ok. I will ask. SunniMan.....

[Coyote]

Oh yea! I offer my posts about the quran to the forum for their conclusions.

Here is some more logic. The quran says if it were not from God you would find in it, contradictions.
The quran goes on to say God is merciful. Then it gives lots of verses that say God will burn unbelievers in eternal hellfire. What is merciful about that? A clear and absolute contradiction.

Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six, Leo Tolstoy.

Kind of like the Bible - full of bloodshed, sanctified genocide, smitings down generations etc etc

 

[Dajjal]

The Koran says Jesus is just a prophet. Since this cannot be, the Koran is in error.

More than that, it says Jesus was not crucified. That would mean that a large portion of all four new testament Gospel books are completely fabricated.

It is

Forgeries in the Bible's New Testament? : Discovery News

Unproven sensational speculation.

 

[Dajjal]

Oh yea! I offer my posts about the quran to the forum for their conclusions.

Here is some more logic. The quran says if it were not from God you would find in it, contradictions.
The quran goes on to say God is merciful. Then it gives lots of verses that say God will burn unbelievers in eternal hellfire. What is merciful about that? A clear and absolute contradiction.

Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six, Leo Tolstoy.

Kind of like the Bible - full of bloodshed, sanctified genocide, smitings down generations etc etc

The quran is largely copied from the bible, and other sources. But God cannot be merciful if he burns unbelievers for all eternity. It is a plain contradiction.

 

[Sunni Man]

Sunni, the book of Imran is flawed because your prophet refers to Mary the Mother of Jesus as Moses sister ( Miriam ) it is quite clear in the text that he is speaking about Aaron and his sister yet he goes into Moses sister having an angel appear to her to tell her she'd have a child. Jesus! There is a 1600 yr gap. So yes, that was a very obvious mistake. - Jeri

Au contraire Mon ami; The Quran was sent down to correct obvious mistakes in the Torah and the Bible.......

 

[Coyote]

Oh yea! I offer my posts about the quran to the forum for their conclusions.

Here is some more logic. The quran says if it were not from God you would find in it, contradictions.
The quran goes on to say God is merciful. Then it gives lots of verses that say God will burn unbelievers in eternal hellfire. What is merciful about that? A clear and absolute contradiction.

Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six, Leo Tolstoy.

Kind of like the Bible - full of bloodshed, sanctified genocide, smitings down generations etc etc

The quran is largely copied from the bible, and other sources. But God cannot be merciful if he burns unbelievers for all eternity. It is a plain contradiction.

They all originate from a jealous Abrahamic deity with anger management problems.

I agree - full of contradictions.

 

[Dajjal]

The Quran was sent down to correct obvious mistakes in the Torah and the Bible.......

If the quran was sent down by God he is a mumbling idiot. See the following for more claims of Allah sending down stuff.


I saw an article by a Professor Armstrong who is supposed to work for Nasa, stating that Iron could not have been formed on Earth as it requires to much energy to make Iron atoms. So when the quran says that Iron was sent down by Allah, at sura 57.25 this is evidence the quran is from God.
But every cosmologist knows that Iron atoms were formed in the first stars, and released into space when they went super nova. So all the heavy atoms like Iron were formed in stars and they gathered together in orbit around the sun and formed the earth. So when the quran says Iron was sent down by Allah, it is mistaken.

In fact it is common parlance in the quran to say that Allah sent stuff down from heaven and the phrase, Sent down, appears 42 times in the knoble quran.

At sura 36.6 the quran states that he sent down eight head of cattle in pairs.

DO MUSLIMS THINK THEY JUMPED OVER THE MOON ON THE WAY?

There is also the matter of Allah sending down Manna and Quails, sura 2.57

More importantly the quran states Allah sent down a table of food.
Sura 5.112 to sura 5.115 tells of a story that God sent down a table of food for Jesus and the disciples. But this story appears nowhere in Christian doctrine, and it is assumed to be a miss interpretation by Muhammad, of the meaning of the last supper. As described in the bible at the Acts of the Apostles. Chapter 10.9 to 10.16

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ These things seem to bother you quite a bit.

But we muslims have zero problem with any of the alleged issues you present.

Question: Have you ever considered getting a hobby?

It might be good for your mental well being.......

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

The Koran says Jesus is just a prophet. Since this cannot be, the Koran is in error.

More than that, it says Jesus was not crucified. That would mean that a large portion of all four new testament Gospel books are completely fabricated.

It is

Forgeries in the Bible's New Testament? : Discovery News

Impossible for it to be a forgery, Polkow. There are more than 5,300 Greek manuscripts of the New Testament. Add over 10,000 Latin Vulgate and at least 9,300 other early versions ( MSS ) and we have more than 24,000 manuscript copies of portions of the New Testament today.

No other document of antiquity even begins to approach such numbers. In comparison, the Iliad by Homer is second with only 643 manuscripts that still survive. The first complete preserved text of Homer dates from the 13th century.

I like what John Montgomery said. That to be sceptical of the resultant text of the New Testament is to allow all of classical antiquity to slip into obscurity, for no other documents of the ancient period are as well attested bibliographically as the New Testament.

Even better, I like what Sir Francis G. Kenyon, who was the director and principal librarian of the British Museum and second to none in authority for issuing statements about manuscripts, says......besides number, the manuscripts of the New Testament differ from those of the classical authors, and this time the difference is clear gain. In no other case is the interval of time between the composition of the book and the date of the earliest extant manuscripts so short as in that of the New Testament. The books of the New Testament were written in the latter part of the first century; the earliest extant manuscripts ( trifling scraps excepted ) are of the fourth century - about 250 - 300 years later.

This may sound like a considerable interval, but it is nothing to that which parts most of the great classical authors from their earliest manuscripts. We believe that we have in all essentials an accurate text of the seven extant plays of Sophocles, yet the earliest substantial manuscript upon which it is based was written in more than 1400 years after the poets death.

Kenyan continues in " The bible and Archaeology" : The interval then between the dates of original composition and the earliest extant evidence becomes so small as to be in fact NEGLIGIBLE, AND THE LAST FOUNDATION OF ANY DOUBT AT ALL that the scriptures have come down to us substantially as they were written HAS NOW BEEN REMOVED. Both the authenticity and the general integrity of the books of the New Testament MAY BE REGARDED AS FINALLY ESTABLISHED.

Furthermore, Polkow, Manuscript reliability is supported by the early church fathers. Consider Ignatius ( A.D. 70 - 110 ) who was the bishop of Antioch and was martryed. He knew the apostled well. His seven epistles contain quotations from Matthew, John, Acts, Romans, 1 Corinthians, Ephesians, Philippians, Galatians, Colossians, James, 1 & 11 Thessalonians, 1 & 11 Timothy and 1 Peter. Polycarp ( A.D. 70 - 156 ) martryed at age 86 was bishop of Smyrna and a disciple of the apostle John.

Among others who quoted from the New Testament are Barnabas, ( A.D. 70) Hermas ( AD 95 ) Tatian ( a.d. 170 ) Clement of Alexandria ( A.D. 150 - 212 ) 2,400 of his quotes are from all but three books of the New Testament. Tertullian ( a.d. 160 - 220 ) quotes the New Testament more than 7,000 and 3,800 are from the Gospels directly. Hippolytus ( 170 235 a.d. ) had more than 1,300 references to the New Testament.

Origen ( a.d. 185 - 253? or 254.. ) compiled more than 6,000 works. He lists more than 18,000 New Testament quotes.

Cyrian ( died a.d. 258 ) he was the bishop of Carthage, he used 740 old testament citations and 1,030 from the New Testament. In fact there were 32,000 citations of the New Testament prior to the Council of Nicea ( 325 ) That is by no means exhaustive.

So what we have is the very same New Testament today and the manuscripts and documentation of these people ( much more but for sake of time let me submit these two ) to confirm that the New Testament of the bible today is indeed authentic ( not a forgery ) and has been verified through documentation to be the genuine article.

Your turn, Polkow.

- Jeri p.s. I liked your other avatar better. The one you have now seems a bit too aggressive.

 

[Dajjal]

^^^ These things seem to bother you quite a bit.

But we muslims have zero problem with any of the alleged issues you present.

Question: Have you ever considered getting a hobby?

It might be good for your mental well being.......

This is my hobby, critical analysis of the quran, and now I have also joined the North Korean forum, so that I can tell them how to run their country.

 

[there4eyeM]

Choosing to abdicate choice and accept fairytales is the easy path, the path of intellectual and existential cowards.

A child of four may believe in Santa Claus and the idea is dear to her/him. We understand and forgive because of the childlike mind at work.

An adult that does it is only childish at best and dishonest at worst.

Silly'man' shows which he/she is.

 

[Sunni Man]

^^^ These things seem to bother you quite a bit.

But we muslims have zero problem with any of the alleged issues you present.

Question: Have you ever considered getting a hobby?

It might be good for your mental well being.......

This is my hobby, critical analysis of the quran, and now I have also joined the North Korean forum, so that I can tell them how to run their country.

No doubt you and Dennis Rodman will be instrumental in brokering the unification between North and South Korea.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Sunni, the book of Imran is flawed because your prophet refers to Mary the Mother of Jesus as Moses sister ( Miriam ) it is quite clear in the text that he is speaking about Aaron and his sister yet he goes into Moses sister having an angel appear to her to tell her she'd have a child. Jesus! There is a 1600 yr gap. So yes, that was a very obvious mistake. - Jeri

Au contraire Mon ami; The Quran was sent down to correct obvious mistakes in the Torah and the Bible.......

So according to the Prophet Mohammad, Moses sister ( Miriam ) was Jesus mother. Who would have known?

Thank you so much for enlightening me concerning the book of Imran. I could have sworn that Miriam lived about 1600 years prior to Mary - mother of Jesus being born.

As you say the Qur'an was sent to correct obvious mistakes the Torah and NT made so the Jews are probably about as grateful as I am for your clarifying this mystery for us. Thank you, Sunni. Your honesty is once again truly appreciated.


Are you reading this today, Mike?

- Jeri

 

[CMike]

Sunni, the book of Imran is flawed because your prophet refers to Mary the Mother of Jesus as Moses sister ( Miriam ) it is quite clear in the text that he is speaking about Aaron and his sister yet he goes into Moses sister having an angel appear to her to tell her she'd have a child. Jesus! There is a 1600 yr gap. So yes, that was a very obvious mistake. - Jeri

Au contraire Mon ami; The Quran was sent down to correct obvious mistakes in the Torah and the Bible.......

So according to the Prophet Mohammad, Moses sister ( Miriam ) was Jesus mother. Who would have known?

Thank you so much for enlightening me concerning the book of Imran. I could have sworn that Miriam lived about 1600 years prior to Mary - mother of Jesus being born.

As you say the Qur'an was sent to correct obvious mistakes the Torah and NT made so the Jews are probably about as grateful as I am for your clarifying this mystery for us. Thank you, Sunni. Your honesty is once again truly appreciated.


Are you reading this today, Mike?

- Jeri

Yes. It seems rather rediculous. But what can I say? They can believe in what they want to.

So was Joseph Moses' third cousin on his mother side twice removed?

 

[Dajjal]

^^^ These things seem to bother you quite a bit.

But we muslims have zero problem with any of the alleged issues you present.

Question: Have you ever considered getting a hobby?

It might be good for your mental well being.......

This is my hobby, critical analysis of the quran, and now I have also joined the North Korean forum, so that I can tell them how to run their country.

No doubt you and Dennis Rodman will be instrumental in brokering the unification between North and South Korea.

North Koreas idea of unification is to enslave south Koreans, like they do their own people.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Au contraire Mon ami; The Quran was sent down to correct obvious mistakes in the Torah and the Bible.......

So according to the Prophet Mohammad, Moses sister ( Miriam ) was Jesus mother. Who would have known?

Thank you so much for enlightening me concerning the book of Imran. I could have sworn that Miriam lived about 1600 years prior to Mary - mother of Jesus being born.

As you say the Qur'an was sent to correct obvious mistakes the Torah and NT made so the Jews are probably about as grateful as I am for your clarifying this mystery for us. Thank you, Sunni. Your honesty is once again truly appreciated.




Are you reading this today, Mike?

- Jeri

Yes. It seems rather rediculous. But what can I say? They can believe in what they want to.

So was Joseph Moses' third cousin on his mother side twice removed?

I'm lost already. Didn't the Persians tell us they invented math?!

 

[there4eyeM]

What's wrong, 'Rock'? Afraid to come out in the open and confront me? Like that back door too much? Wouldn't want the other posters to see your trite, simple-minded side, Silly'man'? Don't worry about it; you have nothing to lose. Everyone sees it already. You've probably already 'negged' them, too, out of intellectual frustration at the inability to exchange honestly.

Perhaps YOU should find a hobby.

 

[CMike]

My take on it is that I don't really care what is in the Koran. They can believe in what they want to and interpret their bible the way they want to.

I care about actions.

• I find it very concerning that some of the muslims in Dearborn celebrated 911.
  
• I find it very concerning that muslims publically celebrated the Boston Marathon terrorist attack.
  
• I find it very concerning that muslims elected a terrorist organization, Hamas, to represent them. Hamas intentionally targets civilians.
  
• I find it vey concerning that the muslim leadership can't allow one tiny little country, composed of jews, to live peacefully, even though it's on such a small sliver of land.
  
• I find it very concerning that the government of almost every muslim country is a brutal dictatorship.
  
• I find it very concerning that some of their leader publically state that it's okay to physically abuse women.
  
• I find it very concerning that muslims in judea and samaria intentionally target civilians to try and terror.
  
• I find it very concerning tha none of the muslim leadershp codemns arab terrorists attacking school buses, malls, movie theatres, restaurants, etc.
  
• I find it very concerning that even the muslim's here justify the intentional target of civilians to spread terror.

Aside from their actions, I don't care what their bible says.

I care about what they do.

 

[CMike]

You must think very little of G-D or not believe in him if you think the Torah was given to enslave the jews.

 

[CMike]

Jeri excellent posts, as usual.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Do you agree with Sharia law? I asked you once before, a few years ago...if you would be able to stand and watch or participate someone being stoned to death..and you said yes. Do you still stand by that opinion? Also, do you agree with honor killings?

There. It's been asked in a different thread than the one below. I DO appreciate you taking the time to post what other muslims are doing in support of the bombing victims. Now I am asking what your thoughts are on Sharia.

Do all muslims have to abide by sharia in order to be muslim? Or can they be against it and still be muslim?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/religion-and-ethics/290680-i-m-muslim-and-i-hate-terrorism-3.html

Gracie, why not ask if all Jews have to abide by Talmudic law in order to be Jews? Do all Hindus have to abide by Vedic law? Do all Christians have to abide by Mosiac law?

The answer is not in the least. Those ancient laws have been superceded. Certainly individuals can choose to live by them as long as they do not clash with civil laws. Under the laws of Moses you were allowed to not only own slaves but also to kill them. Do you expect modern Christians to agree with those laws?

1) The Torah laws are not ancient.They still apply to jews.

2) There is no such thing as Talmudic law. All jews law comes from the five books of Moses.

3) Part of jewish law is to conform to the law of the land. Therefore, jews in America are supposed to keep American law.

4) Back in the old times people could have slaves. It was very common.

However, jewish law treated slaves much different.

If you had one pillow you were supposed to give it to the slave.

Jewish law treated slaves in an extremely human way.

5) You should consider that you are making statements about something you know nothing about.

6)

Yes, I have a feeling that when christians realize the example given by Jews as how to live, how to treat others, demonstrating their forgiveness and longsuffering patience & kindness towards their enemies and such? We'll be getting a better understanding of what it is to be G-ds child.

How to treat a slave according to Jewish law is just one of many examples - we could learn alot from the Jews.