Renewables you support-solar or wind.

[ScienceRocks]

comparison.
Time to Step up the Comparisons: Solar and Wind vs. Coal and Oil

I believe relying on a finite source of energy is short sighted.

 

[elektra]

comparison.


I believe relying on a finite source of energy is short sighted.

Which is exactly what Solar and Wind Power does, they rely on finite source of energy, Solar and Wind production requires massive amounts of a finite source of energy to manufacture Solar Panels and Wind Turbines, hardly renewable. Further the life span of Solar panel or Wind Turbine is a fraction of the life span of Fossil plants. So you will have to manufacture new Solar Panels and new Wind turbines more often, using more of a finite source of energy.

Of course Solar and Wind require finite things like Boron and Propene, so your idea that Solar or Wind can outlast the source that creates them is just ludicrous.

 

[Lumpy 1]

Again, Solar Panel production requires the use of energy from Coal in China, so your solution to manufacture more Solar Panels increases the use of Coal.

Yes, Coal is dirty, so quit using Coal to make Solar Panels and Wind Turbines

This we can agree on. Why don't they use renewable energy to make the solar panels.

Someday, if I'm ever in the mood I'll explain crystal growth and fabrication to you, I've done it for over 35 years. Although, silicon boules are on the low end of growth and fabrication, the rare earth elements, refining, carcinogens/chemicals, manufacturing costs ..etc. are far to much of a problem to be accomplished in the U.S.A. competitively anymore.

There are layers of thin film materials that appear promising for the future of solar though.

When and if that is successful government should get the heck out of the way, the time just hasn't arrived yet.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Yeah, leave it to the Chinese to pour the shit into rivers.

Thank god for regulations here in America

 

[elektra]

Yeah, leave it to the Chinese to pour the shit into rivers.

Thank god for regulations here in America

Yet we import Solar Panels and Wind Turbines, bypassing our own regulations and imposing the problem on others, seems dishonest to call it "Green Energy"

 

[ScienceRocks]

MYTH: Solar Energy Is "Dirty"
◾Claiming that a "green future" would be "dirty," the Taxpayer Protection Alliance's Drew Johnson wrote in a Washington Examiner op-ed that "It turns out that it takes a lot of power (and a lot of carbon) to build solar panels and wind turbines." [Washington Examiner, 7/24/12]
◾A Wall Street Journal editorial lent some credence to the claim that solar "really doesn't reduce greenhouse gas emissions" because the carbon savings from solar projects on desert land could be "negat[ed]" by disturbing caliche deposits that release carbon dioxide. [Wall Street Journal, 9/4/12]
◾At the American Enterprise Institute's blog, Kenneth Green promoted a press release claiming that "Solar cells do not offset greenhouse gases" because solar cell production emits gases that "make carbon dioxide (CO2) seem harmless." [American Enterprise Institute, 1/23/13]

FACT: Solar Energy Can Greatly Reduce Pollution

Solar Energy Emits Much Fewer Greenhouse Gas Emissions Than Fossil Fuels. A special report by the International Panel on Climate Change's Working Group III examined hundreds of estimates of greenhouse gas emissions (including the potent but rare gases that AEI referred to), and compiled the results of the most thorough studies. This chart of their results shows that renewable and nuclear energy have a substantially lower impact than fossil fuels over the lifespan of each power source:

Producing electricity with photovoltaics (PV) emits no pollution, produces no greenhouse gases, and uses no finite fossil fuel resources. The environmental benefits of PV are great. But just as we say that it takes money to make money, it also takes energy to save energy. The term "energy payback" captures this idea. How long does a PV system have to operate to recover the energy--and associated generation of pollution and CO2--that went into making the system, in the first place? Energy payback estimates for rooftop PV systems are 4, 3, 2, and 1 years: 4 years for systems using current multicrystalline-silicon PV modules, 3 years for current thin-film modules, 2 years for anticipated multicrystalline modules, and 1 year for anticipated thin-film modules[.] With energy paybacks of 1 to 4 years and assumed life expectancies of 30 years, 87% to 97% of the energy that PV systems generate won't be plagued by pollution, greenhouse gases, and depletion of resources.

NREL: 87 To 97 Percent Of Solar PV Power Will Create No Pollution. A report by the Department of Energy's National Renewable Energy Laboratory explained that producing electricity with a solar photovoltaic (PV) system produces no greenhouse gases, greatly offsetting emissions from construction:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=8219408

This answers some of the questions. For the rest I just have to thank god for our regulations Anyone that dumps raw sewage into rivers should get fined big time.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Emissions from Photovoltaic Life Cycles
Vasilis M. Fthenakis,*†‡ Hyung Chul Kim,† and Erik Alsema§

PV Environmental Research Center, Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, New York, Center for Life Cycle Analysis, Columbia University, New York, New York, and Copernicus Institute of Sustainable Development, Utrecht University, Heidelberglaan 2, 3584 CS Utrecht, The Netherlands

Received for review July 17, 2007

Revised manuscript received December 19, 2007

Accepted January 4, 2008
Abstract:
Photovoltaic (PV) technologies have shown remarkable progress recently in terms of annual production capacity and life cycle environmental performances, which necessitate timely updates of environmental indicators. Based on PV production data of 2004–2006, this study presents the life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions, criteria pollutant emissions, and heavy metal emissions from four types of major commercial PV systems: multicrystalline silicon, monocrystalline silicon, ribbon silicon, and thin-film cadmium telluride. Life-cycle emissions were determined by employing average electricity mixtures in Europe and the United States during the materials and module production for each PV system. Among the current vintage of PV technologies, thin-film cadmium telluride (CdTe) PV emits the least amount of harmful air emissions as it requires the least amount of energy during the module production. However, the differences in the emissions between different PV technologies are very small in comparison to the emissions from conventional energy technologies that PV could displace. As a part of prospective analysis, the effect of PV breeder was investigated. Overall, all PV technologies generate far less life-cycle air emissions per GWh than conventional fossil-fuel-based electricity generation technologies. At least 89% of air emissions associated with electricity generation could be prevented if electricity from photovoltaics displaces electricity from the grid.


3 GHG and Criteria Pollutant Emissions


We estimate the emissions GHG, SO2, and NOx during the PV life cycles. Together with the heavy metal emissions assessed later in this paper, these emissions comprise the main hazards to the environment and human health from energy use and materials extraction during the PV life cycle. These emissions are normalized by the electricity generated during the life cycle of PV. The major parameters for the life cycle, i.e., lifetime electricity generation of a PV system, include conversion efficiency (E), solar insolation (I), performance ratio (PR), and lifetime (L). The total lifetime electricity generation (G) per m2 of PV module is calculated as follows: G = E × I × PR × L. We consistently use, for our own analysis, the Southern European average insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr, a performance ratio of 0.8, and a lifetime of 30 years.

Alsema and de Wild report that the GHG emissions of Si modules for the year 2004 are within the 30–45 g CO2-equiv/kWh range, with an EPBT of 1.7–2.7 years for a rooftop application under Southern European insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr and a performance ratio (PR) of 0.75 (8, 10). Their estimates are based on the electricity mixture for the current geographically specific production of Si (Figure 2, Case 1).

4 Heavy Metal Emissions

We followed the direct and indirect (due to energy use) emissions of heavy metals (arsenic, cadmium, chromium, lead, mercury, and nickel) during the life cycles of the four PV technologies we studied. The CdTe PV can emit Cd both directly and indirectly whereas the crystalline Si PV stages would emit such only indirectly.

4.1 Direct Cd Emissions
Fthenakis (11) compiled the direct, atmospheric Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe PV modules based on 30 years of module lifetime, 9% efficiency, and the average U.S. insolation of 1800 kWh/m2/yr. The total direct emissions of cadmium during the mining, smelting, and purification of the element and the synthesis of CdTe are 0.015 g/GWh. The total direct emissions of cadmium during module manufacturing are 0.004 g/GWh (11). Emissions during accidental releases (e.g., fires) are extremely small, if any. Such emissions could add to the total of 0.02 g/GWh. The latter have been investigated experimentally with the aid of high-energy synchrotron X-ray microprobes (16). Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe modules (Table S3 in the Supporting Information) are estimated to be 90–300 times lower than those from coal power plants, which are 2–7 g Cd/GWh (17).

4.2 Indirect Cd Emissions due to Electricity and Fuel Use
We hereby accounted for Cd emissions in the generation of electricity used in producing a PV system. Electricity generation by fossil fuels creates heavy metal emissions as those are contained in coal and oil and a fraction is released in the atmosphere during combustion. The electricity demand for PV modules and BOS were investigated based on the life-cycle inventory of each module and the electricity input data for production of BOS materials. Then, Cd emissions from the electricity demand for each module were assigned, assuming that the life-cycle electricity for the silicon-and CdTe-PV modules are supplied by the UCTE grid.

Indirect Cd emissions include those from using fossil fuel, such as natural gas, heavy oil, and coal for providing heat and mechanical energy during materials processing, for climate control of the manufacturing plant, and for the transportation of materials and products throughout the life cycle of PV modules. The dominant sources of such indirect Cd emissions were found to be the use of coal during steel-making processes and the use of natural gas during glass-making processes. The cadmium emissions from natural gas use are indirect, from the boiler materials and from the electricity supply needed in the boiler, not from the burning of gas itself.

The complete life-cycle atmospheric Cd emissions were estimated by adding the Cd emissions from electricity and fuel demand associated with manufacturing and materials production for PV module and Balance of System (BOS). These are shown in Figure 3. The results show that CdTe PV displacing other electricity technologies actually prevents a significant amount of Cd from being released to the air. Every GWh electricity generated by CdTe PV module can prevent around 4 g of Cd air emissions if used instead of or as a supplement to the UCTE electricity grid. The direct emissions of Cd during the life cycle of CdTe PV are 10 times lower than the indirect emissions due to the electricity and fuel use in the same life cycle, and about 30 times lower than those indirect emissions in the life cycle of crystalline photovoltaics.

6 Discussion

Using data compiled from the original records of twelve PV manufacturers, we quantified the emissions from the life cycle of four major commercial photovoltaic technologies and showed that they are insignificant in comparison to the emissions that they replace when introduced in average European and U.S. grids. According to our analysis, replacing grid electricity with central PV systems presents significant environmental benefits, which for CdTe PV amounts to 89–98% reductions of GHG emissions, criteria pollutants, heavy metals, and radioactive species. For roof-top dispersed installations, such pollution reductions are expected to be even greater as the loads on the transmission and distribution networks are reduced, and part of the emissions related to the life cycle of these networks are avoided. It is interesting that emissions of heavy metals are greatly reduced even for the types of PV technologies that make direct use of related compounds. For example the emissions of Cd from the life cycle of CdTe PV are 90−300 times lower than those from coal power plants with optimally functioning particulate control devices. In fact, life-cycle Cd emissions are even lower in CdTe PV than in crystalline Si PV, because the former use less energy in their life cycle than the later. In general, thin-film photovoltaics require less energy in their manufacturing than crystalline Si photovoltaics, and this translates to lower emissions of heavy metals, SOx, NOx, PM, and CO2. In any case, emissions from any type of PV system are expected to be lower than those from conventional energy systems because PV does not require fuel to operate. PV technologies provide the benefits of significantly curbing air emissions harmful to human and ecological health. It is noted that the environmental profiles of photovoltaics are further improving as efficiencies and material utilization rates increase and this kind of analysis needs to be updated periodically. Also, future very large penetrations of PV would alter the grid composition and this has to be accounted for in future analyses.

An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie

 

[elektra]

MYTH: Solar Energy Is "Dirty"
◾Claiming that a "green future" would be "dirty," the Taxpayer Protection Alliance's Drew Johnson wrote in a Washington Examiner op-ed that "It turns out that it takes a lot of power (and a lot of carbon) to build solar panels and wind turbines." [Washington Examiner, 7/24/12]
◾A Wall Street Journal editorial lent some credence to the claim that solar "really doesn't reduce greenhouse gas emissions" because the carbon savings from solar projects on desert land could be "negat[ed]" by disturbing caliche deposits that release carbon dioxide. [Wall Street Journal, 9/4/12]
◾At the American Enterprise Institute's blog, Kenneth Green promoted a press release claiming that "Solar cells do not offset greenhouse gases" because solar cell production emits gases that "make carbon dioxide (CO2) seem harmless." [American Enterprise Institute, 1/23/13]

FACT: Solar Energy Can Greatly Reduce Pollution

Solar Energy Emits Much Fewer Greenhouse Gas Emissions Than Fossil Fuels. A special report by the International Panel on Climate Change's Working Group III examined hundreds of estimates of greenhouse gas emissions (including the potent but rare gases that AEI referred to), and compiled the results of the most thorough studies. This chart of their results shows that renewable and nuclear energy have a substantially lower impact than fossil fuels over the lifespan of each power source:

Producing electricity with photovoltaics (PV) emits no pollution, produces no greenhouse gases, and uses no finite fossil fuel resources. The environmental benefits of PV are great. But just as we say that it takes money to make money, it also takes energy to save energy. The term "energy payback" captures this idea. How long does a PV system have to operate to recover the energy--and associated generation of pollution and CO2--that went into making the system, in the first place? Energy payback estimates for rooftop PV systems are 4, 3, 2, and 1 years: 4 years for systems using current multicrystalline-silicon PV modules, 3 years for current thin-film modules, 2 years for anticipated multicrystalline modules, and 1 year for anticipated thin-film modules[.] With energy paybacks of 1 to 4 years and assumed life expectancies of 30 years, 87% to 97% of the energy that PV systems generate won't be plagued by pollution, greenhouse gases, and depletion of resources.

NREL: 87 To 97 Percent Of Solar PV Power Will Create No Pollution. A report by the Department of Energy's National Renewable Energy Laboratory explained that producing electricity with a solar photovoltaic (PV) system produces no greenhouse gases, greatly offsetting emissions from construction:


This answers some of the questions. For the rest I just have to thank god for our regulations Anyone that dumps raw sewage into rivers should get fined big time.

I do not see a link to the article.

I can post articles as well, do a search on the internet and you can find hundreds of opinion disguised as fact supporting your position. What is more difficult is to actually post the reports and studies used in the articles, if you did this you would find the conclusion is much different than what you believe.

Articles are really a poor source for the argument you make, they just tell you what you want to believe.

The reality is Solar panel production is extremely polluting, more polluting than burning fossil fuel, especially when one considers a solar panel will only last 10 years at best then we will be required to burn more fossil fuel to produce the replacement solar panel.

and what about cadmium waste?

anyhow, I would like to see some real facts from studies instead of opinion or obfuscation that the articles promoting green energy present

and now I see that while I thought out this post you provided more information, thanks, now it get a bit more interesting

 

[elektra]

how about a link to the article?

 

[elektra]

Emissions from Photovoltaic Life Cycles
Vasilis M. Fthenakis,*†‡ Hyung Chul Kim,† and Erik Alsema§

PV Environmental Research Center, Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, New York, Center for Life Cycle Analysis, Columbia University, New York, New York, and Copernicus Institute of Sustainable Development, Utrecht University, Heidelberglaan 2, 3584 CS Utrecht, The Netherlands

Received for review July 17, 2007

Revised manuscript received December 19, 2007

Accepted January 4, 2008
Abstract:
Photovoltaic (PV) technologies have shown remarkable progress recently in terms of annual production capacity and life cycle environmental performances, which necessitate timely updates of environmental indicators. Based on PV production data of 2004–2006, this study presents the life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions, criteria pollutant emissions, and heavy metal emissions from four types of major commercial PV systems: multicrystalline silicon, monocrystalline silicon, ribbon silicon, and thin-film cadmium telluride. Life-cycle emissions were determined by employing average electricity mixtures in Europe and the United States during the materials and module production for each PV system. Among the current vintage of PV technologies, thin-film cadmium telluride (CdTe) PV emits the least amount of harmful air emissions as it requires the least amount of energy during the module production. However, the differences in the emissions between different PV technologies are very small in comparison to the emissions from conventional energy technologies that PV could displace. As a part of prospective analysis, the effect of PV breeder was investigated. Overall, all PV technologies generate far less life-cycle air emissions per GWh than conventional fossil-fuel-based electricity generation technologies. At least 89% of air emissions associated with electricity generation could be prevented if electricity from photovoltaics displaces electricity from the grid.


3 GHG and Criteria Pollutant Emissions


We estimate the emissions GHG, SO2, and NOx during the PV life cycles. Together with the heavy metal emissions assessed later in this paper, these emissions comprise the main hazards to the environment and human health from energy use and materials extraction during the PV life cycle. These emissions are normalized by the electricity generated during the life cycle of PV. The major parameters for the life cycle, i.e., lifetime electricity generation of a PV system, include conversion efficiency (E), solar insolation (I), performance ratio (PR), and lifetime (L). The total lifetime electricity generation (G) per m2 of PV module is calculated as follows: G = E × I × PR × L. We consistently use, for our own analysis, the Southern European average insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr, a performance ratio of 0.8, and a lifetime of 30 years.

Alsema and de Wild report that the GHG emissions of Si modules for the year 2004 are within the 30–45 g CO2-equiv/kWh range, with an EPBT of 1.7–2.7 years for a rooftop application under Southern European insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr and a performance ratio (PR) of 0.75 (8, 10). Their estimates are based on the electricity mixture for the current geographically specific production of Si (Figure 2, Case 1).

4 Heavy Metal Emissions

We followed the direct and indirect (due to energy use) emissions of heavy metals (arsenic, cadmium, chromium, lead, mercury, and nickel) during the life cycles of the four PV technologies we studied. The CdTe PV can emit Cd both directly and indirectly whereas the crystalline Si PV stages would emit such only indirectly.

4.1 Direct Cd Emissions
Fthenakis (11) compiled the direct, atmospheric Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe PV modules based on 30 years of module lifetime, 9% efficiency, and the average U.S. insolation of 1800 kWh/m2/yr. The total direct emissions of cadmium during the mining, smelting, and purification of the element and the synthesis of CdTe are 0.015 g/GWh. The total direct emissions of cadmium during module manufacturing are 0.004 g/GWh (11). Emissions during accidental releases (e.g., fires) are extremely small, if any. Such emissions could add to the total of 0.02 g/GWh. The latter have been investigated experimentally with the aid of high-energy synchrotron X-ray microprobes (16). Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe modules (Table S3 in the Supporting Information) are estimated to be 90–300 times lower than those from coal power plants, which are 2–7 g Cd/GWh (17).

4.2 Indirect Cd Emissions due to Electricity and Fuel Use
We hereby accounted for Cd emissions in the generation of electricity used in producing a PV system. Electricity generation by fossil fuels creates heavy metal emissions as those are contained in coal and oil and a fraction is released in the atmosphere during combustion. The electricity demand for PV modules and BOS were investigated based on the life-cycle inventory of each module and the electricity input data for production of BOS materials. Then, Cd emissions from the electricity demand for each module were assigned, assuming that the life-cycle electricity for the silicon-and CdTe-PV modules are supplied by the UCTE grid.

Indirect Cd emissions include those from using fossil fuel, such as natural gas, heavy oil, and coal for providing heat and mechanical energy during materials processing, for climate control of the manufacturing plant, and for the transportation of materials and products throughout the life cycle of PV modules. The dominant sources of such indirect Cd emissions were found to be the use of coal during steel-making processes and the use of natural gas during glass-making processes. The cadmium emissions from natural gas use are indirect, from the boiler materials and from the electricity supply needed in the boiler, not from the burning of gas itself.

The complete life-cycle atmospheric Cd emissions were estimated by adding the Cd emissions from electricity and fuel demand associated with manufacturing and materials production for PV module and Balance of System (BOS). These are shown in Figure 3. The results show that CdTe PV displacing other electricity technologies actually prevents a significant amount of Cd from being released to the air. Every GWh electricity generated by CdTe PV module can prevent around 4 g of Cd air emissions if used instead of or as a supplement to the UCTE electricity grid. The direct emissions of Cd during the life cycle of CdTe PV are 10 times lower than the indirect emissions due to the electricity and fuel use in the same life cycle, and about 30 times lower than those indirect emissions in the life cycle of crystalline photovoltaics.

6 Discussion

Using data compiled from the original records of twelve PV manufacturers, we quantified the emissions from the life cycle of four major commercial photovoltaic technologies and showed that they are insignificant in comparison to the emissions that they replace when introduced in average European and U.S. grids. According to our analysis, replacing grid electricity with central PV systems presents significant environmental benefits, which for CdTe PV amounts to 89–98% reductions of GHG emissions, criteria pollutants, heavy metals, and radioactive species. For roof-top dispersed installations, such pollution reductions are expected to be even greater as the loads on the transmission and distribution networks are reduced, and part of the emissions related to the life cycle of these networks are avoided. It is interesting that emissions of heavy metals are greatly reduced even for the types of PV technologies that make direct use of related compounds. For example the emissions of Cd from the life cycle of CdTe PV are 90−300 times lower than those from coal power plants with optimally functioning particulate control devices. In fact, life-cycle Cd emissions are even lower in CdTe PV than in crystalline Si PV, because the former use less energy in their life cycle than the later. In general, thin-film photovoltaics require less energy in their manufacturing than crystalline Si photovoltaics, and this translates to lower emissions of heavy metals, SOx, NOx, PM, and CO2. In any case, emissions from any type of PV system are expected to be lower than those from conventional energy systems because PV does not require fuel to operate. PV technologies provide the benefits of significantly curbing air emissions harmful to human and ecological health. It is noted that the environmental profiles of photovoltaics are further improving as efficiencies and material utilization rates increase and this kind of analysis needs to be updated periodically. Also, future very large penetrations of PV would alter the grid composition and this has to be accounted for in future analyses.

An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie

Your "article is not addressing the transportation of the hazardous waste to its disposal sties, it also does not tell us how many tons of waste is being created. The article also does not address the disposal of the Solar Panels after the end of their ten year life span.

 

[Lumpy 1]

Yeah, leave it to the Chinese to pour the shit into rivers.

Thank god for regulations here in America

To a point, yes indeed..but overkill has moved manufacturing overseas.

Beijing..a beautiful place

Beijing announces emergency measures amid fog of pollution - CNN.com

 

[ScienceRocks]

How toxic are solar panels?

Concerns have been expressed recently about pollution from solar panels both during the manufacturing process and when they reach the end of their usable lives.

The manufacture of panels frequently involves toxic heavy metals such as cadmium, lead and mercury as well as producing CO2. However, a recent study found that due to the heavy metal content of fossil fuels, if we were to switch entirely from fossil to solar, overall there would still be a 90% reduction of pollution released into the atmosphere. A recently developed panel, based on cadmium telluride, produces 300x less emissions in its manufacture when directly compared to coal power plants according to Vasilis Fthenakis, from Brookhaven National Laboratory, USA.

Another issue discussed in solar panel manufacture is by-products such as hydrochloric acid. In factories in Europe and America all by-products are recycled. In countries such as China, where there are not so many rules, problems have been reported with toxic waste. These troubles are a symptom of economic corner-cutting and by no means isolated to the solar industry. A simple remedy to ensure solar panel manufacture with minimal pollution, is for companies to only accept sources of materials where there are stringent standards in place, thus placing economic pressure on factories to develop effective waste management.

A further concern is the safe disposal of panels containing toxic material at the end of their useful lives. However, the risk of pollution is far lower than that caused by household electrical goods due to the fact that solar panels are removed by trained professionals. A solar panel is effective for over 20 years, so adequate recycling facilities can be developed to meet the increasing demand. With disposal now more important, recycling technology can now be developed alongside solar technology so that sustainability can be guaranteed from the outset.

Sources:

Study: Solar Power 'Green' Despite Toxic Materials | Fox News

Solar Panel Toxic Manufacturing Byproducts, Product Disposal Needs Greater Oversight, Report Urges : TreeHugger

HYDROCHLORIC ACID - National Library of Medicine ITER Database

Solar Energy Firms Leave Waste Behind in China

Europe greenlights 'toxic' solar panel components - 25 Nov 2010 - News from BusinessGreen

Solar panels to become future source of toxic e-waste

How toxic are solar PV panels? | Sunhive

 

[ScienceRocks]

The link is a science paper and it is below the information I posted. It just doesn't show up as

ttp://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es071763q

 

[ScienceRocks]

Yeah, leave it to the Chinese to pour the shit into rivers.

Thank god for regulations here in America

To a point, yes indeed..but overkill has moved manufacturing overseas.

Beijing..a beautiful place

Beijing announces emergency measures amid fog of pollution - CNN.com

That is from burning coal.
5 years off the avg life span
Cancer rates through the roof.

This is what happens when you don't have regulations.

 

[ScienceRocks]

It was a peer reviewed paper.

Coal, natural gas and oil are 100 times worse. You defend those to the death.

 

[elektra]

Emissions from Photovoltaic Life Cycles
Vasilis M. Fthenakis,*†‡ Hyung Chul Kim,† and Erik Alsema§

PV Environmental Research Center, Brookhaven National Laboratory, Upton, New York, Center for Life Cycle Analysis, Columbia University, New York, New York, and Copernicus Institute of Sustainable Development, Utrecht University, Heidelberglaan 2, 3584 CS Utrecht, The Netherlands

Received for review July 17, 2007

Revised manuscript received December 19, 2007

Accepted January 4, 2008
Abstract:
Photovoltaic (PV) technologies have shown remarkable progress recently in terms of annual production capacity and life cycle environmental performances, which necessitate timely updates of environmental indicators. Based on PV production data of 2004–2006, this study presents the life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions, criteria pollutant emissions, and heavy metal emissions from four types of major commercial PV systems: multicrystalline silicon, monocrystalline silicon, ribbon silicon, and thin-film cadmium telluride. Life-cycle emissions were determined by employing average electricity mixtures in Europe and the United States during the materials and module production for each PV system. Among the current vintage of PV technologies, thin-film cadmium telluride (CdTe) PV emits the least amount of harmful air emissions as it requires the least amount of energy during the module production. However, the differences in the emissions between different PV technologies are very small in comparison to the emissions from conventional energy technologies that PV could displace. As a part of prospective analysis, the effect of PV breeder was investigated. Overall, all PV technologies generate far less life-cycle air emissions per GWh than conventional fossil-fuel-based electricity generation technologies. At least 89% of air emissions associated with electricity generation could be prevented if electricity from photovoltaics displaces electricity from the grid.


3 GHG and Criteria Pollutant Emissions


We estimate the emissions GHG, SO2, and NOx during the PV life cycles. Together with the heavy metal emissions assessed later in this paper, these emissions comprise the main hazards to the environment and human health from energy use and materials extraction during the PV life cycle. These emissions are normalized by the electricity generated during the life cycle of PV. The major parameters for the life cycle, i.e., lifetime electricity generation of a PV system, include conversion efficiency (E), solar insolation (I), performance ratio (PR), and lifetime (L). The total lifetime electricity generation (G) per m2 of PV module is calculated as follows: G = E × I × PR × L. We consistently use, for our own analysis, the Southern European average insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr, a performance ratio of 0.8, and a lifetime of 30 years.

Alsema and de Wild report that the GHG emissions of Si modules for the year 2004 are within the 30–45 g CO2-equiv/kWh range, with an EPBT of 1.7–2.7 years for a rooftop application under Southern European insolation of 1700 kWh/m2/yr and a performance ratio (PR) of 0.75 (8, 10). Their estimates are based on the electricity mixture for the current geographically specific production of Si (Figure 2, Case 1).

4 Heavy Metal Emissions

We followed the direct and indirect (due to energy use) emissions of heavy metals (arsenic, cadmium, chromium, lead, mercury, and nickel) during the life cycles of the four PV technologies we studied. The CdTe PV can emit Cd both directly and indirectly whereas the crystalline Si PV stages would emit such only indirectly.

4.1 Direct Cd Emissions
Fthenakis (11) compiled the direct, atmospheric Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe PV modules based on 30 years of module lifetime, 9% efficiency, and the average U.S. insolation of 1800 kWh/m2/yr. The total direct emissions of cadmium during the mining, smelting, and purification of the element and the synthesis of CdTe are 0.015 g/GWh. The total direct emissions of cadmium during module manufacturing are 0.004 g/GWh (11). Emissions during accidental releases (e.g., fires) are extremely small, if any. Such emissions could add to the total of 0.02 g/GWh. The latter have been investigated experimentally with the aid of high-energy synchrotron X-ray microprobes (16). Cd emissions from the life cycle of CdTe modules (Table S3 in the Supporting Information) are estimated to be 90–300 times lower than those from coal power plants, which are 2–7 g Cd/GWh (17).

4.2 Indirect Cd Emissions due to Electricity and Fuel Use
We hereby accounted for Cd emissions in the generation of electricity used in producing a PV system. Electricity generation by fossil fuels creates heavy metal emissions as those are contained in coal and oil and a fraction is released in the atmosphere during combustion. The electricity demand for PV modules and BOS were investigated based on the life-cycle inventory of each module and the electricity input data for production of BOS materials. Then, Cd emissions from the electricity demand for each module were assigned, assuming that the life-cycle electricity for the silicon-and CdTe-PV modules are supplied by the UCTE grid.

Indirect Cd emissions include those from using fossil fuel, such as natural gas, heavy oil, and coal for providing heat and mechanical energy during materials processing, for climate control of the manufacturing plant, and for the transportation of materials and products throughout the life cycle of PV modules. The dominant sources of such indirect Cd emissions were found to be the use of coal during steel-making processes and the use of natural gas during glass-making processes. The cadmium emissions from natural gas use are indirect, from the boiler materials and from the electricity supply needed in the boiler, not from the burning of gas itself.

The complete life-cycle atmospheric Cd emissions were estimated by adding the Cd emissions from electricity and fuel demand associated with manufacturing and materials production for PV module and Balance of System (BOS). These are shown in Figure 3. The results show that CdTe PV displacing other electricity technologies actually prevents a significant amount of Cd from being released to the air. Every GWh electricity generated by CdTe PV module can prevent around 4 g of Cd air emissions if used instead of or as a supplement to the UCTE electricity grid. The direct emissions of Cd during the life cycle of CdTe PV are 10 times lower than the indirect emissions due to the electricity and fuel use in the same life cycle, and about 30 times lower than those indirect emissions in the life cycle of crystalline photovoltaics.

6 Discussion

Using data compiled from the original records of twelve PV manufacturers, we quantified the emissions from the life cycle of four major commercial photovoltaic technologies and showed that they are insignificant in comparison to the emissions that they replace when introduced in average European and U.S. grids. According to our analysis, replacing grid electricity with central PV systems presents significant environmental benefits, which for CdTe PV amounts to 89–98% reductions of GHG emissions, criteria pollutants, heavy metals, and radioactive species. For roof-top dispersed installations, such pollution reductions are expected to be even greater as the loads on the transmission and distribution networks are reduced, and part of the emissions related to the life cycle of these networks are avoided. It is interesting that emissions of heavy metals are greatly reduced even for the types of PV technologies that make direct use of related compounds. For example the emissions of Cd from the life cycle of CdTe PV are 90−300 times lower than those from coal power plants with optimally functioning particulate control devices. In fact, life-cycle Cd emissions are even lower in CdTe PV than in crystalline Si PV, because the former use less energy in their life cycle than the later. In general, thin-film photovoltaics require less energy in their manufacturing than crystalline Si photovoltaics, and this translates to lower emissions of heavy metals, SOx, NOx, PM, and CO2. In any case, emissions from any type of PV system are expected to be lower than those from conventional energy systems because PV does not require fuel to operate. PV technologies provide the benefits of significantly curbing air emissions harmful to human and ecological health. It is noted that the environmental profiles of photovoltaics are further improving as efficiencies and material utilization rates increase and this kind of analysis needs to be updated periodically. Also, future very large penetrations of PV would alter the grid composition and this has to be accounted for in future analyses.

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These articles are at best, inaccurate, first and foremost they assume that the solar panels last 20-30 years, which is reality, in practice, they do not, further all the calculations are based on "installed capacity", not on actual power produced, take this into consideration and the dirty fact is that Solar Panels are an extreme source of pollution during the manufacture of the panel.

Some panels in the field have lasted less than 2 years, the study is based on the classroom, not the reality.

 

[westwall]

You say that without a clue of what you're talking with. People make a profit off of solar all the time.

Only because they get given OTHER PEOPLES MONEY. Wake the fuck up. Your ignorance is getting annoying.

 

[westwall]

Renewables you support-solar or wind. I support both

I support neither because neither is scalable. Wind power is simply a migratory bird killer so that one is a non starter. I have a solar system and it is fine in event of a disaster but without grid power life would be tough. I also have a water wheel and that is far more reliable.

The renewables I support are geothermal and hydrothermal. Both scalable, and both efficient. Unlike those you champion.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Easing Concerns About Pollution From Manufacture Of Solar Cells

Easing Concerns About Pollution From Manufacture Of Solar Cells

Feb. 26, 2008 — In a finding that could help ease concerns about the potential environmental impact of manufacturing solar cells, scientists report that the manufacture of solar cells produces far fewer air pollutants than conventional fossil fuel technologies. Their report is the first comprehensive study on the pollutants produced during the manufacture of solar cells.

here is another source to that paper.

 

[ScienceRocks]

Let's say for a second that the pollution within the manufacturing process was as bad as coal!(It's not) BUT to be fair you have to consider that once you're powering your home with solar that it doesn't put out pollution at that level over time(emissions x time) = less pollution then that of a coal plant doing the same job.

You also have to consider that solar is a infite resource that will be around for the next few billion years. Solar isn't perfect but will be around when coal is all gone and we will be better for it.