Liberals Won’t Be Around Much Longer!

[rightwinger]

You keep muttering that same falsehood.....

...I understand how difficult it is for you to change at you age.



While it may be too nuanced for you to comprehend, here is the truth:

1. Unlike classical liberalism, which saw government as a necessary evil, of simply a benign but voluntary social contract for free men to enter into willingly, the belief that the entire society was one organic whole left no room for those who didn’t want to behave, let alone ‘evolve.’ Thus progressive reformers saw the home as the front line in the war to transform men into compliant social organs.

a. One answer was to get children out of the home as quickly as possible, so that the home could no longer be an island, separate and sovereign from the rest of society.
b. John Dewey helped create kindergartens to help shape children for the new ‘society.’
c. This can be seen in Woodrow Wilson’s speech as president of Princeton: “Our problem is not merely to help students to adjust to themselves to world life…[but] to make them as unlike their fathers as we can.” (Michael McGerr, “A Fierce Discontent: The Rise and Fall of the Progressive Movement in America, 1870-1920,” p. 111

2.Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked [classical]liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.



... individualism, private property, and limits on power...Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.


OK...you can go back to your prune juice.

Liberals are liberals

It is a mindset of looking at how your society is functioning and saying....I can make it better

The issues change, the tactics change

But what remains the same is.........Conservatives fight every step of the way

So wrong for so long, wingy.


And so easy to destroy your flimsy argument....which I note never comes with links and documentation: the sure sign of apocryphal oral history.


Ready?
OK...if the Founders were your version of modern liberals, as opposed to the truth...that they were conservatives (classical liberals), then they would have desired a strong dominant central government....

...a king, an 'imperial presidency' (e.g., FDR, Obama)...rather than a one based on federalism and the limitations of our Constitution.

QED



Of course, the degree to which your version of history is to be believed can be seen in your avi....'rightwinger'....when you have not even a passing acquaintance with right-wing beliefs.

The concept of "Classical Liberalism" is a farce perpetrated by conservatives

The founders of our country did not have a choice of installing a modern democracy. They were forced by geography, communications and economics to install a small decentralized government. With an agrarian economy and vast distances between populated regions they were forced to install a government which did just enough to get by.

However, in their implementation of an "All Men are created equal" form of government ....They were truly the Liberals of their day

 

[PoliticalChic]

Liberals are liberals

It is a mindset of looking at how your society is functioning and saying....I can make it better

The issues change, the tactics change

But what remains the same is.........Conservatives fight every step of the way

So wrong for so long, wingy.


And so easy to destroy your flimsy argument....which I note never comes with links and documentation: the sure sign of apocryphal oral history.


Ready?
OK...if the Founders were your version of modern liberals, as opposed to the truth...that they were conservatives (classical liberals), then they would have desired a strong dominant central government....

...a king, an 'imperial presidency' (e.g., FDR, Obama)...rather than a one based on federalism and the limitations of our Constitution.

QED



Of course, the degree to which your version of history is to be believed can be seen in your avi....'rightwinger'....when you have not even a passing acquaintance with right-wing beliefs.

The concept of "Classical Liberalism" is a farce perpetrated by conservatives

The founders of our country did not have a choice of installing a modern democracy. They were forced by geography, communications and economics to install a small decentralized government. With an agrarian economy and vast distances between populated regions they were forced to install a government which did just enough to get by.

However, in their implementation of an "All Men are created equal" form of government ....They were truly the Liberals of their day

"....perpetrated by conservatives..."

Other than the Daily Worker, do you have any sources?

No?


What a surprise.



What amazes me is that you've moved beyond Freud....he believed that our dreams are the venue of wish fulfillment.

But you are able to institute that same self-satisfaction while fully awake!
Bravo!

 

[rightwinger]

So wrong for so long, wingy.


And so easy to destroy your flimsy argument....which I note never comes with links and documentation: the sure sign of apocryphal oral history.


Ready?
OK...if the Founders were your version of modern liberals, as opposed to the truth...that they were conservatives (classical liberals), then they would have desired a strong dominant central government....

...a king, an 'imperial presidency' (e.g., FDR, Obama)...rather than a one based on federalism and the limitations of our Constitution.

QED



Of course, the degree to which your version of history is to be believed can be seen in your avi....'rightwinger'....when you have not even a passing acquaintance with right-wing beliefs.

The concept of "Classical Liberalism" is a farce perpetrated by conservatives

The founders of our country did not have a choice of installing a modern democracy. They were forced by geography, communications and economics to install a small decentralized government. With an agrarian economy and vast distances between populated regions they were forced to install a government which did just enough to get by.

However, in their implementation of an "All Men are created equal" form of government ....They were truly the Liberals of their day

"....perpetrated by conservatives..."

Other than the Daily Worker, do you have any sources?

No?


What a surprise.



What amazes me is that you've moved beyond Freud....he believed that our dreams are the venue of wish fulfillment.

But you are able to institute that same self-satisfaction while fully awake!
Bravo!

You are Liberal or Conservative based on the issues and challenges of your era and how you faced them

Trying to relabel our Founding fathers as Conservatives is historical revisionism

 

[PoliticalChic]

The concept of "Classical Liberalism" is a farce perpetrated by conservatives

The founders of our country did not have a choice of installing a modern democracy. They were forced by geography, communications and economics to install a small decentralized government. With an agrarian economy and vast distances between populated regions they were forced to install a government which did just enough to get by.

However, in their implementation of an "All Men are created equal" form of government ....They were truly the Liberals of their day

"....perpetrated by conservatives..."

Other than the Daily Worker, do you have any sources?

No?


What a surprise.



What amazes me is that you've moved beyond Freud....he believed that our dreams are the venue of wish fulfillment.

But you are able to institute that same self-satisfaction while fully awake!
Bravo!

You are Liberal or Conservative based on the issues and challenges of your era and how you faced them

Trying to relabel our Founding fathers as Conservatives is historical revisionism

Did you miss this:

"....perpetrated by conservatives..."

Other than the Daily Worker, do you have any sources?

No?


What a surprise."





I thought my Sigmund Freud allusion was particularly clever....didn't you?

You do recall who Sigmund Freud was, don't you?

 

[rdean]

You mean the 90% white Republican Party won't be around much longer. Thank God.

 

[uscitizen]

True.... liberals do not do as well in a police state as right wingers do.

Remember Ryan voted to make the Patriot act permanant.

 

[PoliticalChic]

True.... liberals do not do as well in a police state as right wingers do.

OMG....all this time I thought you were living right here in America!!!

 

[Bfgrn]

Who was Edmund Burke?
The philosopher who is generally considered the father of modern conservatism.

"If I should claim any man as my master, that man would be Burke"
Woodrow Wilson

 

[regent]

"For the framers of the Constitution were the most liberal thinkers of all the ages and the charter they produced out of the liberal revolution of their time has never been and is not now surpassed in liberal thought."
General Douglas Mac Arthur.


Doug was not know for his liberalism.

 

[rightwinger]

"For the framers of the Constitution were the most liberal thinkers of all the ages and the charter they produced out of the liberal revolution of their time has never been and is not now surpassed in liberal thought."
General Douglas Mac Arthur.


Doug was not know for his liberalism.

There were no equivalents of a Modern Democracy in the late 18th century. To use that as a reason to claim that our founding fathers would not have supported todays country is ludicrous

 

[Bfgrn]

Not so fast PC...don't forget Obama's political prisoners by the thousands, 100,000 government propaganda agents, a quarter million ‘goons’ given legal authority will be voting for Obama by decree...

Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.
Voltaire

 

[PoliticalChic]

Who was Edmund Burke?
The philosopher who is generally considered the father of modern conservatism.

"If I should claim any man as my master, that man would be Burke"
Woodrow Wilson

BoringFriendlessGuy!!!


What the heck kept you???


I know you weren't chatting with friends!!!


Woodrow Wilson...another Democrat who installed segregtion and imposed Jim Crow laws....He's your guy?

Really?


As for the quote, Shakespeare anticipated you: "The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose."



So, what have we learned?
Jot down this rule of thumb, and follow it ...'religiously':

The only truth necessary for you is what I post.


Magnet that to your frig....

 

[PoliticalChic]

"For the framers of the Constitution were the most liberal thinkers of all the ages and the charter they produced out of the liberal revolution of their time has never been and is not now surpassed in liberal thought."
General Douglas Mac Arthur.


Doug was not know for his liberalism.

You must have missed post #17.


Study it, reggie....it will save you future embarrassment!

 

[rightwinger]

The founders had two choices when they created this country

1. Small Government
2. Smaller Government

Because of the immense economic hardship of the time....they selected option 2

 

[PoliticalChic]

Not so fast PC...don't forget Obama's political prisoners by the thousands, 100,000 government propaganda agents, a quarter million ‘goons’ given legal authority will be voting for Obama by decree...

Anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices.
Voltaire

Curious....

Exactly how many years were you playing solitaire before you came up with the idea that posting on a message board counted as social interaction?

 

[peach174]

Part history- part prognostication....

Shortly, ‘Liberals’ will be gone. Why? Mark Twain had the right idea: "History does not repeat itself, but it does rhyme."


1. Under the first Progressive President, Woodrow Wilson, America was the world’s first fascist nation, complete with first modern propaganda ministry, political prisoners by the thousands, 100,000 government propaganda agents, a quarter million ‘goons’ were given legal authority to beat and intimidate and widespread censorship.
http://www.ncpa.org/pdfs/Classical_Liberalism_vs_Modern_Liberal_Conservatism.pdf p. 9

2. The result? “The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. [Republican] Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

a. Wait for similar results in November!




3. So, the chameleon-like Left did the only thing it could do! ‘In the United States, where liberalism most clearly reversed its meaning, in common parlance, it was the socialist John Dewey who openly promoted the idea of stealing the liberal label. [Socialists] knew that [classical] liberalism had a good reputation with the working classes — the very audience which they were targeting. The idea was to adopt the name liberal to describe socialism.’ They changed the name!! Sneaky?? http://orlingrabbe.com/lfetimes/liberal_confusion.htm

a. Change the name from socialist, and progressive....to liberal!!!




4. A straight line can be drawn from Karl Marx and Georges Sorel up to our current version. History has regularly shown how wrong the theories are, so victory requires misdirection, fabrication…and a way to diminish the truth: the answer is the philosophical doctrine known as Postmodernism.

a. … postmodernism is based on the position that reality is not mirrored in human understanding of it, but is rather constructed as the mind tries to understand its own personal reality. Postmodernism is therefore skeptical of explanations that claim to be valid for all groups, cultures, traditions, or races, and instead focuses on the relative truths of each person…. Postmodernism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

b. … truth has fallen in priority to ideology, also known as the ‘greater truth’ of pre-formed conclusions. A case in point is climate change. Normal science discovers facts, and then constructs a theory from those facts. ‘Post-modern science’ starts with a theory that is politically sensitive, and then makes up facts to influence opinion in its favor.
Melanie Philips, “The World Turned Upside Down”




5. “ President Obama often speaks in postmodern language. For example, here is part of a discussion of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence in his book, The Audacity of Hope:

“Implicit in [the Constitution's] structure, in the very idea of ordered liberty, was a rejection of absolute truth, the infallibility of any idea or ideology or theology or “ism,” any tyrannical consistency that might lock future generations into a single, unalterable course, or drive both majorities and minorities into the cruelties [notice cruelty: he's against it] of the Inquisition, the pogrom, the gulag, or the jihad.”

Obama's point here is that absolute truth and ordered liberty are incompatible, because absolute truth turns its believers into fanatics or moral monsters. https://www.hillsdale.edu/news/imprimis/archive/issue.asp?year=2010&month=0

a. So...if you believe that there is no absolute truth, no real right and wrong, no good or evil...hey, you're a Liberal, a Progressive....a Postmodernist!!!




5. So…where will the “Liberals” go when they disappear? No where….they’ll simply change their name…to….”PostMods!”


a. But know this: ‘Barack Obama stuck his foot in his mouth today when he said "you can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig" ‘BARACK OBAMA: PUT LIPSTICK ON A PIG, IT'S STILL A PIG - NYPOST.com

He didn't realize that he was applying same to his views.

When you say liberals won't be around long, what do you and your cohorts mean. Killing, prison, deportation?, what. There will always be liberal minded people in the world like Jesus for example. The only way to get rid of them so they won't be around longer is to do what Hitler did. Now whose the scary one. The loon. To openly threaten someone on an open forum is against the laws of this country. I hope you meant something else

Of course they are going to be around.
We are talking about getting them out of positions of power not killing them off.
Polls all say that there are 20% of liberals in this nation yet they rule and are in power of everything in this country.They should represent around one quarter of rule in the Nation.
Especially in politics, media, journalism,schools and universities.

 

[uscitizen]

True.... liberals do not do as well in a police state as right wingers do.

OMG....all this time I thought you were living right here in America!!!

I am just visiting here, a student of alien cultures.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Liberalism hasn't been around in over a century. Politichic, you may enjoy this book. It's a classic in poli sci.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/The-End-Liberalism-Second-Republic/dp/0393090000]Amazon.com: The End of Liberalism: The Second Republic of the United States (9780393090000): Theodore J. Lowi: Books[/ame]

The End of Liberalism: The Second Republic of the United States

This widely read book has become a modern classic of political science.

The main argument which Lowi develops through this book is that the liberal state grew to its immense size and presence without self-examination and without recognizing that its pattern of growth had problematic consequences. Its engine of growth was delegation. The government expanded by responding to the demands of all major organized interests, by assuming responsibility for programs sought by those interests, and by assigning that responsibility to administrative agencies. Through the process of accommodation, the agencies became captives of the interest groups, a tendency Lowi describes as clientelism. This in turn led to the formulation of new policies which tightened the grip of interest groups on the machinery of government.

 

[PoliticalChic]

True.... liberals do not do as well in a police state as right wingers do.

OMG....all this time I thought you were living right here in America!!!

I am just visiting here, a student of alien cultures.

Well, in that case, I want to see your birth certificate and student transcripts before I vote for you!

 

[Politico]

Yeah, that five-day, 40-hour work week sure does suck the big one.

Yeah I heard of those. People used to buy something called tape decks in those days right?