Looks Like the Public Isn't Interested In Cutting Spending

[AVG-JOE]

Is Rabeye really a demented easter bunny?

A truly rw kook.

Yeah, pointing out that how you phrase the question in a poll will pretty much determine the answer really is right wing kookery, right?

What morons the two of you are.

The Libs will resort to ad homelum attacks and use these push polls. If they use common since like a real American... Scandals are brewing.

Perhaps a poll of TEA Party enthusiasts which says basically the same thing would be more to your liking?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/tea-party/164480-my-problem-with-the-tea-party-3.html#post3563152

 

[rdean]

Misleading. The country is interested in cutting spending, just not throwing the elderly under the bus.

Have you noticed how Republicans demonize groups of people? They are so good at sowing discord. Their problem is when they pick a loyal section of the Republican base. Now they are going to have to pay the piper.

Don't get me wrong, elderly white Republicans won't vote for Obama. They can't stand having a black president. They just won't vote at all.

 

[AVG-JOE]

I do not doubt that this poll might very well have been designed to evoke a certain response.

After all, most polls today do seem to be designed to arrive at the outcome the designers are hoping for.

But nevertheless the people responded to something that is real even if it is not the whole story.

People DO want medicade and medicare to surive. Hence the outcome of this poll.

However if the poll had included information about how those HC insurance liabilities are going to bankrupt the nation, the outcome would have been different.

But how do you think people would REACT (not vote, but react) if suddenly their grandmother wasn't getting the HC she needed?

Do you think they'd say, that's okay?

Even knowing that the nation is going bankrupt, what do you think the average American is going to think when GM doesn't get her health care?

Do you RW cranks on this board still think the average American is going to support your anti-government Randian POVs?

I think that public sentiment will stop on dime and reverse itself within a month.

I honest think the BEST thing that could happen to this nation is for you RAndians to get your way, to shut down the Federal government just so the American people can see what that society would look like.

I suspect a few of you here, those of you counting on your military retirement checks and the VA, are going to suddenly remember that YOU TOO are dependents of the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

WE'll see how serious you guys are about shutting down the nanny state government when YOUR NANNY gets gored.

Well, my two grandmas are both dead.
How do you think people will react when asked if they would support paying an extra $3,000/year in taxes to support some fat slob smoker who's had his third MI?
Democrats breed irresponsible behavior and foist this off on everyone else.

AVG-MOM is alive and well because of Medicare. She faithfully paid the taxes all her working career and when she got old and needed care, it was there for her.

Do you want to talk tit-for-tat irresponsible waste of public resources? How about $3 TRILLION spent on blowing things up in Iraq? THAT one belongs to the republicans - hook, line and sinker.

 

[AVG-JOE]

I'd lvoe to see the results of a poll that asked "would you support increasing your own taxes to save Medicare, or would you prefer to see the program changed to become more efficient?"

Do you have any suggestions? I mean other than the lame-ass voucher give away to the insurance piggies?

 

[The Rabbi]

I do not doubt that this poll might very well have been designed to evoke a certain response.

After all, most polls today do seem to be designed to arrive at the outcome the designers are hoping for.

But nevertheless the people responded to something that is real even if it is not the whole story.

People DO want medicade and medicare to surive. Hence the outcome of this poll.

However if the poll had included information about how those HC insurance liabilities are going to bankrupt the nation, the outcome would have been different.

But how do you think people would REACT (not vote, but react) if suddenly their grandmother wasn't getting the HC she needed?

Do you think they'd say, that's okay?

Even knowing that the nation is going bankrupt, what do you think the average American is going to think when GM doesn't get her health care?

Do you RW cranks on this board still think the average American is going to support your anti-government Randian POVs?

I think that public sentiment will stop on dime and reverse itself within a month.

I honest think the BEST thing that could happen to this nation is for you RAndians to get your way, to shut down the Federal government just so the American people can see what that society would look like.

I suspect a few of you here, those of you counting on your military retirement checks and the VA, are going to suddenly remember that YOU TOO are dependents of the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

WE'll see how serious you guys are about shutting down the nanny state government when YOUR NANNY gets gored.

Well, my two grandmas are both dead.
How do you think people will react when asked if they would support paying an extra $3,000/year in taxes to support some fat slob smoker who's had his third MI?
Democrats breed irresponsible behavior and foist this off on everyone else.

AVG-MOM is alive and well because of Medicare. She faithfully paid the taxes all her working career and when she got old and needed care, it was there for her.

Do you want to talk tit-for-tat irresponsible waste of public resources? How about $3 TRILLION spent on blowing things up in Iraq? THAT one belongs to the republicans - hook, line and sinker.

Um Medicare isn't like Social Security.
Do you have any source for that 3 trillion dollar figure? Obama spent that in 2 years.

 

[The Rabbi]

I'd lvoe to see the results of a poll that asked "would you support increasing your own taxes to save Medicare, or would you prefer to see the program changed to become more efficient?"

Do you have any suggestions? I mean other than the lame-ass voucher give away to the insurance piggies?

Why do you think the Ryan proposal will not work?

 

[AVG-JOE]

Bottom line for this average Joe is that addressing spending without also addressing the revenue side with mass simplification of the tax code is a complete waste of time and resources. When taxes are collected simply taxes will be collected fairly and only when taxes are collected simply and fairly will we know how much money our tax base is truly worth. Until we know that, how can we possibly discuss how much to spend?

 

[AVG-JOE]

I'd lvoe to see the results of a poll that asked "would you support increasing your own taxes to save Medicare, or would you prefer to see the program changed to become more efficient?"

Do you have any suggestions? I mean other than the lame-ass voucher give away to the insurance piggies?

Why do you think the Ryan proposal will not work?

Confusion and a complete lack of competition in the health insurance market. All the voucher system will accomplish is to add a layer of private bureaucracy to the existing system and private bureaucracies cost between 20% and 25% to operate, compared to 3% to 5% costs for public bureaucracies.

The voucher system will create confusion for consumers and profits for the insurance piggies - just like the lobbyists engineered it to do.

 

[chikenwing]

The public has proven time and time we are not real smart,a fast glance at DC proves this.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Well, my two grandmas are both dead.
How do you think people will react when asked if they would support paying an extra $3,000/year in taxes to support some fat slob smoker who's had his third MI?
Democrats breed irresponsible behavior and foist this off on everyone else.

AVG-MOM is alive and well because of Medicare. She faithfully paid the taxes all her working career and when she got old and needed care, it was there for her.

Do you want to talk tit-for-tat irresponsible waste of public resources? How about $3 TRILLION spent on blowing things up in Iraq? THAT one belongs to the republicans - hook, line and sinker.

Um Medicare isn't like Social Security.
Do you have any source for that 3 trillion dollar figure? Obama spent that in 2 years.

The true cost of the Iraq war: $3 trillion and beyond

When did I mention Social Security?

 

[mudwhistle]

Is Rabeye really a demented easter bunny?

A truly rw kook.

You're a useful idiot.

 

[mudwhistle]

Misleading. The country is interested in cutting spending, just not throwing the elderly under the bus.

Have you noticed how Republicans demonize groups of people? They are so good at sowing discord. Their problem is when they pick a loyal section of the Republican base. Now they are going to have to pay the piper.

Don't get me wrong, elderly white Republicans won't vote for Obama. They can't stand having a black president. They just won't vote at all.

Have you noticed how great the left is at demonizing groups of people (The Tea Party), how great they are at sowing discord (union protesters shipped all over the country). The assumption that most Republicans are Middle-Aged whites that hate gays and blacks is a prime example. The assumption that Republicans are mostly rich white folks when in fact most of the rich in the North East are elderly liberals. The assumption that the left actually helps the poor when their policies keep them where they are.

We don't give a shit what color the President as long as he's honest to us. We also wouldn't mind if the SOB didn't constantly prove to us that he hates us.

 

[Flopper]

In a recent ABC/Washington Post poll, Americans were in no mood to cut entitlement programs. Americans strongly reject Medicare cuts and broadly support higher taxes on the wealthy, underscoring the political risks in Republican debt-reduction plans.

The poll, conducted for ABC News by Langer Research Associates, finds that 65 percent of Americans oppose changing Medicare to a system in which the government would give seniors vouchers with which to buy private insurance. Opposition was essentially the same in a Kaiser Family Foundation/Harvard School of Public Health survey when the idea came up 15 years ago.

The language may matter, in that even most Republicans, 56 percent, oppose Medicare vouchers, as do more than seven in 10 Democrats. And opposition soars to 84 percent of all Americans, including nearly three-quarters of Republicans, if government payments failed to meet the full cost of seniors' insurance coverage.

CUT? -- And what to cut is hardly a simple matter. Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid and military spending consume nearly two-thirds of federal spending. But 78 percent in this survey oppose cuts in Medicare in order to address the federal debt (indeed 65 percent "strongly" oppose it); 69 percent oppose cuts in Medicaid, the insurance program for the poor (52 percent strongly); and fewer, but still 56 percent, oppose cutting military spending.

Far more popular is taxing people perceived as being most able to pay: Seventy-two percent support achieving debt-reduction by raising taxes on people with household incomes more than $250,000 a year.

Medicare Cuts Proposed by Republicans Face Broad Opposition in ABC News Poll - ABC News

I think that's called a "push poll" in the vernacular. Like this question:

19. I'm going to read you two statements about the future of the Medicare program. After I read both statements, please tell me which one comes closer to your own view:
Medicare should remain as it is today, with a defined set of benefits for people over 65, OR Medicare should be changed so that people over 65 would receive a check or voucher from the government each year for a fixed amount they can use to shop for their own private health insurance policy.

Now, if you added, do you think Medicare should be allowed to grow to consume 50% of the U.S. budget, I suspect the results would vary greatly.

The items listed in this question are the items being debated in Congress. Adding projections based on assumed tax rates and projections of healthcare cost increase would certainly skew the results and invalidate the question.

 

[Old Rocks]

That is why true fiscal conservatives supported the PO or single payer health care. We really have a lot of room to minimize our HC costs and improve HC outcomes. Unfortunately, we didn't get true HC reform, but a re-hashed GOP bill that hardly saves anything at all.

Anyways, I don't blame the American public. Why should "entitlement programs" (i.e. programs that people actually pay into and are 'entitled' to) be cut, especially when they didn't cause our current budget mess or financial crisis. However, that is what Republicans are going after along with workers' right, NPR, PP, and the EPA.

I won't disagree that there is waste in these programs and that some reform is needed. However, it is ludicrous to go after the working class and lower income people to make them pay for something that they didn't cause. Sadly, these people are the GOP's fabricated nemesis.

The proposal from Obama increases costs. It's the worst of ALL possible solutions. It increases costs and tries to balance the increase in cost by increases taxes which are in turn collected from the people who could not afford to pay the costs BEFORE they were increased.

The smartest man on the planet doesn't know that companies don't pay taxes, they only collect them.

Any effort to reduce costs is an effort to reduce costs. That seems to be the part of the puzzle that got past you.

As long as you buy in to the premise that only one segment of the society needs to sacrifice to answer this question, you have been pulled right into the Class Warfare startegy of the Democrat Demagogues and we will not solve this. Ever.

We are spending 3 and a half trillion dollars annually on the waste and inefficiency that is our government. If you had the $100.00 bills to stack up to pay our debt, it would stack up to about 8000 miles tall.

We are in very deep doo doo and it won't get better with class warfare.

That is surely true, it won't get better with class warfare. That is why Ryan's proposals should be rejected out of hand. For they are class warfare.

 

[Old Rocks]

I think what the public is telling us, is they want a fair and balanced approach to deficit reduction. To require that the poor and our seniors make all of the sacrifices while those that have the most, sacrifice nothing is not going to wash with voters in either party.

Without in any way denying that "the Poor" need help, why is reducing the amount of aid that they recieve from the generosity of those around them regarded as a sacrifice?

Let's be honest. We are paying the poor to not riot in the street.

They are accepting the payments, and for the most part, don't riot.

This is a deal with the devil. When the payments can no longer be afforded, we're screwed.

I see. The SS I have paid into all of my life is welfare.

But you are wrong, take it away, no riots in the streets. Riots around high end gated communities.

 

[Old Rocks]

Misleading. The country is interested in cutting spending, just not throwing the elderly under the bus.

Have you noticed how Republicans demonize groups of people? They are so good at sowing discord. Their problem is when they pick a loyal section of the Republican base. Now they are going to have to pay the piper.

Don't get me wrong, elderly white Republicans won't vote for Obama. They can't stand having a black president. They just won't vote at all.

Have you noticed how great the left is at demonizing groups of people (The Tea Party), how great they are at sowing discord (union protesters shipped all over the country). The assumption that most Republicans are Middle-Aged whites that hate gays and blacks is a prime example. The assumption that Republicans are mostly rich white folks when in fact most of the rich in the North East are elderly liberals. The assumption that the left actually helps the poor when their policies keep them where they are.

We don't give a shit what color the President as long as he's honest to us. We also wouldn't mind if the SOB didn't constantly prove to us that he hates us.

What a crock you post, Mud. Why don't you listen to the demonizing rhetoric of the right wingnuts on Faux for a while.

 

[Old Rocks]

Is Rabeye really a demented easter bunny?

A truly rw kook.

You're a useful idiot.

And you are just an idiot.

 

[The T]

That poll just proves that most people don't understand that even if we took all the wealth generated by the evil rich it still wouldn't cover the US Government to the end of the year. Even if it did, what would we do the next year?

The real problem is the Federal Reserve and International Bankers.

AndI for one support Auditing the FED...and even getting RID of it.

 

[finebead]

In a recent ABC/Washington Post poll, Americans were in no mood to cut entitlement programs. Americans strongly reject Medicare cuts and broadly support higher taxes on the wealthy, underscoring the political risks in Republican debt-reduction plans.

The poll, conducted for ABC News by Langer Research Associates, finds that 65 percent of Americans oppose changing Medicare to a system in which the government would give seniors vouchers with which to buy private insurance. Opposition was essentially the same in a Kaiser Family Foundation/Harvard School of Public Health survey when the idea came up 15 years ago.

The language may matter, in that even most Republicans, 56 percent, oppose Medicare vouchers, as do more than seven in 10 Democrats. And opposition soars to 84 percent of all Americans, including nearly three-quarters of Republicans, if government payments failed to meet the full cost of seniors' insurance coverage.

CUT? -- And what to cut is hardly a simple matter. Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid and military spending consume nearly two-thirds of federal spending. But 78 percent in this survey oppose cuts in Medicare in order to address the federal debt (indeed 65 percent "strongly" oppose it); 69 percent oppose cuts in Medicaid, the insurance program for the poor (52 percent strongly); and fewer, but still 56 percent, oppose cutting military spending.

Far more popular is taxing people perceived as being most able to pay: Seventy-two percent support achieving debt-reduction by raising taxes on people with household incomes more than $250,000 a year.

Medicare Cuts Proposed by Republicans Face Broad Opposition in ABC News Poll - ABC News

Just because americans want to keep medicare intact (which is something we all need, healthcare), does not mean they are opposed to spending cuts. We could competitive bid the drugs consumed under medicare part D instead of the sweetheart deal the repubs gave big pharma (pay list price for drugs under medicare part D). The public wants to cut spending by being more efficient, not by killing programs.

 

[MarcATL]

The public has proven time and time we are not real smart,a fast glance at DC proves this.

So you agree with Bill Maher and the rest of when we say that Americans are dumb right?