Supreme Court Rules 7-2 on Obamacare

[Donald H]

Just more of your stupid Marxist propaganda. Companies provide a service for a marketable cost. You want them to shut down giving away free shit because you want it.

As I pointed out, charity should be the LAST option, not the first, which is why our medical system is failing

I won't lie to you and say that my wife and I can have better quality HC in Canada for about $150 a month.

No American would ever buy that kind of big lie!

fkng losers!

 

[Hutch Starskey]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

 

[kaz]

Just more of your stupid Marxist propaganda. Companies provide a service for a marketable cost. You want them to shut down giving away free shit because you want it.

As I pointed out, charity should be the LAST option, not the first, which is why our medical system is failing

I won't lie to you and say that my wife can have better quality HC in Canada for about $150 a month.

No American would ever buy that kind of big lie!

fkng losers!

Yeah, that's what it costs, $150 a month. That's all you pay. Total cost. Sure it is, LOL

 

[jc456]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

That's truly a shame. The Court is a joke. I just hope Manchin keeps his finger in the dam. Otherwise, we're all fucked.

So much for those three trump Justices.....

Now you like them? Amazing a demofk

 

[Donald H]

Just more of your stupid Marxist propaganda. Companies provide a service for a marketable cost. You want them to shut down giving away free shit because you want it.

As I pointed out, charity should be the LAST option, not the first, which is why our medical system is failing

I won't lie to you and say that my wife can have better quality HC in Canada for about $150 a month.

No American would ever buy that kind of big lie!

fkng losers!

Yeah, that's what it costs, $150 a month. That's all you pay. Total cost. Sure it is, LOL

We pay more in taxes for some goods and services.

But again I won't lie to you and say that taxes in Canada and the US are roughly equal. fkng losers!

 

[Papageorgio]

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

and you think Medicare is any different?...

And the irony of ACA is that it forces people to buy insurance.

How? How can ACA force you?

Without a public option the only other choice is to go without insurance.

They left out the one and only way to properly bring some competition to the health care insurance industry.

I wish they had included a public option but the republicans said if that happened no one would buy private for profit insurance.

Which should tell everyone that Americans can't stand private for profit insurance companies.

If we had real choice like the republicans say they want us to have, there would have been a public option. Those who are sick and tired of the private for profit insurance companies can finally tell them to bite me. Those who want to stay with that system can.

That is real choice.

The Republicans did not have the votes to stop public option. Democrats stopped it. They had the 60 votes needed and they didn't pass it.

Obama caved right away took it off the table when the negotiations barely started.

Wasn't that because he knew early on that it had no chance of passing? I didn't know he conceded that early.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Sadly, nobody really wants your shittier idea of a health care solution either....if they did, you wouldn't be whining about it so much

I’m not whining about my healthcare at all. I have excellent “Cadillac” health insurance through my employer.

My concern is that the more people become accepting of extended Government interference in health services the more likely a “Medicare for All” system is and then I have no health care at all.

and your employer subsidizes your healthcare....

What makes employers subsidizing your healthcare some sacred right but taxpayers subsidizing healthcare is Communist?

If employers didn't have to burden the costs of covering healthcare for their employees -- they can use that money to buy back more stocks and artificially inflate their value so execs can have bigger bonuses...

Because it damn sure won't be used on wage increases

 

[kaz]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

 

[kaz]

Just more of your stupid Marxist propaganda. Companies provide a service for a marketable cost. You want them to shut down giving away free shit because you want it.

As I pointed out, charity should be the LAST option, not the first, which is why our medical system is failing

I won't lie to you and say that my wife can have better quality HC in Canada for about $150 a month.

No American would ever buy that kind of big lie!

fkng losers!

Yeah, that's what it costs, $150 a month. That's all you pay. Total cost. Sure it is, LOL

We pay more in taxes for some goods and services.

But again I won't lie to you and say that taxes in Canada and the US are roughly equal. fkng losers!

Canada is a tiny fraction the size of the US and a lot of costs are way lower. But you're still paying a lot more than you grasp

 

[Dana7360]

Republicans and Conservatives lose again.

No. Working Americans loose again. The only people who like Obamacare are those the rest of us are paying for.

If Renquist had still been alive and Chief Justice of the SC, Obamacare would have been kicked to the curb. Right where it belongs.

So, please thrill us with your idea of "something better."

HC should be kicked back to the private sector where it belongs. Check the Constitution. You won't find health care anywhere in the Constitution.

Provide for the common welfare....

There is no health care in the constitution. You think the FF even thought of health care??

Common welfare means everyone has the same chance to be all they can be. It has nothing to do with HC which you won't fine anywhere in the Constitution.

You could refer to it as the US Constipation, because that's its equivalent. Literally!

The ACA isn't government healthcare

By forcing people to purchase insurance, even if they don’t want to, it may as well be Government Healthcare.

It’s also a major step to acceptance of Government involvement in health care, which is immoral and unconstitutional.

It's neither.

People who won't purchace health care insurance are expecting a free ride on other people's dime.

How's that for a conservative agenda? You fkng American bozos just refuse to 'get it'!

Exactly.

They don't pay insurance then when they get sick or are in an accident not covered by car insurance they deadbeat on the bills.

Then those bills are "cost shifted" to those of us who are responsible, do buy insurance and pay our bills.

It's one of the biggest reasons why health care is much more expensive in America.

Right now if you go to a doctor's office or hospital you're not just paying for yourself but you're paying for all those deadbeats who refuse to be responsible.

When all medical bills are paid, everyone has lower insurance premiums and medical costs.

Example, Hawaii had single payer health care until Obamacare. That means every medical bill for everyone was paid properly.

I was in a life threatening accident with monster 15 ft waves in Hawaii. I first went through the ER then was admitted to the ICU. I was in a coma. Almost every type of doctor helped me from cardiologists to breathing specialists and everything in between.

When the bill came from the hospital I expected it to be at the very least 50 thousand dollars.

The bill from the hospital was 26 thousand dollars. The bills from the labs and doctors were equally as low.

Because there is no "cost shifting" of medical bills. There are no unpaid bills to cause everyone else to have to pay many times more than it should cost.

My latest bill from the hospital was $0,000,000.
And the next one is going to be even higher if it's not lower.

What is freedom?

I didn't have to pay that bill. I had employer provided insurance at the time.

It was union negotiated insurance so any medical care incurred out of state is paid at 100%.

All of the care I received for that accident was paid 100%.

The thing is, that is the exception in America. Most people even with insurance would have been left with a very large medical bill to pay.

Some people have proper medical care in America. Most people don't. It all depends on your employer. If you have a jerk for an employer who doesn't offer proper insurance or not a member of a union or have no employer provided insurance, you have sub standard and very expensive health care.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

I think it's a very good thing that we still have Obamacare.

In fact, I think we should do away with insurance companies for health care.

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

We have some people who can have health care without being bankrupted or have insurance premiums that aren't astronomical. It's not fair that some people have proper insurance that is affordable and others don't here in the United States.

Our health care system is a total mess.

I've spent way too much time discussing the merits, or lack thereof, of ACA. It's corporatist shitshow throughout.

But, outside it's corruption and the blatant violation of Constitutional limits on government, the ACA does not have broad consensus. It was passed on strict partisan lines and will be a political football going forward, constantly torn and twisted as successive administrations get their hands on it.

You've managed to put politicians in charge of our health care. Congrats.

You will never convince a Statist that anything is wrong with a government program.

What gets me is that they pass this shit, presumably, with the assumption that the "other side" will never, ever, be in power again. Do they really want miscreants like Trump (or worse) in charge of their health care???

Trump nor Biden is in charge of your health insurance


Why do you think private healthcare execs are so trustworthy with being in charge of your insurance??

Are they Gods that are impervious to scamming their customers for their own profit?

4 healthcare execs sentenced in $189M fraud scheme

Four executives at a hospital management company based in Texas were sentenced for their roles in a $189 million healthcare fraud scheme, the U.S. Justice Department said April 23.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

 

[bodecea]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

That's truly a shame. The Court is a joke. I just hope Manchin keeps his finger in the dam. Otherwise, we're all fucked.

So much for those three trump Justices.....

Now you like them? Amazing a demofk

Did I say I liked them? I'm laughing at this entire "con-servative justices" schtick.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

It was just announced that the Supreme Court ruled 7-2 on Obamacare saying the states don't have standing on this case.

So Obamacare stays.

For now.

Supreme Court spares Obamacare from GOP challenge

Two of Trump's three appointees, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett, joined the majority opinion, while the third, Neil Gorsuch, dissented.

www.nbcnews.com

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

The same cop out they used to not rule on Democrat election fraud

Exactly!
Republicans showed up again empty handed and without merit.

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

That isn't what I said. God you're stupid

It’s exactly what you said. You just don’t understand what you meant by “cop out”.
SCOTUS literally decided that the argument was so dumb that they couldn’t rule on it.

 

[jc456]

Did I say I liked them? I'm laughing at this entire "con-servative justices" schtick.

so the ruling you disagree with?

 

[Donald H]

Republicans and Conservatives lose again.

No. Working Americans loose again. The only people who like Obamacare are those the rest of us are paying for.

If Renquist had still been alive and Chief Justice of the SC, Obamacare would have been kicked to the curb. Right where it belongs.

So, please thrill us with your idea of "something better."

HC should be kicked back to the private sector where it belongs. Check the Constitution. You won't find health care anywhere in the Constitution.

Provide for the common welfare....

There is no health care in the constitution. You think the FF even thought of health care??

Common welfare means everyone has the same chance to be all they can be. It has nothing to do with HC which you won't fine anywhere in the Constitution.

You could refer to it as the US Constipation, because that's its equivalent. Literally!

The ACA isn't government healthcare

By forcing people to purchase insurance, even if they don’t want to, it may as well be Government Healthcare.

It’s also a major step to acceptance of Government involvement in health care, which is immoral and unconstitutional.

It's neither.

People who won't purchace health care insurance are expecting a free ride on other people's dime.

How's that for a conservative agenda? You fkng American bozos just refuse to 'get it'!

Exactly.

They don't pay insurance then when they get sick or are in an accident not covered by car insurance they deadbeat on the bills.

Then those bills are "cost shifted" to those of us who are responsible, do buy insurance and pay our bills.

It's one of the biggest reasons why health care is much more expensive in America.

Right now if you go to a doctor's office or hospital you're not just paying for yourself but you're paying for all those deadbeats who refuse to be responsible.

When all medical bills are paid, everyone has lower insurance premiums and medical costs.

Example, Hawaii had single payer health care until Obamacare. That means every medical bill for everyone was paid properly.

I was in a life threatening accident with monster 15 ft waves in Hawaii. I first went through the ER then was admitted to the ICU. I was in a coma. Almost every type of doctor helped me from cardiologists to breathing specialists and everything in between.

When the bill came from the hospital I expected it to be at the very least 50 thousand dollars.

The bill from the hospital was 26 thousand dollars. The bills from the labs and doctors were equally as low.

Because there is no "cost shifting" of medical bills. There are no unpaid bills to cause everyone else to have to pay many times more than it should cost.

My latest bill from the hospital was $0,000,000.
And the next one is going to be even higher if it's not lower.

What is freedom?

I didn't have to pay that bill. I had employer provided insurance at the time.

It was union negotiated insurance so any medical care incurred out of state is paid at 100%.

All of the care I received for that accident was paid 100%.

The thing is, that is the exception in America. Most people even with insurance would have been left with a very large medical bill to pay.

Some people have proper medical care in America. Most people don't. It all depends on your employer. If you have a jerk for an employer who doesn't offer proper insurance or not a member of a union or have no employer provided insurance, you have sub standard and very expensive health care.

I know.
Everybody knows but some pretend they don't.

The tone of this board is shifting with each of the discussions that make the point of facing up to reality.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

I’ve done no such thing. I said nothing of welfare or suggested it be free or without profit. It’s obvious to anyone reading this that it is you who struggles.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

But we do wonder why Americans refuse single payer universal health care that's half the cost per capita and proven to be better in other countries?

It’s something called self-reliance and personal responsibility. I wouldn’t expect foreigners to understand but some of us believe we can do a better job of looking after ourselves than the Government can.

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

I understand the mindset that holds Americans back from demanding better. And yes, some of you still, after many years of torture, still think that for profit health care is going to come to the rescue.

Give the private insurance companies another 40 or 50 years to get it right. It's only fair!

How will you pay for services without health insurance? Who’s paying that $250k bill for the 10 surgeries to rebuild your pelvis after a car accident or your $60k a month chemotherapy treatments?
There’s a reason health insurance exists. The healthy pay for the sick. Not many individuals could afford to pay for open heart surgery out of pocket.

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

Insurance is to spread unknown risk, not known costs. What you are describing is welfare. Welfare should be a last resort backup, not the way the entire system is designed

WTF? Risk is cost to insurers.
Insurance, like any business, is about controlling cost in order to maximize profits. The risks and costs of untreated chronic disease are well known and understood. It is proven that people actually go to their doctors and manage their chronic illnesses when they have coverage. It is by far cheaper to manage disease then treat the inevitable and avoidable emergencies that require hospital interventions and stays. This is the concept of wellness. It’s better for you and cheaper for your insurers to have your doctors to help you stay well rather than treat you emergently.

You fundamentally don't understand insurance. Insurance is ex ante, not ex post. You're trying to create a welfare program out of it where known costs are spread out driving up the cost of other insured who then don't want to buy it because it's too expensive. That is a welfare program and only works when government uses force

Most things only work because of the government's monopolization of force

Or you think things like contracts, or intellectual property are protected by nature??

 

[BlindBoo]

Most people in America can't stand insurance companies controlling what health care they can have and denying to pay medical bills.

and you think Medicare is any different?...

And the irony of ACA is that it forces people to buy insurance.

How? How can ACA force you?

Without a public option the only other choice is to go without insurance.

They left out the one and only way to properly bring some competition to the health care insurance industry.

I wish they had included a public option but the republicans said if that happened no one would buy private for profit insurance.

Which should tell everyone that Americans can't stand private for profit insurance companies.

If we had real choice like the republicans say they want us to have, there would have been a public option. Those who are sick and tired of the private for profit insurance companies can finally tell them to bite me. Those who want to stay with that system can.

That is real choice.

The Republicans did not have the votes to stop public option. Democrats stopped it. They had the 60 votes needed and they didn't pass it.

Obama caved right away took it off the table when the negotiations barely started.

Wasn't that because he knew early on that it had no chance of passing? I didn't know he conceded that early.

That might have been the single payer option. The House passed a public option but the Senate didn't

 

[Anathema]

f you want nothing from the government then only drive on your roads, go to your schools, have your own military, have your own fire fighters, have your own police, if you cannot pay for health care, die

I want nothing from the Government except what they’re specifically given power over in founding documents, and which I pay taxes for:

From the Feds thst would be interstate roads and defense of the nation (not other nations). From the state that would be state roads. From the local Government that would be fire, police, local roads. Schools should be a private affair.

The Government should not have its nose or fingers in most of people’s affairs. Definitely not our health care.

 

[Anathema]

Your concern is wrong and unwarranted

How is that?

My pension doesn’t include health insurance. I will not use Medicare/Medicaid. I will not have an income to buy insurance, even if there were to be some available. So, what insurance would there be for me?