Right-Wing Challenge: Fair Income Tax For The Top 50% vs Bottom 50%

[Papageorgio]

I paid $340k of income taxes last year. I cant wait to see this year. April 3rd is when I review them. I have no issues paying taxes. I am a patriot. A fake patriot hates paying taxes.

Then be a real patriot and don’t use any deductions that way you can pay a lot more in taxes and feel so much better.

 

[Independent thinker]

Your system would have poorer starve to death while still working...

The rich will still find loopholes (they always do)...

The real question is, What kind of society do you want?
Do you want a place where society looks after their weakest and most vulnerable OR where your chance to succeed is better than most if you work hard?

At the moment the US lags behind US in both of those criteria.
A large part US is convinced

• The weakest and most vulnerable are all scammers and cheating the system
• US rewards hard work (it doesn't, is 27th in world in Economic Social Mobility)

Global Social Mobility Index - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

US has been bullshitted by people with money that the best way for you to get rich is to allow the rich to keep more of their money and pay less tax...

Not true. A $300 a week gross check would take out $21 weekly at 7%, or $84 per month. While this might hurt the poor some it would not be that devastating. Since they're probably already getting government benefits, those benefits would probably increase to make up some of the difference.

 

[citygator]

You get rid of passive income, if you get income all of it is taxed at the same rate, you get rid of all deductions, you earn it, you pay it. That alone could raise $1.5 to $2 trillion alone, it would also alleviate the need for tax preparers and save consumers money and businesses money.

We could allow a deduction for children and anyone making all income under $25k per year exempt from paying taxes.

I agree with alot there. I will say the ONE thing from 2016 Trump campaign I did like is "simplifying taxes". It didnt really happen outside raising the standard deduction so fewer people itemize... but it is a good idea.

 

[Independent thinker]

Hate to say it, but that's kinda funny. Like how does that work?? Tell your employer to not withold taxes? Can they even do that??

But then again, they'd actually have to have a job in order to have an income to refuse to pay taxes from.........

Yes, you can tell your employer not to take out any taxes. Theoretically, in that case, if you are actually liable to pay taxes, depending on the amount, you would have to file your return and pay the taxes and penalties for not withholding enough money from your check or not paying taxes yourself quarterly.

 

[struth]

Then be a real patriot and don’t use any deductions that way you can pay a lot more in taxes and feel so much better.

It’s always funny watching people like citygator never volunteer to pay their full taxes…and cheer when people like Biden pardon tax cheats

They always whine about others paying thier fair share…while never paying their simple share

 

[citygator]

You are concentrating on the income tax. There are so many more taxes, fees, and other ways to take money for citizens. Progressives over the decades also enlarged, state, city, county and regional taxing governments including monopolies and authorities. If we did nothing before Reagan, anyone at the 50 thousand dollar a year wage would e at the 50% federal tax rate in those earnings. Eliminate many of the taxes the federal government levies.

You are correct on some of that. Most states are much worse for taxing the low earners than the federal government is. Sales taxes for instance are as regressive as a tax can be. Surprisingly or not the highest life outcomes (health, lifespan, happiness, income safety) occur in high tax states. Make what of that as you may.

 

[Independent thinker]

How about spending 2T less?

That's never an option or a consideration to the left. In fact, whenever they want to raise taxes on the richer, it is never to pay down the debt or the deficit, but to spend more.

I remember Joe Manchin made a deal with Biden and the dems to vote for (I think it was the IRA) so that it would generate 500 million dollars specifically aimed at paying down the national debt so Manchin voted for the bill. Just a week or two later Biden announced that the was going to forgive student loans, which would cost the government a total of 500 million dollars. Manchin was furious that he got swindled.

 

[citygator]

It’s always funny watching people like citygator never volunteer to pay their full taxes…and cheer when people like Biden pardon tax cheats

They always whine about others paying thier fair share…while never paying their simple share

Lets not get personal. I dont applaud tax cheats. I think Trump has pardoned a record number of tax dodgers and ponzi scheme runners.

I would put my payments up against anyone. None of us are paying our fair share. I am fine raising the tax bracket I am in to 39% and adding people into it by lowering the threshold. I'd take up a few more tiers too. I'd leave the lower ones alone. We need more revenue AND more spending cuts.

 

[Independent thinker]

I paid $340k of income taxes last year. I cant wait to see this year. April 3rd is when I review them. I have no issues paying taxes. I am a patriot. A fake patriot hates paying taxes.

LOL. You just called out half of Americans for not being patriots and just about everyone on the left, who don't want half the country to pay any federal income taxes at all. Isn't this YOUR thread where you proposed just that?

 

[Papageorgio]

It’s always funny watching people like citygator never volunteer to pay their full taxes…and cheer when people like Biden pardon tax cheats

They always whine about others paying thier fair share…while never paying their simple share

Warren Buffett made a big point that his effective tax rate was less than his Secretary and said income tax should be raised but 95% of his income was passive, he took every deduction allowed. He was such a hypocrite.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why isnt it fair to tax everyone the same percent AFTER you take out money for living? So we tax people on discretionary income? You cant live on $23,000 and give a lot to taxes.

Cut spending.

Less spending, less need for higher taxes.

It's rather straightforward.

Let's cut the Keynesian garbage.

 

[citygator]

Cut spending.

Less spending, less need for higher taxes.

It's rather straightforward.

Let's cut the Keynesian garbage.

I think you have to meet in the middle if you really want success. Got to do both. You'd have to cut 1/3 of the expenses otherwise and that just isnt going to work... no matter how bad one wants it to work.

 

[progressive hunter]

Oh tons and tons

Sadly though now it’s credited and we got to pay it back, and we are paying most of our money just serving our debt

thats not an answer,,

how much of federal spending do you think is waste or unconstitutional??

 

[Frankeneinstein]

I get that but we elected the nitwits. We have to live with their sins. Their sins require us to pay more in taxes. I see know way around that. Sure tax cuts need to occur but they will be small until our revenues catch up.

meh

 

[Rawley]

I paid $340k of income taxes last year.

And let us guess, your Johnson is 12 inches.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Here is the challenge and it is based on next year's budget.

You need to raise about $2.4T in personal income taxes just to be $2.0T short of next year's expenses (Trump's plan) in a way that allows people to also live a life.

How do you raise your $2.4T from income taxes between the two halves of earners? Bottom half and top half.

Today we get 98% from the top 50% as it is circled in red on the chart to the right but as you can see they earn almost all the income and certainly 100% of the discretionary income after you put bare bones living expenses against $23k vs 137k.

What is "fair" to you?

I predict a long line of right-wingers suggesting we take $200B from people making $23K still leaving a $1.6T deficit without regard to how one would live. But maybe they will surprise me with some thoughtful reflection on income tax burdens and living with low means.

GO!

Trump 2026 Budget
$7T in Expenses

$2.4T of Income Tax
$1.7T of Payroll Tax
$0.5T of Corporate Tax
$0.5T of Excise and Tariffs
$5.2T of Revenue

$1.8T Deficit


View attachment 1229675

How does the federal tax system affect low-income households?

taxpolicycenter.org

No you don't.

Monaco has no national debt and no income tax. Just copy them.

 

[Captain Creeper]

Here is the challenge and it is based on next year's budget.

You need to raise about $2.4T in personal income taxes just to be $2.0T short of next year's expenses (Trump's plan) in a way that allows people to also live a life.

How do you raise your $2.4T from income taxes between the two halves of earners? Bottom half and top half.

Today we get 98% from the top 50% as it is circled in red on the chart to the right but as you can see they earn almost all the income and certainly 100% of the discretionary income after you put bare bones living expenses against $23k vs 137k.

What is "fair" to you?

I predict a long line of right-wingers suggesting we take $200B from people making $23K still leaving a $1.6T deficit without regard to how one would live. But maybe they will surprise me with some thoughtful reflection on income tax burdens and living with low means.

GO!

Trump 2026 Budget
$7T in Expenses

$2.4T of Income Tax
$1.7T of Payroll Tax
$0.5T of Corporate Tax
$0.5T of Excise and Tariffs
$5.2T of Revenue

$1.8T Deficit


View attachment 1229675

How does the federal tax system affect low-income households?

taxpolicycenter.org

F the poor!! There, I said it! Only 50% of Americans actually pay income taxes. How dare the 50% who do not pay income taxes opine on whether us taxpayers are paying enough (Our fAiR sHarE). They should be grateful that we put up with our ass-backwards tax system. And now they want more. F those people, man. What if we taxpayers just stop working or move to Bolivia. YOU would be F-ED!! big time.

I will not go as far as saying that the non income tax voters, who suffer no infirmities, should not be allowed to vote. However, their votes should not count for as much as MINE! People with skin in the game (e.g., wealth, property, assets) will manage our nation much more prudently than those who do not.

I propose that if you pay income and/or capital gains taxes, and have been doing so for at least 10 years, then each of you get 1 vote. If you do not pay income taxes, but you hold property or other significant assets, you get 2/3 of a vote. If you don’t pay income taxes and don’t own shit, then you get 1/3 of a vote. If you are an alien, convicted felon, or declared enemy of the republic, then you get 0 vote and a good swift kick in the nuts.

 

[Nostra]

Here is the challenge and it is based on next year's budget.

You need to raise about $2.4T in personal income taxes just to be $2.0T short of next year's expenses (Trump's plan) in a way that allows people to also live a life.

How do you raise your $2.4T from income taxes between the two halves of earners? Bottom half and top half.

Today we get 98% from the top 50% as it is circled in red on the chart to the right but as you can see they earn almost all the income and certainly 100% of the discretionary income after you put bare bones living expenses against $23k vs 137k.

What is "fair" to you?

I predict a long line of right-wingers suggesting we take $200B from people making $23K still leaving a $1.6T deficit without regard to how one would live. But maybe they will surprise me with some thoughtful reflection on income tax burdens and living with low means.

GO!

Trump 2026 Budget
$7T in Expenses

$2.4T of Income Tax
$1.7T of Payroll Tax
$0.5T of Corporate Tax
$0.5T of Excise and Tariffs
$5.2T of Revenue

$1.8T Deficit


View attachment 1229675

How does the federal tax system affect low-income households?

taxpolicycenter.org

Why do I need to raise $2.4 trillion when I could cut that much spending in a few hours?




.

 

[Nostra]

Hate to say it, but that's kinda funny. Like how does that work?? Tell your employer to not withold taxes? Can they even do that??

But then again, they'd actually have to have a job in order to have an income to refuse to pay taxes from.........

You can have any amount withheld. Those idiots will still have to pony up at the end of the year.

 

[Deplorable Yankee]

If they didn't loot the treasury for the last 50 years and waste just about every dollar youd have plenty of money and there'd be zero debt..