Sick and tired of US debate on raising the min. wage.

[Oldestyle]

Around nineteen percent for the previous decade. It is awful for minimum wage earners trying to be able to afford our first world economy.

Don't be so uppity and charge so much for rent, groceries, fuel, car insurance, mental health insurance, and so on and so forth. If there's a minimum wage, don't be such a buttfucker and raise the minimum rent above what that can pay for.

Floor, walls, windows and doors, roof to keep the rain and snow out, kitchen and bath -- keep the cost down a little let people build on their own -- don't force such a High California standard of living that people can't afford it anyways. Prison isn't comfortable, and it isn't cheap either.

Inflation still happens regardless. Only right wingers prefer to "hate on the Poor" instead of being more market friendly.

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

 

[justinacolmena]

Don't expect the government to give you things

Don't expect the government to let you keep the things you own or the money you earn either.

 

[justinacolmena]

When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it.

There's a federal prison in Denver, Colorado offers nicer digs than that, Mr. Buttfucker Asshole.

 

[danielpalos]

Inflation still happens regardless. Only right wingers prefer to "hate on the Poor" instead of being more market friendly.

Being "friendly," spending more money and pandering to "the market" only raises prices out of reach of the poor.

Not when wages outpace inflation.

 

[danielpalos]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

 

[danielpalos]

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

My point is that Government Costs. Why complain about taxes for social services that help pick up the slack for Capitalists paying low wages?

 

[Oldestyle]

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

My point is that Government Costs. Why complain about taxes for social services that help pick up the slack for Capitalists paying low wages?

What you need to understand, Daniel is that taxes take money out of the Private Sector which means less investment and less job growth. The more you take out...the more you strangle the economy. It's a concept that you don't seem to grasp. Everything you propose here is going to take jobs away from people who need them.

 

[Oldestyle]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

 

[danielpalos]

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

My point is that Government Costs. Why complain about taxes for social services that help pick up the slack for Capitalists paying low wages?

What you need to understand, Daniel is that taxes take money out of the Private Sector which means less investment and less job growth. The more you take out...the more you strangle the economy. It's a concept that you don't seem to grasp. Everything you propose here is going to take jobs away from people who need them.

In other words, Your solution is to subsidize the Cost of labor for Capitalists' bottom line and still whine about taxes for social services?

 

[danielpalos]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

Inflation happens regardless. Inflation happened even with the minimum wage stagnating for around a decade. What is Your basis for such drama over any potential inflation from a Minimum wage?

 

[Oldestyle]

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

My point is that Government Costs. Why complain about taxes for social services that help pick up the slack for Capitalists paying low wages?

What you need to understand, Daniel is that taxes take money out of the Private Sector which means less investment and less job growth. The more you take out...the more you strangle the economy. It's a concept that you don't seem to grasp. Everything you propose here is going to take jobs away from people who need them.

In other words, Your solution is to subsidize the Cost of labor for Capitalists' bottom line and still whine about taxes for social services?

Your "solution" is to take jobs away from people and put them on a government "dole"! That isn't good for the people or for the country. Minimum Wage isn't supposed to be something that people remain on for a long period of time! I'm sorry but just isn't! It's what businesses pay entry level employees with few job skills. Part of what someone receives as an entry level worker is training that qualifies them for better jobs and better pay. You don't seem to understand that and I wonder why that is?

 

[Oldestyle]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

Inflation happens regardless. Inflation happened even with the minimum wage stagnating for around a decade. What is Your basis for such drama over any potential inflation from a Minimum wage?

One more time, Daniel...

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF THAT INCREASING MINIMUM WAGE BY SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT WON'T CAUSE INFLATION?

 

[danielpalos]

Your "solution" is to take jobs away from people and put them on a government "dole"! That isn't good for the people or for the country. Minimum Wage isn't supposed to be something that people remain on for a long period of time! I'm sorry but just isn't! It's what businesses pay entry level employees with few job skills. Part of what someone receives as an entry level worker is training that qualifies them for better jobs and better pay. You don't seem to understand that and I wonder why that is?

I am advocating for more comprehensive unemployment compensation which has an already measured multiplier of two. What is the ratio of employees employers would lay off or reduce their hours? Most of their labor force would still be working and making the higher wages and therefore creating more in demand and generating more tax revenue; the multiplier would have its usual effect, demand would increase employers will start to hire more people to meet that additional demand.

 

[danielpalos]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

Inflation happens regardless. Inflation happened even with the minimum wage stagnating for around a decade. What is Your basis for such drama over any potential inflation from a Minimum wage?

One more time, Daniel...

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF THAT INCREASING MINIMUM WAGE BY SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT WON'T CAUSE INFLATION?

I am saying inflation won't be a problem with supply side economics. We have not had a supply problem in the past it was a demand problem. And, the Fed has more to work with when there is some inflation.

 

[Oldestyle]

Your "solution" is to take jobs away from people and put them on a government "dole"! That isn't good for the people or for the country. Minimum Wage isn't supposed to be something that people remain on for a long period of time! I'm sorry but just isn't! It's what businesses pay entry level employees with few job skills. Part of what someone receives as an entry level worker is training that qualifies them for better jobs and better pay. You don't seem to understand that and I wonder why that is?

I am advocating for more comprehensive unemployment compensation which has an already measured multiplier of two. What is the ratio of employees employers would lay off or reduce their hours? Most of their labor force would still be working and making the higher wages and therefore creating more in demand and generating more tax revenue; the multiplier would have its usual effect, demand would increase employers will start to hire more people to meet that additional demand.

The CBO is estimating that 1.3 million Americans would lose their jobs if the $15 minimum wage was passed. They are also predicting a slower economy and increased inflation.

 

[Oldestyle]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

Inflation happens regardless. Inflation happened even with the minimum wage stagnating for around a decade. What is Your basis for such drama over any potential inflation from a Minimum wage?

One more time, Daniel...

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF THAT INCREASING MINIMUM WAGE BY SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT WON'T CAUSE INFLATION?

I am saying inflation won't be a problem with supply side economics. We have not had a supply problem in the past it was a demand problem. And, the Fed has more to work with when there is some inflation.

Would you care to explain why the number crunchers at the CBO have gotten it wrong, Daniel?

 

[dblack]

You don't seem to understand that and I wonder why that is?

Kush

 

[Rigby5]

Around nineteen percent for the previous decade. It is awful for minimum wage earners trying to be able to afford our first world economy.

Don't be so uppity and charge so much for rent, groceries, fuel, car insurance, mental health insurance, and so on and so forth. If there's a minimum wage, don't be such a buttfucker and raise the minimum rent above what that can pay for.

Floor, walls, windows and doors, roof to keep the rain and snow out, kitchen and bath -- keep the cost down a little let people build on their own -- don't force such a High California standard of living that people can't afford it anyways. Prison isn't comfortable, and it isn't cheap either.

Inflation still happens regardless. Only right wingers prefer to "hate on the Poor" instead of being more market friendly.

If you can't afford rent...get a roomate...get two...get three! When I lived in Aspen ski bums would cram ten people into a two bedroom apartment because the rent was so high it was the only way to swing it. That had nothing to do with someone being "uppity"...it was all about supply and demand. The market set the price on rentals. People adapted to be able to live there. The concept isn't any different for low income people looking for affordable housing.

Use the barter system. Offer your landlord something in value in return for a lower rent. What skills do you have that are valuable? A good friend of mine was a carpenter before he went to college...he got cheap rent by renovating apartments one at a time as he was living in them. He had to move about every three months which sucked but his rent was next to nothing.

My point is if you want to make it in this world...use your head. Don't expect the government to give you things. Everything you need is out there waiting for you to get off your ass and figure out how to take advantage of it!

That is unrealistic.
Sure, as a student we crammed a many people are we could.
I lived in a closet.
But the point is ever since the industrial revolution, those with capital have a monopoly on jobs, and ever since the frontier was gone, you have no escape from that economic dictatorship.
But people have a right to a living wage they can raise a family on.
And rents are through the roof due to unfair tax laws and mortgage lending practices, again established by monopolies.

So a reasonable minimum wage is required, since most people don't have union collective bargaining protection.
It is just unclear to me exactly what it should be because it likely should be dependent on local conditions, not federal.

 

[Rigby5]

Name a single time that we've ever increased the minimum wage by the amount that you on the left are demanding! You can't because we've NEVER been that stupid before now!

Only because the minimum wage was not adjusted for around a decade while inflation still happened. Don't blame the left when it is right wingers who only have right wing fantasy about the benefits of Capitalism, which can't even help wages for the Poor meet or beat inflation.

So you can't name a single time we've ever increased the minimum wage by this amount? Then how is it exactly that you're able to make the claim that it won't be inflationary? What do you base that on, Daniel? Wishful thinking?

I don't have to fantasize about the benefits of Capitalism. I can simply look at the amount of wealth that it has created and the millions of people that it has taken out of poverty. There is a reason why poor people from around the globe have wanted to come to America! It isn't because it the land of high minimum wages! It's because America is the land of opportunity. A place where with a great idea and a lot of hard work...you can become wildly successful.

Means nothing. Sounds like a good excuse for businesses to legitimately as for a tax break instead of tax breaks being handed out like candy by the previous administration.

I just asked you a very straight forward question, Daniel and you dodged it as usual. You claim that going to a $15 an hour minimum wage won't be inflationary. What do you base that on?

Inflation happens regardless. Inflation happened even with the minimum wage stagnating for around a decade. What is Your basis for such drama over any potential inflation from a Minimum wage?

One more time, Daniel...

DO YOU HAVE ANY PROOF THAT INCREASING MINIMUM WAGE BY SUCH A LARGE AMOUNT WON'T CAUSE INFLATION?

I can answer that, since I have been in business many times, for many decades.
In general, raising minimum wage won't have much of an effect.
If you have your business running efficiently, then labor is less than a third of your overhead. And most already are not minimum wage earners. So then the increase in costs will likely be smaller than 5% or so. Which should not effect most businesses very much.

The exception is a very low markup, high unskilled labor business.
Fast food, Walmart, and those kinds of places.
But a 5% increase, making burgers cost ten cents more, is not going to hurt any business, because all fast food will be going up the same amount.

 

[Rigby5]

Your "solution" is to take jobs away from people and put them on a government "dole"! That isn't good for the people or for the country. Minimum Wage isn't supposed to be something that people remain on for a long period of time! I'm sorry but just isn't! It's what businesses pay entry level employees with few job skills. Part of what someone receives as an entry level worker is training that qualifies them for better jobs and better pay. You don't seem to understand that and I wonder why that is?

I am advocating for more comprehensive unemployment compensation which has an already measured multiplier of two. What is the ratio of employees employers would lay off or reduce their hours? Most of their labor force would still be working and making the higher wages and therefore creating more in demand and generating more tax revenue; the multiplier would have its usual effect, demand would increase employers will start to hire more people to meet that additional demand.

The CBO is estimating that 1.3 million Americans would lose their jobs if the $15 minimum wage was passed. They are also predicting a slower economy and increased inflation.

Other people are predicting that since minimum wage people spend instead of saving or investing, that an increase in minimum wage employment will be the best way possible to boost the economy.
Inflation is good to some degree, because it reduces the pain of repaying loans the businesses took out to get started.
We want some constant inflation.
It reduces old debt.