Liberalism

[PaintMyHouse]

I just listen to my metal and give the government the finger. My pregnant brain keeps forgetting what I was gonna say, but I have a feeling it was of importance.

Nothing said on the Internet is of any importance. What is said here matters even less.

 

[Pogo]

A good many of the vocal ones certainly are, and more than that they're Eliminationists -- focused not on dialogue or exchange of ideas but on outright demonization of anything that opposes them, the goal of course being to absolutely extinguish any alternate view to their own and establish ideological monopoly.

It's hard for me to recall when I've read a more inaccurate piece of writing. Congratulations to you.

Look, right up front let's acknowledge that a good many liberal ideas are a stalking horse for liberal totalitarianism. When a rapist is in the middle of attacking a woman, you shouldn't be faulting the woman for not having a "dialogue or exchange of ideas" on the issue of rape.

The liberal assault on human rights needs to be stopped, not debated.

On the issues which liberals favor which are not predicated upon totalitarian control, there certainly is debate.

So for you to confuse opposition to liberal totalitarianism with Eliminationism and close-mindedness is pretty impressive sophistry on your part.

This country was founded by Liberals as a Liberal experiment, and that philosophy has been under fire from both the right and left ever since.

And during the same era "gay" used to mean happy and using your argument, definitions never change and so to call someone gay today implies that they are a happy person, not some homosexual.

Round about half a century ago the Joe McCarthys of the right started using Liberal as a slur, conflating them with their political enemies, Democrats (who were both liberals and conservatives). Round about 1988 Lee Atwater and the George Bush Presidential campaign revived that conflation as a campaign propaganda tool. Round about six years ago a writer named Jonah Goldberg wrote a book called "Liberal Fascism" (a concept functionally much like "Antarctic Heat Wave") to further conflate the meaning. All these wags were (and are) attacking Liberalism by trying to morph its meaning into some kind of slur. Which makes about as much sense as claiming Adolf Hitler was a leftist (oh wait, some have already gone there).

Correcting purposeful misinformation is now a conflation of meaning.

Today, halfwit self-styled pundits like Sean Hannity and Lush Rimjob continue the same conflation in their quest to dumb-down the populace. The drones picked up on all this malarkey and ran with it, not bothering to strip out the baloneyistic demagoguery and examine the true definition. By now we have people walking around who literally think Liberalism is the opposite of what it actually is.

We see this a lot with immature thinkers - they appeal to dictionary definitions and ignore the reality on the ground. A favorite tactic is to make a claim like this - "True communism has never actually been implemented yet, so to condemn the communist systems of the Soviet Union, the Eastern Bloc, China, Vietnam and Cambodia is wrong. They weren't really communist." For the people listening to this idiocy, they're having a good laugh at an immature thinking trying to think his way out of a wet paper bag.

Abstract definitions have very little utility when compared to how adherents of a philosophy actually implement the philosophy. The abstract doesn't exist unlike the philosophy implemented by the adherents. We can measure how that political philosophy actually intersects the real world.

See what I mean? Posted sixteen minutes after my post; I know there's no way this punditry wannabe read my link in sixteen minutes. It's like thirty pages long. No, he just whines that I laugh at his poo catapult. Because that's all he has. This is exactly what I mean by Eliminationists and their level of interest in dialogue.

By the way Evelyn Wood, "liberal totalitarianism" is an oxymoron. Had you bothered to read my points and links you might have a clue why that is.

 

[Rikurzhen]

By the way Evelyn Wood, "liberal totalitarianism" is an oxymoron. Had you bothered to read my points and links you might have a clue why that is.

And communism had never been tried, am I right?

 

[PaintMyHouse]

By the way Evelyn Wood, "liberal totalitarianism" is an oxymoron. Had you bothered to read my points and links you might have a clue why that is.

And communism had never been tried, am I right?

Not that I know of. Capitalism, to Socialism, to Communism. In that order.

 

[Pogo]

By the way Evelyn Wood, "liberal totalitarianism" is an oxymoron. Had you bothered to read my points and links you might have a clue why that is.

And communism had never been tried, am I right?

Not that I know of. Capitalism, to Socialism, to Communism. In that order.

Communism has been used in socio-religious contexts for centuries, and it still is. With remarkable success I might add.

Not the topic here though. The title is Liberalism. I suspect Evelyn Wood up there is desperate to change the subject. Wonder why.
Anybody want some red herring? I'm full. ::burp::

 

[Rikurzhen]

Communism has been used in socio-religious contexts for centuries, and it still is. With remarkable success I might add.

I have to agree with you there, communism has been remarkable successful as a mass murder mechanism putting Nazism to shame.

 

[kiwiman127]

So, here on this forum I've been getting called a liberal. I don't involve myself with politics and I don't really understand the terminology and the difference between all the parties.
I've always considered myself as an independent because I don't really care for politics.

Please don't judge. I just want to understand all of it better.

The classical term liberal is the opposite of authoritarianism. However, today's modern liberal is all about increasing the size and scope of the state over the individual. Now we have the state telling us that we can't drink biggie sodas and what kinds of toilets we can buy etc.

Last year alone, the government passed well over 40,000 new regulations and laws. For the modern liberal, the problem is personal freedom because we drink too much, eat to much, don't eat and drink the right things, use too much energy because we live in houses too big and drive cars that are too big. Our mere existence is increasing carbon emissions and choosing the reproduce just makes it worse. We pollute the environment and we don't share enough of our wealth with the poor etc.

No doubt about it, personal freedom is the biggest danger to mother earth, so ever endeavor should be made to curb and control it, if not crush it.

I've always said that jail is the ideal liberal utopia. This is because:

1. Everyone wears the same cloths and eats the same food. No where on earth is there such equality.
2. Everything is free, including health care.
3. Everyday is gay pride day in jail.
4. You could not be safer behind bars and with guards watching your every move......unless you share a jail cell with a big guy named "Bubba".
5. You have free access to educational opportunities.
6. No one has to work, and all the porn and sex you can muster.
6. In jail, the minority is the majority. If you are a weak white man you are a dead man.

Damn, I'm positive I have read the same exact post, except it was a different poster. Maybe you should be posting a link or something?
This is what happens when ideologues all go to the same places for their talking points. This why we have so many duplicate threads and posts! It's really too bad that people have seemed to have lost the ability to think for themselves. I guess it's too much work for them. And then they think their ideology is so superior than other ideologies. Why? Because they all talk alike, word for word. Yeah, let's all be robots!
Both the right and left extremes are clueless and totally out of touch with the real world.

 

[Pogo]

Communism has been used in socio-religious contexts for centuries, and it still is. With remarkable success I might add.

I have to agree with you there, communism has been remarkable successful as a mass murder mechanism putting Nazism to shame.

The communists I had in mind are absolute pacifists and have been driven out of several of their countries of residence for exactly that reason -- including the United States when some were tortured at Leavenworth for refusal to participate in WWI. They're not immune to murder though, there is a history. A total of exactly two murders and one suicide. In a time span of five hundred years.

Be that as it may, communism has no more to do with murder than butter has to do with taillights. Apparently I was right in guessing you wouldn't know jack squat about this. Go crack a PoliSci book and get back to us in a couple of years. You're not ready for this.

(/offtopic)

 

[Rikurzhen]

The communists I had in mind are absolute pacifists

Communism, as an organizing principle for society, and pacificism are mutually exclusive. When communists are pooling all of society's resources in order to eradicate private property what do they do when someone objects? Just give up on communism and go home?

 

[bripat9643]

By the way Evelyn Wood, "liberal totalitarianism" is an oxymoron. Had you bothered to read my points and links you might have a clue why that is.

And communism had never been tried, am I right?

Not that I know of. Capitalism, to Socialism, to Communism. In that order.

Saying communism has never been tried is like saying building a perpetual motion machine has never been tried. Yes, it has been tried, but no one ever succeeded. 100 million have died in the attempt.

 

[Newby]

[
And 30 years ago every damn liberal my parents knew couldn't even conceive of the notion of two dudes getting married to each other. You simply haven't been browbeaten and shamed enough for your transphobia and insensitivity to the hurt you're causing trans-men. After some public shamings from more enlightened liberals, you'll begin toeing the line. Why look at how many liberals now believe that homosexual marriage is, you know, actually marriage.

Conservatives are against progress, we get that. That's why conservatives ultimately lose in the long run.

You're developing quite a reputation for stating everything 100% in opposition to reality.

Progress usually implies that matters will get better in the future. All of the liberal reforms over the last century are making things worse. People ask "will my standard of living be better than that of my parents" and the answer is usually coming up "No."

The liberal mindset is easy to understand - they see something in society and they seek to destroy that in order to replace it with something "better." The thing is, the replacement is an untested quantity, it's only "better" in the mind of the liberal. The liberal takes society on a leap of faith, a leap off of a cliff, with the promise that we'll float upwards instead of plummeting into the canyon bottom.

Layer after layer after layer of liberal reform fundamentally changes society and no one in the liberal reform movement give a god damn about the after effects nor the unintended consequences. This is the wreckage that liberals causes.

Look back half a century ago. High school graduates were getting married in their early 20s and some in their late teens. Children were being born soon into the marriage. The man was able to modestly support the young family on his income. As his work experience grew he was promoted and the quality of life for the family improved. As the family grew with more children they moved up the income ladder and up the housing ladder too. The public schools weren't shitholes and liberal intellectual ghettos, they actually managed to teach and kids actually managed to learn.

Everything liberals touch turns to shit because none of their ideas survive touching reality.

Progress doesn't just mean doing something different, it means actually making things better. This is where liberals fail. People will come to realize this if they actually think about it. So the liberal strategy must focus on getting people to not think about it or to inject all sorts of bogus distractions to shift the blame for all the change onto conservatives, people who were trying to defend the status quo and manage incremental change based on reforms known to work.

Excellent post!

 

[Mathbud1]

Please stop scaring the conservatives.

Freedom of speech, man.

That really frightens them.

You know nothing, John Snow.

 

[Pogo]

Conservatives are against progress, we get that. That's why conservatives ultimately lose in the long run.

You're developing quite a reputation for stating everything 100% in opposition to reality.

Progress usually implies that matters will get better in the future. All of the liberal reforms over the last century are making things worse. People ask "will my standard of living be better than that of my parents" and the answer is usually coming up "No."

The liberal mindset is easy to understand - they see something in society and they seek to destroy that in order to replace it with something "better." The thing is, the replacement is an untested quantity, it's only "better" in the mind of the liberal. The liberal takes society on a leap of faith, a leap off of a cliff, with the promise that we'll float upwards instead of plummeting into the canyon bottom.

Layer after layer after layer of liberal reform fundamentally changes society and no one in the liberal reform movement give a god damn about the after effects nor the unintended consequences. This is the wreckage that liberals causes.

Look back half a century ago. High school graduates were getting married in their early 20s and some in their late teens. Children were being born soon into the marriage. The man was able to modestly support the young family on his income. As his work experience grew he was promoted and the quality of life for the family improved. As the family grew with more children they moved up the income ladder and up the housing ladder too. The public schools weren't shitholes and liberal intellectual ghettos, they actually managed to teach and kids actually managed to learn.

Everything liberals touch turns to shit because none of their ideas survive touching reality.

Progress doesn't just mean doing something different, it means actually making things better. This is where liberals fail. People will come to realize this if they actually think about it. So the liberal strategy must focus on getting people to not think about it or to inject all sorts of bogus distractions to shift the blame for all the change onto conservatives, people who were trying to defend the status quo and manage incremental change based on reforms known to work.

Excellent post!

With all the focus and direction of a mouse put in a box last week and still bouncing off the walls today looking for a way out.

 

[Redfish]

Which is why you're being called a 'liberal' by conservatives.

Conservatives are in essence authoritarians, they need to label that which they don't understand and fear: change, diversity, dissent, and expressions of individual liberty terrify most conservatives.

When one refuses to conform to the conservative ideal, as expressed in rightist dogma, conservatives perceive that as a 'threat,' a 'threat' that must be attacked, however unwarranted their fear.

Yes, the reaction you get in act of professing compassion for one of their designated fear/hate targets, such as illegal immigrants, is proof enough of that.

And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate.

fear and hate??? Nope. Conservatives want everyone to be treated equally, no special treatment for anyone.

Now, lets list the categories that liberals fear and hate:

Christians
Southerners
republicans
rich people
catholics
conservatives
republicans
straight couples
white people
anyone who watches Fox
anyone who appears on Fox
Limbaugh
Beck
Levin
Palin
Conservative attractive women
anyone who is pro life
anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama
gun owners
the NRA
republican governors
anyone who wants secure borders
anyone who wants voter ID
anyone who wants a balanced budget

I could go on, but maybe you get the idea---------you are the haters and fearers. You hate and fear because somewhere deep down inside you know that liberalism is a failure and always will be.

 

[Pogo]

Yes, the reaction you get in act of professing compassion for one of their designated fear/hate targets, such as illegal immigrants, is proof enough of that.

And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate.

fear and hate??? Nope. Conservatives want everyone to be treated equally, no special treatment for anyone.

Now, lets list the categories that liberals fear and hate:

Christians
Southerners
republicans
rich people
catholics
conservatives
republicans
straight couples
white people
anyone who watches Fox
anyone who appears on Fox
Limbaugh
Beck
Levin
Palin
Conservative attractive women
anyone who is pro life
anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama
gun owners
the NRA
republican governors
anyone who wants secure borders
anyone who wants voter ID
anyone who wants a balanced budget

I could go on, but maybe you get the idea---------you are the haters and fearers. You hate and fear because somewhere deep down inside you know that liberalism is a failure and always will be.

Leaving aside the blanket generalizations, "fear" and "hate" are emotions. Philosophies do not involve emotions. Try a new diaper for those butthurtorhhoids.

Check it out Darlene -- some wags here not only don't know what Liberalism is, they don't even know what a philosophy is.

 

[Redfish]

And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate.

fear and hate??? Nope. Conservatives want everyone to be treated equally, no special treatment for anyone.

Now, lets list the categories that liberals fear and hate:

Christians
Southerners
republicans
rich people
catholics
conservatives
republicans
straight couples
white people
anyone who watches Fox
anyone who appears on Fox
Limbaugh
Beck
Levin
Palin
Conservative attractive women
anyone who is pro life
anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama
gun owners
the NRA
republican governors
anyone who wants secure borders
anyone who wants voter ID
anyone who wants a balanced budget

I could go on, but maybe you get the idea---------you are the haters and fearers. You hate and fear because somewhere deep down inside you know that liberalism is a failure and always will be.

Leaving aside the blanket generalizations, "fear" and "hate" are emotions. Philosophies do not involve emotions. Try a new diaper for those butthurtorhhoids.

Check it out Darlene -- some wags here not only don't know what Liberalism is, they don't even know what a philosophy is.

your comment is obviously addressed to C. Jones who said "And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate."

I was merely responding to his comment with a list that liberals fear and hate.

philosophies teach fear and hate. liberal indoctrination is all about fear and hate.

 

[NoNukes]

That's really bad advice.

When neophytes ask about a political philosophy, the proponents usually want to say "We honor timeless principles which speak to the best of humanity."

When liberals are asked what they're all about, this is what you get "We take the most outrageous comedy routines of Monty Python and adopt them as Holy Scripture. We aspire to turn parody into reality."

What was Monty Python trying to do for it's audience back when they filmed that movie? They were trying to come up with the most outlandish nonsense that they could imagine in order to get the audience to laugh at the sheer silliness of the scene.

Today, liberals take seriously what used to have movie audiences in stitches. It's now offensive to note that women get pregnant. Liberals don't want to offend anyone so they refrain from drawing attention to the fact that women get pregnant.

99.9% of the liberals I know have no problem calling women women and pregnancy pregnancy.

And 30 years ago every damn liberal my parents knew couldn't even conceive of the notion of two dudes getting married to each other. You simply haven't been browbeaten and shamed enough for your transphobia and insensitivity to the hurt you're causing trans-men. After some public shamings from more enlightened liberals, you'll begin toeing the line. Why look at how many liberals now believe that homosexual marriage is, you know, actually marriage.

Was it both of the liberals that your parents knew?

 

[norwegen]

And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate.

fear and hate??? Nope. Conservatives want everyone to be treated equally, no special treatment for anyone.

Now, lets list the categories that liberals fear and hate:

Christians
Southerners
republicans
rich people
catholics
conservatives
republicans
straight couples
white people
anyone who watches Fox
anyone who appears on Fox
Limbaugh
Beck
Levin
Palin
Conservative attractive women
anyone who is pro life
anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama
gun owners
the NRA
republican governors
anyone who wants secure borders
anyone who wants voter ID
anyone who wants a balanced budget

I could go on, but maybe you get the idea---------you are the haters and fearers. You hate and fear because somewhere deep down inside you know that liberalism is a failure and always will be.

Leaving aside the blanket generalizations, "fear" and "hate" are emotions. Philosophies do not involve emotions. Try a new diaper for those butthurtorhhoids.

Check it out Darlene -- some wags here not only don't know what Liberalism is, they don't even know what a philosophy is.

Can you comprehend English? Redfish didn't say that liberalism hates and fears. He said that liberals do.

 

[NoNukes]

You're developing quite a reputation for stating everything 100% in opposition to reality.

Progress usually implies that matters will get better in the future. All of the liberal reforms over the last century are making things worse. People ask "will my standard of living be better than that of my parents" and the answer is usually coming up "No."

The liberal mindset is easy to understand - they see something in society and they seek to destroy that in order to replace it with something "better." The thing is, the replacement is an untested quantity, it's only "better" in the mind of the liberal. The liberal takes society on a leap of faith, a leap off of a cliff, with the promise that we'll float upwards instead of plummeting into the canyon bottom.

Layer after layer after layer of liberal reform fundamentally changes society and no one in the liberal reform movement give a god damn about the after effects nor the unintended consequences. This is the wreckage that liberals causes.

Look back half a century ago. High school graduates were getting married in their early 20s and some in their late teens. Children were being born soon into the marriage. The man was able to modestly support the young family on his income. As his work experience grew he was promoted and the quality of life for the family improved. As the family grew with more children they moved up the income ladder and up the housing ladder too. The public schools weren't shitholes and liberal intellectual ghettos, they actually managed to teach and kids actually managed to learn.

Everything liberals touch turns to shit because none of their ideas survive touching reality.

Progress doesn't just mean doing something different, it means actually making things better. This is where liberals fail. People will come to realize this if they actually think about it. So the liberal strategy must focus on getting people to not think about it or to inject all sorts of bogus distractions to shift the blame for all the change onto conservatives, people who were trying to defend the status quo and manage incremental change based on reforms known to work.

Sorry to say but societal norms always trend to more progressive ideals. 120 years ago it was unthinkable to see a women showing her ankle in public but things gradually turn more progressive. In another hundred years people will be looking back and laughing at you conservatives and your beliefs about gay marriage, abortion, …etc. 500 years from now people will be looking back at the utter absurdity of orthodox religion. Religion is dying and you guys can't handle it.

A majority of Americans are laughing at conservatives and their inane position on these and other issues today.

People outside of America are laughing also.

 

[Pogo]

fear and hate??? Nope. Conservatives want everyone to be treated equally, no special treatment for anyone.

Now, lets list the categories that liberals fear and hate:

Christians
Southerners
republicans
rich people
catholics
conservatives
republicans
straight couples
white people
anyone who watches Fox
anyone who appears on Fox
Limbaugh
Beck
Levin
Palin
Conservative attractive women
anyone who is pro life
anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama
gun owners
the NRA
republican governors
anyone who wants secure borders
anyone who wants voter ID
anyone who wants a balanced budget

I could go on, but maybe you get the idea---------you are the haters and fearers. You hate and fear because somewhere deep down inside you know that liberalism is a failure and always will be.

Leaving aside the blanket generalizations, "fear" and "hate" are emotions. Philosophies do not involve emotions. Try a new diaper for those butthurtorhhoids.

Check it out Darlene -- some wags here not only don't know what Liberalism is, they don't even know what a philosophy is.

your comment is obviously addressed to C. Jones who said "And gay Americans, transgender Americans, minority voters, and same-sex couples – the list is disturbingly long of those whom conservatives fear and hate."

I was merely responding to his comment with a list that liberals fear and hate.

philosophies teach fear and hate. liberal indoctrination is all about fear and hate.

CCJ's post was following up on a post analyzing the behaviour of conservatives on this board. Yours proclaimed "liberals fear and hate" A, B, C, etc. Difference.

(Catholics? Maybe you're thinking of the KKK?)

But returning to the question of that behaviour, and the actual thrust of the OP, which is the posters of this site flinging label-poo, here's one particularly telling section of Redfish's list:

anyone who dares criticize obama
anyone who did not vote for obama
anyone who does not worship obama

I've found myself, and I'm far from alone, repeatedly pinned with "statist", "Obamadrone", "you promote anything the government does" etc etc ad nauseum, not on the basis of actually making any posts or points about any of these (and others on this list) but on the basis that I failed to jump on the rhetorical bandwagon of Birferist Bullshit. It speaks of a mob mentality wherein you damn well better murmur along with the mob, or be attacked for not doing so. That's an interesting psychology in its desperation.

That, and of course the other factor is the box itself, where they imagine "Box L" has the following characteristics, and if you exhibit one of them, then you must believe in all of them. F'rinstance I get regularly tagged with a stance on abortion, a topic on which I've never posted at all. When I challenge the poster to show evidence, all they do is go "humma humma humma" or more often, run away. That's rhetorical cowardice. And it speaks volumes of the untenable position of those who have no point but to attack, even to the point of attacking what does not exist. Because, again, they're not interested in dialogue or in finding out these things, they have their preconceptions and that's all they need; the mind shuts like a bank vault.