So, is Trump breaking a few eggs or burning down the kitchen?

[usmbguest5318]

Rush was positively giddy

Typical.

CNN was talking about the literal end of our republic as we know it

Typical.

Fox didn't notice anything unusual happening.

Say what? Something that (1) has happened twice in modern history and (2) this most recent time wasn't expected given the POTUS' recent (about a week ago) remarks about the FBI Director doesn't count as "unusual?"

 

[usmbguest5318]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election. And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

^^ This!

There's more afoot than just optics. I don't know exactly what it is, but it's there...were it not, the WH would not, in face of ever increasing scrutiny, keep changing its story about why Comey was fired.

The question is will we find out before or after Trump's tenure in the WH ends.

 

[rightwinger]

Well, yesterday - the day after Comey's firing - sure was interesting. Most of the media was in hysterics, Rush was positively giddy, CNN was talking about the literal end of our republic as we know it, and of course Fox didn't notice anything unusual happening.

As for me, my personal nightmare scenario is playing out in real time: Trump is creating absolute chaos at a level somehow far beyond everything I had feared, opening the door for the "progressives" (ha) in the Democratic party to take back control before long, and before the party can first go through its badly-needed Reformation. Wild, insane swings, back and forth, the last thing we need right now.

They say "you have to break a few eggs to make the omelette", and holy shit, I don't see any intact eggs anywhere and I'm definitely smelling smoke.

So how about you? Is this what you expected (good or bad), or have we managed to go beyond your expectations (good or bad)?
.

Where there is smoke, there is fire

How will the American public view this?
An honest removal of a nonperforming public servant or Trump trying to squash an investigation into his Russian ties?

This could bring down the Republican Party if they are viewed as contributing to a massive cover up

 

[miketx]

Trump realizes his mistake, and hires Comey back. Headline reads, "Trump flip flops again, decisions can't be trusted!"

 

[miketx]

List the evidence that Trump colluded with the Russians.

You will never get a response. All they do is sling and hope.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Well, yesterday - the day after Comey's firing - sure was interesting. Most of the media was in hysterics, Rush was positively giddy, CNN was talking about the literal end of our republic as we know it, and of course Fox didn't notice anything unusual happening.

As for me, my personal nightmare scenario is playing out in real time: Trump is creating absolute chaos at a level somehow far beyond everything I had feared, opening the door for the "progressives" (ha) in the Democratic party to take back control before long, and before the party can first go through its badly-needed Reformation. Wild, insane swings, back and forth, the last thing we need right now.

They say "you have to break a few eggs to make the omelette", and holy shit, I don't see any intact eggs anywhere and I'm definitely smelling smoke.

So how about you? Is this what you expected (good or bad), or have we managed to go beyond your expectations (good or bad)?
.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

I don't fault him for firing Comey. What begs questions is the timing. It seems that everywhere you turn Trump is firing someone connected to the the Russian investigation. It could mean nothing but the perception will invite conspiracy theories throughout his term.

I mentioned on another thread that, under normal circumstances, you would think that the President had thought it through, weighed the pros and the cons, including whether the person he's firing could come back and ruin him.

But I'm just not seeing that kind of pragmatism out of the White House so far.
.

So true. It seems poorly thought out at best.
When looking at the whole picture, the president's actions seem insane.

Yates testifies. Her testimony is clear and concise and raised serious questions about the president's judgement regarding Flynn.

Two days later, without warning to anyone, including his own staff, the president fires Comey sending our institutions into a chaotic uproar.

The very next day, the president meets with the Russian Foreign Minister at the WH and only the Russian media is admitted.

Add in all of the incidentals like the Obama warnings on Flynn, the fact that Comey had requested additional resources for the investigation, Sessions making a recommendation despite his recusal, the WH staff leaking stories of total chaos at the WH, Spicer hiding in the bushes to avoid questions and the Senate Intel Cmte just yesterday sent a subpoena for Flynn's documents and it certainly creates a picture of insanity.

 

[Kondor3]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

 

[rightwinger]

I don't fault him for firing Comey. What begs questions is the timing. It seems that everywhere you turn Trump is firing someone connected to the the Russian investigation. It could mean nothing but the perception will invite conspiracy theories throughout his term.

I mentioned on another thread that, under normal circumstances, you would think that the President had thought it through, weighed the pros and the cons, including whether the person he's firing could come back and ruin him.

But I'm just not seeing that kind of pragmatism out of the White House so far.
.

So true. It seems poorly thought out at best.
When looking at the whole picture, the president's actions seem insane.

Yates testifies. Her testimony is clear and concise and raised serious questions about the president's judgement regarding Flynn.

Two days later, without warning to anyone, including his own staff, the president fires Comey sending our institutions into a chaotic uproar.

The very next day, the president meets with the Russian Foreign Minister at the WH and only the Russian media is admitted.

Add in all of the incidentals like the Obama warnings on Flynn, the fact that Comey had requested additional resources for the investigation, Sessions making a recommendation despite his recusal, the WH staff leaking stories of total chaos at the WH, Spicer hiding in the bushes to avoid questions and the Senate Intel Cmte just yesterday sent a subpoena for Flynn's documents and it certainly creates a picture of insanity.

I like how Trump insisted a statement commending Comey for saying "three times" that he was not under investigation


Something Comey has refused to say

 

[Hutch Starskey]

The timing of it is key to what Trump actually thinks of Comey's job performance. If this was about Comey mishandling the investigation into Clinton's emails, he would have fired him months ago.

Except he praised Comey for those actions saying he regained his credibility.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

The posse may be getting too close. If you want to stymie an investigation, firing the director of the body investigating you is a sure way to do it.

If the reasoning is that it just "took time" to replace him, much larger governmental organizations had new leadership appointed and confirmed by the Senate... that excuse doesn't hold water.

In the meantime, watch the FBI start leaking like a sieve for the way they did Comey.

 

[mudwhistle]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

Obviously it does, or you wouldn't feel that way. Your opinion colors your perceptions.


The left lived off of a positive perception of Obama, or to put it another way, they were wearing Rose-Colored Glasses.
To wit; Everything Obama did must have had a good reason.

However, you've swallowed the media's false narrative that everything Trump does has to have been for a bad reason.

When it came to Obama, sending billions of our tax dollars to Iran, a known terrorist state and sworn enemy, must have had some justification.
But Trump fires his FBI director for incompetence and you feel he did a terrible thing.

James Comey was roundly criticized for handing Trump the election. He had zero credibility. His approvals were down at the level of the US Congress and serial killers.
Now that he's gone he's supposedly been unfairly sacked by a president that you idiots think is under investigation.
Oh...poor James Comey. Let's give him an award now.

 

[Kondor3]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

Obviously it does, or you wouldn't feel that way. Your opinion colors your perceptions.


The left lived off of a positive perception of Obama, or to put it another way, they were wearing Rose-Colored Glasses.
To wit; Everything Obama did must have had a good reason.

However, you've swallowed the media's false narrative that everything Trump does has to have been for a bad reason.

When it came to Obama, sending billions of our tax dollars to Iran, a known terrorist state and sworn enemy, must have had some justification.
But Trump fires his FBI director for incompetence and you feel he did a terrible thing.

James Comey was roundly criticized for handing Trump the election. He had zero credibility. His approvals were down at the level of the US Congress and serial killers.
Now that he's gone he's supposedly been unfairly sacked by a president that you idiots think is under investigation.
Oh...poor James Comey. Let's give him an award now.

I couldn't give a rat's ass less about Comey, or Leftist angst over the most recent.

What I care about is integrity and honesty and transparency and sensitivity and competency.

Attributes sorely lacking in the Trump Administration.

Of course my opinion colors my perception.

Your opinion colors your perception, as well.

Dog bites Man.

That's a Gimme... obvious.

But the perception that the Trump Administration is optics-blind and arrogant and dissembling and opaque and incompetent, is well-founded in evidence, since January 20, 2017.

You just haven't come to grips yet, that you backed a charlatan and shell-game flim-flam man, who is incapable of delivering on his promises, and who has no center of gravity.

I, for one, am totally in favor of harsh pursuit of Illegal Aliens, and aggressive pursuit of better trade deals, and to stop screwing-around with several foreign powers.

Your boy, however, and his demagogic autocratic tendencies and self-aggrandizing and self-enriching misuse of power, was predictable, and far too high a price to pay.

 

[gipper]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

Obviously it does, or you wouldn't feel that way. Your opinion colors your perceptions.


The left lived off of a positive perception of Obama, or to put it another way, they were wearing Rose-Colored Glasses.
To wit; Everything Obama did must have had a good reason.

However, you've swallowed the media's false narrative that everything Trump does has to have been for a bad reason.

When it came to Obama, sending billions of our tax dollars to Iran, a known terrorist state and sworn enemy, must have had some justification.
But Trump fires his FBI director for incompetence and you feel he did a terrible thing.

James Comey was roundly criticized for handing Trump the election. He had zero credibility. His approvals were down at the level of the US Congress and serial killers.
Now that he's gone he's supposedly been unfairly sacked by a president that you idiots think is under investigation.
Oh...poor James Comey. Let's give him an award now.

It seems most on the left, like those who post here, merely parrot whatever the MSM tells them. They clearly can't be expected to think for themselves.

The hypocrisy by the left with Comey is AMAZING, yet many average run-the-mill leftists still get duped by the MSM. They are willfully blind.

I guess the only benefit of all this is we now have a media that attacks the POTUS 24/7, unlike the past eight years of being a lapdog for the prior POTUS.

 

[mudwhistle]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

Obviously it does, or you wouldn't feel that way. Your opinion colors your perceptions.


The left lived off of a positive perception of Obama, or to put it another way, they were wearing Rose-Colored Glasses.
To wit; Everything Obama did must have had a good reason.

However, you've swallowed the media's false narrative that everything Trump does has to have been for a bad reason.

When it came to Obama, sending billions of our tax dollars to Iran, a known terrorist state and sworn enemy, must have had some justification.
But Trump fires his FBI director for incompetence and you feel he did a terrible thing.

James Comey was roundly criticized for handing Trump the election. He had zero credibility. His approvals were down at the level of the US Congress and serial killers.
Now that he's gone he's supposedly been unfairly sacked by a president that you idiots think is under investigation.
Oh...poor James Comey. Let's give him an award now.

Of course my opinion colors my perception.

Your opinion colors your perception, as well.

Dog bites Man.

That's a Gimme... obvious.

But the perception that the Trump Administration is optics-blind and arrogant and dissembling and opaque and incompetent, is well-founded in evidence, since January 20, 2017.

You just haven't come to grips yet, that you backed a charlatan and shell-game flim-flam man, who is incapable of delivering on his promises, and who has no center of gravity.

I, for one, am totally in favor of harsh pursuit of Illegal Aliens, and aggressive pursuit of better trade deals, and to stop screwing-around with several foreign powers.

Your boy, however, and his demagogic autocratic tendencies and self-aggrandizing and self-enriching misuse of power, was predictable, and far too high a price to pay.

And thus you prove my point.

 

[Kondor3]

The President of the United States has just fired the high official charged with investigating his alleged involvement with foreign interference in a US general election.

And then he meets with the Russian Foreign Minister, during which time he holds the American press at arms' length, while allowing the Russians to use it as a photo op.

Terrible, terrible optics.

Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Even if Comey was the worst Director in the history of the Bureau, the optics and timing and related were - again, for the thousandth time - very badly botched.

At a bare-bones minimum, this Administration is incompetent.

Let us hope that the Comey Firing triggers the creation of a Special Prosecutor with full powers and resources to get to the bottom of all this.

It is in the interests of the Republic, its People, and both mainstream political parties, to investigate the Russia Connection, and to restore the confidence of Americans.

I think your problem is you have no trust in Trump. Everything else emanates from that.

I have no trust in Trump.

That does not, however, have anything to do with the optics nor judgment nor arrogance nor incompetency attributable to this Administration.

Obviously it does, or you wouldn't feel that way. Your opinion colors your perceptions.


The left lived off of a positive perception of Obama, or to put it another way, they were wearing Rose-Colored Glasses.
To wit; Everything Obama did must have had a good reason.

However, you've swallowed the media's false narrative that everything Trump does has to have been for a bad reason.

When it came to Obama, sending billions of our tax dollars to Iran, a known terrorist state and sworn enemy, must have had some justification.
But Trump fires his FBI director for incompetence and you feel he did a terrible thing.

James Comey was roundly criticized for handing Trump the election. He had zero credibility. His approvals were down at the level of the US Congress and serial killers.
Now that he's gone he's supposedly been unfairly sacked by a president that you idiots think is under investigation.
Oh...poor James Comey. Let's give him an award now.

Of course my opinion colors my perception.

Your opinion colors your perception, as well.

Dog bites Man.

That's a Gimme... obvious.

But the perception that the Trump Administration is optics-blind and arrogant and dissembling and opaque and incompetent, is well-founded in evidence, since January 20, 2017.

You just haven't come to grips yet, that you backed a charlatan and shell-game flim-flam man, who is incapable of delivering on his promises, and who has no center of gravity.

I, for one, am totally in favor of harsh pursuit of Illegal Aliens, and aggressive pursuit of better trade deals, and to stop screwing-around with several foreign powers.

Your boy, however, and his demagogic autocratic tendencies and self-aggrandizing and self-enriching misuse of power, was predictable, and far too high a price to pay.

And thus you prove my point.

We prove each others' point... namely, that opinions color perceptions... not exactly news, eh?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Well, yesterday - the day after Comey's firing - sure was interesting. Most of the media was in hysterics, Rush was positively giddy, CNN was talking about the literal end of our republic as we know it, and of course Fox didn't notice anything unusual happening.

As for me, my personal nightmare scenario is playing out in real time: Trump is creating absolute chaos at a level somehow far beyond everything I had feared, opening the door for the "progressives" (ha) in the Democratic party to take back control before long, and before the party can first go through its badly-needed Reformation. Wild, insane swings, back and forth, the last thing we need right now.

They say "you have to break a few eggs to make the omelette", and holy shit, I don't see any intact eggs anywhere and I'm definitely smelling smoke.

So how about you? Is this what you expected (good or bad), or have we managed to go beyond your expectations (good or bad)?
.

Trump isn't creating chaos.
The media is creating chaos.

Maybe you need to take a big step back and just watch what is going on instead of falling for the false rhetoric everyone is spewing.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

I don't fault him for firing Comey. What begs questions is the timing. It seems that everywhere you turn Trump is firing someone connected to the the Russian investigation. It could mean nothing but the perception will invite conspiracy theories throughout his term.

I mentioned on another thread that, under normal circumstances, you would think that the President had thought it through, weighed the pros and the cons, including whether the person he's firing could come back and ruin him.

But I'm just not seeing that kind of pragmatism out of the White House so far.
.

So true. It seems poorly thought out at best.
When looking at the whole picture, the president's actions seem insane.

Yates testifies. Her testimony is clear and concise and raised serious questions about the president's judgement regarding Flynn.

Two days later, without warning to anyone, including his own staff, the president fires Comey sending our institutions into a chaotic uproar.

The very next day, the president meets with the Russian Foreign Minister at the WH and only the Russian media is admitted.

Add in all of the incidentals like the Obama warnings on Flynn, the fact that Comey had requested additional resources for the investigation, Sessions making a recommendation despite his recusal, the WH staff leaking stories of total chaos at the WH, Spicer hiding in the bushes to avoid questions and the Senate Intel Cmte just yesterday sent a subpoena for Flynn's documents and it certainly creates a picture of insanity.

I like how Trump insisted a statement commending Comey for saying "three times" that he was not under investigation


Something Comey has refused to say

That was just bizarre to include that. You know Trump insisted that be included.

 

[Crixus]

Well, yesterday - the day after Comey's firing - sure was interesting. Most of the media was in hysterics, Rush was positively giddy, CNN was talking about the literal end of our republic as we know it, and of course Fox didn't notice anything unusual happening.

As for me, my personal nightmare scenario is playing out in real time: Trump is creating absolute chaos at a level somehow far beyond everything I had feared, opening the door for the "progressives" (ha) in the Democratic party to take back control before long, and before the party can first go through its badly-needed Reformation. Wild, insane swings, back and forth, the last thing we need right now.

They say "you have to break a few eggs to make the omelette", and holy shit, I don't see any intact eggs anywhere and I'm definitely smelling smoke.

So how about you? Is this what you expected (good or bad), or have we managed to go beyond your expectations (good or bad)?
.

Chaos ? Stop panicking. Take a deep breath and relax. See, the news guys on cable have to keep you scared so you will watch their news channel. It would be best to hold any news report on TV in the same reguards as a young teens excuse for being out all night. There is no chaos. Just folks being manipulated with their emotions.

 

[Seawytch]

Terrible, terrible optics. Terrible, gawdawful judgment.

Yeah. If nothing else, it smells bad, and they're just walking right into it, chin first.

I realize this all plays great with his base, or at least they say it does, but it's just an insane way to run an American presidency.
.

I don't get how it plays well to their base. Their base doesn't want to have to defend seemingly indefensible positions.