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Individual mandate...a Republican idea

Bfgrn

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For Republicans, the idea of requiring every American to have health insurance is one of the most abhorrent provisions of the Democrats' health overhaul bills.

hatch.jpg

"Congress has never crossed the line between regulating what people choose to do and ordering them to do it," said Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-UT). "The difference between regulating and requiring is liberty."

But Hatch's opposition is ironic, or some would say, politically motivated. The last time Congress debated a health overhaul, when Bill Clinton was president, Hatch and several other senators who now oppose the so-called individual mandate actually supported a bill that would have required it.

In fact, says Len Nichols of the New America Foundation, the individual mandate was originally a Republican idea. "It was invented by Mark Pauly to give to George Bush Sr. back in the day, as a competition to the employer mandate focus of the Democrats at the time."

The 'Free-Rider Effect'
Pauly, a conservative health economist at the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School, says it wasn't just his idea. Back in the late 1980s — when Democrats were pushing not just a requirement for employers to provide insurance, but also the possibility of a government-sponsored single-payer system — "a group of economists and health policy people, market-oriented, sat down and said, 'Let's see if we can come up with a health reform proposal that would preserve a role for markets but would also achieve universal coverage.' "

The idea of the individual mandate was about the only logical way to get there, Pauly says. That's because even with the most generous subsidies or enticements, "there would always be some Evel Knievels of health insurance, who would decline coverage even if the subsidies were very generous, and even if they could afford it, quote unquote, so if you really wanted to close the gap, that's the step you'd have to take."

One reason the individual mandate appealed to conservatives is because it called for individual responsibility to address what economists call the "free-rider effect." That's the fact that if a person is in an accident or comes down with a dread disease, that person is going to get medical care, and someone is going to pay for it.

"We called this responsible national health insurance," says Pauly. "There was a kind of an ethical and moral support for the notion that people shouldn't be allowed to free-ride on the charity of fellow citizens."

Republican, Democratic Bills Strikingly Similar

continued...
 

Oddball

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So, republicans are stupid dickweeds....What else is new?

That dumbasscrats would steal their ideas and tout them as their own tells me as much about them as it does the alleged "other side".

But then again, you only had a sixth grade edumacation, Jethro, so you can be pardoned for being the dimwitted backwoods rube that you are.

jethro_bodine.jpg
 

Ragnar

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Well facts are facts. As Homer Simpson says, "You can use facts to prove anything that is even remotely true". :tongue:


The real test is just hours away. Can't wait to see how many Republican's vote for it.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
 

Bern80

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It just amazes me how often you here this justification from libs. That because they can point to bad legislation, corruption, etc. by the other side that means it's justified for them to be corrupt and pass bad legislation themselves.
 

Bern80

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Well facts are facts. As Homer Simpson says, "You can use facts to prove anything that is even remotely true". :tongue:


The real test is just hours away. Can't wait to see how many Republican's vote for it.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Just look for the one's that got bribed by Obama with money for some project or special favors of some type to their state in the bill.
 
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Bfgrn

Bfgrn

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So, republicans are stupid dickweeds....What else is new?

That dumbasscrats would steal their ideas and tout them as their own tells me as much about them as it does the alleged "other side".

But then again, you only had a sixth grade edumacation, Jethro, so you can be pardoned for being the dimwitted backwoods rube that you are.

jethro_bodine.jpg

Here's your dilemma DUD... I am a hundred times smarter than you...so where does that leave you Hayekseed?
 

Oddball

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You're not any smarter than a bag of hammers.

A terrible idea floated by the republitards doesn't suddenly become a good idea because demotards have stolen it and put into their latest legislation.

Rube.
 

Ragnar

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Here's your dilemma DUD... I am a hundred times smarter than you...so where does that leave you Hayekseed?


Dude your a "Hayekseed"? Why didn't you tell me?

I've liked most of your post up till this startling revelation. A Hayekseed who I'm so often so typically in agreement with. I'll have to reevaluate my whole thought process. I've not been one to agree with hayekseeds so often.

:eek::eek:
 
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Bfgrn

Bfgrn

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You're not any smarter than a sack of hammers.

A terrible idea floated by the republitards doesn't suddenly become a good idea because demotards have stolen it and put into their latest legislation.

Rube.

No, but it does reveal that Republicans are not interested in health care reform, reducing the deficit or the easing the struggles of the American people. They are only interested in turning health care reform or any legislation into Obama's Waterloo and regaining power.

Their Waterloo should have been when Republicans Sam Brownback of Kansas, Mike Crapo of Idaho, John Ensign of Nevada, Kay Bailey Hutchison of Texas, James Inhofe of Oklahoma and John McCain of Arizona voted against legislation forming a fiscal commission, after being co-sponsors of the bill.

You 'call' yourself a libertarian, but just calling Republicans republitards doesn't give you cover...you offer NOTHING that resemble solutions in any conversations, you talk like a right wing pea brain, nothing you say resembles libertarian ideas...Grover Norquist 'calls' himself a libertarian...he's a far right wing hack...just like you...
 

LuckyDan

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Hatch and several other senators who now oppose the so-called individual mandate actually supported a bill that would have required it.

In fact, says Len Nichols of the New America Foundation, the individual mandate was originally a Republican idea. "It was invented by Mark Pauly to give to George Bush Sr. back in the day, as a competition to the employer mandate focus of the Democrats at the time."

What?

Some would-be policy dork sent a memo to the WH, and it is now, historically, the position of the Bush 41 admin?

What bill was this? I don't recall any discusion about it.
 

Oddball

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You're not any smarter than a sack of hammers.

A terrible idea floated by the republitards doesn't suddenly become a good idea because demotards have stolen it and put into their latest legislation.

Rube.

No, but it does reveal that Republicans are not interested in health care reform, reducing the deficit or the easing the struggles of the American people. They are only interested in turning health care reform or any legislation into Obama's Waterloo and regaining power.

Their Waterloo should have been when Republicans Sam Brownback of Kansas, Mike Crapo of Idaho, John Ensign of Nevada, Kay Bailey Hutchison of Texas, James Inhofe of Oklahoma and John McCain of Arizona voted against legislation forming a fiscal commission, after being co-sponsors of the bill.

You 'call' yourself a libertarian, but just calling Republicans republitards doesn't give you cover...you offer NOTHING that resemble solutions in any conversations, you talk like a right wing pea brain, nothing you say resembles libertarian ideas...Grover Norquist 'calls' himself a libertarian...he's a far right wing hack...just like you...
It proves that there ain't a dime's worth of difference between remocrats and depublicans....Or you, for that matter.

And no matter how insincerely and disingenuously you try to cower behind the likes of Hayek and Goldwater, you're still a collectivist-authoritarian knuckle-dragging goon.
 

Si modo

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I find it hysterical, in a very sick and twisted way, that the reason so many believe we need reform is because government got involved in it in the first place and screwed it up so much that it needs reform.

Nice racket.
 
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Bfgrn

Bfgrn

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You're not any smarter than a sack of hammers.

A terrible idea floated by the republitards doesn't suddenly become a good idea because demotards have stolen it and put into their latest legislation.

Rube.

No, but it does reveal that Republicans are not interested in health care reform, reducing the deficit or the easing the struggles of the American people. They are only interested in turning health care reform or any legislation into Obama's Waterloo and regaining power.

Their Waterloo should have been when Republicans Sam Brownback of Kansas, Mike Crapo of Idaho, John Ensign of Nevada, Kay Bailey Hutchison of Texas, James Inhofe of Oklahoma and John McCain of Arizona voted against legislation forming a fiscal commission, after being co-sponsors of the bill.

You 'call' yourself a libertarian, but just calling Republicans republitards doesn't give you cover...you offer NOTHING that resemble solutions in any conversations, you talk like a right wing pea brain, nothing you say resembles libertarian ideas...Grover Norquist 'calls' himself a libertarian...he's a far right wing hack...just like you...
It proves that there ain't a dime's worth of difference between remocrats and depublicans....Or you, for that matter.

And no matter how insincerely and disingenuously you try to cower behind the likes of Hayek and Goldwater, you're still a collectivist-authoritarian knuckle-dragging goon.

Not even close pea brain...how ironic, you refused to take the Political Spectrum Quiz...

10x28.gif
 

Ragnar

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So, you took a stupid and stale old quiz to prove that you're a knucklehead.

Whatcha want, a medal?

PC2010.png


The above is my knuckehead result from a very old and very stale internet quiz.

Hey, His Dudness, you know USMB better than I. Does Bfgrn really claim Hayek and Goldwater as his intellectual cousins (??) because I do (Von Mises, Rand and A. Smith notwithstanding) and our knuckleheaded quiz taking don't mesh.

Enter-toobs, you've beat me again! :redface:
 
R

rdean

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Individual mandate...a Republican idea

I don't know why you are accusing Republicans of having an idea, but if they find out, they are going to be really mad. Republicans don't need stupid "ideas". They have already been given "talking points". So stop trying to cause trouble.
 

Oddball

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So, you took a stupid and stale old quiz to prove that you're a knucklehead.

Whatcha want, a medal?

PC2010.png


The above is my knuckehead result from a very old and very stale internet quiz.

Hey, His Dudness, you know USMB better than I. Does Bfgrn really claim Hayek and Goldwater as his intellectual cousins (??) because I do (Von Mises, Rand and A. Smith notwithstanding) and our knuckleheaded quiz taking don't mesh.

Enter-toobs, you've beat me again! :redface:
Despite my rejection of the premises of several of the questions, I've charted in your general neighborhood every time I've taken that goofy quiz.

And yes, Jethro regularly attempts to cross dress his flaming collectivist authoritarian proclivities behind the words of Hayek, Goldwater and just about any other real freedom lover in history...It's become quite pathetic.
 
OP
Bfgrn

Bfgrn

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So, you took a stupid and stale old quiz to prove that you're a knucklehead.

Whatcha want, a medal?

PC2010.png


The above is my knuckehead result from a very old and very stale internet quiz.

Hey, His Dudness, you know USMB better than I. Does Bfgrn really claim Hayek and Goldwater as his intellectual cousins (??) because I do (Von Mises, Rand and A. Smith notwithstanding) and our knuckleheaded quiz taking don't mesh.

Enter-toobs, you've beat me again! :redface:
Despite my rejection of the premises of several of the questions, I've charted in your general neighborhood every time I've taken that goofy quiz.

And yes, Jethro regularly attempts to cross dress his flaming collectivist authoritarian proclivities behind the words of Hayek, Goldwater and just about any other real freedom lover in history...It's become quite pathetic.

Ye DUD...e, I'm really an authoritarian, and the people that designed these quizzes are conspiring with me to hide it from you...

10x28.gif


As I've said before, there is more than ONE issue that encompasses what is defined as libertarian beliefs. If you were really a student of Hayek, you'd be aware he didn't call himself a libertarian.

But no one knows your beliefs DUD...e, you are merely one of lifes' spectators, and so self absorbed and narcissistic that you see your self as a self appointed 'judge'

My libertarian beliefs are not your one issue monolith, thus the can't be real...
 

Oddball

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You're amongst the phoniest turds on this forum...I wouldn't put it past you to have lied on that quiz, largely irrelevant that it is in the first place.

What I've gathered from your borderline psycho shriekings is that you're essentially a social libertine and an economic authoritarian ...Exactly the kind of dictatorial central planner Hayek strenuously spoke out against.

Closet tyrant poseurs like you are even phonier that Fabian socialists and Wilsonian progressives who cynically hide behind the term "liberal".
 

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