Nurses (and Teachers) are not "professionals"


The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.
Congratulations dumbass! You just described most teachers and every school administrator, but claimed they are not professionals.
 
One of the finest troll threads ever. Nurses here work 3 22 hour shifts and get paid for 40 hours. Any overtime is 2x the normal pay. The young unmarried older nurses here are living the good life. As it should be. They travel alot and drive nice cars. No kids no husbands.
 
How many do you know or have talked with to be able to determine this?
We used to have to take convicts from time to time to see them at UVA or MCV, of course I had to set in attendance.

I never saw a one of the "mental health professionals" that wasn't just plain weird or more like snake-oil salesmen.

LOL....More than one convict told me, "Well that was a waste of time".....Bear in mind these guys had nothing but time.

LOL....They did enjoy looking at the young women. ;)
 
One of the finest troll threads ever. Nurses here work 3 22 hour shifts and get paid for 40 hours. Any overtime is 2x the normal pay. The young unmarried older nurses here are living the good life. As it should be. They travel alot and drive nice cars. No kids no husbands.
Younger older nurses? Are those the ones that they have at the home that Methusaleh should be in?

Why on earth would they work nurses 22-hour days! Are you sure that isn't a typo? Most nurses struggle with 12-hour shift.

BTW "alot" is not a word.

Seek help for your dementia, please!
 

The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.
This may be the dumbest post I've read here all month.

Of course nurses are professionals, so are teachers, engineers, accountants, and architects
based on what?
Based on the fact that tRump said it so he has to believe it no matter what he thought five minutes ago.
.
 
Obviously, if you make up your own definitions, nurses can be "professionals." But if words have definite meanings, not so much.

Has anyone here ever heard of a nurse being sued for malpractice? A teacher? Can you even imagine such a a thing? If a nurse administers the wrong medicine, that would be NEGLIGENCE. A nurse cannot be guilty of malpractice.

Licensure means nothing. My father in law worked heavy construction and had a license to work with explosives. Barely spoke English.

He was not a "professional."
 
Obviously, if you make up your own definitions, nurses can be "professionals." But if words have definite meanings, not so much.

Has anyone here ever heard of a nurse being sued for malpractice? A teacher? Can you even imagine such a a thing? If a nurse administers the wrong medicine, that would be NEGLIGENCE. A nurse cannot be guilty of malpractice.

Licensure means nothing. My father in law worked heavy construction and had a license to work with explosives. Barely spoke English.

He was not a "professional."
Professionals do not necessarily practice like doctors practice medicine, so there cannot be malpractice. If you don't "practice" anything, how can you be guilty of "malpractice" because you cannot do it wrong of if you don't do it in the first place.

What do you consider lawyers?
 
Maybe the ones doing that, but not the profession as a whole

Psychiatrists have completed medical school
So did Josef Mengele.
My biggest go-to when determining whether a title is Professional is this: Do they need to be licensed to practice their profession?
Like hairdressers?
I'm guessing Unkotare and Sweet Sue will be somewhat offended by this thread as well...
Unk is offended by everything.
 

The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.
Some school districts require its teachers to acquire a master’s degree either before hiring or within a designated period of time after being hired and starting the teaching job.

Accordingly, I don’t believe it is fair or accurate to say that teachers aren’t professionals. Some are and many are in the process of obtaining that graduate degree to acquire the professional status.
 

The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.

Professional means you do the job as your job, and you earn a living from it.

Teachers and nurses are a lot more "professional", or skilled, than a lot of people's jobs.
 

The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.
/—-/ My late wife was a teacher. She had a Masters in Education from St John’s and was licensed by the state. She also had special training for her speciality in reading. She was a professional.
 
15th post
That is the stupidest move the Dept of education has ever done! They're the idiots.

This lessons their chances of financing their educations needed.

We need nurses MORE than near any job out there for the next 30 years....for goodness sake!

The nurses handle the entire healthcare system up here....practically. Doctors are very very limited.....Florida seems to have them all....🤕
 
I’d have to go look stuff up, and I’m going to bed in a moment, so that isn’t going to happen. … BUT ….

I vaguely recall that the word “professional” can be used to distinguish employee classification: “paid by the hour” would be one classification while “salaried employee” might be called “professional staff.”
 
I’d have to go look stuff up
like>>>>

AI Overview



A "professional" can refer to
a person who is an expert in a field, someone who does a job for a livelihood, or a behavior that is competent, skilled, and ethical. It can also describe an activity that is done for money rather than as a hobby, or work that is performed with skill and competence.

As a person
  • An expert: Someone with specialized knowledge and skills, often gained through advanced education or training.
  • A paid worker: An individual who engages in an activity for gain or as a means of livelihood, rather than as an amateur.
  • A skilled practitioner: Someone who performs a job or activity with a high degree of competence and skill.

As an adjective
  • Characteristic of a profession: Pertaining to the high standards and ethics of a profession.
  • Expert or highly skilled: Describing a piece of work or a person's competence (e.g., a "professional presentation").
  • Livelihood-based: Relating to an activity that is done for money, as opposed to a hobby.
~S~
 

The internet and Media are filled with nurses outraged that the Trump Administration has classified them as not "professionals." Something to do with financing grad school, I think.

The word "professional" is badly misused, usually harmlessly, but it is instructive to take a step back every once in a while and look at what a "profession" really is. Here are a few pointers:

Professionals require a college degree BEYOND the Bachelors level. Law Degree, Medical Degree, Dental degree...you get the idea. A field of endeavor that you can enter with nothing more than a Bachelors degree is not a "profession."

A profession requires a large body of knowledge not known, perhaps not even available, to the general public, without which knowledge you cannot function in the profession. You can read law books and case studies until your eyes wear out, but I wouldn't trust you to write me a will, or defend me in traffic court. Same for taking medical advice from a well-informed member of the general public. It would be foolish indeed.

A professional can "put up a shingle" and practice the profession serving the general public without supervision.

A professional is certified competent by a "professional association" based on formal education, passing of a brutal and comprehensive battery of tests, and usually some certification of good character. That professional certification can be withdrawn for demonstrated incompetence or acting in such a way that brings disrepute on the profession itself.

Last and I would almost say, most importantly, professionals are held to a higher standard than others. They must not only one competent, but they must keep themselves abreast of the latest developments in the profession throughout their careers. If they fail in that standard and a client is thereby harmed, they can be sued for "malpractice," which is a whole level beyond simple negligence.

So having said all that - I think the points are obvious to anyone taking the matter seriously - it is clear that there are lots of worthy and valuable fields of endeavor that exhibit "professionalism" (or they might), but are not true professions, to wit,
  • nursing,
  • teaching,
  • engineering,
  • accounting,
  • architecture.
In a similar way, some small-p professions have created certification programs where by practitioners can set themselves apart and above their general peers with a "professional" certification. CPA's and PE's, come to mind, and I'm sure there are several others. Hell, I was a Certified Professional Contract Manager for many years, which required education, many years of relevant experience, and passing of a comprehensive test. (I'm also a retired member of the Pennsylvania Bar).

It is not an insult to be told that your field of endeavor is not a "profession." In the case of nurses, it's merely a statement of fact. Your contribution to society can be enormous - even greater than that of some physicians - but that doesn't make nursing a "profession."

Sorry.
Holy shit you're stupid. You keep proving it over and over and over.
 
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