“It will be my objective to phase out Social Security." - Sen. Mike Lee says the quiet part out loud.

[Zincwarrior]

Democrats are incapable of wiping their own butts without government assistance. They have no room to talk.

Musk gets tens of billions in government assistance.

 

[Contumacious]

Musk gets tens of billions in government assistance.

Be that as it may , he has put the $$$ to good use

 

[DBA]

There are a lot of arguments for and against taxing unrealized capital gains but protecting 401s of the average person isn’t one of them.

That’s a potential tax on very wealthy people

You do realize there is a cap on 401k contributions, right? Are you suggesting taxing the 401ks of those that have a high balance in them or taxing the 401ks of those that are “rich” aside from their 401k balances? Are we talking about net worth here? Is someone “rich” if they have a bit of real estate, but not a lot of income?

This taxing the rich idea has to stop.

 

[DBA]

One that is feasible and takes care of all.

I am sure you are in favor of it because you won’t have to pay for it. Democrats love other people’s money.

 

[initforme]

You do realize there is a cap on 401k contributions, right? Are you suggesting taxing the 401ks of those that have a high balance in them or taxing the 401ks of those that are “rich” aside from their 401k balances? Are we talking about net worth here? Is someone “rich” if they have a bit of real estate, but not a lot of income?

This taxing the rich idea has to stop.

Same with any talk of phasing out SS

 

[WorldWatcher]

If you go back to the 1930's, Social Security was sold as part of a total retirement philosophy, which consisted of three parts:

• Personal Savings,
• Employer Pension,
• Social Security.

The 3 together were supposed to take care of the elderly in retirement so they weren't living in poverty like was happening.

But then companies underfunded pension programs and the wall street types figure out they could make money by tapping into an obscure section of the tax code we now call 401K's. Companies didn't fund pensions and did away with them.

Employer pensions are very rare today, eliminating one of the fundamental legs of the retirement vision.

WW
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[Mac-7]

I m not sure on that. My granddaughter and her husband, both highly successful high paying careers. Working, saving, no.kids, are highly moral.

Of course there are exceptions

And also contradictions even within individuals

 

[Jarlaxle]

How can it implode? Worst case retirees get 70% of promised benefits.

Stop playing stupid. It's not possible for anyone to be this dense.

 

[DBA]

Stop bitching and put up a better fix for SS.
Its going to be means testing, or raising the cap, or ___________.

Maybe raise(a little) the SS tax rate across the board but don’t include that increase in the benefit calculation. We would all pay a little more, while getting more back. At least everyone would be paying for it as opposed to the “rich” getting absolutely soaked by removing the cap. Like I mentioned before, the SS benefit algorithm is already skewed to favor those that paid in less, meaning they get a higher pecentage of their contributions on a monthly basis. A higher paid individual would have to live quite a few more years to recoup the same percentage of their contributions. Removing the contributions cap and leaving the maximum benefit in place would be a major welfare program subisdize by the “rich”, if you consider making above 168k/yr rich.

 

[kyzr]

Stop playing stupid. It's not possible for anyone to be this dense.

duh. that is not refuting anything dumbass. explain how SS can implode. waiting...

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

With the price rises under Biden the lower 90% of incomes are struggling.
The high earners should take the tax cut extension with a cap raise and be thankful.
I'd even raise the early retirement age from 62 to 63.

Why should they be paying for you? You sound like Bernie Sanders.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

With the price rises under Biden the lower 90% of incomes are struggling.
The high earners should take the tax cut extension with a cap raise and be thankful.
I'd even raise the early retirement age from 62 to 63.

Why should they be paying for you? You sound like Bernie Sanders.

 

[kyzr]

Maybe raise(a little) the SS tax rate across the board but don’t include that increase in the benefit calculation. We would all pay a little more, while getting more back. At least everyone would be paying for it as opposed to the “rich” getting absolutely soaked by removing the cap. Like I mentioned before, the SS benefit algorithm is already skewed to favor those that paid in less, meaning they get a higher percentage of their contributions on a monthly basis. A higher paid individual would have to live quite a few more years to recoup the same percentage of their contributions. Removing the contributions cap and leaving the maximum benefit in place would be a major welfare program subsidize by the “rich”, if you consider making above 168k/yr rich.

There are a few more options to consider. Raising the retirement ages from 62/67 to 63/70, since people are living longer (Wharton). Covering the shortfall from the general fund, assuming Elon and Vivek can cut spending significantly. A combination of everything, including raising the cap and tax rate.

 

[kyzr]

Why should they be paying for you? You sound like Bernie Sanders.

The wealthy benefited from using the SS surplus, someone needs to pay the fuck up.
There are a few more options to consider. Raising the retirement ages from 62/67 to 63/70, since people are living longer (Wharton). Covering the shortfall from the general fund, assuming Elon and Vivek can cut spending significantly. A combination of everything, including raising the cap and the tax rate.

 

[justoffal]

You can look at it that way.
SS is an income tax that you get paid back in inflated dollars after you retire.

That's true

 

[justoffal]

There are a few more options to consider. Raising the retirement ages from 62/67 to 63/70, since people are living longer (Wharton). Covering the shortfall from the general fund, assuming Elon and Vivek can cut spending significantly. A combination of everything, including raising the cap and tax rate.

I never understood why there was any cap on it.... It should be a certain percentage regardless.

 

[boedicca]

It does not matter if the "rate of return doesn't keep up with real inflation".
Social Security still saves us all trillions in the interest the national debt would incur for all of us, if not for being able to borrow the temporary SS surplus each year.
The point is that SS is not a ponzi scheme because it does pay out and is so modest in pay out that it is nothing at all like a ponzi scheme.
The plain facts are that people would not otherwise save for retirement, so then SS is an essential public service.
If not for SS, then we would also have to come up with trillions to support those who failed to invest in retirement on their own.

You are making the erroneous assumption that the spending funded by raiding SS is valid and appropriate.

It's not - most of it qualifies as Looting The Treasury in the mode of late stage empires.

 

[Jarlaxle]

duh. that is not refuting anything dumbass. explain how SS can implode. waiting...

More money coming out than going in. No money to pay debts. Come on, this is second grade stuff!

 

[WorldWatcher]

More money coming out than going in. No money to pay debts. Come on, this is second grade stuff!

When the trust runs out...

You won't have more money going out than going in. That's Kyzr has been trying to tell you.

Let's say right now that $1.00 is paid in benefits:

• $0.25 is paid from the trust
• $0.75 is paid from revenues taken in by taxes.

When the trust runs out, benefits will still be paid but at $0.75 on the dollar. Once the trust runs out SS will not be in a situation where more money is paid out than comes it, money going out gets adjusted to money coming in.

WW

 

[kyzr]

More money coming out than going in. No money to pay debts. Come on, this is second grade stuff!

As long as there is money coming in there will always be a payout. You need to research things before shooting your mouth off.

Trustees Report Summary

A SUMMARY OF THE 2024 ANNUAL REPORTS

www.ssa.gov

• The Old-Age and Survivors Insurance (OASI) Trust Fund will be able to pay 100 percent of total scheduled benefits until 2033, unchanged from last year's report. At that time, the fund's reserves will become depleted and continuing program income will be sufficient to pay 79 percent of scheduled benefits.