Zone1 If God were real, you wouldn’t need a book

[frigidweirdo]

We are here to learn and decide whether to go down the Godly way (for the good of us and all) or go down the Devil way (for the bad side). We are fallible (not perfect) so God puts bad things in our way for US to decide which way to go. How do we learn? by facing bad things. God is not here to protect us but to teach us!

In addition, our souls live many lives, meaning that our lessons are not learned in just one life by through many. If we make the right decisions in our life, our lives will be better as well as our next life will be better as well, though we will have to face those problems then, where we failed in this life. If we did not learn anything, our next life will be even worse.

Does that address and answer your question?

The problem with what you say is that you've decided there's good and bad.

What I've found in life is there are really bad people, and really good people, not many, but some. In between are lots and lots, billions of people who are selfish, who have a certain amount of empathy, who have learned a certain way of being, who focus on certain things, and ignore others. They're not good, they're not bad, they just are human.

China, without gods for the most part, has lower murder rates than the US, which has a lot of gods. Why? Is it the fear of God or gods that is stopping people from committing crime? The Italian mafia went to church on a Sunday....

And if God decided that we could all decide to make choices, why then kill most people, because he didn't like those choices?

And why then not kill all the people after WW2, WW1 and all the other evil killing that's happened?

And why not kill all the people after humans kill TRILLIONS of animals every year?

And why make carnivores and omnivores if God doesn't like violence?

 

[pal]

I have a book. But never wanted the Church to pray and to believe. Social Media better significance and better place. Home are better place.

 

[The Irish Ram]

If God liked free will, he'd let people do whatever they wanted and wouldn't intervene.

And he decided humans were really violent back then, but did nothing about WW2, the Holocaust, WW1, the Killing Fields in Cambodia and all the other mass violence we've seen in this world since.

The point is, you can't say "I think you're wrong because you're too violent" and then go and punish them with WORSE VIOLENCE.

Wait a minute. Sentence 1, why not nonintervention, and then in the second sentence you berate Him for not intervening. He can't win...

 

[Mashmont]

Not just the christian god, any god.

If they were real it would be self evident.

From a guy who spend decades as a preacher:

“Christians go in with their god as an assumption rather than a conclusion. When in fact, after close examination, the virgin birth falls apart, the resurrection falls apart, the basis of morality falls apart, the promise of afterlife fizzles into fear based marketing.”

“The gods of Islam, of Judaism, of Christianity only exist in scripture. If they actually existed, we wouldn’t need the books to claim they did. Once the book fails, the god goes with it.”



Feel free to explain why he is wrong or right.

I always look at the lives of atheists overall. They lead all belief groups in addiction, depression, broken relationships, and suicides. Just take a look at the atheist standard bearer George Carlin. Had to go to rehab at age 67. Huh? This is an age when most people have things figured out. One would think if atheists had the answer and wisdom for the most significant of all questions known to man, their lives would be together across the board. Instead, it's the opposite. That makes you question their judgment in everything.

Putting your faith in Carlin's opinion on God is a bit like asking the drunk downtown living over a grate to be your life coach.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Wait a minute. Sentence 1, why not nonintervention, and then in the second sentence you berate Him for not intervening. He can't win...

That's because you're assuming I'm coming at this with an idea of what God is. I'm not.

I'm asking questions to people who believe in God, rather than trying to push my view of what God is.

 

[Crepitus]

I always look at the lives of atheists overall. They lead all belief groups in addiction, depression, broken relationships, and suicides. Just take a look at the atheist standard bearer George Carlin. Had to go to rehab at age 67. Huh? This is an age when most people have things figured out. One would think if atheists had the answer and wisdom for the most significant of all questions known to man, their lives would be together across the board. Instead, it's the opposite. That makes you question their judgment in everything.

Putting your faith in Carlin's opinion on God is a bit like asking the drunk downtown living over a grate to be your life coach.

Atheists are not a "belief group" And I can guarantee you they don't lead the pack in at least one category.

Religiosity and Child Sexual Abuse: A Risk Factor Assessment | Office of Justice Programs

www.ojp.gov

Feel free to post your evidence for the others.

 

[Luckyone]

The problem with what you say is that you've decided there's good and bad.

What I've found in life is there are really bad people, and really good people, not many, but some. In between are lots and lots, billions of people who are selfish, who have a certain amount of empathy, who have learned a certain way of being, who focus on certain things, and ignore others. They're not good, they're not bad, they just are human.

China, without gods for the most part, has lower murder rates than the US, which has a lot of gods. Why? Is it the fear of God or gods that is stopping people from committing crime? The Italian mafia went to church on a Sunday....

And if God decided that we could all decide to make choices, why then kill most people, because he didn't like those choices?

And why then not kill all the people after WW2, WW1 and all the other evil killing that's happened?

And why not kill all the people after humans kill TRILLIONS of animals every year?

And why make carnivores and omnivores if God doesn't like violence?

Our souls live many lives, meaning that dying is not a thing that is to be protected by God or the soul

 

[frigidweirdo]

Our souls live many lives, meaning that dying is not a thing that is to be protected by God or the soul

Well, you're making two assumptions.

1) we have souls
2) they live many lives.

And your argument basically means we don't die, so we can't kill, therefore killing isn't bad.

 

[Meriweather]

What is your purpose for deliberately ignoring things that don't fit your narrative?

Is it a "story"? Something made up or something that happened?

If it is a story, then the whole of the Bible is something just made up. Then what?

It may seem like "ignoring" to those who avoid studying. If you want it to be a "story", the very least you owe it is to identify the theme.

 

[Luckyone]

Well, you're making two assumptions.

1) we have souls
2) they live many lives.

And your argument basically means we don't die, so we can't kill, therefore killing isn't bad.

If we don’t have souls, why is there good people and bad people. If we didn’t have souls., we would all simply act the same way, such as ants do!

 

[frigidweirdo]

It may seem like "ignoring" to those who avoid studying. If you want it to be a "story", the very least you owe it is to identify the theme.

So, if you sit down in a Bible study group and you all agree to ignore things, it's not "ignoring"?

Come on, did God go and kill all but 7 to 9 people because he got angry?

You want a theme, who decides the "theme"? The study group? When a person who isn't religious looks at the story and sees that God is blatantly killing people because he "doesn't like violence", there's a HUGE HOLE in the story.

But if it's just a story, then the Bible is just a book of morals from 2,000 - 6,000 years ago. Perhaps morality has changed and there needs to be a different, better written book on morality.

 

[frigidweirdo]

If we don’t have souls, why is there good people and bad people. If we didn’t have souls., we would all simply act the same way, such as ants do!

Are there good and bad people?

Surely "good and bad" is just what you decide they are.

We kill trillions of animals a year, and all these "thou shalt not kill" Christians have NO PROBLEM with this.

One person, or one chicken, might see a mass genocide taking place, a Christian sees food.

All you are describing is something that people have decided. Not something that is.

 

[Meriweather]

So, if you sit down in a Bible study group and you all agree to ignore things, it's not "ignoring"?

Come on, did God go and kill all but 7 to 9 people because he got angry?

You want a theme, who decides the "theme"? The study group? When a person who isn't religious looks at the story and sees that God is blatantly killing people because he "doesn't like violence", there's a HUGE HOLE in the story.

But if it's just a story, then the Bible is just a book of morals from 2,000 - 6,000 years ago. Perhaps morality has changed and there needs to be a different, better written book on morality.

Shrug. It tells simply of truths that have always been inherent to mankind. We're no different now than we were then.

 

[DukeU]

 

[buttercup]

No one ever put this better than C.S. Lewis:

“God will invade. But I wonder whether people who ask God to interfere openly and directly in our world quite realise what it will be like when He does. When that happens, it is the end of the world. When the author walks on to the stage the play is over. God is going to invade, all right: but what is the good of saying you are on His side then, when you see the whole natural universe melting away like a dream and something else - something it never entered your head to conceive - comes crashing in; something so beautiful to some of us and so terrible to others that none of us will have any choice left? For this time it will God without disguise; something so overwhelming that it will strike either irresistible love or irresistible horror into every creature. It will be too late then to choose your side. There is no use saying you choose to lie down when it has become impossible to stand up. That will not be the time for choosing; it will be the time when we discover which side we really have chosen, whether we realised it before or not. Now, today, this moment, is our chance to choose the right side. God is holding back to give us that chance. It will not last for ever. We must take it or leave it.”​

― C.S. Lewis

I love that quote.

 

[JustAGuy1]

Not just the christian god, any god.

If they were real it would be self evident.

From a guy who spend decades as a preacher:

“Christians go in with their god as an assumption rather than a conclusion. When in fact, after close examination, the virgin birth falls apart, the resurrection falls apart, the basis of morality falls apart, the promise of afterlife fizzles into fear based marketing.”

“The gods of Islam, of Judaism, of Christianity only exist in scripture. If they actually existed, we wouldn’t need the books to claim they did. Once the book fails, the god goes with it.”



Feel free to explain why he is wrong or right.

Translation: It doesn't my human "logic" there fore it cannot be true.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Shrug. It tells simply of truths that have always been inherent to mankind. We're no different now than we were then.

We're very different. The Old and New Testaments are completely different and tell two different stories because we are that different.

 

[BreezeWood]

we would all simply act the same way, such as ants do!

all living beings have souls ...

The average ant of the average species lives approximately 2 years. They have been around for more or less 150 million years.

they have been present ~ 149 million years longer than humans. gives an idea the finite existence of the desert religions, no more than 3000 years a mere twinkle in time at best.

to be heavenly is to respect your elders ...

 

[The Irish Ram]

So, if you sit down in a Bible study group and you all agree to ignore things, it's not "ignoring"?

Come on, did God go and kill all but 7 to 9 people because he got angry?

You want a theme, who decides the "theme"? The study group? When a person who isn't religious looks at the story and sees that God is blatantly killing people because he "doesn't like violence", there's a HUGE HOLE in the story.

But if it's just a story, then the Bible is just a book of morals from 2,000 - 6,000 years ago. Perhaps morality has changed and there needs to be a different, better written book on morality.

God killed all but 8 people, but not because He was angry. Doing it grieved Him. The reason He did it was to preserve the human race, because only 8 humans were pure in their generations. They still had only human DNA. Hybrids/Nephilim were the reason for the flood.

 

[frigidweirdo]

God killed all but 8 people, but not because He was angry. Doing it grieved Him. The reason He did it was to preserve the human race, because only 8 humans were pure in their generations. They still had only human DNA. Hybrids/Nephilim were the reason for the flood.

Right.... if it grieved him then he's more sick than if he did it because he felt like it.

He wanted to preserve the human race did he? The human race he made that was violence? And the offspring from these inbreds did what, exactly? WW1, WW2, pogroms, holocausts, all kinds of things. Clearly didn't work, did it?