Rand Paul doubles down on big, beautiful bill criticism after Trump slam

[dblack]

I am not arguing for federal deficits

But raising taxes is not the solution

That depresses economic activity which leads to lower tax revenue

The problem with that is that we'll never have the political support to cut spending unless people are actually paying for the government they're getting. As long as the shit they're getting is free, people won't vote to get rid of it.

 

[citygator]

If the GOP does what Paul would like... I'm afraid republicans would be out of power in the house and senate... the dems would say they are cutting your goodies... if you want to reduce Debt. raise income through trade and the sale of Gas and Oil... and cutting waste and fraud....
Imagine the stories before the next midterms if we started kicking the ill off of medicaid...
Paul has lived through this before and he will again...

The only oil the US owns is in the reserve. That aint no $5Trillion. Its like $25B

 

[Mac-7]

The problem with that is that we'll never have the political support to cut spending unless people are actually paying for the government they're getting. As long as the shit they're getting is free, people won't vote to get rid of it.

I think the public could accept lower spending if everyone shares the consequences equally

As it is every special interest group want to cut the other guy’s money but not their own

We should freeze the 2025 budget for 2026 and cut every spending program by 1% next year and every year after

And I mean spare no one

We alll give up something with no exceptions

 

[initforme]

Tough questions? Why do those who saved have to pay their own bills 100%? Why is it on taxpayers to pay for stuff like this where fraud is always found off the charts decades later?

Like most he wasted most all of his adult years working so he paid in. Yes cut fraud and abuse but do not shut off seniors who wasted their lives toiling away like he did.

 

[Zincwarrior]

On an absolute basis, is total spending going up or down under the bill?

1. Keep the tax breaks for those making less than $100,000 - including capital gains. Let the rest expire.
2. As with post #124 freeze spending. I would personally freeze all noninterest paid spending back to 2019 levels. If congress wants to tinker further at reductions thats fine, but no increase in spending above that.

 

[Godboy]

Still waiting for do nothing Rand to offer some alternative. All that guy does is grandstand and accomplish jack shit.

He is still better than Massie. That dude may as well be a democrat since he literally votes "no" every single time. He is costing us a seat. Worse, he has given his seat to the dems because, he votes in lockstep with them every time.

Principles are great, but not when you handle your principles like Massie does.

 

[kyzr]

This bill adds to the deficit.

Biden added $8T to the debt. Trump-47 should add much less, if anything. We'll see in the next few years.

 

[kyzr]

some say as high as 8T

The CBO says $3.8T over 10 years. That is "only" $380b a year
Tariffs could cover that
A 40% top rate as Trump wants could cover that
GDP growth more than 1.8% could cover that
DOGE could cover that
More cuts by the senate could cover that
The Fed cutting interest rates could cover that

So your low-IQ math doesn't get reality.

 

[kyzr]

The DOGE findings are barely a drop in the bucket.

$180b a year is not a "drop in the bucket"

Look at the rescission packages coming soon

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DOGE: Department of Government Efficiency

DOGE: Department of Government Efficiency

doge.gov

Added together the "waste, fraud, and theft" adds up to more than $600b

 

[Zincwarrior]

Well, why are we increasing military spending by 13%? If we froze it, thats half the annual deficit different year one. Keep it frozen for a few years and it balances. Or just don't raise it and eliminate the tax breaks on the wealthy being extended or increased.

But hey, thats the point of all this isn't it.

 

[dblack]

I think Rand figures he can afford this. The bill will still pass, he'll take his lumps from crazy Uncle Donny, and then in three years he'll be able to say that he took the high road and refused to cave.

I do enjoy his response to the gratuitous insults from Trump. He just laughs and moves on. No response in kind, he just ignores Trumps childish shit and keep's saying what he's saying.

 

[initforme]

The CBO says $3.8T over 10 years. That is "only" $380b a year
Tariffs could cover that
A 40% top rate as Trump wants could cover that
GDP growth more than 1.8% could cover that
DOGE could cover that
More cuts by the senate could cover that
The Fed cutting interest rates could cover that

So your low-IQ math doesn't get reality.

If thats true then no more cuts are necessary.

 

[kyzr]

If thats true then no more cuts are necessary.

They are true, problem is that NONE of them are in the BBB yet.

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

I am not arguing for federal deficits

But raising taxes is not the solution

That depresses economic activity which leads to lower tax revenue

Raising taxes on corporations and the wealthy is the ONLY way out of this rat's maze of debt.
Ever since Dutch started fucking around with the tax rates in the early 80's but still spending like a drunken sailor, it's been a downhill slide.

Raise taxes. Take the cap off Social Security max contributions. Then we can talk about cutting spending...but that opens up a whole other can of omnibus worms.

 

[dblack]

Raising taxes on corporations and the wealthy is the ONLY way out of this rat's maze of debt.

I don't agree. The tax increases have to hit everyone more or less equally. If we don't all feel the pain, we'll never address the problem.

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

I don't agree. The tax increases have to hit everyone more or less equally. If we don't all feel the pain, we'll never address the problem.

That's the problem. They keep going back to the largest pool of taxpayers in the middle because they don't want to go after the upper end. The people in the middle keep getting hit. While those at the top..keep getting breaks. And don't get me wrong. Dems ultimately don't have the sack to pull the trigger on tax hikes either.

 

[initforme]

The debt isn't such a big problem. If it was it wouldn't exist.

 

[leftwinger]

On an absolute basis, is total spending going up or down under the bill?

1. Keep the tax breaks for those making less than $100,000 - including capital gains. Let the rest expire.
2. As with post #124 freeze spending. I would personally freeze all noninterest paid spending back to 2019 levels. If congress wants to tinker further at reductions thats fine, but no increase in spending above that.

Single or joint? The tax code is a mess. Very complicated.

Business tax at 21% created millions good jobs in 2017-2019, revenue increased. You want to fool with that too? You cant just fire from the hip like a loose cannon. All brackets had a cut in 2017.

Sure go ahead put the top one to 40%. Then they complain to Congress about SALT cap like 2017 Piglousy Schmer gave them a cut to offset.
Just SHUP.

Trump got thru the House what they allowed for now. Maybe Senate improves it but I doubt it.

DOGE finds $175B savings in a few months. Maybe $1T will be idebtified over 1 yr? That is better than raising taxes. If the rabid Leftist Courts stop stalling progress.

 

[YoursTruly]

We didn't get into this debt overnight and we can't get out of it overnight either...

And you can't spend your way out of debt.

the dems and some republicans have spent decades getting us into this much of a hole... if Trump loses his house majority none of what Rand wants will be enacted... This is something Rand Paul just refuses to see... his hard line stance has caused the GOP to lose seats many times before...
Rand gets votes from his libertarian base by fighting with republicans... its all calculated on his part....

It's not a "hard line stance." It's a common sense stance. It's a "what Trump promised" stance. It's a "keep the USD from crashing" stance.

Rand isn't radical. He's simply where republicans are supposed to be. Trump and his RINO's have move left of center. Rand is still standing where FC's have always been.

 

[YoursTruly]