same sex marriage

[indianaboy]

In the United States same sex marriage doesnt have to do with religious institutions recognizing the marriage rather the state, which is a secular democracy, recognizing it.

And, of course, marriage is not a concept that is unique to Christianity... Also, if a certain group of Christians wants to recognize same sex marriage its their decision. No demoniation of christianity follows everything as stated in the bible. ALL and I do mean ALL christians pick and choose what they want to believe from the bible.

where does it say in the bible "just use the parts that suits you and you'll be alright".

o shut up froggy...i am late to this debate...but are you following the bible to the letter? somehow i seriously doubt that....do you wear blended cloths? do you dare plant two crops in one field? are you taking slaves from canada or mexico? the list just goes on and on...for example...how is the sun rotating around the earth working for ya?

Bible never says the Sun rotates the Earth... and as Christians, we are not under the Law anymore.

 

[BigBarry]

Sodomy = anal sex.

God said don't do it.

He actually had to mention it? Was there a big epidemic of fudge packing?

 

[logical4u]

You're one of those straight laced, fanatical, rabid GOP Christians ain't ya No Logic For Anyone?

I bet you probably think that Sanford and his Bible quotes exonerates him from adultery in Argentina as well.

I have tried to answer questions as my faith leads me. I do have a sense of humor, but would not try to disrespect the Lord.

The post here have implied there is nothing against the Lord when participating in homosexuality. I have pointed out the flaws in their arguement. I have shown where that behavior is sinful. I have not said that they are not loved by the Lord, or that I am better in any way (I will have to answer for my own sins, also).

Sanford has sinned as well. His behavior is unacceptable (same term used for homosexuality). His voters will decide his political fate soon enough. As for his spiritual fate, that will be up to the Lord (the same as it will be for homosexuals). Many have already told him, that his behavior was wrong and have called on him to repent (and resign to demonstrate his guilt). He, (like homosexuals) must now decide for HIMSELF if he will try to overcome sin or if he will fall into the trap of sin, and be limited in his spiritual growth.

So, lemmie get this straight............you think that homosexuality is against God?

Okay, let me ask you something else.............do you know anything about Judaism, you know, the religion that Christianity developed from (remember, Jesus was a Jew)?

In their belief, each person is a small piece of God Himself that He carved out from under His Throne of Glory with the blade of self will, and inserted into the embryo created by your parents, which powers your nervous system and is actually your Soul. Also, according to their belief system, they understand that God is actually both male and female.

Which, incidentally, explains when Yeshua (Jesus) was asked what is the greatest Commandment, He stated "love God above all else (remember where you came from), and love one another like you would love God" (remember where everyone else came from, as they are also a small piece of God). Buddhists believe along those lines as well.

So, since YOU PERSONALLY believe that homosexuality is a sin, and that it should not be done, you then condemn those who participate in it, and then want to consign them to Hell.

Nice piece of work for someone who just stated they don't like blasphemy.

Yes, I stated that homosexual behavior is sinful. I DID NOT state that they would be consigned to hell. I went out of my way to explain that we are all sinners and that only through the grace of G*d can we improve and be forgiven for our sins.

I have also pointed out that while I am a sinner, I do not ask others to "tolerate" or "accept" my sins as not sinful (something the homosexual community is trying to do by legal means).

I cannot judge you, only the Lord has that power. I do have the responsibility of speaking to you (a sinner) to let you know that your behavior is sinful. If you are aware, I have done my duty.
If you were not aware, you have been informed and make your own choice.

So far, the defense for homosexual behavior is to deny what is in the Bible.
Why do you want to force those that believe the Bible to "share" your sin by silencing them or attacking them for stating their beliefs?
Why not just admit that you are committing sins? At that point, you relieve Christians of being punished for your sins (as well as theirs).

 

[paperview]

Ah, so you're looking for redemption by pointing out what you think are their sins.



And people wonder why some become agnostic...

 

[logical4u]

The parents being supportive of sinful behavior is not honoring the parents. It is puting the sin of the child on the parent(s); Christians are obligated to notify someone when they are sinning and to encourage them to improve. If they do not try to stop, the Christian is obligated to avoid them or stop them (crimminal behavior).

But wait! The bible says nothing about gay marriage. Anywhere. It's not a sin. I've asked this thread several times to point out where the act of gay *marriage* is mentioned in the bible. You can't. It's not. .

The Bible says nothing about marriage between an animal and a human either. I am pretty sure that is viewed as sinful also.
Marriage protected women...men were not viewed as needing protection.
In Leviticus, it specifically states that a man should not lay with another man as a woman...since gay marriage would sanctify that "union"....it would theoretically be .... sin.
Also, Sodom and Gamorrah were proof that the Lord would punish lewd and perverted behavior. It didn't mention anything about marriage in that story either. It stated the behavior was wrong.

Gay marriage does not build families, naturally. It is a poor imitation (and in some situtations, a mocked, twisted, nightmare). It does not make for two people, so different (opposite sex) joining to become one.

Why doesn't it build families? What do you even consider a family? By the way, I liked how you completely skirted the issue of how gay marriage is somehow hurting the sanctity of heterosexual marriage. How? OK let's say there's a husband and wife in Florida, and suddenly a gay couple marries in Massachusetts. How is the Florida couple affected?

As for needing two "so different" people joining to become one: I can show you two homosexual people that are very different. Meanwhile, ignorant white hicks who are all inbred from one another in a small town getting married as husband and wife cuz they think and act exactly the same doesn't really seem like "so different" people joining to me. Why do people need to be different to be married? You can't back a lick of the garbage you're spewing..[/QUOTE]

That inbred thing is not a good choice either. It should be discouraged.
People need to be different to produce children (your arguement...a few couples can't have children...my arguement....they didn't know when they got married), homosexuals cannot do that without being unfaithful to "their choice" or stealing from the heterosexual community's children.

If you want to look at it from a purely social stand point, gay marriage can not grow society without 'stealing' from heterosexual relationships (gays cannot remain 'true to themselves' and reproduce, they must use a heterosexual union to get a child).
If you look at heterosexual couples that do not have children, you will find many that worked to make their communities a better place. I do not know of any such works done by homosexuals.

That's cuz you're a moron. Have you tried actually looking? Wait, let's take a step back: how many loving monogamous homosexual couples do you know? Let's face it: you're a homophobic hick who would be too scared of a gay person to even ask what they do for their community. You don't know of any such works because you don't want to look.
The LGBT Center of Greater Cleveland: LGBT Center of Greater Cleveland
The LOFT
The Center Orange County - Your LGBT Community Center
The list goes on and on of gay community service centers. Are you really that naive in thinking that only straight people give back to their communities? really? Does blindness run in your family or was that a result of blunt trauma to the head?.[/QUOTE]

Okay, I will give you that one, but the things you have listed here looks like it only supports making more homosexuals, not helping mankind.

No, DNA evidence is not fully understood. But from what we do understand, it firmly backs up the theory of evolution. Yes, it is a theory, NOT a fact.

Just to go off that and clarify a bit further: scientific theory is more or less the equivalent of fact. Gravity is a scientific theory. It holds the same weight of fact as evolution in the science community.

But, as iagainsti very clearly pointed out: all evidence supports evolution - none goes against it. DNA, fossil records, you name it.[/QUOTE]

DNA evidence also supports the theory of Creation. Does that mean we get to teach THAT theory as fact in schools now?

 

[Sunni Man]

Most everyone knows that fudge packing homos are sick, nasty, disease carrying perverts.

They should all be locked up for the protection of society and safety of our children.

 

[SmarterThanHick]

and as Christians, we are not under the Law anymore.

you mean, the rules don't apply as long as you don't want them to, but all the things you dislike that are mentioned in the old testament, such as homosexuality, still apply. Gotcha. So what law does apply? Jesus himself told his followers to give all their possessions to the poor. Doesn't appear many Christians are doing that either...

It's nice, isn't it? To pick and choose the rules you think apply, and ignore all the ones you don't like....

I cannot judge you, only the Lord has that power. I do have the responsibility of speaking to you (a sinner) to let you know that your behavior is sinful.

You kinda need to deem someone a sinner (also known as JUDGEMENT) to do that... You may wanna reconsider that first sentence there.

The Bible says nothing about marriage between an animal and a human either. I am pretty sure that is viewed as sinful also.
Marriage protected women...men were not viewed as needing protection.

We're not talking about bestiality, which is immoral for its own reasons. We're talking about gay marriage, which I believe you JUST admitted is not mentioned anywhere in the bible. Glad we have that straightened out, so all the ignorant hicks can stop claiming the bible condemns gay marriage.

In Leviticus, it specifically states that a man should not lay with another man as a woman...since gay marriage would sanctify that "union"....it would theoretically be .... sin.

So even IF you claim that homosexual sex is sinful, the bible says nothing of marriage. Nor does marriage NEED sex (as countless married men can attest ). The idea that a marriage must "sanctify that union" is a Christian belief. Sex and marriage are two completely separate things. One involves a ceremony where two consenting adults express their love for one another before public witnesses. The other involves a private experience involving genitalia. Again I repeat: sex does not equal marriage.

So again to be clear: the bible does not in any place forbid gay marriage, and yet that is the act you are attempting to stop. If you have grievances with other acts, perhaps you should ask your local politician to makes those illegal.

That inbred thing is not a good choice either. It should be discouraged.
People need to be different to produce children (your arguement...a few couples can't have children...my arguement....they didn't know when they got married), homosexuals cannot do that without being unfaithful to "their choice" or stealing from the heterosexual community's children.

Stealing children? I'm sorry, I must have missed the last time the news reported savage homosexuals are breaking into married couple's houses at night and stealing their babies. Can you cite a single instance of this on CNN?

Your bigotry is inherent in your wording. Maybe I should start claiming that women are "stealing from the homosexual community's men". That's ridiculous. But please, show me the horrid robberies that have occurred.

Does blindness run in your family or was that a result of blunt trauma to the head?.

Okay, I will give you that one, but the things you have listed here looks like it only supports making more homosexuals, not helping mankind.

Making more homosexuals? Do you think they come from the homosexual factory? Or maybe they are grown on the homotree? What do you mean "make" more homosexuals? These are community centers run by volunteers for people who have needed to face the hardships and ignorance of people like you. Do you really think only straight people give back to their communities? 1 in 10 people is gay. That means right now, gay people are in your neighborhood, in your church, in your public schools, and working in your local businesses. Next time you're on the street, count 10 people. Convince yourself that it's not true all you want, but the statistics stand, and they aren't changed just because you live in a bigoted community - it just means people got really good at hiding it. Then again, when people like you are too afraid to even look, I can't imagine it would be very difficult.

DNA evidence also supports the theory of Creation. Does that mean we get to teach THAT theory as fact in schools now?

No, no it doesn't support the theory of Creation at all. Every doctor you have ever seen in your life knows evolution is true. The most highly educated of people realize Creationism has no scientific support whatsoever. So why is it that you, my little hick, with no scientific background whatsoever, believe that DNA supports Creationism? cuz someone else without a scientific background told you so? The purpose of science is NOT to refute religion. The purpose of science is to explore all possibilities and ascertain truth. Truth which has brought you every medicine you have ever taken; truth which runs your truck and powers your trailer; truth which has extended the human lifespan and our reach into the universe.

If you want to go toe to toe with a highly educated scientist with your fabricated or otherwise coerced ideas, I would be happy to thoroughly shoot you down time and time again.

If, on the other hand, you would actually like to understand the theory of evolution, why the overwhelmingly large amount of the scientific community (which btw is mostly Christian) support it, and try to actually learn a different point of view, I would be happy to humbly teach. Rest assured, I know both Creationist "reasoning" and evolution support inside and out - that's what discovering truth is all about - looking at all possibilities and drawing the most logical conclusion. I'm guessing you don't follow that trend.

 

[Sunni Man]

We're not talking about bestiality, which is immoral for its own reasons. We're talking about gay marriage

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

 

[BigBarry]

Most everyone knows that fudge packing homos are sick, nasty, disease carrying perverts.

They should all be locked up for the protection of society and safety of our children.

Sounds like you want to be locked in a closet with one.

 

[52ndStreet]

We're not talking about bestiality, which is immoral for its own reasons. We're talking about gay marriage

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

This poster is correct. In certain countries beastiality , and Homosexuality are considered one in the same crime, or sin or offense.

Punishable by Mutilation and incineration, or a death penalty offense.

 

[SmarterThanHick]

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

One is between two consenting adults. The other is between a person and an unconsenting animal. Do you have trouble differentiating between a sentient person and an animal?

Nevertheless, we're not talking about bestiality, nor are we even talking about homosexual intercourse. We're talking about gay marriage - a topic which ignorant bigots such as yourself seem incapable of separating from sex with goats.

This poster is correct. In certain countries beastiality , and Homosexuality are considered one in the same crime, or sin or offense.

Punishable by Mutilation and incineration, or a death penalty offense.

which countries would those be? Canada, Japan, Iceland? Any country in the EU? Any first world nation at all? No, didn't think so...

 

[Sunni Man]

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

One is between two consenting adults. The other is between a person and an unconsenting animal. Do you have trouble differentiating between a sentient person and an animal?

Homosexuals are basically subhumans and not much different than animals.

 

[iagainsti]

No, DNA evidence is not fully understood. But from what we do understand, it firmly backs up the theory of evolution. Yes, it is a theory, NOT a fact.

Just to go off that and clarify a bit further: scientific theory is more or less the equivalent of fact. Gravity is a scientific theory. It holds the same weight of fact as evolution in the science community.

But, as iagainsti very clearly pointed out: all evidence supports evolution - none goes against it. DNA, fossil records, you name it.

DNA evidence also supports the theory of Creation. Does that mean we get to teach THAT theory as fact in schools now?

If you wouldn't mind, please explain how DNA evidence supports the theory of creation, because as far as I'm aware it definitely doesn't.

For starters, you need to clarify WHICH theory of creation DNA evidence supports. Does it support the theory of intelligent design, which is not scientific and says that living organisms are too complex to have come into existence by natural phenomena and must instead have been put here by an intelligent creator? (WHY is it not scientific, you ask? Because science involves testing hypothesis, and the hypothesis that something happened through supernatural phenomena is not testable and cannot be disproven.) Or does it support the literal Genesis creation account, in which God created the first man in his image from dust and the first woman from his rib? This is obviously not a scientific theory for the same reason.

After you've specified what exactly you mean by the "theory of creation"...how does DNA evidence support it? Because, as far as I'm aware, DNA evidence so far suggests that all living organisms likely had a common ancestor, which does not line up with the Biblical creation account.

Oh, and by the way, the theory of evolution is NOT taught in schools as a fact. It is taught in schools as a scientific theory. The scientific method is also taught in schools, so students also learn that the highest level an idea can attain in science is that of a theory, and that the term "fact" is reserved for things that can be observed firsthand. Here's an easy example in case you missed that particular lesson:

"The sky appears to be blue" is a fact that can be observed.
"The earth's atmosphere scatters short-wavelength blue light more than other, longer-wavelength light" is a theory which explains this observable fact and falls in line with other facts we have observed, and has yet to be disproven.

So, to sum it up: students in science classes learn that the theory of evolution explains the possible origin of our species in light of the DNA, fossil, archaeological, and countless other evidence that has been found. They also learn that this theory, along with all other theories, is NOT a fact and could be disproven if contradicting evidence were found. They do not learn the theory of intelligent design in science classes because this theory is not scientific, since it involves a hypothesis that our species has a supernatural origin, which cannot be tested or disproven as a scientific theory must be able to be.

 

[eagleseven]

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

One is between two consenting adults. The other is between a person and an unconsenting animal. Do you have trouble differentiating between a sentient person and an animal?

Homosexuals are basically subhumans and not much different than animals.

Meaning homosexuals are a few levels above Jews, right?

One day, I hope a homosexual Jews kicks your ass

 

[AnCo]

Beastiality and homosexuality are basically the same thing.

Both are unnatural and animalistic perversions.

One is between two consenting adults. The other is between a person and an unconsenting animal. Do you have trouble differentiating between a sentient person and an animal?

Homosexuals are basically subhumans and not much different than animals.

How so?

 

[SmarterThanHick]

Homosexuals are basically subhumans and not much different than animals.

And what exactly makes the average homosexual any different than you, aside from higher education level and income (on average)?

 

[BigBarry]

Homosexuals are basically subhumans and not much different than animals.

More proof that islam is a religion of hate. Thanks for making our point.

 

[logical4u]

Just to go off that and clarify a bit further: scientific theory is more or less the equivalent of fact. Gravity is a scientific theory. It holds the same weight of fact as evolution in the science community.

But, as iagainsti very clearly pointed out: all evidence supports evolution - none goes against it. DNA, fossil records, you name it.

DNA evidence also supports the theory of Creation. Does that mean we get to teach THAT theory as fact in schools now?

If you wouldn't mind, please explain how DNA evidence supports the theory of creation, because as far as I'm aware it definitely doesn't.

For starters, you need to clarify WHICH theory of creation DNA evidence supports. Does it support the theory of intelligent design, which is not scientific and says that living organisms are too complex to have come into existence by natural phenomena and must instead have been put here by an intelligent creator? (WHY is it not scientific, you ask? Because science involves testing hypothesis, and the hypothesis that something happened through supernatural phenomena is not testable and cannot be disproven.) Or does it support the literal Genesis creation account, in which God created the first man in his image from dust and the first woman from his rib? This is obviously not a scientific theory for the same reason.

After you've specified what exactly you mean by the "theory of creation"...how does DNA evidence support it? Because, as far as I'm aware, DNA evidence so far suggests that all living organisms likely had a common ancestor, which does not line up with the Biblical creation account.

Oh, and by the way, the theory of evolution is NOT taught in schools as a fact. It is taught in schools as a scientific theory. The scientific method is also taught in schools, so students also learn that the highest level an idea can attain in science is that of a theory, and that the term "fact" is reserved for things that can be observed firsthand. Here's an easy example in case you missed that particular lesson:

"The sky appears to be blue" is a fact that can be observed.
"The earth's atmosphere scatters short-wavelength blue light more than other, longer-wavelength light" is a theory which explains this observable fact and falls in line with other facts we have observed, and has yet to be disproven.

So, to sum it up: students in science classes learn that the theory of evolution explains the possible origin of our species in light of the DNA, fossil, archaeological, and countless other evidence that has been found. They also learn that this theory, along with all other theories, is NOT a fact and could be disproven if contradicting evidence were found. They do not learn the theory of intelligent design in science classes because this theory is not scientific, since it involves a hypothesis that our species has a supernatural origin, which cannot be tested or disproven as a scientific theory must be able to be.

You say that creation is a theory because you can not prove it scientifically.
Show me the proof that life randomly started on this planet.
Show me the proof that DNA did not have the same creator, and therefore appears to have a similar ancestor.
Show me the proof where one animal species changed into another, totally different animal species.
Just because something sounds good, doesn't make it so.

 

[froggy]

You're one of those straight laced, fanatical, rabid GOP Christians ain't ya No Logic For Anyone?

I bet you probably think that Sanford and his Bible quotes exonerates him from adultery in Argentina as well.

I have tried to answer questions as my faith leads me. I do have a sense of humor, but would not try to disrespect the Lord.

The post here have implied there is nothing against the Lord when participating in homosexuality. I have pointed out the flaws in their arguement. I have shown where that behavior is sinful. I have not said that they are not loved by the Lord, or that I am better in any way (I will have to answer for my own sins, also).

Sanford has sinned as well. His behavior is unacceptable (same term used for homosexuality). His voters will decide his political fate soon enough. As for his spiritual fate, that will be up to the Lord (the same as it will be for homosexuals). Many have already told him, that his behavior was wrong and have called on him to repent (and resign to demonstrate his guilt). He, (like homosexuals) must now decide for HIMSELF if he will try to overcome sin or if he will fall into the trap of sin, and be limited in his spiritual growth.

So, lemmie get this straight............you think that homosexuality is against God?

Okay, let me ask you something else.............do you know anything about Judaism, you know, the religion that Christianity developed from (remember, Jesus was a Jew)?

In their belief, each person is a small piece of God Himself that He carved out from under His Throne of Glory with the blade of self will, and inserted into the embryo created by your parents, which powers your nervous system and is actually your Soul. Also, according to their belief system, they understand that God is actually both male and female.

Which, incidentally, explains when Yeshua (Jesus) was asked what is the greatest Commandment, He stated "love God above all else (remember where you came from), and love one another like you would love God" (remember where everyone else came from, as they are also a small piece of God). Buddhists believe along those lines as well.

So, since YOU PERSONALLY believe that homosexuality is a sin, and that it should not be done, you then condemn those who participate in it, and then want to consign them to Hell.

Nice piece of work for someone who just stated they don't like blasphemy.

did you ever consider thats why jesus (a jew) changed it because they were making religon into theirs instead of his.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Okay.......let's talk about your favorite passage against gays. The book of Leviticus. You people DO realize that it's a manual for JEWISH PRIESTS? Now, with that being said, would a Christian use a manual for Catholics in their service?

Leviticus (Greek: Λευιτικός, "relating to the Levites") or Vayikra (Hebrew: ויקרא, literally "and He called") is the third book of the Hebrew Bible/Christian Old Testament, and the third of five books of the Jewish Torah or Pentateuch.

Leviticus contains laws and priestly rituals, but in a wider sense is about the working out of God's covenant with Israel set out in Genesis and Exodus - what is seen in the Torah as the consequences of entering into a special relationship with God (specifically, Yahweh). These consequences are set out in terms of community relationships and behaviour.

The first 16 chapters and the last chapter make up the Priestly Code, with rules for ritual cleanliness, sin-offerings, and the Day of Atonement, including Chapter 12 which mandates male circumcision. Chapters 17-26 contain the Holiness Code, including the injunction in chapter 19 to "love one's neighbor as oneself" (the Great Commandment). The book is largely concerned with "abominations", largely dietary and sexual restrictions. The rules are generally addressed to the Israelites, except for the prohibition in chapter 20 against sacrificing children to Molech, which applies equally to "the strangers that sojourn in Israel."

According to tradition, Moses authored Leviticus[1] as well as the other four books of the Torah [2]. Modern biblical scholars believe Leviticus to be almost entirely from the priestly source (P), marked by emphasis on priestly concerns, composed c 550-400 BC, and incorporated into the Torah c 400 BC.[3]