Kurt Russell nails it

[BS Filter]

It's the same dishonest crap you children spew all the time.

Shrug.

If teachers shoot back, schools would never be sitting ducks.

 

[Crepitus]

If teachers shoot back, schools would never be sitting ducks.

'Till the teacher is the shooter.

 

[BS Filter]

'Till the teacher is the shooter.

Let us know when that happens.

 

[Crepitus]

Let us know when that happens.

It already has

 

[BS Filter]

It already has

That's too bad.

 

[krichton]

Yeah...bullshit......

There is no downside to allowing normal, law abiding people to carry guns without putting them in Legal Peril through red tape......criminals carry regardless of the law, and normal people shouldn't have to jump through hoops to exercise a Right....

Criminals don't use any background checks, ever, since they can't legally buy, own or carry guns....they use straw buyers.....usually family members. The number of crime guns bought at gun shows are tiny, since the areas are crawling with Feds......

And, twit........if a criminal is caught with any gun, they can already be arrested, making your point just dumb.

Can you explain to us then with Illinois why Illinois has more gun crime than Indiana? considering their criminals don't have to cross state lines? Dittos Texas, and other states bordering insane gun control states?


We are amazingly safe as a country.....

Keep in mind, Europe, registered guns in the 1920s, and by 1939 the German socialists began the process of murdering 20 million people....not war dead, not collateral from combat actions.....innocent civilians rounded up, taken to forests and death camps and murdered....

All in the span of 6 years.

Gun murder in the U.S. over our entire 247 year history averages about 2,470,000....

So you have nothing to compare us to when it comes to murder.....

Murder has gone up in Texas because the democrats have flooded the state with drug cartels, illegal aliens and human traffickers.....and they sitll have a lower gun murder rate than Illinois......

Lives saved....based on research? By law abiding gun owners using guns to stop criminals?



Case Closed: Kleck Is Still Correct





There are roughly 100,000 people shot in the United States yearly, and something over 30,000 die. If this 1/3 vs. 2/3 ratio of deaths to injuries in actual shootings pertains in these DGUs, that makes for at least 176,000 lives saved—less some attackers who lost their lives to defenders. This enormous benefit dwarfs, both in human and economic terms, the losses trumpeted by hoplophobes who only choose to see the risk side of the equation.



that makes for at least 176,000 lives saved—

==============

Gun self defense research.........

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....

The name of the group doing the study, the year of the study, the number of defensive gun uses and if police and military defensive gun uses are included.....notice the bill clinton and obama defensive gun use research is highlighted.....

GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, no military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, no military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, no military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, no military)


2021 national firearm survey, Prof. William English, PhD. designed by Deborah Azrael of Harvard T. Chan School of public policy, and Mathew Miller, Northeastern university.......1.67 million defensive uses annually.

CDC...1996-1998... 1.1 million averaged over those years.( no cops, no military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, no military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, no military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops,no military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, no military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, no military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

2021 national firearms survey..

The survey was designed by Deborah Azrael of the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Matthew Miller of Northeastern University,
----
The survey further finds that approximately a third of gun owners (31.1%) have used a firearm to defend themselves or their property, often on more than one occasion, and it estimates that guns are used defensively by firearms owners in approximately 1.67 million incidents per year. Handguns are the most common firearm employed for self-defense (used in 65.9% of defensive incidents), and in most defensive incidents (81.9%) no shot was fired. Approximately a quarter (25.2%) of defensive incidents occurred within the gun owner's home, and approximately half (53.9%) occurred outside their home, but on their property. About one out of ten (9.1%) defensive gun uses occurred in public, and about one out of twenty (4.8%) occurred at work.
2021 National Firearms Survey

Clinton's study by the DOJ....

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/165476.pdf

Applying those restrictions leaves 19 NSPOF respondents (0.8 percent of the sample), representing 1.5 million defensive users. This estimate is directly comparable to the well-known estimate of Kleck and Gertz, shown in the last column of exhibit 7. While the NSPOF estimate is smaller, it is statistically plausible that the difference is due to sampling error. Inclusion of multiple DGUs reported by half of the 19 NSPOF respondents increases the estimate to 4.7 million DGUs.



n the third column of Table 6.2, we apply the Kleck and Gertz (1995) criteria for "genuine" DGUs (type A), leaving us with just 19 respondents. They represent 1.5 million defensive users. This estimate is directly comparable to the well-known Kleck and Gertz estimate of 2.5 million, shown in the last

While ours is smaller, it is staistically plausible that the difference is due to sampling error. to the when we include the multiple DGUs victim. defensive reported by half our 19 respondents, our estimate increases to 4.7 milli

While ours is smaller, it is statistically plausible that the difference petrator; in most cases (69 percent), the is due to sampling error. Note that when we include the multiple DGUs reported by half our 19 respondents, our estimate increases to 4.7 million DGUs.
----

As shown in Table 6.6, the defender fired his or her gun in 27 percent of these incidents (combined "fire warning shots" and "fire at perpetrator" percentages, though some respondents reported firing both warning shots and airning at the perpetrator). Forty percent of these were "warning shots," and about a third were aimed at the perpetrator but missed. The perpetrator was wounded by the crime victim in eight percent of all DGUs. In nine percent of DGUs the victim captured and held the perpetrator at gunpoint until the police could arrive.

Obama's study...

Defensive Use of Guns

Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed (Cook and Ludwig, 1996; Kleck, 2001a). Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million (Kleck, 2001a), in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008 (BJS, 2010).
National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. 2013. Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence. Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence | The National Academies Press.

Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence | Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence | The National Academies Press

“It’s hell”: Surge of Texas kids dying from gun violence carves canyons of grief through families

In 2012, around 100 Texans under 18 died of gunshot wounds. Last year, that number reached nearly 300.

www.texastribune.org

Deaths from firearms keep climbing in Texas, decades after lawmakers began weakening gun regulations

The rate of firearm-related deaths in Texas has reached a level not seen since the 1990s. Texas lawmakers have approved more than 100 bills that loosened gun restrictions since 2000.

www.texastribune.org

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/17/us/texas-gun-ownership-mass-shootings/index.html

Texas is No. 11 most dangerous state in US, new report says

Using FBI data, a new report lists the 15 most dangerous states in the U.S. where the violent crime rate exceeds the national rate.

www.beaumontenterprise.com

Why is Texas so unsafe when they have so many guns? Aren't more guns supposed to be the answer to stop crime? Why is crime going up then? Hmmm

 

[krichton]

If teachers shoot back, schools would never be sitting ducks.

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

 

[BS Filter]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

Some teachers will volunteer and be trained if they need it. Problem solved.

 

[2aguy]

“It’s hell”: Surge of Texas kids dying from gun violence carves canyons of grief through families

In 2012, around 100 Texans under 18 died of gunshot wounds. Last year, that number reached nearly 300.

www.texastribune.org

Deaths from firearms keep climbing in Texas, decades after lawmakers began weakening gun regulations

The rate of firearm-related deaths in Texas has reached a level not seen since the 1990s. Texas lawmakers have approved more than 100 bills that loosened gun restrictions since 2000.

www.texastribune.org

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/17/us/texas-gun-ownership-mass-shootings/index.html

Texas is No. 11 most dangerous state in US, new report says

Using FBI data, a new report lists the 15 most dangerous states in the U.S. where the violent crime rate exceeds the national rate.

www.beaumontenterprise.com

Why is Texas so unsafe when they have so many guns? Aren't more guns supposed to be the answer to stop crime? Why is crime going up then? Hmmm

You have illegal alien criminals, and drug cartel members flooding Texas…in the 10s of thousands……close to 10 million in 3 years……..e..because of democrat party policies……,that is why gun crime is increasing in Texas, you dumb ass……it is not increasing because normal,people have guns.

What is so hard for idiots like you to understand that?

As for Uvalde, the democrat party police chief ordered the police to stand down and do nothing, even going to the point of restraining officers and parents who wanted to attack the killer….

Meanwhile, when the democrat party supporting, left wing transgender killer was murdering children and staff at the Christian school, two officers immediately entered the building and killed her, saving countless lives.

In Tennessee, when the left win, democrat party, anti-gun extremist, entered his former bank and began shooting co-workers, two cops immediately entered the building and killed him.

In Indiana, a nut opened fire in am Indiana ,mall with a rifle, and an armed citizen with a handgun killed him in 15 seconds.

A killer who attacked a house party with a rifles was shot and killed by a woman with her carry pistol…..

And with Texas…..when the democrats are allowing drug cartels, rapists, and human traffickers flood the state, crime goes up…and not having your own guns makes it easier for them to rape, rob and murder you.

How does crime go up when law abiding people who dont use their guns for crime or murder have guns?

Care to explain that, dumb ass?

 

[2aguy]

'Till the teacher is the shooter.

Dipshit……we already have states that train staff to carry guns….,,you moron.

And if a teacher was going to murder students with a gun, they could already do that….nothing would stop them….

Why are you anti-gun extemists so evil and stupid?

 

[2aguy]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

Moron……if the school has armed and trained staff, killers wont attack….

How do we know?

Because of the statements of living killers, and the writings of the dead killers…..they target gun free zones because they are looking to kill unarmed people, not engage in a gun fight.

Having an unknown number of staff, in random locations in a building keeps the school from being targeted in the first place…….

We already have states that arm staff, you twit.

 

[2aguy]

“It’s hell”: Surge of Texas kids dying from gun violence carves canyons of grief through families

In 2012, around 100 Texans under 18 died of gunshot wounds. Last year, that number reached nearly 300.

www.texastribune.org

Deaths from firearms keep climbing in Texas, decades after lawmakers began weakening gun regulations

The rate of firearm-related deaths in Texas has reached a level not seen since the 1990s. Texas lawmakers have approved more than 100 bills that loosened gun restrictions since 2000.

www.texastribune.org

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/17/us/texas-gun-ownership-mass-shootings/index.html

Texas is No. 11 most dangerous state in US, new report says

Using FBI data, a new report lists the 15 most dangerous states in the U.S. where the violent crime rate exceeds the national rate.

www.beaumontenterprise.com

Why is Texas so unsafe when they have so many guns? Aren't more guns supposed to be the answer to stop crime? Why is crime going up then? Hmmm

California has had more mass public shootings than Texas, and they aphave all the gun control you want…..

 

[2aguy]

“It’s hell”: Surge of Texas kids dying from gun violence carves canyons of grief through families

In 2012, around 100 Texans under 18 died of gunshot wounds. Last year, that number reached nearly 300.

www.texastribune.org

Deaths from firearms keep climbing in Texas, decades after lawmakers began weakening gun regulations

The rate of firearm-related deaths in Texas has reached a level not seen since the 1990s. Texas lawmakers have approved more than 100 bills that loosened gun restrictions since 2000.

www.texastribune.org

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/17/us/texas-gun-ownership-mass-shootings/index.html

Texas is No. 11 most dangerous state in US, new report says

Using FBI data, a new report lists the 15 most dangerous states in the U.S. where the violent crime rate exceeds the national rate.

www.beaumontenterprise.com

Why is Texas so unsafe when they have so many guns? Aren't more guns supposed to be the answer to stop crime? Why is crime going up then? Hmmm

And the “kids” getting shot bullshit…..

In the very first line of that link?

kids under 18…..

The typical bullshit from anti-gun extremists……those “kids” getting shot are not “kids” in any sense of the word….the majority are 15-18 year old gang members getting shot by other gang members over drug turf, social media insults and assassinations…..

They are not “kids” but criminals engaged in crime and murder.

 

[2aguy]

“It’s hell”: Surge of Texas kids dying from gun violence carves canyons of grief through families

In 2012, around 100 Texans under 18 died of gunshot wounds. Last year, that number reached nearly 300.

www.texastribune.org

Deaths from firearms keep climbing in Texas, decades after lawmakers began weakening gun regulations

The rate of firearm-related deaths in Texas has reached a level not seen since the 1990s. Texas lawmakers have approved more than 100 bills that loosened gun restrictions since 2000.

www.texastribune.org

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/17/us/texas-gun-ownership-mass-shootings/index.html

Texas is No. 11 most dangerous state in US, new report says

Using FBI data, a new report lists the 15 most dangerous states in the U.S. where the violent crime rate exceeds the national rate.

www.beaumontenterprise.com

Why is Texas so unsafe when they have so many guns? Aren't more guns supposed to be the answer to stop crime? Why is crime going up then? Hmmm

I guess you havent been paying attention…..democrats are telling us that gun crime went down across the country last year…..as records for gun sales are being broken each month…..with the biggest growth areas for gun ownership and carrying guns among women and minorities……

When your state isnt being flooded with 10s of thousands of Mexican criminals each month, your crime rates dont go up……especially when your citizens own and carry guns.

 

[The Duke]

Some teachers will volunteer and be trained if they need it. Problem solved.

They're already doing that in some states.

 

[2aguy]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

Yeah....you really don't know what you are talking about...

ndiana mall shooting...



Fifteen seconds after the shooting began, Elisjsha Dicken, a legally-armed 22-year-old man from Seymour, engaged the shooter in a gunfight. Dicken, a civilian bystander, was shopping with his girlfriend when the perpetrator opened fire.[7] From a distance of forty yards, Dicken fired ten rounds from a Glock handgun, hitting the shooter eight times. The shooter fired once, and attempted to retreat into the restroom, but instead fell to the ground and died soon afterwards.[8][9][10]



Afterward, Dicken approached security guards at the mall, informed them that he had neutralized the shooter, and waited for police to arrive.[7]



Greenwood Park Mall shooting - Wikipedia







West Virginia woman....



Witnesses said Butler seemed agitated and left but returned to the complex shortly after, armed with an AR-15 style rifle, and started shooting at the crowd.

Police said a woman pulled out her pistol, shooting and killing him.

"This lady was carrying a lawful firearm," Hazelett said. "A law abiding citizen who stopped the threat of probably 20 or 30 people getting killed. She engaged the threat and stopped it. She didn't run from the threat, she engaged it. Preventing a mass casualty event here in Charleston."


Woman credited with stopping mass shooting at apartment complex in West Virginia

======

 

[2aguy]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

You really don't know what you are talking about...

Southerland Springs Church shooting .....



Willeford propped his AR-15 on the pickup’s hood and peered through the sight. He could see a holographic red dot on the man’s chest. He fired twice. He wasn’t sure he’d hit him, though he was later told that the man had contusions on his chest and abdomen consistent with getting shot while wearing body armor. Regardless, the gunman stopped shooting and ran for a white Ford Explorer that was idling outside the chapel, roughly twenty yards from where Willeford had positioned himself.



The Hero of Sutherland Springs Is Still Reckoning with What Happened that Day



Deputies: Osceola pastor shot church janitor in self-defense

According to deputies, Parangan pulled out a handgun and fired multiple shots at Pastor Terry Howell, who took out his own weapon and fired back, striking Parangan.

Howell was not injured, but Parangan was taken to Osceola Regional Medical Center in critical condition.

Deputies said several church employees witnessed the incident and gave similar statements.

this Psychiatrist was not an off duty cop.....

Penn. psychiatric center shooting intended mass killing: DA

The Pennsylvania patient accused of killing his caseworker in a psychiatric center shooting carried dozens of bullets — and he would have likely continued shooting if a doctor didn’t fire back, officials said.

Richard Plotts, 49, is expected to be charged with murder for allegedly opening fire at Sister Marie Lenahan Wellness Center in Darby Thursday.

After he killed his caseworker, 53-year-old Theresa Hunt, and shot his psychiatrist, Lee Silverman, the wounded doctor fired back, stopping the attack, District Attorney Jack Whelan said in a Friday press conference.

Plotts had 39 more bullets on him. He intended a mass shooting, Whelan said.

=============

 

[2aguy]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

You really don't know what you are talking about...

This past Sunday, exactly two weeks to the day after the Pulse attack, there was a mass shooting outside a night club in South Carolina. I’m sure you haven’t heard about it, and for two good reasons. The first reason is that the attempted murderer was unsuccessful in killing any of his victims. The second reason is because the attempted murderer was stopped by a concealed carrier at the club drawing his weapon and putting a bullet into the bad guy.


Lyman man charged following shooting at nightclub

Shotgun attacker at Church service....

Wilson’s single shot quickly ended the attack that killed Wallace, 64, and White, 67, at the West Freeway Church of Christ in the Fort Worth-area town of White Settlement. He said the entire confrontation was over in no more than six seconds. More than 240 congregants were in the church at the time.

Firearms instructor took out gunman at Texas church service
=====

======================
As Hunt and other partiers had a bite to eat in the kitchen, the suspect pulled out a gun and began firing on the crowd, sending everyone fleeing, Mendez recounted.

Mendez was shot in the head in front of his wife, who rushed to his side and believed he was dead due to the amount of blood covering his face. She then grabbed their two daughters and put them into a room deeper in the house, barricading them and other children inside.

"She barricaded the door with the dresser. There were three other children in there, not including my two daughters. A total of five kids. She … throws them in the closet, throws clothes over them. Tells them, ‘Be quiet. Do not make a peep if you hear loud noises in this room,’" Mendez said of his wife's actions.

As Hunt continued his alleged rampage, two other women began fighting back against the suspect and screamed for Mendez, knowing he had a concealed carry weapon, Mendez said.

"By the glory of God or the adrenaline and just everything, just the will to live and the will to protect my family, I was able to hear those pleas, those yells for help. I heard my name. And I was able to get up," he said.

He was able to pull out his firearm and shoot the suspect four times in the chest.

"Detectives have determined the individual who shot Jason, and others who fought against Jason, were acting in self-defense and defense of other innocent parties," Sgt. Tommy Hale said in a press release days after the incident, KTAR reported at the time.

http://[URL='https://www.foxnews.co...celebrates-second-amendment-thwarting-shooter

[/URL]

 

[2aguy]

Wait, didn't we have armed and trained police officers too scared to confront a school shooter in Uvalde texas? How would a random teacher with a gun fare? Forget the teachers, we need to arm all the students.

Yeah....you really are a dumb human being....

Major New Research on School Safety: Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns haven’t seen school shootings during school hours​

There are two obvious questions: Does letting teachers carry create dangers? Might they deter attackers?

Twenty states currently allow teachers and staff to carry guns to varying degrees on school property, so we don’t need to guess how the policy would work.

There has yet to be a single case of someone being wounded or killed from a shooting, let alone a mass public shooting, between 6 AM and midnight at a school that lets teachers carry guns. Fears of teachers carrying guns in terms of such problems as students obtaining teachers guns have not occurred at all, and there was only one accidental discharge outside of school hours with no one was really harmed. While there have not been any problems at schools with armed teachers, the number of people killed at other schools has increased significantly – doubling between 2001 and 2008 versus 2009 and 2018.

The paper is available here. A related journal publication is available here.

Major New Research on School Safety: Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns haven’t seen school shootings during school hours

Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns are Extremely Safe: Data on the Rate of Shootings and Accidents in Schools that allow Teachers to Carry Abstract After the Columbine school shooting 20 yea…

crimeresearch.org

 

[krichton]

Yeah....you really are a dumb human being....

Major New Research on School Safety: Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns haven’t seen school shootings during school hours​

There are two obvious questions: Does letting teachers carry create dangers? Might they deter attackers?

Twenty states currently allow teachers and staff to carry guns to varying degrees on school property, so we don’t need to guess how the policy would work.

There has yet to be a single case of someone being wounded or killed from a shooting, let alone a mass public shooting, between 6 AM and midnight at a school that lets teachers carry guns. Fears of teachers carrying guns in terms of such problems as students obtaining teachers guns have not occurred at all, and there was only one accidental discharge outside of school hours with no one was really harmed. While there have not been any problems at schools with armed teachers, the number of people killed at other schools has increased significantly – doubling between 2001 and 2008 versus 2009 and 2018.

The paper is available here. A related journal publication is available here.

Major New Research on School Safety: Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns haven’t seen school shootings during school hours

Schools that Allow Teachers to Carry Guns are Extremely Safe: Data on the Rate of Shootings and Accidents in Schools that allow Teachers to Carry Abstract After the Columbine school shooting 20 yea…

crimeresearch.org

Twenty states allow teachers to carry, but how many actually do? I haven't read one story, seen one video or photo of an actual teacher strapped with a sidewarm or ar15 in his classroom, lol. In this day and age that is virtually impossible. The only story I've read of a teacher bringing a gun to school is a teacher in Florida, who was eventually arrested. His reasoning for doing so is because he had fears he was being watched through his phone. Now tell me again, how safe it is for teachers to be armed. Arm all the students instead! More guns = safety!