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No Trump didn't commit treason or espionage

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Moving the goal post now, I figured.
I responded to an article posted by someone that claimed Hillary's emails caused the deaths of agents in China. When I read the article, it cited an article by the times as the reason for the headline. Problem was that the Times didn't say it was caused by the emails. So the poster came back with an article that said Hillary had confidential documents on her email server wich again is NOT saying it caused 20 deaths in China.

Goalposts where moved, not by me I'm afraid.
 
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Rust_Cohle

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What Pardons?

Address it.
I'm not your Google servant, you said they weren't factual. You lost your concession is already noted
 
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Rust_Cohle

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I responded to an article posted by someone that claimed Hillary's emails caused the deaths of agents in China. When I read the article, it cited an article by the times as the reason for the headline. Problem was that the Times didn't say it was caused by the emails. So the poster came back with an article that said Hillary had confidential documents on her email server wich again is NOT saying it caused 20 deaths in China.

Goalposts where moved, not by me I'm afraid.
I underlined what you said and I found what you asked then you changed what you were asking so yeah

Moved by you
 

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I underlined what you said and I found what you asked then you changed what you were asking so yeah

Moved by you
Just reread the thread I was responding to. You are right I did move the goalpost by not formulating my question properly.
 
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Rust_Cohle

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Just reread the thread I was responding to. You are right I did move the goalpost by not formulating my question properly.
Well at least you admit it. There's hope for you yet
 
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Rust_Cohle

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Ah using the archives, I'll return the favor.

In 1978, Congress passed the Presidential Records Act (PRA), which changed the legal status of Presidential and Vice Presidential materials. Under the PRA, the official records of the President and his staff are owned by the United States, not by the President.

  • The Archivist is required to take custody of these records when the President leaves office, and to maintain them in a Federal depository.
  • These records are eligible for access under the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) five years after the President leaves office.
  • The President may restrict access to specific kinds of information for up to 12 years after he leaves office, but after that point the records are reviewed for FOIA exemptions only.
  • This legislation took effect on January 20, 1981, and the records of the Reagan administration were the first to be administered under this law.
  • Staff at the Reagan Library, the George H. W. Bush Library, the William J. Clinton Library, and the George W. Bush Library can provide additional information regarding access to Presidential records in their collections.
  • Staff at the libraries can provide additional information regarding access to Presidential records in their collections.

Seems an important step was not followed here.
And if the President has 5 years to turn them over to archives from the time he leaves office and he's been out for 2 years then who has legal right to hold and maintain those records?

Trump
 

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lol.."Whataboutism" is merely the layman [or socially educated] synonym for "Precedent" which is the academic term...

however, if you for some reason prefer "whataboutism" to "precedent" I/we all would understand, but both are to show there is "standing" [also a synonym for both the academic term and yours] for such a practice or exercise.

... to make sure you did not miss the point, your above claim means the same as saying ""Precedent at its finest" or "long standing practice at its finest"
Whataboutism is a logical fallacy called an Appeal to Hypocrisy. It's something everybody in their normal life is confronted with, especially if they have kids. It's the idea that if you do something wrong and you can point out someone else doing the same thing wrong it all of a sudden becomes acceptable.

It doesn't work for my daughter. It doesn't work for my employees, and it sure as hell doesn't work legally.
 

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Well at least you admit it. There's hope for you yet
It's called intellectual honesty. I am capable of questioning myself, and admitting fault. An ability I've noticed is severely lacking in nearly anybody on this site.
 
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Rust_Cohle

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Whataboutism is a logical fallacy called an Appeal to Hypocrisy. It's something everybody in their normal life is confronted with, especially if they have kids. It's the idea that if you do something wrong and you can point out someone else doing the same thing wrong it all of a sudden becomes acceptable.

It doesn't work for my daughter. It doesn't work for my employees, and it sure as hell doesn't work legally.
Or that, you and leftist do something wrong and get away with it

Then the right does something less

Then you all cry

Right points out you all did it first

You all "whataboutism"

So basically you all want two sets of rules. 1 for us and none for you
 
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Rust_Cohle

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It's called intellectual honesty. I am capable of questioning myself, and admitting fault. An ability I've noticed is severely lacking in nearly anybody on this site.
If you were truly honest you wouldn't have left out the parts from the PRA you posted after mine
 

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What do you think Biden and his DoJ have been doing?

Trump
Jan 6 protesters
Parents at school board meetings protesting CRT and Drag Queens
Covid Truthers
Free Speech advocates
Pro Life advocates
2A advocates


Fascism is already here and its you DEMONRATS bringing it ya idiot
Jan 6 was a failed coup. and speaks for it's self. The rest you mentioned weren't a concern unless they made terroristic threats or otherwise presented a verifiable, valid threat.
 

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And if the President has 5 years to turn them over to archives from the time he leaves office and he's been out for 2 years then who has legal right to hold and maintain those records?

Trump
The problem is the ex-president doesn't have 5 years to turn them over.

  • The Archivist is required to take custody of these records when the President leaves office, and to maintain them in a Federal depository.
Mar-O-Lago is NOT a federal depository and Trump is NOT the Archivist.
 
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Rust_Cohle

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Jan 6 was a failed coup. and speaks for it's self. The rest you mentioned weren't a concern unless they made terroristic threats or otherwise presented a verifiable, valid threat.
Failed coup my ass. Chaz/Chop was a failed coup during you leftist "summer of love" where people were raped, robbed and murdered. Like Ashli Babbit was murdered

You leftist sure love murder
 
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Rust_Cohle

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The problem is the ex-president doesn't have 5 years to turn them over.


Mar-O-Lago is NOT a federal depository and Trump is NOT the Archivist.
There you go being intellectually dishonest


  • Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA.
  • Establishes a process by which the President may restrict and the public may obtain access to these records after the President leaves office; specifically, the PRA allows for public access to Presidential records through the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) beginning five years after the end of the Administration, but allows the President to invoke as many as six specific restrictions to public access for up to twelve years.
 

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If you were truly honest you wouldn't have left out the parts from the PRA you posted after mine
No, I believe politics should not drive decisions made by the FBI. Unfortunately, when you make a decision during an election year you will influence the elections for one party or another regardless. At that point, I believe it's the duty of the FBI to just tell the truth. In the case of Clinton, Comey first came out saying that Clinton was in the clear. The problem was. Potential additional evidence was discovered after that statement. Comey could sit on it, in which case, the GOP would blame him for trying to cover up evidence if it leaked. Which it would surely do. Or he could immediately release it. In an attempt to cut off the accusation. And try to expedite the evaluation of the potential evidence. Now, I think there is nothing wrong with making decisions based on what you consider the best of 2 shitty options.
This is me defending the decision of Comey to reopen the investigation into Clinton a few weeks before the general election. I knew it was damaging politically and it didn't matter. Because to me the rule of law is more important than my politics. That is honesty. So NO this leftists didn't say that what Clinton did was okay.

And the reason I didn't post the PRA you did is that NOWHERE in it does it say that it is ex-president who has custody of the documents if he leaves office. But the ARCHIVIST. You start from the wrong premise.
 
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This is me defending the decision of Comey to reopen the investigation into Clinton a few weeks before the general election. I knew it was damaging politically and it didn't matter. Because to me the rule of law is more important than my politics. That is honesty. So NO this leftists didn't say that what Clinton did was okay.

And the reason I didn't post the PRA you did is that NOWHERE in it does it say that it is ex-president who has custody of the documents if he leaves office. But the ARCHIVIST. You start from the wrong premise.
Literally highlighted it for you and linked it straight for the Archives own site.

  • Places the responsibility for the custody and management of incumbent Presidential records with the President.

So yes again you are being intellectually dishonest. Its says President twice, doesn't say Archivist once.

I don't care what you're pulling up from Comey as that has 0 to do with what we are discussing

Nice try but you fail
 

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There you go being intellectually dishonest


  • Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA.
  • Establishes a process by which the President may restrict and the public may obtain access to these records after the President leaves office; specifically, the PRA allows for public access to Presidential records through the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) beginning five years after the end of the Administration, but allows the President to invoke as many as six specific restrictions to public access for up to twelve years.

(B) does not include any documentary materials that are (i) official records of an agency (as defined in section 552(e) of title 5, United States Code; (ii) personal records; (iii) stocks of publications and stationery; or (iv) extra copies of documents produced only for convenience of reference, when such copies are clearly so identified.

So in other words NOT intelligence material.

(g)(1) Upon the conclusion of a President’s term of office, or if a President serves consecutive terms upon the conclusion of the last term, the Archivist of the United States shall assume responsibility for the custody, control, and preservation of, and access to, the Presidential records of that President. The Archivist shall have an affirmative duty to make such records available to the public as rapidly and completely as possible consistent with the provisions of this chapter.

In other words NOT at Mar-O lago.

These are exerps from the actual law found by clicking the hyperlink in the SYNOPSIS your link provides

Read it all before you question my intellectual honesty.
 
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Rust_Cohle

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(B) does not include any documentary materials that are (i) official records of an agency (as defined in section 552(e) of title 5, United States Code; (ii) personal records; (iii) stocks of publications and stationery; or (iv) extra copies of documents produced only for convenience of reference, when such copies are clearly so identified.

So in other words NOT intelligence material.

(g)(1) Upon the conclusion of a President’s term of office, or if a President serves consecutive terms upon the conclusion of the last term, the Archivist of the United States shall assume responsibility for the custody, control, and preservation of, and access to, the Presidential records of that President. The Archivist shall have an affirmative duty to make such records available to the public as rapidly and completely as possible consistent with the provisions of this chapter.

In other words NOT at Mar-O lago.

These are exerps from the actual law found by clicking the hyperlink in the SYNOPSIS your link provides

Read it all before you question my intellectual honesty.
You really are dumb aren't ya

govregs.com/uscode/expand/title44_chapter22_section2202
"The President shall remain exclusively responsible for custody, control, and access to such Presidential records."

"Consistent with the provisions of this chapter" that means after the 5 years after the President has left office. In the meantime from the day the present leaves office for the last time to when 5 years is up the President is responsible to maintain them and if he lives at Mar-a-Logo guess where he chose to maintain them

You lose again
 

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