No Evidence for Jesus Outside Bible

[hobelim]

Hobe, you are not only wrong about your last comparison, but you smokescreens the result of my previous point.
Your reply is liken to PeeWee Herman saying "I know you are but what am I" or a Child claiming "Well you do it too".
That's not a clearance to what you do.

The comparison is completely appropriate and your very own scriptures confirm it.

And I am not doing anything other than pointing out the obvious, that the Gospels were deliberately written to obscure the revelation of Jesus Christ about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of Mosaic Law in the exact same dialect of figurative language used to compose the OT and deliberately conceal the way to life by its many unknown editors..



I will give you hidden treasures, riches stored in secret places, so that you may know that I am the LORD, the God of Israel, who summons you by name. Isaiah 45:3

 

[HaShev]

Close but it reads different in the Tanakh.
45:10 you are experiencing the
birth pangs, but don't forget Is 45:20
Assemble and come, approach together, you survivors of the nations; those who carry their graven wooden image and pray to a god who does not save, do not know.

*clearing my throat*

 

[Blackrook]

It seem bizarre to even go down this road. If Christ didn't exist then where did Christianity come from?

 

[HaShev]

Christianity is a blanket term that did not yet exist. What existed was the HaNotzrim (offshoot) cult, the Nazarenes, The Yehudites, and the followers of Theudas which might have been the Nazarenes. Nazarene means guardian of the NT not those from Nazareth where Nazarite would be used.
Krishna was called Christos, Mithra was popular in Tarsus as a pagan christ, there were followers of Benjamin the Egyption and other Christs named Yehuda besides the Galilean tax revolter one.
When Rome converged all religions to one world religion under their authority Christians were those who worshiped or followed a christ=generalized term. The NT clearly shows Paul and James claiming each was teaching another christ then they were, and John of Patmos also declared Rome was forging this anti messiah figure and some were worshiping Mithra and a different christ.
And that his christ was not son of man.
Lastly Christianity itself fallaciously claim Jesus in Zech 12:10 which refers to 2 seperate people: 1 pierced but they mourn for the other thus claiming a confused worship for the wrong christ and compiling of christs.

In propaganda using enough truth to make it seem real confuses people into believing something is real. In creating the Jesus image they used enough real figures with the plagiarism and mythical characters and biblical figures to confuse people into thinking he existed. Those figures existed, but do not make the character real or historical. This is why people refuse to tell us which historical figure is Jesus.
Once they do they are stuck by the historical facts of rhe figure which is never Jesus, just small portions making Jesus image.

 

[Blackrook]

HaShev, whatever. There is better evidence that Christ exists then there is for Moses and the prophets and yet you believe in them, don't you?

 

[HaShev]

Ummmm you just inadvertantly admited There is no such thing as a Moshiach.
You guys need to stop shooting your christ in the foot.
South Park kills Kenny less then you guys kill Jesus with your blundering excuses and arguments.

 

[Blackrook]

Ummmm you just inadvertantly admited There is no such thing as a Moshiach.
You guys need to stop shooting your christ in the foot.
South Park kills Kenny less then you guys kill Jesus with your blundering excuses and arguments.

I have no clue what you are trying to say.

 

[HaShev]

And you don't understand what the Bible is trying to say, so tell us something new.

- - -
Ted Turner hates the Jesus myth but loves the arch malakh Michael and he is blessed. How can he be blessed instead of cursed?

 

[HaShev]

Answer: Because Michael is the messenger of Life and Jesus is the messenger of death.
Blessed are those who chose life and cursed are those who chose death.
Deuteronomy\Devarim: 30:19 I call heaven
and earth to witness against you this
day,That I have set before you life and
death, the blessing and the curse;Therefore
choose life, that you may live, you and your
children.
Yet The Church teaches the curse when
they say:"solution for mankind's dilemma
lies in suffering, and through the portals of
death" "Suffering Is Also God's
Gift” - Pope John Paul II Angelus, October
13, 1996, Gemelli Hospital.
So why would you chose the Curse?

Sources:
Jesus as the angel of death (power of the
devil according to book of Rev) and gate keeper to death:
Example of what they taught:
Death worship:
Colossians 2:12] and you were
buried with him in baptism Romans 6:4 We
were buried therefore with him by baptism
into death in John 18:33-37 :his kingdom is
not of the earth..
The mystery is you've been worshiping death and the gate keeper of death.
John 10 :9 {Jesus speaking} I am the
gate; whoever enters through me will be
saved. But his kingdom was not of this earth
it was in death so he claims to be the gate
keeper of Hades. Thus the whole world is
deceived.
Rev 9:1 the fallen star was given
the key to the shaft of the Abyss. remember
Jesus is the one admitting to having this
Key to the abyss in Revelation 1:18 He’s
also always saying salvation is in death and
we see his proud proclaimation of being the
gate keeper of death: -Apocryphon of
James- "become seekers for death, like the
dead who seek for life; for that which they
seek is revealed to them. And what is there
to trouble them? As for you, when you
examine death it will teach you election.
Verily I say unto you, none of those who fear
death will be saved; for the kingdom of
death belongs to those who put themselves
to death!"

 

[Blackrook]

Christianity is not a myth. It's been around for 2000 years. What is your theory, that 11 fisherman and a tax collector dreamed up this guy, and everything he said, and managed to con the Western world to believe in their lies?

 

[OZman]

Because Michael is the messenger of Life

Just who is this Michael you keep raving about?

 

[Blackrook]

HaShev I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish here. Are you trying to convert Christians to Judaism? Or are you trying to make Christians lose their faith?

 

[HaShev]

Lets answer your question by asking you, if you aren't already Jewish, then how can Jesus be Moshiach?

 

[HaShev]

Christianity is not a myth. It's been around for 2000 years. What is your theory, that 11 fisherman and a tax collector dreamed up this guy, and everything he said, and managed to con the Western world to believe in their lies?

I posted the sources showing the figure is plagiarization of myths such as Baal, Mithra, etc... Rome did this scam to many cultures predating what they did to the Jews.
Read up on what they did to the Veiians and their goddess Juno, a preview of the same thing they did later with YHWH and the Jewish Temple.

Repeat some mythology sources to research:
Canaanite dying god mythology of Athtar the Fierce Morning Star son of Baal.
Research:
discovery of the tablet
in Nineveh in Assyria
dated 700 B.C., now housed in The British Museum,
and referred to by British Museum officials as the "Marduk's Ordeal tablet".
Also referred to as the Baal Passion Play Tablet.

Babylonian myth of Bel (Baal in
Hebrew) is described in a passion play in which:
(1) Bel is taken prisoner;
(2) Bel is tried in a great hall;
(3) Bel is smitten;
(4) Bel is led away to the Mount (a sacred grove on a
hilltop);
(5) with Bel are taken two malefactors, one of whom is
released;
(6) After Bel has gone to the Mount and is executed,
the city breaks into tumult;
(7) Bel's clothes are carried away;
(8.) Bel goes down into the Mount and disappears from
life;
(9) weeping women seek Bel at the Tomb;
(10) Bel is brought back to life.

Fact: Baal's son is the Morning Star
-Rev 22:16 Jesus claims to be Baal's son,
so now we know the fathers name and why Rome claims father (Baal) and son are one in the same. Thus now we can secret the number of his name, Baal Jesus=666
in ASCll numerology used to secret numbers from names.

Fact:the circle (sun)behind the cross is a Baal Cross. Look it up.
Fact; Baal's father was the fishman god Dagon. The fishman ring the Pope wears, the fishead hat miters and the scales on their robes are Symbols of Baal's father reeling the guppys in as fishers of men and symbolizing the Baal worship with harvest god seed talk and dagon fish symbols.
Yeshu son of Mary was not a fisherman, the later christ from Capernaum was.
The Fish symbol and fishing for guppies predated the christ from Capernaum.
Just as the Baal seed scam existed predating Christianity.

 

[OZman]

I do not believe there is an external Moshiach, whether his name is Jesus, or Michael. To me they are both representations of the Higher Self that is in our own being.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Ummmm you just inadvertantly admited There is no such thing as a Moshiach.
You guys need to stop shooting your christ in the foot.
South Park kills Kenny less then you guys kill Jesus with your blundering excuses and arguments.

So then there's no evidence for Abraham or Moses either, right?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Christianity is not a myth. It's been around for 2000 years. What is your theory, that 11 fisherman and a tax collector dreamed up this guy, and everything he said, and managed to con the Western world to believe in their lies?

I posted the sources showing the figure is plagiarization of myths such as Baal, Mithra, etc... Rome did this scam to many cultures predating what they did to the Jews.
Read up on what they did to the Veiians and their goddess Juno, a preview of the same thing they did later with YHWH and the Jewish Temple.

Repeat some mythology sources to research:
Canaanite dying god mythology of Athtar the Fierce Morning Star son of Baal.
Research:
discovery of the tablet
in Nineveh in Assyria
dated 700 B.C., now housed in The British Museum,
and referred to by British Museum officials as the "Marduk's Ordeal tablet".
Also referred to as the Baal Passion Play Tablet.

Babylonian myth of Bel (Baal in
Hebrew) is described in a passion play in which:
(1) Bel is taken prisoner;
(2) Bel is tried in a great hall;
(3) Bel is smitten;
(4) Bel is led away to the Mount (a sacred grove on a
hilltop);
(5) with Bel are taken two malefactors, one of whom is
released;
(6) After Bel has gone to the Mount and is executed,
the city breaks into tumult;
(7) Bel's clothes are carried away;
(8.) Bel goes down into the Mount and disappears from
life;
(9) weeping women seek Bel at the Tomb;
(10) Bel is brought back to life.

Fact: Baal's son is the Morning Star
-Rev 22:16 Jesus claims to be Baal's son,
so now we know the fathers name and why Rome claims father (Baal) and son are one in the same. Thus now we can secret the number of his name, Baal Jesus=666
in ASCll numerology used to secret numbers from names.

Fact:the circle (sun)behind the cross is a Baal Cross. Look it up.
Fact; Baal's father was the fishman god Dagon. The fishman ring the Pope wears, the fishead hat miters and the scales on their robes are Symbols of Baal's father reeling the guppys in as fishers of men and symbolizing the Baal worship with harvest god seed talk and dagon fish symbols.
Yeshu son of Mary was not a fisherman, the later christ from Capernaum was.
The Fish symbol and fishing for guppies predated the christ from Capernaum.
Just as the Baal seed scam existed predating Christianity.

So in the 4th Century Constantine made up a figure and a religion and was just lucky enough that Nero was persecuting this mythical, just made up figure and religion in 66AD.

Wow

What a stroke of luck!

 

[OZman]

I do not believe there is an external Moshiach, whether his name is Jesus, or Michael. To me they are both representations of the Higher Self that is in our own being.

Job 27:
3 For as long as my soul is within me and the spirit of God is in my nostrils, גכִּי כָל עוֹד נִשְׁמָתִי בִי וְרוּחַ אֱלוֹהַּ בְּאַפִּי:

 

[sealybobo]

Christianity is not a myth. It's been around for 2000 years. What is your theory, that 11 fisherman and a tax collector dreamed up this guy, and everything he said, and managed to con the Western world to believe in their lies?

I posted the sources showing the figure is plagiarization of myths such as Baal, Mithra, etc... Rome did this scam to many cultures predating what they did to the Jews.
Read up on what they did to the Veiians and their goddess Juno, a preview of the same thing they did later with YHWH and the Jewish Temple.

Repeat some mythology sources to research:
Canaanite dying god mythology of Athtar the Fierce Morning Star son of Baal.
Research:
discovery of the tablet
in Nineveh in Assyria
dated 700 B.C., now housed in The British Museum,
and referred to by British Museum officials as the "Marduk's Ordeal tablet".
Also referred to as the Baal Passion Play Tablet.

Babylonian myth of Bel (Baal in
Hebrew) is described in a passion play in which:
(1) Bel is taken prisoner;
(2) Bel is tried in a great hall;
(3) Bel is smitten;
(4) Bel is led away to the Mount (a sacred grove on a
hilltop);
(5) with Bel are taken two malefactors, one of whom is
released;
(6) After Bel has gone to the Mount and is executed,
the city breaks into tumult;
(7) Bel's clothes are carried away;
(8.) Bel goes down into the Mount and disappears from
life;
(9) weeping women seek Bel at the Tomb;
(10) Bel is brought back to life.

Fact: Baal's son is the Morning Star
-Rev 22:16 Jesus claims to be Baal's son,
so now we know the fathers name and why Rome claims father (Baal) and son are one in the same. Thus now we can secret the number of his name, Baal Jesus=666
in ASCll numerology used to secret numbers from names.

Fact:the circle (sun)behind the cross is a Baal Cross. Look it up.
Fact; Baal's father was the fishman god Dagon. The fishman ring the Pope wears, the fishead hat miters and the scales on their robes are Symbols of Baal's father reeling the guppys in as fishers of men and symbolizing the Baal worship with harvest god seed talk and dagon fish symbols.
Yeshu son of Mary was not a fisherman, the later christ from Capernaum was.
The Fish symbol and fishing for guppies predated the christ from Capernaum.
Just as the Baal seed scam existed predating Christianity.

I agree. Now let's turn our attention to the original even more unbelievable fairytale the old testament. Moses didn't talk to God and the Noah tale is also a story. Clearly written by ancient primitive uncivilized men.

 

[HaShev]

I do not believe there is an external Moshiach, whether his name is Jesus, or Michael. To me they are both representations of the Higher Self that is in our own being.

In Judaism Moshiach is a servant to mankind not served. Is a Man & mediator between that Essence of life we call God,
so we can reflect and manifest that
nature. Moshiach is not God who is being described and reflected (malakh).
That Essence the Torah & Scrolls says is in the name of the Holy City thus is Shalem (completeness-wholeness).

All Jews are inspired to become Shalem and thus liberating Moshiach for their people. Simple concept bastardized by pagan influenced Christianity deifying the role and concept.
Ask yourself what are the titles of Moshiach if it's to be the top (arch) Malakh (angel),
The Shalem (evening star who rises for the People-Dan 12:1-4), the head mediator (Metatron means mediator),
king of righteousness (Melchi-Tsadek)
Messenger of righteousness (Malakh- Tsadek) king of the Zadokite line
Melchi-Zadok, all=Melchizedek.
Head of the hosts (Rabbis).
Coming with and out of the "clouds"(i.e. Gathering of Kohanim)=Moshiach is out of the line of Aaron.-4QSe (4Q259).
If you research these terms they all refer to Michael. They are not names of a bunch of people, they are roles of the one.


Isaiah first of all mentions the Prince of the Congregation-"Michael", as the Davidic Messiah (scroll 4 Q285 Fr. 5 which is written in the Book of Isaiah & In the "Isaiah Commentary" scroll: (IQSb,v 20-29)

War Scroll” (4Q471)
Where in verse XVII, it says, “God will send eternal bliss by the might of the Princely Angel of "the Kingdom of Michael". He will enlighten with joy the children of Israel.

Words of the Archangel Michael scroll 4Q529, 6Q23 YeruShalem will carry his name.

The Coming of Melchizedek (king/messenger of righteousness) (11Q19-20)

Commander of G-d of Israel, 4Q285, Fr.4&5 and fr 10

1QM v, 1-2) States:He (Michael)will not have much room to act as Royal Messiah while battling the Sons of Darkness.
“God himself is a supreme agent of salvation and after him in importance is Michael.”

4QSe (4Q259) the Moshiach's Aaron Lineage,

IIQ13 "Heavenly Prince Melchizedek Scroll" about Michael conducting the atonement day Judgment.
Blessings scroll (1QSb=1Q28b)
V:20 "blessings of the Prince of the Congregation (Michael)
Renew him the covenant of the community so he might establish the kingdom of his people for ever, that he might judge the poor with righteousness & dispense Justice with equity to the oppressed.

4Q285 5&10 Judgment of the Kittim (Romans)

Dead Sea Scrolls:
llQMelch ll,9,13 ,
4Q246 ,
1QS x12-18