Is it fair to have pit bulls around other people?

[Anguille]

For mani whose silly black and white ideas about dog breeding led him to once claim golden retrievers are trustworthy dogs.

Family pet attacks toddler over weekend


Posted: Tuesday, April 1, 2008 12:00 am | Updated: 3:52 pm, Tue Jul 14, 2009.
| 0 comments
Child has surgery to reattach ear, over 200 stitches in face
By TONIE MARRIOTT - Register Staff Writer


A Mt. Carmel toddler, Branson Goodman, 2, had just woken up Saturday morning at approximately 9:30 a.m. and walked into the kitchen of the family home in Cherry Street Estates when the tragedy occurred, his grandmother Patty Lindsey told the Register late Monday afternoon.
"He just walked into the kitchen when he woke up and the dog attacked him for no reason," said Lindsey. "And bit him three times."
The dog in question is a four-year-old Golden Retriever that the family has only had for approximately two weeks, according to Lindsey. She explained that her daughter, Brandy Goodman, had acquired the dog while at a veterinarian's office in Albion."


Family pet attacks toddler over weekend

 

[Coyote]

FIND THE PITBULL​

Only one of the pictures below features the real American PitBull Terrier. Take the test to see if you can find it. To find the breed of a dog, click on image. Note there are no mixes or rescue dogs of unknown background who's breed could be debated. All dogs have been picked from breeders' websites and should be good representatives of their breed.​

When you are done, ask your family and friends to take to test and watch the results. For many people, a Pit Bull is a a big headed dog, or a dog with cropped ears. For some it's a brindle dog, a big, stocky dog, or one with an eye patch. ​

Quite often dogs that attack are identified as pit bulls when they are not. There are 20+ breeds that are commonly incorrectly identified as pit bulls. Visit Understand-a-bull for more information.

Pet Pitbull - Find the Pit Bull

One more reason why breed specific laws are ineffective.

The system insists I have to spread more rep around dang it! That is a great link!

 

[Anguille]

Ah, so it's a law that's not really very effective then. It's a complicated issue unfortunately

No,unless the people whose dogs realy are dangerous still muzzle them properly. I think Italy's law is silly since a muzzle is required of all dogs, regardless of any proven danger and the law is so badly written anyway.
But like I said above, I agree with muzzle laws for dogs that have proven to be a danger when unprovoked.

I also wish that the stigma of having a dog on a muzzle was not so strong. I one time asked this owner of a German Shepherd whose dog is terrified of other dogs and barks and lunges aggressively at them why he doesn't just keep his dog on a muzzle when walking him, for his and everyone's peace of mind. The guy said he didn't want his dog to look like a scary dog.
I have also heard that muzzled dogs are likely to act less aggressive when muzzled, so maybe muzzles could help in rehabing these dogs. I don't know if it's true.

I know the stigma can be a problem - I've used head-halters on dogs and people think they are muzzles. The advantage is that the owner, knowing there is muzzle or that they have better control over the dog with a halter - will noticably relax, and this relaxation is communicated to the dog - when the owner is all tensed up, the dog reacts to that tension by escalating. I have one dog I will muzzle at some point in working with her and it will be tricky. She isn't a lunger but she doesn't want people reaching for her or touching her. We're trying to get desensitized but, I doubt she will ever be a trustworthy dog and will always have to be carefully managed.

It's really commendable that you spend time helping these dogs.



With time maybe you will be successful with her. Meanwhile it looks like a muzzle is a good option for her.

 

[Anguille]

FIND THE PITBULL​

Only one of the pictures below features the real American PitBull Terrier. Take the test to see if you can find it. To find the breed of a dog, click on image. Note there are no mixes or rescue dogs of unknown background who's breed could be debated. All dogs have been picked from breeders' websites and should be good representatives of their breed.​

When you are done, ask your family and friends to take to test and watch the results. For many people, a Pit Bull is a a big headed dog, or a dog with cropped ears. For some it's a brindle dog, a big, stocky dog, or one with an eye patch. ​

Quite often dogs that attack are identified as pit bulls when they are not. There are 20+ breeds that are commonly incorrectly identified as pit bulls. Visit Understand-a-bull for more information.

Pet Pitbull - Find the Pit Bull

One more reason why breed specific laws are ineffective.

The system insists I have to spread more rep around dang it! That is a great link!

Isn't it!! I still haven't found the pit bull in it.

I once cared for an extremely dangerous purebred Rhodesian Ridgeback who looked like he could have been what many people identifiy as pit bull. But his papers indicated he was not. He was eventually put down.

I also used to take care of a half Brittany Spaniel half Black Lab, bred from champions who as a younf dog was aggressive towards other male dogs and children. He also resembled pit bulls. Fortunately he finally stopped being aggressive to other dogs and actually grew fond of kids. Mostly because another dog taught him!

 

[☭proletarian☭]

I like American Bulldogs...

 

[Ravi]

I'm almost positive that it is illegal to have cows out in public.

If that's no so, are you calling for cow banning also?

Nope. If pits were penned in the same manner as cows we wouldn't be having this discussion.

 

[Coyote]

No,unless the people whose dogs realy are dangerous still muzzle them properly. I think Italy's law is silly since a muzzle is required of all dogs, regardless of any proven danger and the law is so badly written anyway.
But like I said above, I agree with muzzle laws for dogs that have proven to be a danger when unprovoked.

I also wish that the stigma of having a dog on a muzzle was not so strong. I one time asked this owner of a German Shepherd whose dog is terrified of other dogs and barks and lunges aggressively at them why he doesn't just keep his dog on a muzzle when walking him, for his and everyone's peace of mind. The guy said he didn't want his dog to look like a scary dog.
I have also heard that muzzled dogs are likely to act less aggressive when muzzled, so maybe muzzles could help in rehabing these dogs. I don't know if it's true.

I know the stigma can be a problem - I've used head-halters on dogs and people think they are muzzles. The advantage is that the owner, knowing there is muzzle or that they have better control over the dog with a halter - will noticably relax, and this relaxation is communicated to the dog - when the owner is all tensed up, the dog reacts to that tension by escalating. I have one dog I will muzzle at some point in working with her and it will be tricky. She isn't a lunger but she doesn't want people reaching for her or touching her. We're trying to get desensitized but, I doubt she will ever be a trustworthy dog and will always have to be carefully managed.

It's really commendable that you spend time helping these dogs.



With time maybe you will be successful with her. Meanwhile it looks like a muzzle is a good option for her.

Well...in all honesty, I didn't know exactly what I was getting into when I got her, I knew she had some issues, that had not been there when our group had fostered her and when she got adopted - they showed up over the year in which she was adopted. She came back and I agreed to give her a try. She has enough good points - she is smart as hell, a fast learner, very very sensitive and quick, but she has a lot of edge and a low reactivity threshold driven by noises and fears. I see so much potential in her, but a lot of "screwed up" too. It's sad I don't know that I'd willingly take on aggression again - it's very hard to work with and if not for the help of more knowledgeable people then I, I couldn't. She is not adoptable, so she is a permenent member of our pack...but I wouldn't add another...

She's a cutie - here's her Christmas picture after her sock orgy (you can see why I couldn't put her down). Last night I couldn't find my snow boots (fluffy lined warmth)....found them both on her dog bed under the table...hmmmm.

 

[Coyote]

I'm almost positive that it is illegal to have cows out in public.

If that's no so, are you calling for cow banning also?

Nope. If pits were penned in the same manner as cows we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Ban cars.

 

[Coyote]

FIND THE PITBULL​

Only one of the pictures below features the real American PitBull Terrier. Take the test to see if you can find it. To find the breed of a dog, click on image. Note there are no mixes or rescue dogs of unknown background who's breed could be debated. All dogs have been picked from breeders' websites and should be good representatives of their breed.​

When you are done, ask your family and friends to take to test and watch the results. For many people, a Pit Bull is a a big headed dog, or a dog with cropped ears. For some it's a brindle dog, a big, stocky dog, or one with an eye patch. ​

Quite often dogs that attack are identified as pit bulls when they are not. There are 20+ breeds that are commonly incorrectly identified as pit bulls. Visit Understand-a-bull for more information.

Pet Pitbull - Find the Pit Bull

One more reason why breed specific laws are ineffective.

The system insists I have to spread more rep around dang it! That is a great link!

Isn't it!! I still haven't found the pit bull in it.

I once cared for an extremely dangerous purebred Rhodesian Ridgeback who looked like he could have been what many people identifiy as pit bull. But his papers indicated he was not. He was eventually put down.

I also used to take care of a half Brittany Spaniel half Black Lab, bred from champions who as a younf dog was aggressive towards other male dogs and children. He also resembled pit bulls. Fortunately he finally stopped being aggressive to other dogs and actually grew fond of kids. Mostly because another dog taught him!

It's interesting, I've evaluated a few pitbulls for other rescues, when they've been at our local shelter, and they've been phenomenal dogs. A few times, I've seen some there I wouldn't have gone near (usually, they were confiscated from neglect or abuse cases and had to be held). The only time I've been bitten with serious intent was by a cattledog, and that was pretty scary (it was bit, shake, tear and bite again) - fortunately I had layers and long sleeves. But he gave very little indication of his intent it was so fast - but there were a lot of little warning signs along the way that made me cautious and circumvent certain parts of the test. None of the warning signs however were aggression - rather supreme confidence, an in-your-space attitude, more interest in pissing on stuff then in the people. If you didn't know what to look for you would think he was very friendly until you did something *he* didn't like.

 

[ron scott]

new here and would like to know how i can keep track of my posts?
is there a way to do that?
the search window sort of helped but I still had to dig through pages to find my last post
and I know I have other posts I made that didn't come up when I searched my user name..


thanks, anyone,

"nice dog"

 

[manifold]

Whatever kind of dog that is and for whatever reason it was provoked into baring it's fangs, it's only representative of that individual dog.

Right. But Petey the little rascal's dog represents all pit bulls.

Epic Fail!

 

[Ravi]

If that's no so, are you calling for cow banning also?

Nope. If pits were penned in the same manner as cows we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Ban cars.

Irrelevant.

 

[Coyote]

new here and would like to know how i can keep track of my posts?
is there a way to do that?
the search window sort of helped but I still had to dig through pages to find my last post
and I know I have other posts I made that didn't come up when I searched my user name..


thanks, anyone,

"nice dog"

If you click on your name next to your avatar on a message - it should show a pull down menu that lets you look at all your posts. (I'm not sure I'm explaining it well, but give it a try?)

 

[Coyote]

Nope. If pits were penned in the same manner as cows we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Ban cars.

Irrelevant.

An average of 4 Pitbull fatalities and 10 maimings a year, out of a population of 5 million pitbulls....

Out of a populatiion of 254.4 million cars, there are ... six million car accidents each year, causing permenant injury to 2 million of those people and killing 40,000 people AND the leading cause of death for individuals between 2 and 34 years old is motor vehicle crashes.


Which is statistically relevant? Which causes more real loss of life and limb...hmmm?

 

[manifold]

Ban cars.

Irrelevant.

An average of 4 Pitbull fatalities and 10 maimings a year, out of a population of 5 million pitbulls....

Out of a populatiion of 254.4 million cars, there are ... six million car accidents each year, causing permenant injury to 2 million of those people and killing 40,000 people AND the leading cause of death for individuals between 2 and 34 years old is motor vehicle crashes.


Which is statistically relevant? Which causes more real loss of life and limb...hmmm?

So you're suggesting that pit bull owners should be required to get a license and have their dog's registered and inspected annually. Interesting idea.

 

[Ravi]

The car thing is still irrelevant, but if you wish to get them banned, more power to you.

I'm curious though, if people often call dogs that aren't pit bulls pit bulls, how do we know the population of pit bulls in the US?

 

[Ravi]

Irrelevant.

An average of 4 Pitbull fatalities and 10 maimings a year, out of a population of 5 million pitbulls....

Out of a populatiion of 254.4 million cars, there are ... six million car accidents each year, causing permenant injury to 2 million of those people and killing 40,000 people AND the leading cause of death for individuals between 2 and 34 years old is motor vehicle crashes.


Which is statistically relevant? Which causes more real loss of life and limb...hmmm?

So you're suggesting that pit bull owners should be required to get a license and have their dog's registered and inspected annually. Interesting idea.

It is an excellent idea. Make them go through the same type of trials that show dogs go through...it would be very easy then to know if the dogs were vicious or not.

 

[Anguille]

I know the stigma can be a problem - I've used head-halters on dogs and people think they are muzzles. The advantage is that the owner, knowing there is muzzle or that they have better control over the dog with a halter - will noticably relax, and this relaxation is communicated to the dog - when the owner is all tensed up, the dog reacts to that tension by escalating. I have one dog I will muzzle at some point in working with her and it will be tricky. She isn't a lunger but she doesn't want people reaching for her or touching her. We're trying to get desensitized but, I doubt she will ever be a trustworthy dog and will always have to be carefully managed.

It's really commendable that you spend time helping these dogs.



With time maybe you will be successful with her. Meanwhile it looks like a muzzle is a good option for her.

Well...in all honesty, I didn't know exactly what I was getting into when I got her, I knew she had some issues, that had not been there when our group had fostered her and when she got adopted - they showed up over the year in which she was adopted. She came back and I agreed to give her a try. She has enough good points - she is smart as hell, a fast learner, very very sensitive and quick, but she has a lot of edge and a low reactivity threshold driven by noises and fears. I see so much potential in her, but a lot of "screwed up" too. It's sad I don't know that I'd willingly take on aggression again - it's very hard to work with and if not for the help of more knowledgeable people then I, I couldn't. She is not adoptable, so she is a permenent member of our pack...but I wouldn't add another...

She's a cutie - here's her Christmas picture after her sock orgy (you can see why I couldn't put her down). Last night I couldn't find my snow boots (fluffy lined warmth)....found them both on her dog bed under the table...hmmmm.

She is beautiful!! I love that look of mischief on her face.

I fostered a dog for a while, a half Basset half Labrador Retriever that my brother eventually adopted who had a similar problem as yours. If anyone stuck their face in his he would snap. And people tended to do that alot because he was so cute and gave no warning signs. At his worst he would lunge at people who walked past us while I had him on the leash. Fortunately he didn't give anyone more than a minor scratch and no one was a jerk about it. Eventually he calmed down after my brother had him for a few years and he lived to be 17 with no more incidents after about 4 years old. So maybe you dog just needs more time. Good luck with her!

 

[chanel]

Off topic - how does an angry eel turn into a nosy neighbor and then back again? Simply bewitching...

 

[Anguille]

I'm almost positive that it is illegal to have cows out in public.

If that's no so, are you calling for cow banning also?

Nope. If pits were penned in the same manner as cows we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Don't you think those 21 cows that killed people were in some kind of enclosure?

So are you now saying you want laws that require pit pulls to be kept in pens? Do you really think that's the way to address the issue of dangerous dogs?