cheapest and the highest quality. The minute you start forcing companies to provide free healthcare or mandate any services, you toss out the free market.

So the poor starve and die of curable diseases? Seems more cutthroat than we need to be.

 

[Thinker101]

Bullshit. Show me one grocery store than doesn't have chicken, rice, carrots or broccoli.

In low income areas, many people live closer to a McDonalds than a grocery store. That can also get more calories for a lower price at McDonalds than at the grocery store.

So now you think the Poor are innately less intelligent and unable to locate a grocery store.

Low income areas, poor housing, no transportation, no grocery store located nearby. Proximity and the price you pay for a calorie of food is what is critical here.

Good thing we have capitalism in this country. You can get a job and bump up those calories.

Its harder to get a job in low income areas. If your physically or mentally ill In a low income area the situation gets much worse.

I see, so all the people in low income areas are physically or mentally ill?

 

[hunarcy]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

 

[Taz]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

 

[bripat9643]

The rest of the developed world piggybacks off of that the pharmaceutical companies do here....And most of them either knock off (i.e. steal) or heavily subsidize medications and devices....So of course they're going to be less costly for the end user.

No only are you not comparing apples to apples, but you're also ignoring basic economic sense.

I think that is what I just said. What exactly have I said that you disagree with?

You original comment was that medical care can't be left to market forces, yet you've been confronted with numerous ways that market forces have been interfered with and usurped....These things are what's driving up the costs, not a truly free marketplace.

I have said that leaving health care purely to market forces does not seem to be the most effective way to provide the best quality care at the most affordable rate. I have also said that unchecked government interference is dangerous and a sure fire way to make health care inefficient and unaffordable. Finding a middle ground is all I am advocating.

You can't say that since you have no frame of reference.

I think the root of our disagreement is that you see healthcare as a commodity and I see at as something citizenship could entitle one to. Not saying everybody gets the same, just saying basic healthcare for all seems like a luxury we can afford. In a purely free market there will be some that inevitably will be left on the outside looking in. I believe that we do not need to accept that.

You're correct: I don't see it as a right. How can it be? Rights have been the same for 10,000 years. They are something you are born with. No one is born with the right to a CAT scan or an MRI. They didn't even exist a couple of decades ago, so how can you have a right to them?

It's utterly ridiculous to speak of healthcare as a right.

 

[bripat9643]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

In other words, they didn't purchase health insurance.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

You guys scream over $5 billion for border security, yet see no problem with this-

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
Medicare for All’ Would Cost $32.6 Trillion Over 10 Years, Study Says

You guys scream of the cost and never ever talk about the benefits such as better national health and productivity. Nor do you ever talk about the cost of not getting everyone insure. You cant properly evaluate a program without discussing all of those factors.

 

[Anathema]

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

What’s wrong with that model? Healthcare is NOT a Right and never has been. Hopefully it never will be considered a Right either.

 

[EL Rich]

I think that is what I just said. What exactly have I said that you disagree with?

You original comment was that medical care can't be left to market forces, yet you've been confronted with numerous ways that market forces have been interfered with and usurped....These things are what's driving up the costs, not a truly free marketplace.

I have said that leaving health care purely to market forces does not seem to be the most effective way to provide the best quality care at the most affordable rate. I have also said that unchecked government interference is dangerous and a sure fire way to make health care inefficient and unaffordable. Finding a middle ground is all I am advocating.

You can't say that since you have no frame of reference.

I think the root of our disagreement is that you see healthcare as a commodity and I see at as something citizenship could entitle one to. Not saying everybody gets the same, just saying basic healthcare for all seems like a luxury we can afford. In a purely free market there will be some that inevitably will be left on the outside looking in. I believe that we do not need to accept that.

You're correct: I don't see it as a right. How can it be? Rights have been the same for 10,000 years. They are something you are born with. No one is born with the right to a CAT scan or an MRI. They didn't even exist a couple of decades ago, so how can you have a right to them?

It's utterly ridiculous to speak of healthcare as a right.

Never said healthcare was a right, what I said is that it seems to me to be a luxury we can afford.

 

[hunarcy]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

So, they did have treatment? Thanks for admitting that.

 

[Taz]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

In other words, they didn't purchase health insurance.

Maybe they couldn't afford it. Ever think of that?

 

[bripat9643]

I think that is what I just said. What exactly have I said that you disagree with?

You original comment was that medical care can't be left to market forces, yet you've been confronted with numerous ways that market forces have been interfered with and usurped....These things are what's driving up the costs, not a truly free marketplace.

El Rich believes insurance can still be cheap after government forces insurance companies to cover people with preexisting conditions.

Hey straw man, come on??! All I have said is that healthcare should be of high quality and affordable. I’m not claiming that any path forward is right or wrong. I do suspect if we are to assure that basic healthcare is affordable to all and that high quality healthcare is available to those who can afford it, we need rethink our current approach.

You also claim that people who have no money should receive free healthcare.

The free market is the way to make healthcare the cheapest and the highest quality. The minute you start forcing companies to provide free healthcare or mandate any services, you toss out the free market.

So the poor starve and die of curable diseases? Seems more cutthroat than we need to be.

No one has ever starved in this country unless they were stranded by a blizzard.

People die of incurable diseases every day. Most diseases that once had no cure are now curable, thanks to capitalism. Under the free market, the poor would go to charity hospitals. There would be a lot fewer poor people of the government wasn't subsidizing poverty.

 

[Taz]

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

What’s wrong with that model? Healthcare is NOT a Right and never has been. Hopefully it never will be considered a Right either.

You're too far gone if you think that people should die in the streets because they can't afford heath care.

 

[hunarcy]

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

In other words, they didn't purchase health insurance.

Maybe they couldn't afford it. Ever think of that?

Before Obama, there was cheap insurance and the right to gamble if you didn't think you'd need insurance. People made choices that they thought was best for them. Now, there is no choices.

 

[bripat9643]

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

In other words, they didn't purchase health insurance.

Maybe they couldn't afford it. Ever think of that?

They can afford to own a home, but they can't afford health insurance?

The cost of healthcare is way higher than it needs to be because of government meddling. The ACA is a prime example.

 

[Taz]

Below are the 50 most developed countries in the world ranked according to the UN Human Development index which measures development and standard of living through estimates of GDP per capita, life expectancy, and education. There are a total of 197 countries in the world today. 193 of those countries are part of the United Nations. 45 out of the 50 most developed countries in the world below provide UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE for its citizens, essentially medicare for all. The following are the five countries from the list below that do not:

01. Cyprus
02. United Arab Emirates
03. Qatar
04. Bahrain
05. United States

Cyprus is currently In the process of moving to a Universal Healthcare system which will be completed in a few years. That will leave the United States alone with three Arab countries as being the only countries, of the 50 most developed in the world, that do not have Universal HealthCare.

Why does the United States, the wealthiest country in the world and the 3rd wealthiest per captia country, still not provide Universal Healthcare for its citizens? How could anyone say that Universal HealthCare is impossible or too expensive for the United States when nearly all of the 50 most developed countries in the world provide it for its citizens?


50 MOST DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD RANKED:

01 - Norway
02 - Switzerland
03 - Australia
04 - Ireland
05 - Germany
06 - Iceland
07 - San Marino
08 - Sweden
09 - Singapore
10 - Netherlands
11 - Denmark
12 Canada
13 - United States
14 - United Kingdom
15 - Monaco
16 - Vatican City
17 - Finland
18 - New Zealand
19 - Belgium
20 - Liechtenstein
21 - Japan
22 - Austria
23 - Luxembourg
24 - Israel
25 - Taiwan
26 - South Korea
27 - France
28 - Slovenia
29 - Spain
30 - Czech Republic
31 - Italy
32 - Malta
33 - Estonia
34 - Greece
35 - Cyprus
36 - Poland
37 - United Arab Emirates
38 - Andorra
39 - Lithuania
40 - Qatar
41 - Slovakia
42 - Brunei
43 - Saudi Arabia
44 - Latvia
45 - Portugal
46 - Bahrain
47 - Chile
48 - Hungary
49 - Croatia
50 - Argentina

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

So, they did have treatment? Thanks for admitting that.

^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[bripat9643]

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

What’s wrong with that model? Healthcare is NOT a Right and never has been. Hopefully it never will be considered a Right either.

You're too far gone if you think that people should die in the streets because they can't afford heath care.

Feel free to pay for the healthcare.

 

[hunarcy]

Because Americans know that, based on the VA and Obamacare, government will only screw things up.

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

So, they did have treatment? Thanks for admitting that.

^^^^^^^^^^^^
View attachment 246399

LOL! It does seem that most of your posts are retarded. Thanks for admitting you have no argument.

 

[bripat9643]

You original comment was that medical care can't be left to market forces, yet you've been confronted with numerous ways that market forces have been interfered with and usurped....These things are what's driving up the costs, not a truly free marketplace.

I have said that leaving health care purely to market forces does not seem to be the most effective way to provide the best quality care at the most affordable rate. I have also said that unchecked government interference is dangerous and a sure fire way to make health care inefficient and unaffordable. Finding a middle ground is all I am advocating.

You can't say that since you have no frame of reference.

I think the root of our disagreement is that you see healthcare as a commodity and I see at as something citizenship could entitle one to. Not saying everybody gets the same, just saying basic healthcare for all seems like a luxury we can afford. In a purely free market there will be some that inevitably will be left on the outside looking in. I believe that we do not need to accept that.

You're correct: I don't see it as a right. How can it be? Rights have been the same for 10,000 years. They are something you are born with. No one is born with the right to a CAT scan or an MRI. They didn't even exist a couple of decades ago, so how can you have a right to them?

It's utterly ridiculous to speak of healthcare as a right.

Never said healthcare was a right, what I said is that it seems to me to be a luxury we can afford.

You pay for it. Why should I pay for someone else's healthcare?

 

[Taz]

The free market health care system isn't a model to follow either, as only people with money can get proper care.

Funny how it worked well for most people from 1783 to 2010, but the past 9 years and 11 months has been a disaster.

You mean most people with money. Some have had to sell their homes to get treatment...

In other words, they didn't purchase health insurance.

Maybe they couldn't afford it. Ever think of that?

Before Obama, there was cheap insurance and the right to gamble if you didn't think you'd need insurance. People made choices that they thought was best for them. Now, there is no choices.

What's happening now isn't universal health care, so I can agree that it's bad.