Reason and Experience tell us that there is Evidence for a Creator

[Brynmr]

Reason and experience tell us that there is evidence for a Creator.

We need a definition of 'create'. Does it mean to bring something into existence where there was nothing before or does it mean working with existing materials to make something new?

The latter as the intent was to discuss tangible items but intangible creations like songs would work too.

But I thought God had created something from nothing or are you discussing human creation.

 

[ding]

Reason and experience tell us that there is evidence for a Creator.

We need a definition of 'create'. Does it mean to bring something into existence where there was nothing before or does it mean working with existing materials to make something new?

The latter as the intent was to discuss tangible items but intangible creations like songs would work too.

But I thought God had created something from nothing or are you discussing human creation.

Yes. I am using our experiences as a proxy. There is a great deal we can learn from an exercise like this.

 

[Mudda]

Reason and experience tell us that there is evidence for a Creator.

We need a definition of 'create'. Does it mean to bring something into existence where there was nothing before or does it mean working with existing materials to make something new?

The latter as the intent was to discuss tangible items but intangible creations like songs would work too.

But I thought God had created something from nothing or are you discussing human creation.

Yes. I am using our experiences as a proxy. There is a great deal we can learn from an exercise like this.

Oh man here we go again.

 

[SaxonJackson]

Reason and experience tell us that there is evidence for a Creator.

I agree!!

 

[there4eyeM]

By our means of perception and our experiences of life at our level, the universe would appear to have a beginning source. That doesn't mean that it does.

 

[SaxonJackson]

By our means of perception and our experiences of life at our level, the universe would appear to have a beginning source. That doesn't mean that it does.

But it makes sense that it does. It would make little sense for a product not to have a source.

 

[ding]

By our means of perception and our experiences of life at our level, the universe would appear to have a beginning source. That doesn't mean that it does.

It would be illogical if it didn’t. Matter and energy are not eternal.

Changing subjects… Do you understand the relationship between existence and nature?

 

[Hafar1014]

Reason and experience tell us that there is evidence for a Creator.

There is no evidence only belief which is fine

 

[ding]

There is no evidence only belief which is fine

You are arguing against what Judaism teaches.

Judaism teaches that the physical universe is evidence of God's existence, often referred to as finding the Creator through creation. Classical Jewish philosophy, notably by Maimonides, argues that the orderly nature of the universe necessitates a divine creator. While belief is commanded, observing the cosmos and nature serves as a means to recognize and know God.
Aish.com +4

• Evidence in Nature: The complexity and existence of the universe (creation) are viewed as proof of an external, self-caused Creator.
• Theological Foundation: The Torah begins with the premise that God exists and created everything.
• Purpose of Creation: The world was created with purpose, and recognizing this design leads to understanding God's role.
• Role of Observation: While some views focus on blind faith, others, such as Kabbalistic traditions, see the natural world as a reflection of divine,, sefirot.
  Mechon Mamre +4

Therefore, Judaism generally views the natural world not as random, but as evidence of a, divine Creator.

 

[Hafar1014]

You are arguing against what Judaism teaches.

Judaism teaches that the physical universe is evidence of God's existence, often referred to as finding the Creator through creation. Classical Jewish philosophy, notably by Maimonides, argues that the orderly nature of the universe necessitates a divine creator. While belief is commanded, observing the cosmos and nature serves as a means to recognize and know God.
Aish.com +4

• Evidence in Nature: The complexity and existence of the universe (creation) are viewed as proof of an external, self-caused Creator.
• Theological Foundation: The Torah begins with the premise that God exists and created everything.
• Purpose of Creation: The world was created with purpose, and recognizing this design leads to understanding God's role.
• Role of Observation: While some views focus on blind faith, others, such as Kabbalistic traditions, see the natural world as a reflection of divine,, sefirot.
  Mechon Mamre +4

Therefore, Judaism generally views the natural world not as random, but as evidence of a, divine Creator.

Thats not evidence thats belief. You dont need evidence for a belief. If you think you do its because your belief is weak

 

[SaxonJackson]

There is no evidence only belief which is fine

When you look at a Corvette engine, you see a complex piece of machinery. Every component of the engine is necessary for the engine to function properly. It's a product of irreducible complexity which means that if any single component is removed, the engine will fail to function properly.

So we instinctively know that the engine was designed and created by an intelligent source. We don't have to see that source to know that the source exists. We know for a fact that the engine didn't create itself. But the engine, itself, is evidence of its creator.

 

[ding]

Thats not evidence thats belief. You dont need evidence for a belief. If you think you do uts bevause yoiur belief is weak

You must not be Jewish. Stating that there is evidence of God’s existence does not mean I need evidence to believe in God’s existence. It merely acknowledges that there is evidence and that it can be known through the light of human reasoning.

 

[Hafar1014]

You must not be Jewish. Stating that there is evidence of God’s existence does not mean I need evidence to believe in God’s existence. It merely acknowledges that there is evidence and that it can be known through the light of human reasoning.

The problem is you dont know what evidence means. It means proof. You cant prove god exists or does not exist. So we have beliefs. A belief can be valid without evidence

 

[ding]

The problem is you dont know what evidence means. It means proof. You cant prove god exists or does not exist. So we have beliefs. A belief can be valid without evidence

The problem is that you don’t know what Judaism teaches.

 

[ding]

The problem is you dont know what evidence means. It means proof. You cant prove god exists or does not exist. So we have beliefs. A belief can be valid without evidence

Evidence is not automatically proof. While often used interchangeably, evidence refers to raw data, facts, or information that supports a claim, whereas proof is the accumulation of evidence sufficient to establish a claim as true beyond a reasonable doubt or to a certainty. Evidence is tentative and indicates truth, while proof is conclusive.
WriteAtHome.com +3

Key differences between evidence and proof include:

• Evidence (The "What"):
  Individual pieces of information (testimony, documents, forensics) that make a fact more or less likely.
  • Proof (The "Result"): The logical conclusion or total sum of evidence that convinces a judge, jury, or researcher of a fact's truth.
  • Context: In science, evidence accumulates to support theories, but absolute "proof" is rare; in law, evidence is used to establish proof of guilt or liability.
  • Example: A fingerprint on a gun is evidence(suggests3 a connection), but it may not be proof of murder on its own if other evidence suggests a different story.

 

[Hafar1014]

Evidence is not automatically proof. While often used interchangeably, evidence refers to raw data, facts, or information that supports a claim, whereas proof is the accumulation of evidence sufficient to establish a claim as true beyond a reasonable doubt or to a certainty. Evidence is tentative and indicates truth, while proof is conclusive.
WriteAtHome.com +3

Key differences between evidence and proof include:

• Evidence (The "What"):
  Individual pieces of information (testimony, documents, forensics) that make a fact more or less likely.
  • Proof (The "Result"): The logical conclusion or total sum of evidence that convinces a judge, jury, or researcher of a fact's truth.
  • Context: In science, evidence accumulates to support theories, but absolute "proof" is rare; in law, evidence is used to establish proof of guilt or liability.
  • Example: A fingerprint on a gun is evidence(suggests3 a connection), but it may not be proof of murder on its own if other evidence suggests a different story.

There is no way to apply science to god because we have no way to measure the question.

 

[ding]

There is no way to apply science to god because we have no way to measure the question.

Science is used to discover the order within nature so as to be able to make predictions of nature. Human reason is used to make conclusions about the order within nature.

You are arguing against what Judaism teaches. You must not be Jewish.

 

[Hafar1014]

Science is used to discover the order within nature so as to be able to make predictions of nature. Human reason is used to make conclusions about the order within nature.

You are arguing against what Judaism teaches. You must not be Jewish.

Science requires the scientific method which cant measure the existence of god.

 

[Meriweather]

The problem is you dont know what evidence means. It means proof. You cant prove god exists or does not exist. So we have beliefs. A belief can be valid without evidence

Isn't it also true that 'belief' in Judaism (Hebrew) is does not have the same defining points as English where belief is a noun?

noun
An acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
Something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.
Trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.

While I don't fully grasp the Hebrew, isn't 'belief' not so much a mental exercise where one decides whether something is true, but an action where one is in a steadfast relationship with God, one that is secure and immovable?

 

[ding]

Science requires the scientific method which cant measure the existence of god.

I didn’t say it did.