St. Louis couple defends their house from protestors, with guns. Do you support "stand your ground laws"?

Do you support "stand your ground laws"?

  • Yes

    Votes: 54 91.5%
  • No

    Votes: 5 8.5%

  • Total voters
    59
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a citizen of that country who is a licensed CCW holder and a black belt in martial arts
Really? Me too.
:beer:

I am nowhere near the badass that my wife is. Her family has a LONG history in martial arts. Her brother owns the biggest school in Utah. That dude is a millionaire and his kids are famous YouTubers: Ninja Kidz TV

(bastard didn't even graduate from high school and I have had 20 years of formal education--I have been cheated)
 

zaangalewa

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I'm anti gun, anti trump, anti racist cons which those couple are probably but I don't blame them for defending their property from trespassers.
From what I understand, they are hard leftists.
Still my position is stated above.
Only in America thugh, in other countries is not necessary....here is too violent, people are culturally violent and killings are the norm. Many of you gun lovers don't know that there are countless of countries living without guns, no shootings at school, work places......I know it is hard to understand. Not strange where most don't even know where cANADA is, or who the founding fathers are, or when the independence took place and so forth...thinks that me as an immigrant knew by heart in elementary school overseas in 3 languages.
America is not other countries. In fact, we are really one of a kind. Our problem is not guns, our problem is we thought this concept of a melting pot would work. It never has, and still doesn't.

The other countries you speak of are virtually one culture people. We are not that. Besides different races of people, we also have different cultures. You cannot successfully force the tiger and hyena to live together. One will end up killing the other.

I've made this point many times before: If you made law that all people in a low crime nice white middle-class suburb had to own a gun, their crime rate will not change. At the same time, if you created a law that nobody in a high crime minority city can own a gun, their crime rate will not change either. Hence, the object used to kill people is not what makes the difference.

And this is the ignorance of the left. They blame the object instead of the people for crime.
You are so wrong at so many levels I don't know where to begin.
Let's take Australia for example, almost identical history to the US there were natives, than European came in slaughtered them and took their land...later on more European migrants came in....down the road more migrants came in from many parts of the world and especially from third world countries just like the US. They don't have the same problems the US suffers from especially gun massacres, mass shootings, killings left and right and so forth....they have a far better quality life in general, better education system, better health care and list goes on.

And who the hell gave you the right to dictate who can come in and who can not? just because you landed here earlier than the rest of us? Did you even ask the original land owners?
Australia is better?

Well, here:
Australia Immigration--Online Application

Fucking immigrants coming here and demanding that we change to accommodate YOU. GO TO HELL!!!

NO OTHER COUNTRY ON EARTH WOULD TOLERATE THAT SHIT!!!
In my ears you sound like someone, who says "I do not tolerate life quality!", "I do not tolerate a good education!" and "I do not tolerate health care!". You seem to love alcohol or drugs and hell on earth. So who should tolerate your grumpy attitudes? Why?
 

zaangalewa

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
 

Ray From Cleveland

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
Unlike where you live, people here are very aware of safety precautions when using firearms. As a CCW holder, I've had 10 hours of class time, and 2 hours of range time before getting my license. There is nothing you can tell me about guns that I don't already know.
 

Ray From Cleveland

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a citizen of that country who is a licensed CCW holder and a black belt in martial arts
Really? Me too.
:beer:

I am nowhere near the badass that my wife is. Her family has a LONG history in martial arts. Her brother owns the biggest school in Utah. That dude is a millionaire and his kids are famous YouTubers: Ninja Kidz TV

(bastard didn't even graduate from high school and I have had 20 years of formal education--I have been cheated)
Don't feel bad, a lot of wealthy people never had an advanced education. Running a business is more about talent and desire. Education helps, but is not a necessary requirement.

I'm a little too old to be fighting, but I still remember a lot of what I was taught, especially when using deadly force. As you already know, when you start getting to the more advanced belts, you are trained to kill people in just a few moves, so learning the laws about it was part of the program.

One lesson I expressed concern about the law and possibly killing somebody. My instructor told me if in a battle, never think about karate. You just fight like you always did before you even knew how to front kick.

After his demonstration, I was amazed. I was using moves I never even thought about for years. The instructor just smiled at me and said "wax on--wax off."
 

Ray From Cleveland

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
And the people, who never touch a weapon? How they are able to survive in the anti-united weaponed toy world of America?

Some don't. I don't ever want to be one of those people.
 

badbob85037

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
I don't need a gun because one day I might need it. I need a lot of guns, semi auto pistols, 45's, 9 mm. Revolvers, 357's, short barrel .38's, and a long barrel .44 mag. In rifles I need an AK in 7.62 x 39. Don't care for the AR-15's but got a couple AR-10's, got a skeet shooter and to many shotguns. Then there are my big caliber bolt actions. The reason I have needed these guns since I turned 12 is because there is nothing more fun than putting a piece of lead in the middle of a target from 3 feet to out over a mile.

Children dying. The NRA and every American has the duty to teach their children to shot before they learn to ride a bike. If a child learns to shot safely then they will never find some yahoo's loaded gun and shoot their self or another child. My three girls never were stupid with any gun. They are safer than some so called gunners. When they started dating I never worried

Has anyone ever heard of the 1903 Dick Act. It defines out military. Regular troops, reserve and the militia. All Americans should read it and when you are done go turn your self in for neglecting your duty
 

freyasman

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I'm anti gun, anti trump, anti racist cons which those couple are probably but I don't blame them for defending their property from trespassers.
From what I understand, they are hard leftists.
Still my position is stated above.
Only in America thugh, in other countries is not necessary....here is too violent, people are culturally violent and killings are the norm. Many of you gun lovers don't know that there are countless of countries living without guns, no shootings at school, work places......I know it is hard to understand. Not strange where most don't even know where cANADA is, or who the founding fathers are, or when the independence took place and so forth...thinks that me as an immigrant knew by heart in elementary school overseas in 3 languages.
America is not other countries. In fact, we are really one of a kind. Our problem is not guns, our problem is we thought this concept of a melting pot would work. It never has, and still doesn't.

The other countries you speak of are virtually one culture people. We are not that. Besides different races of people, we also have different cultures. You cannot successfully force the tiger and hyena to live together. One will end up killing the other.

I've made this point many times before: If you made law that all people in a low crime nice white middle-class suburb had to own a gun, their crime rate will not change. At the same time, if you created a law that nobody in a high crime minority city can own a gun, their crime rate will not change either. Hence, the object used to kill people is not what makes the difference.

And this is the ignorance of the left. They blame the object instead of the people for crime.
You are so wrong at so many levels I don't know where to begin.
Let's take Australia for example, almost identical history to the US there were natives, than European came in slaughtered them and took their land...later on more European migrants came in....down the road more migrants came in from many parts of the world and especially from third world countries just like the US. They don't have the same problems the US suffers from especially gun massacres, mass shootings, killings left and right and so forth....they have a far better quality life in general, better education system, better health care and list goes on.

And who the hell gave you the right to dictate who can come in and who can not? just because you landed here earlier than the rest of us? Did you even ask the original land owners?
Except, no not really.
Not up to you those are facts.
1594321383988.png


Tell me again how much better the Aussies have it?
 

freyasman

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?
 

2aguy

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?

I wish the quotes would put the # of the post with the quote so I could go back and directly address Dragonlady's lies and misinformation...

Guns save lives....according to the Centers For Disease Control, Americans use their legal guns 1.2 million times a year to stop rape, robbery and murder....as to the cost....guns save more money than she quoted...

Case Closed: Kleck Is Still Correct


that makes for at least 176,000 lives saved—less some attackers who lost their lives to defenders. This enormous benefit dwarfs, both in human and economic terms, the losses trumpeted by hoplophobes who only choose to see the risk side of the equation.





==============
Annual Defensive Gun Use Savings Dwarf Study's "Gun Violence" Costs - The Truth About Guns

I was going to go on and calculate the costs of incarceration ($50K/year) saved by people killing 1527 criminals annually, and then look at the lifetime cost to society of an average criminal (something in excess of $1 million). But all of that would be a drop in the bucket compared to the $1,000,000,000,000 ($1T) annual benefit of gun ownership.
--------

It’s one of the antis’ favorite tricks: cost benefit analysis omitting the benefit side of the equation. So what are the financial benefits of firearm ownership to society? Read on . . .

In my post Dennis Henigan on Chardon: Clockwork Edition, I did an analysis of how many lives were saved annually in Defensive Gun Uses (DGUs). I used extremely conservative numbers. Now I am going to use some less conservative ones.
--------------

How can we get a dollar figure from 1.88 million defensive gun uses per year? Never fear, faithful reader, we can count on the .gov to calculate everything.

According to the AZ state government, in February of 2008 a human life was worth $6.5 million. Going to the Inflation Calculator and punching in the numbers gives us a present value of $6.93 million.

So figuring that the average DGU saves one half of a person’s life—as “gun violence” predominantly affects younger demographics—that gives us $3.465 million per half life.

Putting this all together, we find that the monetary benefit of guns (by way of DGUs) is roughly $1.02 trillion per year. That’s trillion. With a ‘T’.

I was going to go on and calculate the costs of incarceration ($50K/year) saved by people killing 1527 criminals annually, and then look at the lifetime cost to society of an average criminal (something in excess of $1 million). But all of that would be a drop in the bucket compared to the $1,000,000,000,000 ($1T) annual benefit of gun ownership.

When compared to the (inflation adjusted from 2002) $127.5 billion ‘cost’ of gun violence calculated by by our Ludwig-Cook buddies, guns save a little more than eight times what they “cost.”

Which, I might add, is completely irrelevant since “the freedom to own and carry the weapon of your choice is a natural, fundamental, and inalienable human, individual, civil, and Constitutional right — subject neither to the democratic process nor to arguments grounded in social utility.”


So even taking Motherboard’s own total and multiplying it by 100, the benefits to society of civilian gun ownership dwarf the associated costs.
 

2aguy

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?
She won't answer this question.........how is it that as more Americans own and carry guns our gun crime rate went down 75%.....our gun murder rate went down 49%..

She will never answer that question.......she will just use fake facts to make an emotional argument devoid of truth, facts or reality...

Over the last 27 years, we went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 18.6 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2018...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%


Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.



The anti-gun hypothesis and argument.....

More Guns = More Gun crime regardless of any other factors.

Actual Result:

In the U.S....as more Americans own and carry guns over the last 26 years, gun murder down 49%, gun crime down 75%, violent crime down 72%

The result: Exact opposite of theory of anti-gunners....


In Science when you have a theory, when that theory is tested....and the exact opposite result happens...that means your theory is wrong. That is science....not left wing wishful thinking.

Maine tops ‘safest states’ rankings four years after removing major gun restriction

When Maine passed a “Constitutional Carry” law allowing Maine residents to carry a concealed firearm without any special permit in 2015, opponents of the law forecast a dangerous future for the state. They said the new law would hurt public safety and put Maine kids at risk.



One state representative who opposed the bill went so far as to say it would give Mainers a reason to be afraid every time they went out in public or to work.

Another state representative suggested the law would lead to violent criminals with recent arrests and convictions legally carrying handguns.


-----

Now four years later, Maine has been named the safest state in the nation according to US News and World Report’s public safety rankings, which measures the fifty states based on crime data.



Ranking as the top safest state for violent crime and fourth for property crime, Maine edges out another New England state, Vermont, for the top spot. Of note, Vermont also is a “Constitutional Carry” state. New Hampshire ranks third in the national rankings, giving New England all three of the top spots in the nation.

In 2018, Maine was edged out by Vermont in the same “safest states” ranking, but declared the best state overall in the broader “Crime and Corrections” category.

In 2017, using a different methodology, Maine was ranked second among the fifty states in the “Crime and Corrections” category and also second in the categories used to rank the “safest states.”

The U.S. News and World Report “Best States” rankings are built in partnership with McKinsey & Company, a firm that works closely with state leaders around the nation.

Maine has also ranked at the top of other state rankings. WalletHub.com recently ranked Maine second in “Personal and Residential Safety” among the fifty states, and third overall.

=============

Bolsonaro's Brazil, More Legal Guns, Homicide Rates Down Precipitously

In December, 2018, in an article published by the Wall Street Journal, this pronouncement was made. From the wsj.com:

Now, Brazil is set to embark on an experiment that will determine what happens when you loosen gun restrictions in a country battling an overpowering wave of gun crime.
Homicides in Brazil were at historic highs in 2017. They dropped a bit in 2018, as candidate Bolsonaro ran on reform of the gun laws to allow self defense, and reform of the law to get tough on crime. The homicide numbers dropped from 59,000 in 2017, to 51,000 in 2018. President Bolsonaro was elected in October of 2018.

After taking office on 1 January, 2019, President Bolsonaro issued his first decree reforming some of Brazil's extreme gun laws on 15 January, 2019. The drop in Brazil's homicide rate accelerated.
-------

Early in the Bolsonaro presidency, a Brazilian lawyer prediceted the homicide rate would drop. From ammoland.com:

César Mello, asked that I include information that early reports are showing a 25% drop in Brazil's homicide rate, in the first quarter of 2019. If this trend continues, 16,000 lives will have been saved in the first year of President Bolsonaro's time in office.
The rate reduction was not quite that high. Only 10,000 lives were saved. From wtop.com:
Brazil had 41,635 killings in 2019, down 19% from the prior year and the least number of homicides since 2007, when the so-called Violence Monitor index was launched. It is a partnership between the non-profit Brazilian Forum of Public Security, the University of Sao Paulo’s Center for the Study of Violence, and news website G1, which published the data Friday.
When translated to homicide rates, the rate dropped 17% in 2018, then 23% more in 2019. The population of Brazil in 2019 was 210 million. The rate of homicides per 100,000 was 19.83. That is less than 2/3 of the homicide rate in 2017, which was 30.8.
 

Ray From Cleveland

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?
Same thing with house or car insurance. The chances of you needing it are very slim unless you're careless or a bad driver, but if you do ever need it, you'll be glad it's there.

What we can't pound through the heads of leftists is that guns don't kill people--people kill people. A person who wants to kill another person or several people are not going to allow no access to guns to stop them.

At 60 years old, I can honestly say recreational narcotics have been illegal my entire time on this planet. Yet today, we have a worse problem with narcotics, especially the hard stuff than we ever had before. OD deaths have reached record levels.

In spite of that, leftists believe that if they could strip us of all our guns, the bad guys would surrender theirs too, and we would have a gun-free society outside of police officers and armed security. Liberals live in fairy land.
 

freyasman

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?
Same thing with house or car insurance. The chances of you needing it are very slim unless you're careless or a bad driver, but if you do ever need it, you'll be glad it's there.

What we can't pound through the heads of leftists is that guns don't kill people--people kill people. A person who wants to kill another person or several people are not going to allow no access to guns to stop them.

At 60 years old, I can honestly say recreational narcotics have been illegal my entire time on this planet. Yet today, we have a worse problem with narcotics, especially the hard stuff than we ever had before. OD deaths have reached record levels.

In spite of that, leftists believe that if they could strip us of all our guns, the bad guys would surrender theirs too, and we would have a gun-free society outside of police officers and armed security. Liberals live in fairy land.
No I don't think they believe that at all.
I think they for some reason, resent the hell out of people who are better prepared for things than they are; they don't like it when someone is stronger, smarter, better educated, or better equipped than they are.
I don't for the life of me understand why they don't simply improve themselves rather than trying to handicap everyone else, but it seems like that's all they want to do.
 

Ray From Cleveland

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Don't tell me bullshit.
It's not bullshit.

What a bullshit. What you "believe" has to be real and to be plausible in such a case - otherwise every jugde will think you are a liar. No one has any "license to kill", also not agent 007.
It's not a license to kill, it's a license to use deadly force against a potential attack. Need me to link our laws for you? I'll be happy to do it. I'm a licensed CCW carrier, and I do know the laws very well.

I do not try to speak about Trump. Meanwhile Trump is in my eyes only a criminal idiot any longer and it helps no one anything what this man says nor what are the answers on his stupidities. So I changed this first draft. You answered before I finished the text. Read again what I wrote.
Well you did speak of Trump and that's why I responded with Trump. I'm sorry, but it's very difficult to understand what you are writing about. Your translation program is not very good.
You have NO RIGHT to use deadly force unless threatened with deadly force. You need to LEARN the laws of self defence.
Talking out your lying ass again...
"A stand-your-ground law (sometimes called "line in the sand" or "no duty to retreat" law) provides that people may use lethal force to defend themselves or others (right of self-defense) against threats or reasonably perceived threats, regardless of whether they can safely retreat from the situation. Under such a law, people have no duty to retreat from any place where they have a lawful right to be[1] and may use any necessary force if they reasonably believe they are in imminent danger of death, serious bodily harm, kidnapping, rape, or (in some jurisdictions) robbery or some other serious crimes. The exact details vary by jurisdiction. "
That's idiotic. No one is per se innocent. I remember an US-American, who had murdered a German exchange student some long years ago, because the student had entered his garage. An irreplaceable loss. I was astonished how many US-Americans think everyone has the right to murder someone, who enters their house. But this murderer is in jail now for the rest of his life. I remember in this context for example someone, who had a car accident. This was in the USA. Another car driver stopped and liked to help him. The idiot murdered the helping person by saying something like he thought he likes to use his helpless situation for to do a crime. A very bad thing happened once in Germany here. A man saw a teenager at a railway station, who was sad, and asked "What's wrong, may I help?" - the teenager murdered him.
Then you wonder why we carry guns here?
A gun is a thing, which throws little pieces of metal with a very high speed through the air. If someone takes not care such pieces of metal are able to hurt a living organism - in worst case someone dies, because of the use of such toys. I think to use guns is a boring and stupid game from idiots for idiots.

That toy may save my life someday, so this idiot will always keep his.
How long have you owned this gun? You say it "may" save your life "someday" which implies you've never needed it. Do you think maybe, you don't need this gun, but you got snookered into buying one because of right wing fear and paranoia.

I cannot tell you how many times people on this board have told me I "need" a gun to protect myself. I'm 71 years old and I have never "needed" a gun in my life. I used to play poker in Toronto in underground rooms and hung out with pretty dodgy people in my time, so it's not like I lived this pristine "church lady" life that never exposed me to any dangers.

You people have sold your souls to the NRA, and what did you get in return? 35,000 shootings deaths every year. 1000 children gunned killed by guns every year. More mass shootings than the rest of the world combined.

Gun violence costs your economy $229 billion per year:


This is a piece from the Globe and Mail in Toronto on the economic costs of gun violence in Canada. Canada's population is 1/10th that of the US. If you factor in the population differences, the economic cost of gun violence in Canada is $3 billion, compared to $299 billion for the USA.


Since Americans don't care about the bloodshed, or the children dying, let's point out the ONLY thing that matters to Americans. The cost to the economy.

$229 billion per year, is what your obsession with guns costs. Is it worth it?
Your numbers are way off btw, and yes, some of us have used our guns to stop people from killing us, or others.
I've never used either of the fire extinguishers I keep handy, and I haven't put a tourniquet on anyone since Afghanistan, but I'm not getting rid of those either.

And I have to wonder why you are so against someone keeping a piece of emergency, life-saving equipment (which is what a pistol is) handy...... that doesn't seem like the behavior of someone with good intentions to me, it sounds like someone who wants to see people die.
Why do you want people to die?
Same thing with house or car insurance. The chances of you needing it are very slim unless you're careless or a bad driver, but if you do ever need it, you'll be glad it's there.

What we can't pound through the heads of leftists is that guns don't kill people--people kill people. A person who wants to kill another person or several people are not going to allow no access to guns to stop them.

At 60 years old, I can honestly say recreational narcotics have been illegal my entire time on this planet. Yet today, we have a worse problem with narcotics, especially the hard stuff than we ever had before. OD deaths have reached record levels.

In spite of that, leftists believe that if they could strip us of all our guns, the bad guys would surrender theirs too, and we would have a gun-free society outside of police officers and armed security. Liberals live in fairy land.
No I don't think they believe that at all.
I think they for some reason, resent the hell out of people who are better prepared for things than they are; they don't like it when someone is stronger, smarter, better educated, or better equipped than they are.
I don't for the life of me understand why they don't simply improve themselves rather than trying to handicap everyone else, but it seems like that's all they want to do.
Dragonlady is Canadian, so she has a different agenda than leftists here. As for leftists here, they are merely sheep. So why does the party promote gun confiscation?

If they could override the US Constitution, take all our guns and ammo, they know that would only leave the police and criminals who had weapons. Crime would skyrocket because cops can't be everywhere, and we would all be helpless to armed criminals. They could break into our homes in the middle of the night, and unless you can get to your phone fast enough, we would be totally helpless. They could rape our women and children, steal anything of value in the house, tie us up and light the place on fire, and there would be nothing we could do about it.

So gun confiscation would create a new problem: Big crime. And how would we be able to fight big crime? The same way we fight big pharma, big business, big tobacco, big polluters, and that is with a bigger government.

More prisons, more courts, more court employees, more lawyers........

The Democrat party exists because of two groups of people: government dependents and victims. If we could rid ourselves of both, the only time you'd see Democrats would be in history books. It's important they keep expanding those two groups for power. Therefore, disarming us makes us victims, and more people to potentially support the Democrat party.
 
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a citizen of that country who is a licensed CCW holder and a black belt in martial arts
Really? Me too.
:beer:

I am nowhere near the badass that my wife is. Her family has a LONG history in martial arts. Her brother owns the biggest school in Utah. That dude is a millionaire and his kids are famous YouTubers: Ninja Kidz TV

(bastard didn't even graduate from high school and I have had 20 years of formal education--I have been cheated)
Don't feel bad, a lot of wealthy people never had an advanced education. Running a business is more about talent and desire. Education helps, but is not a necessary requirement.

I'm a little too old to be fighting, but I still remember a lot of what I was taught, especially when using deadly force. As you already know, when you start getting to the more advanced belts, you are trained to kill people in just a few moves, so learning the laws about it was part of the program.

One lesson I expressed concern about the law and possibly killing somebody. My instructor told me if in a battle, never think about karate. You just fight like you always did before you even knew how to front kick.

After his demonstration, I was amazed. I was using moves I never even thought about for years. The instructor just smiled at me and said "wax on--wax off."
That "was on--wax off" concept really sank in for me when I branched into Wing Chun (I wanted to understand Bruce Lee's methods) and started using the mook jong (wooden dummy). They cost over $1000 retail, so I just built one by gluing and clamping 8 2x10x84 Southern Yellow Pine deck boards together, cutting the holes before a final glue up, and shaving it into a "log" with a cheap, Harbor Freight electric hand planer. :laugh: Made the biggest mess. I made the leg and the arms by gluing 1x4 poplar and red oak boards in a pattern I found on the web.

3B4E65B1-203D-4169-BA7C-7E57C7B37534.jpeg
7DE8DDB8-3139-41C7-A43D-7250C044692B.jpeg


The leg was really tricky.

We had a "fight club" at my buddy's house every Wednesday night. When I started training on the dummy, I noticed (and so did the other guys) that the hand/leg/center-line positioning the dummy form drills into your brain becomes automatic. They were surprised at the lack of openings I provided, and how my stance and approach would throw off their balance.
:meow:
:auiqs.jpg:
Fun stuff.

But, like you said, when you do get to the higher levels, it is a one or two move take down. Even non-lethal actions can aggravate charges to a felony if the use is not justified.

One move in the 3rd segment of the Wing Chun dummy form will destroy a knee, and can be employed both defensively and offensively at the same time.

myFile (4).gif

That move.

Causes serious bodily injury (blown knee) so you better have a good reason for it.
:laugh2:

:beer:
 
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I'm anti gun, anti trump, anti racist cons which those couple are probably but I don't blame them for defending their property from trespassers.
From what I understand, they are hard leftists.
Still my position is stated above.
Only in America thugh, in other countries is not necessary....here is too violent, people are culturally violent and killings are the norm. Many of you gun lovers don't know that there are countless of countries living without guns, no shootings at school, work places......I know it is hard to understand. Not strange where most don't even know where cANADA is, or who the founding fathers are, or when the independence took place and so forth...thinks that me as an immigrant knew by heart in elementary school overseas in 3 languages.
America is not other countries. In fact, we are really one of a kind. Our problem is not guns, our problem is we thought this concept of a melting pot would work. It never has, and still doesn't.

The other countries you speak of are virtually one culture people. We are not that. Besides different races of people, we also have different cultures. You cannot successfully force the tiger and hyena to live together. One will end up killing the other.

I've made this point many times before: If you made law that all people in a low crime nice white middle-class suburb had to own a gun, their crime rate will not change. At the same time, if you created a law that nobody in a high crime minority city can own a gun, their crime rate will not change either. Hence, the object used to kill people is not what makes the difference.

And this is the ignorance of the left. They blame the object instead of the people for crime.
You are so wrong at so many levels I don't know where to begin.
Let's take Australia for example, almost identical history to the US there were natives, than European came in slaughtered them and took their land...later on more European migrants came in....down the road more migrants came in from many parts of the world and especially from third world countries just like the US. They don't have the same problems the US suffers from especially gun massacres, mass shootings, killings left and right and so forth....they have a far better quality life in general, better education system, better health care and list goes on.

And who the hell gave you the right to dictate who can come in and who can not? just because you landed here earlier than the rest of us? Did you even ask the original land owners?
Except, no not really.
Not up to you those are facts.
View attachment 361405

Tell me again how much better the Aussies have it?
Holy....



That is some serious authoritarian bullshit, right there.
 

zaangalewa

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
Unlike where you live, people here are very aware of safety precautions when using firearms.
That's a joke.

As a CCW holder, I've had 10 hours of class time, and 2 hours of range time before getting my license. There is nothing you can tell me about guns that I don't already know.
Guns are shit. Exploding shit. Exponentially exploding shit.

 
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Ray From Cleveland

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
Unlike where you live, people here are very aware of safety precautions when using firearms.
That's a joke.

As a CCW holder, I've had 10 hours of class time, and 2 hours of range time before getting my license. There is nothing you can tell me about guns that I don't already know.
Guns are shit. Exploding shit. Exponentially exploding shit.

No, rounds (bullets) are exploding shit. Guns are merely the tool used to set off that explosion. In these firearms discussions, I often find evidence to conclude the anti-gun people are usually people that never shot a gun in their lives. They are simply scared of the unknown.
 

irosie91

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
Unlike where you live, people here are very aware of safety precautions when using firearms.
That's a joke.

As a CCW holder, I've had 10 hours of class time, and 2 hours of range time before getting my license. There is nothing you can tell me about guns that I don't already know.
Guns are shit. Exploding shit. Exponentially exploding shit.

No, rounds (bullets) are exploding shit. Guns are merely the tool used to set off that explosion. In these firearms discussions, I often find evidence to conclude the anti-gun people are usually people that never shot a gun in their lives. They are simply scared of the unknown.
Please do not use the terminology of the racists-----your comment reminds me of the racists who claim that "whites" are "afraid" of blacks ---
 

zaangalewa

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... Will I need my gun in the future? I certainly hope not. But if I do, I'll be glad I had it.
... and shoot you into your own foot? Or your baby finds it and kills the own mother, your wife? And ... and ... and ... . If someone is weaponed, then he has also always to be aware someone else is able to kill him with the own weapon.
Unlike where you live, people here are very aware of safety precautions when using firearms.
That's a joke.

As a CCW holder, I've had 10 hours of class time, and 2 hours of range time before getting my license. There is nothing you can tell me about guns that I don't already know.
Guns are shit. Exploding shit. Exponentially exploding shit.

No, rounds (bullets) are exploding shit. Guns are merely the tool used to set off that explosion. In these firearms discussions, I often find evidence to conclude the anti-gun people are usually people that never shot a gun in their lives. They are simply scared of the unknown.
You sound like a drug addict or alcoholics. Most weapon addicts sound like drug addicts. No one needs to take drugs or weapons to find out that drugs or weapons are shit. It's the responsibility of the leaders of a community to take care that no one needs any weapon. And the best way to realize this is it to make very strict weapon laws.
 
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